Board 8 > What was Board 8's general reaction to FFVII Remake?

(+) Yeah! (+)

If you're gonna go into it with that attitude, it wouldn't matter how good it is, you'll come out still being dismissive/hating on it.

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I think he intends it that way

why hate something with no basis when you can hate it with a pjbasis

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Nice

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I know what the game is like in broad strokes, and I've framed my opinions that way. I don't like the concept of the game, and I doubt the way it's presented could change that. I also see what opinions other people have, and the fact the biggest fans are people never liking the original anyway tells me that they come from an entirely different angle. (and yes some people love both)

I have not talked about the gameplay because I don't know about it. I know that I don't conceptually like FF being an action series now. FFXV left me wanting because I usually come to RPGs for at least a modicum of menu diving and character growth. Not to say that FFVIIR is going to be bad just because it's an ARPG. It could, in fact, be an incredible ARPG. I will call FFVIIR a good game because of it. It won't stop me from being disappointed that the "old" series is dead though, especially since this is a remake of an old game. I think there was an opportunity to take something turn based and make it action-y without completely sacrificing it for real time action. Maybe in practice it does feel this way, but I haven't heard that articulated a lot.

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Idk when I just press a button at any moment to stop time forever and then scroll around my abilities choosing which one I want to use, debating if using an item is better, etc. and I can do that forever even against bosses it does feel pretty turn-based

But then if it's a little pod of 3 enemies that are wimps I can just run up and slash around and they'll die easily

Win win

It's not just about in game tactics, although that's definitely a part of it. I like the long term decision making too of choosing which abilities I should be dumping AP into, stuff like that. FF is pretty basic about this stuff in general, and it looks like it's even simpler than ever before?

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pjbasis posted...

It's not just about in game tactics, although that's definitely a part of it. I like the long term decision making too of choosing which abilities I should be dumping AP into, stuff like that. FF is pretty basic about this stuff in general, and it looks like it's even simpler than ever before?

FFVII didn't really have that though! You only used AP for building materia, and that still exists in Remake.

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Yeah I'll have to play the game to really see how similar it ends up being in practice.


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Heck, if anything Remake has MORE stuff because you can level up and develop your weapons.

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pjbasis posted...

I know what the game is like in broad strokes, and I've framed my opinions that way. I don't like the concept of the game, and I doubt the way it's presented could change that. I also see what opinions other people have, and the fact the biggest fans are people never liking the original anyway tells me that they come from an entirely different angle. (and yes some people love both)

I have not talked about the gameplay because I don't know about it. I know that I don't conceptually like FF being an action series now. FFXV left me wanting because I usually come to RPGs for at least a modicum of menu diving and character growth. Not to say that FFVIIR is going to be bad just because it's an ARPG. It could, in fact, be an incredible ARPG. I will call FFVIIR a good game because of it. It won't stop me from being disappointed that the "old" series is dead though, especially since this is a remake of an old game. I think there was an opportunity to take something turn based and make it action-y without completely sacrificing it for real time action. Maybe in practice it does feel this way, but I haven't heard that articulated a lot.

The way you talk about the gameplay tells you know literally nothing about it lol. It's barely an action RPG. It still has a ton of menu diving and party management.

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How would you compare it on a spectrum of action to RPG to, say, FFXV.

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It's a turn-based action RPG.

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And ffxv is not? The words mean different things to different people. You can pause the menu in ffxv.

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It's an ATB system, where auto attacks are happening while the ATB is charging instead of everyone just standing around. The fights only progress upon spending ATB unless it's against the most basic Shinra soliders.

There is an entire Classic Mode where you do not control attacks and dodges, you're just waiting and spending ATB.

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pjbasis posted...

And ffxv is not? The words mean different things to different people. You can pause the menu in ffxv.

It's not the same as FFXV, no.

Regardless, don't bother playing the game. If your goal is to hate it, then you'll hate it.

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Leonhart4 posted...

Regardless, don't bother playing the game. If your goal is to hate it, then you'll hate it.

If you actually mistook honest conversation as hostility you need to check your cynicism.

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In any case, its good to hear its not like FFXV. I hope 16 pushes more in a blended direction.

