Poll of the Day > Captain America is gay

(+) Yeah! (+)

https://www.complex.com/pop-culture/marvel-comics-set-to-debut-captain-america-who-is-lgbtq-during-pride-month-gay-teen-aaron-fischer

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Well I have never read a comic book other than The Dark Knight Rises and The Killing Joke, but you bet your ass I have strong opinions on this

Please follow this link to a 22 minute YouTube video ranting about Brie Larson

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That's America's ass

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peggy carter says otherwise
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Shouldnt they call him sassy pants America to accommodate

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Krazy_Kirby posted...

peggy carter says otherwise

I mean...

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JoanOfArcade posted...

That's America's ass

Yes fucking sir.

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Their blatant pandering hasn't exactly done phenomenally well for them in the past. Woke or not, people can tell when youre not being genuine and marvel is just about incapable of being so.

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TheOkHornedRat posted...

Their blatant pandering hasn't exactly done phenomenally well for them in the past. Woke or not, people can tell when youre not being genuine and marvel is just about incapable of being so.

So fucking true. I remember when Lady Gaga said that shes coming out with a song(Born this way) thatll presumably end up being the lbgtq anthem... and my gay friends were like, Its up to us to decide that.


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It doesn't really matter, at this point there's only about a hundred or so people left still buying or reading comics. So they mostly just shit out ideas in the hope of coming up with something interesting they can recycle into the next batch of films.

But most of their good ideas were written 30+ years ago anyway, so those are the ones they mostly wind up using.
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That's not unusual today!

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Thats not the cap people want to get torn in half by

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who is john walker?

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HornedLion posted...

So fucking true. I remember when Lady Gaga said that shes coming out with a song(Born this way) thatll presumably end up being the lbgtq anthem... and my gay friends were like, Its up to us to decide that.

But we pretty much decided yeah it was

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*A version of Captain America is gay.

I think its pretty cool to have a gay Cap. I'm going to check it out.

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sounds good

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helIy posted...

who is john walker?

He's basically a replacement Cap. The government hired him during a time when Steve felt he couldn't justify being Captain American because he didn't agree with some of their actions. After Steve took up the mantle again, Walker took the name US Agent.

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I want to fuck captain america

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get it El Capitano!!!

Wouldnt change how I feel about the character in any way considering his sexuality already had practically nothing to do with him as a character.

And it would explain why he wasnt spending half of The Winter Soldier trying to sleep with Romanoff.

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Make America Gay Again

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ParanoidObsessive posted...

It doesn't really matter, at this point there's only about a hundred or so people left still buying or reading comics. So they mostly just shit out ideas in the hope of coming up with something interesting they can recycle into the next batch of films.

But most of their good ideas were written 30+ years ago anyway, so those are the ones they mostly wind up using.

I dunno man a lot of the iconic stuff is from way back but they still churn out some pretty quality stuff from time to time

Have you read Jonathan Hickmans run of Avengers? Ran from 2012-2015 I think. I thought that was freaking great.

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They should've made a female Captain America and have her be a lesbian.

AC_Dragonfire posted...

They should've made a female Captain America and have her be a lesbian.

theres already a Peggy Carter Cap from another universe, and shes fucking awesome

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AC_Dragonfire posted...

They should've made a female Captain America and have her be a lesbian.

I remember an AU where the Civil War was ended by the marriage of Captain America and Iron Woman.

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Mead posted...

Have you read Jonathan Hickmans run of Avengers?

I'm really, really, really not a fan of his work in general. I hate what he's doing with the X-Men right now, and I thought pretty much every single facet of their new version of Secret Wars was kind of terrible (and I'm also annoyed by Marvel's current practice of taking the names of old popular crossovers and "redoing" them, because it kind of underlines how creatively bankrupt they are as a company at this point). He's not the worst writer they've had there in recent times, but that's faint praise indeed.

I honestly haven't seen much of anything from Marvel or DC worth caring about since 2011. Which is a shame, because they both spent most of the 2000s recovering from the creative void that was the 1990s, and there was reason to be optimistic about a lot of titles. Then both companies basically rebooted all of their major franchises around the exact same time for the significant worse, and haven't really recovered for the last decade.

I can't really speak on Hickman's specific run on Avengers because Marvel's comics line in general just feels like an utter wasteland of bad ideas at this point, so I mostly ignore it (or forget about it after hearing about it). But considering I dislike pretty much everything I know he worked on (including the Avengers issues involving the Incursions and stuff leading up to Secret Wars), I can't imagine he wrote any brilliant storylines that I would love if only I discovered them.

Like I said, though, I get the impression that Marvel's comics at this point are mostly an afterthought, and only exist so they can have different writers (who are mostly just grown-up comic nerds writing borderline fanfiction) brainstorm tons of ideas and throw everything at the wall in the hopes that something might stick, so they can use it as a plot idea in a movie years from now. We're never really going to get the sort of iconic storylines and memorable plot moments (that always get recycled into every version of a character, a la Dark Phoenix) like we used to, because the entire nature of the medium and the value of its audience has changed (which isn't helped by the rush to incorporate plot elements from the movies back into the comics in a desperate pandering attempt to sell comics to the millions of people who watch the films, which almost never works).
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TheOkHornedRat posted...

Their blatant pandering hasn't exactly done phenomenally well for them in the past. Woke or not, people can tell when youre not being genuine and marvel is just about incapable of being so.

Are you sure? I mean, gay heroes is nothing new to Marvel. They already had quite a few...
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SilentSeph posted...

Make America Gay Again

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If it's not a straight white dude, its pandering. No exceptions

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If only I didn't love Blade.

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Oh, it's a new guy. I thought Jean Grey made someone gay again.

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Don't see why it matters that much since it isn't them changing Steve Rogers himself. Just a new character.
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VeeVees posted...

Oh, it's a new guy. I thought Jean Grey made someone gay again.

lol did she make someone gay?

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EvilMegas posted...

If it's not a straight white dude, its pandering. No exceptions

Not really. Most comic fans were more than willing to accept Kamala Khan (Ms Marvel) when she debuted, and there was a fair amount of support for Jaime Reyes as Blue Beetle (after he shook off the initial hate because DC killed off a popular character in Ted Kord to clear a spot for him as a legacy character). Miles Morales was also a very popular addition to the roster (so much so that Marvel literally took him out of the alternate universe he debuted in and dropped him into the main Marvel universe). Then there's more marginal cases (like the Hispanic Spider-Man 2099 or Spider-Gwen).

The key is generally whether or not a character feels like a well-written character who can be gay (or ethnic, or female, or whatever) as a part of their personality, or if they were created as a one-dimensional stereotype for Tumblr to masturbate over. And whether they're being introduced as a new character, or being shoehorned into someone else's legacy spandex at that original character's expense.

Comic fans are most likely to pull the pandering card when the writing is shit, or when it feels so utterly forced you know it's a callous marketing attempt to try and exploit certain demographics in a vain hope of selling more comics.

Usually, when people try to paint all dissent as "Oh, well, you just don't like women/people of color/alternative sexuality/etc", it's because someone has an agenda and they're looking to demonize criticism. It's possible to think something sucks because, you know, it actually sucks.

(Like criticizing Carol Danvers Captain Marvel not because she's a woman, but because she's the most boring and irritating version of the character, and pointing out you'd have preferred they used the black girl or space lesbian versions of the character instead. But that would have been TOO MUCH diversity.

Though I personally wonder if people bringing up "black Captain Marvel" is what led to her character being used in WandaVision, or if they were already planning to bring her into the movies at some point even before that, which is why we got the flashback version of her in the actual Captain Marvel movie. Hard to say with the MCU, because they do plan stuff pretty far ahead.)
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ParanoidObsessive posted...

I'm really, really, really not a fan of his work in general. I hate what he's doing with the X-Men right now, and I thought pretty much every single facet of their new version of Secret Wars was kind of terrible (and I'm also annoyed by Marvel's current practice of taking the names of old popular crossovers and "redoing" them, because it kind of underlines how creatively bankrupt they are as a company at this point). He's not the worst writer they've had there in recent times, but that's faint praise indeed.

I honestly haven't seen much of anything from Marvel or DC worth caring about since 2011. Which is a shame, because they both spent most of the 2000s recovering from the creative void that was the 1990s, and there was reason to be optimistic about a lot of titles. Then both companies basically rebooted all of their major franchises around the exact same time for the significant worse, and haven't really recovered for the last decade.

I can't really speak on Hickman's specific run on Avengers because Marvel's comics line in general just feels like an utter wasteland of bad ideas at this point, so I mostly ignore it (or forget about it after hearing about it). But considering I dislike pretty much everything I know he worked on (including the Avengers issues involving the Incursions and stuff leading up to Secret Wars), I can't imagine he wrote any brilliant storylines that I would love if only I discovered them.

Like I said, though, I get the impression that Marvel's comics at this point are mostly an afterthought, and only exist so they can have different writers (who are mostly just grown-up comic nerds writing borderline fanfiction) brainstorm tons of ideas and throw everything at the wall in the hopes that something might stick, so they can use it as a plot idea in a movie years from now. We're never really going to get the sort of iconic storylines and memorable plot moments (that always get recycled into every version of a character, a la Dark Phoenix) like we used to, because the entire nature of the medium and the value of its audience has changed (which isn't helped by the rush to incorporate plot elements from the movies back into the comics in a desperate pandering attempt to sell comics to the millions of people who watch the films, which almost never works).

are there any non-marvel/DC comics that youd recommend from recent years?

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Mead posted...

lol did she make someone gay?

Iceman.
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ParanoidObsessive posted...

Iceman.

Lol wtf, I knew they made his character gay but I figured it was just a retcon

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Mead posted...

Lol wtf, I knew they made his character gay but I figured it was just a retcon

They wanted to make young iceman gay but the reveal was poorly done. It's basically just Jean going you're gay and iceman is confused then just accepts it later. I think they also ungayed him after a bit. So it was just stupid.