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I have it on good authority that XVI is going to be an exact port of I except with voice acting and next gen graphics.

Also, bugfixes.

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Holy shit cant wait to see garland

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redrocket posted...

Also, bugfixes.

Nvm No peninsula of power No buy

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pjbasis posted...

If you actually mistook honest conversation as hostility you need to check your cynicism.

Calling it "hostility" is a bit hyperbolic, but if you go into a game looking for reasons to dislike it, you'll find them. You certainly don't come across as someone who wants to like what Remake is and what it represents.

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I don't "want" to like or dislike things. I'm half joking because I'm played up like that from people like you.

The only difference is that this is a franchise that hits closer to home and I have a very clear preference about what I think would be best for it.

I don't know why expressing that is such a problem, even in a non threatening jokey way.


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Expressing what you want from a franchise isn't a problem. If you don't think Remake is it, then whatever. I don't care whether you play it or whether you like it.

You just come across as having already passed judgment on it without having played it based on just what you've heard it is or what you assume it is.

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But everyone's in agreement that Roach is a geek and a nerd and a fuckin' loser, right?
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Hard Mode doesn't mess around, but it's really enjoyable so far!

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Hard Mode surprised me a lot. Stuff I thought would be a killer like Hell House was actually not too bad. Other stuff though...

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Leonhart4 posted...

You just come across as having already passed judgment on it without having played it based on just what you've heard it is or what you assume it is.

I am 99% sure I am going to greatly dislike any thing like time travel ghosts or the reveal that characters that should have died aren't dead and most of opinions have been about things of that nature. I know I'm going to take issue with pacing because enough people have said as much and because I know pacing is important to me. I don't think I've ever insinuated I've judged the entire game. I'm sure I've even explicitly stated that I need to play the game still because gameplay is half the battle. Of course I'm skeptical of what I perceive as a forcing of action elements into an RPG series.

Whatever, I don't really care to defend that I have opinions pre-formed because it's perfectly reasonable to do so. I just don't like my authenticity being questioned that I would do something as performative as play a game just to hate it.

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I feel like using Cloud's Counterstance and Tifa's charged Chi attacks will be imperative for getting through Hard (Counterstance made the Roche fight pretty easy). I've gotten through four chapters without a ton of trouble, but thinking about some of those bosses later on is making me nervous.

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its the MP management mostly, some of the later boss fights and arena stuff requires very specific stuff

I had to learn to play the entire game differently for Hard, which was very cool. Made use of lots of abilities I never touched first time

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Oh yeah, the MP management is an enormous difference and has already altered the way I play. Maybe the MP Absorption materia I just earned will help out (but I lol'd when I saw the fine print).

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pjbasis posted...

Whatever, I don't really care to defend that I have opinions pre-formed because it's perfectly reasonable to do so. I just don't like my authenticity being questioned that I would do something as performative as play a game just to hate it.

Nah, I don't think you're playing it specifically to hate it. I just think that's what will ultimately happen.

And it's fine to form impressions on stuff before you play it. There are plenty of things I'm sure I won't like without playing them because I know what I want and what I don't want in a game. For instance, I have little doubt I'd hate TLOU2, but I don't bother going into TLOU2 topics to pontificate about it. That's the weird thing to me.

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Elemental Materia is your best friend.

Master both of them.

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Leonhart4 posted...

For instance, I have little doubt I'd hate TLOU2, but I don't bother going into TLOU2 topics to pontificate about it. That's the weird thing to me.

I mean this goes back to before the game coming out. People were telling me to stfu because the game wasn't out yet whenever I expressed doubt. And then as more stuff was revealed post-release I feel pretty justified in the what I was concerned about. After I play the game ya'll will probably still act the same (even if I say I like overall) because it's really just about feathers being ruffled that someone disagrees with their happy party. And it's probably not you.

For this topic though I was just jabbing at kanz' very poor way of saying why he felt it was better than the original.

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I mean really, dialogue and writing are the same thing! And if you don't understand japanese how can you tell the original writing was improved more than the translation? It was just very preposterous.

XIII_rocks posted...

Writing/dialogue in games is obviously better now than it was in the 90s so it should be no surprise that Remake handles the characters better.