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Revelation34 posted...

Don't see why it matters that much since it isn't them changing Steve Rogers himself. Just a new character.

The usual complaint is that the original gets marginalized or removed to make room for the new. That was one of the reasons for the huge backlash against "female Thor" in the comics a few years ago - the (bad) writing mostly shat on the original Thor to get him out of the way to justify giving the hammer to someone new, who seemed to get the job solely because she was female. And as I previously mentioned, there was backlash when DC introduced a new Hispanic Blue Beetle mostly because they shot the old (fairly popular) Blue Beetle in the head and killed him more or less solely to get him out of the way so the name would be free.

It's not even necessarily limited to race/gender, though - comic fans were PISSED back in the 1980s when Steve Rogers stepped down from being Captain America and John Walker took his place (though fans being pissed was part of the point of that storyline, because they always intended for Rogers to take the name/costume back). The same sort of happened with Jean-Paul Valley replacing Bruce Wayne as Batman in the 90s Knightfall storyline (and again, fans being pissed was sort of the point - you were supposed to be annoyed that this guy was taking Bruce's place, so you'd welcome Bruce back when he returned). And major changes in general can annoy people even if the character themselves don't change at all - the storyline in the 90s where Superman turned into a living laser sort of energy being who could shoot lightning (and later split into two separate people) annoyed a lot of fans, even though it was still Clark Kent.

Comic fans are generally much more open to the idea of "diversity" legacy characters when the new character doesn't hurt the old one. A large part of why fans like Miles Morales and Spider-Gwen is because Marvel didn't kill off Peter Parker to make room for either of them, and they generally co-exist (and interact with each other). A lot of people liked the Young Avengers version of Hawkeye because she actually hung out with and trained with the original (something Marvel has implied they're probably going to do in the MCU as well).
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Shit. I love ParanoidObsessive in this topic. He is hitting the nail on the head.

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ParanoidObsessive posted...

The usual complaint is that the original gets marginalized or removed to make room for the new. That was one of the reasons for the huge backlash against "female Thor" in the comics a few years ago - the (bad) writing mostly shat on the original Thor to get him out of the way to justify giving the hammer to someone new, who seemed to get the job solely because she was female. And as I previously mentioned, there was backlash when DC introduced a new Hispanic Blue Beetle mostly because they shot the old (fairly popular) Blue Beetle in the head and killed him more or less solely to get him out of the way so the name would be free.

It's not even necessarily limited to race/gender, though - comic fans were PISSED back in the 1980s when Steve Rogers stepped down from being Captain America and John Walker took his place (though fans being pissed was part of the point of that storyline, because they always intended for Rogers to take the name/costume back). The same sort of happened with Jean-Paul Valley replacing Bruce Wayne as Batman in the 90s Knightfall storyline (and again, fans being pissed was sort of the point - you were supposed to be annoyed that this guy was taking Bruce's place, so you'd welcome Bruce back when he returned). And major changes in general can annoy people even if the character themselves don't change at all - the storyline in the 90s where Superman turned into a living laser sort of energy being who could shoot lightning (and later split into two separate people) annoyed a lot of fans, even though it was still Clark Kent.

Comic fans are generally much more open to the idea of "diversity" legacy characters when the new character doesn't hurt the old one. A large part of why fans like Miles Morales and Spider-Gwen is because Marvel didn't kill off Peter Parker to make room for either of them, and they generally co-exist (and interact with each other). A lot of people liked the Young Avengers version of Hawkeye because she actually hung out with and trained with the original (something Marvel has implied they're probably going to do in the MCU as well).

Well removing a character is stupid. They can just create a new character while retaining the originals.
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If it was up to me theyd stop being cowards and actually kill off major characters from time to time or change them and stick to it. Instead theyre always hitting the reset button and telling the same old stories over and over because theyre just worried about the next movie tie-in or whatever.

Like they made the biggest deal out of killing wolverine even though everyone knew they were gonna bring him back within a few years.

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Mead posted...

If it was up to me theyd stop being cowards and actually kill off major characters from time to time or change them and stick to it. Instead theyre always hitting the reset button and telling the same old stories over and over because theyre just worried about the next movie tie-in or whatever.

Have you read anything from Ultimate/1610?

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Mead posted...

lol did she make someone gay?

It was more like she reminded Ice Man he was gay...
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Nichtcrawler X posted...

Have you read anything from Ultimate/1610?

Ive read some of The Ultimates and some of Ultimate Spider-Man/Fantastic Four. Of all of them Ultimate Fantastic Four is probably my favorite.

Theyre interesting but sometimes it feels like theyre trying way too hard to be edgy, especially in The Ultimates.

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Nichtcrawler X posted...

Have you read anything from Ultimate/1610?

Creating an alternate universe so you can keep the status quo is cowardly.

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Krazy_Kirby posted...

peggy carter says otherwise

So bad in the sack she converted him for good.

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Black_Crusher posted...

So bad in the sack she converted him for good.

watch it, thats Americas Beard youre talking about

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So...

How long until they ship this new Captain and Bucky?

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