Like come on.

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Leonhart4 posted...

Nah, I don't think you're playing it specifically to hate it. I just think that's what will ultimately happen.

And it's fine to form impressions on stuff before you play it. There are plenty of things I'm sure I won't like without playing them because I know what I want and what I don't want in a game. For instance, I have little doubt I'd hate TLOU2, but I don't bother going into TLOU2 topics to pontificate about it. That's the weird thing to me.

to be fair this topic is asking how people feel about FF7 Remake and pjbasis is talking about how he feels about FF7 Remake

Also, pj don't bother playing it. I'm sure you won't like it.

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MZero posted...

Also, pj don't bother playing it. I'm sure you won't like it.

*dinosaur screeches*

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pj, don't forget....

https://i.imgur.com/1KOtpFk.gif

Shame she wasn't just released in smash bros...!

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Nah you right. I shoulda let it slide since I trolled to start with. Thanks ulti!

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pjbasis posted...

I mean this goes back to before the game coming out. People were telling me to stfu because the game wasn't out yet whenever I expressed doubt. And then as more stuff was revealed post-release I feel pretty justified in the what I was concerned about. After I play the game ya'll will probably still act the same (even if I say I like overall) because it's really just about feathers being ruffled that someone disagrees with their happy party. And it's probably not you.

For this topic though I was just jabbing at kanz' very poor way of saying why he felt it was better than the original.

Nah, I get it. The ghosts were stupid and I hated every time they showed up. They bogged the game down every single time, but thankfully, it doesn't seem like they'll be a thing going forward. The game was good in spite of them.

And for what it's worth, I agree with you on the writing thing. One of the best things about Remake is that it highlights why these characters were always good. They aren't doing anything novel with them. I guess people just got used to how they were written in Kingdom Hearts!

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Elemental and magnify material are the best there, really. Magnify-cure in Aerith when she's vailable and Cloud otherwise, then elemental with whatever your next enemy is weak to on Cloud and Tifa/Barret. HP Up and MP Up are of course great as all. Revive is necessary, and then first strike, barrier etc can fill out the rest. That's perfect for like 90% of hard mode.

Bosses often require you to think differently though and I really enjoyed this. No boss was that bad when you had the best setup, but that was not always obvious to figure out.

Edit: Actually, First Strike is almost mandatory on Cloud and Tifa/Barret outside of boss battles. Really speeds up a lot of encounters.

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pjbasis posted...

Like come on.

???

Is that some kind of controversial take?
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It's just a basic logical fallacy.

Orange Tree A has, on average, bigger oranges than Orange Tree B. The fallacy would be concluding that it proves that a particular orange from A must be bigger than one from B.

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Get what you mean but if FF7 remake came out and had worse writing or dialogue than one made when games had a smaller budget, less experience and less globalisation behind them than I'd be a very disappointed - to the point of livid - consumer. It's natural to expect improvement in that area and Remake delivered.

I genuinely expected it to be poor by modern standards because I figured it would drown in tropes I despise (name followed be ellipsis for no fucking reason, weird grunts at strange times) but even though it did sink into that territory from time to time the rest of it was so well-done that that stuff ended up mattering less.
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Leonhart4 posted...

And it's fine to form impressions on stuff before you play it. There are plenty of things I'm sure I won't like without playing them because I know what I want and what I don't want in a game. For instance, I have little doubt I'd hate TLOU2, but I don't bother going into TLOU2 topics to pontificate about it. That's the weird thing to me.

Good thing no one else did this either!

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XIII_rocks posted...

(name followed be ellipsis for no fucking reason, weird grunts at strange times)

I do hate this shit, but it's not really in the domain of writing imo. A lot of this stuff is the product of voice acting and 3D scene direction that you can't even compare to a 2D text only PS1 game. Like how when you read a novel a lot more is being supplied by your imagination, similarly the old PS1 games need some "help" (especially ff7!) from the player to really capture the essence of the scenes. That's why the arguments that greater fidelity of graphics makes the characters better is very cold to me.

I'll make sure to give you guys my detailed analysis in the future though! It may surprise me what I actually end up liking and not liking about it.

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I refuse to be surprised

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