Board 8 > Politics Containment Topic 349: Rudy Can't Fail

(+) Yeah! (+)

https://twitter.com/Fahrenthold/status/1336483828349751296

But they're totally not a deranged cult, guys

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Seanchan posted...

As for the "sense of purpose", you know what could do that? The Green New Deal; rebuilding America to deal with inevitable climate change. But I don't think Biden has the chops to be able to sell that to the 50% of America that already scoffs at that idea.

Just remember when using numbers like that, you're talking about voters. Even in the highest ever turnout for an election here, around a third of U.S. adults didn't vote.

That number is probably closer to 25-33%.

Anywho speaking of the too far gone sector of our populace, OAN is quite fascinating to watch. I had no idea Rand Paul and Matt Gaetz were on there all the damn time.

So in the next 10 years, does Fox News go full InfoWars now that they've created a monster they no longer can control, or does OAN become more mainstream on the right? They...do already have a cable channel.

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StartTheMachine posted...

Just remember when using numbers like that, you're talking about voters. Even in the highest ever turnout for an election here, around a third of U.S. adults didn't vote.

That number is probably closer to 25-33%.

Is there any reason to assume that non-voters have different views on the Green New Deal? It's generally agreed that non-voters as a group have about the same opinions on any given issue as voters do.
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It should also be pointed out that, while the GOP uniformly condemns the Green New Deal, the Democratic voters aren't 100% in lock step in favor of it. I'd wager there are more Dem voters wary of the GND than supporting it.

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Xeybozn posted...

Is there any reason to assume that non-voters have different views on the Green New Deal? It's generally agreed that non-voters as a group have about the same opinions on any given issue as voters do.

I mean, you can be assured that if they were voting for Trump, they would have done so. I'm just saying I bet the majority are at least reachable. I don't know much about non-voter statistics though, would be interested in seeing studies! My guess is most are apolitical, anti-political (the screw politics crowd), or uninformed enough to feel like they should vote.

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StartTheMachine posted...

I mean, you can be assured that if they were voting for Trump, they would have done so. I'm just saying I bet the majority are at least reachable. I don't know much about non-voter statistics though, would be interested in seeing studies! My guess is most are apolitical, anti-political (the screw politics crowd), or uninformed enough to feel like they should vote.

A lot of nonvoters are not eligible to vote (because they are under 18 or not citizens). I think turnout this year was already the highest in 100 years.

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red sox 777 posted...

A lot of nonvoters are not eligible to vote (because they are under 18 or not citizens). I think turnout this year was already the highest in 100 years.

Right. I looked up U.S. adults exclusively when getting the numbers for this election. 66.7%.

https://www.statista.com/statistics/1184621/presidential-election-voter-turnout-rate-state/

It would be closer to 50% turnout if we factored in around 80 million people under 18.

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https://twitter.com/RzstProgramming/status/1335975677720453120?s=20

I'm all for Republicans accidentally defunding the police.

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https://twitter.com/realdonaldtrump/status/1336691981981016066?s=21

Cant even get American history right
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Jakyl25 posted...

https://twitter.com/realdonaldtrump/status/1336691981981016066?s=21

Cant even get American history right

It only happened once! 1960 (although I think Rudy is alleging fraud by the Dems in that election too).

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StartTheMachine posted...

Right. I looked up U.S. adults exclusively when getting the numbers for this election. 66.7%.

https://www.statista.com/statistics/1184621/presidential-election-voter-turnout-rate-state/

It would be closer to 50% turnout if we factored in around 80 million people under 18.

Plus felons in some states

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Xeybozn posted...

Is there any reason to assume that non-voters have different views on the Green New Deal? It's generally agreed that non-voters as a group have about the same opinions on any given issue as voters do.

Uh source. It's generally to my knowledge agreed many nonvoters don't care much politically or detest politics. Thus, would generally have normal current every day life views and not sweeping progressive views that would change the current every day status quo or don't want government involved in anything.

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I think this past election is pretty strong evidence that the theory that if all the nonvoters just voted, progressives would win is not very good. Votals went into the stratosphere with no apparent disadvantage for the GOP.

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I would want to see a breakdown of non-voters by age bracket before I would comment on that.

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UshiromiyaEva posted...

I would want to see a breakdown of non-voters by age bracket before I would comment on that.

I think it will be interesting to see where all the "new" voters came from. Was this just an across the board 10% (or whatever it was) increase, or was there a correlation with age/sex/race/etc.?

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Like if 40% of non voters were in the 18-25 range you can be damn sure what way that would swing.

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UshiromiyaEva posted...

Like if 40% of non voters were in the 18-25 range you can be damn sure what way that would swing.

Wouldn't bet my house on that.

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Governor Wolf tests positive for Covid. PA people wide and large already (based on my anecdotal evidence) stating how this either proves his lockdowns and mask policies are bullshit or how this means he is not following the guidelines he is trying to make everyone else follow.

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Corrik7 posted...

Governor Wolf tests positive for Covid. PA people wide and large already (based on my anecdotal evidence) stating how this either proves his lockdowns and mask policies are bullshit or how this means he is not following the guidelines he is trying to make everyone else follow.

People have 0 concept of the difference between "safer" and "safe".

Not to mention masks are generally for preventing the spread from you as the mask wearer, so if there's a bunch of people not wearing masks uhhh yeah you're not guaranteed safety

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https://twitter.com/ghostoftr1/status/1336697917084614658?s=21



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oh my lord at the motion to intervene that trump filed with SCOTUS in Texas's lawsuit

have some excerpts:

"Indeed, a recent poll by the reputable Rasmussen polling firm"

"President Trump prevailed on nearly every historical indicia of success in presidential elections. For example, he won both Florida and Ohio; no candidate in history - Republican or Democrat - has ever lost the election after winning both States." <- as discussed here earlier this is false

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Corrik7 posted...

Governor Wolf tests positive for Covid. PA people wide and large already (based on my anecdotal evidence) stating how this either proves his lockdowns and mask policies are bullshit or how this means he is not following the guidelines he is trying to make everyone else follow.

All of these are constantly caught breaking their own rules. It's why people aren't listening to them.

This is not a political divide, either. ALL of them stop wearing masks and social distancing the second the cameras are off, and this is a case where they should be leading by example.

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xp1337 posted...

oh my lord at the motion to intervene that trump filed with SCOTUS in Texas's lawsuit

have some excerpts:

"Indeed, a recent poll by the reputable Rasmussen polling firm"

"President Trump prevailed on nearly every historical indicia of success in presidential elections. For example, he won both Florida and Ohio; no candidate in history - Republican or Democrat - has ever lost the election after winning both States." <- as discussed here early this is false

Never heard of the word indicia.

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Speaking of which.

https://twitter.com/NateSilver538/status/1336794295156740096?s=19

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yeah "indicia" triggers my spellcheck but looking it up on wiktionary tells me what I suspected that it's basically another way to pluralize index (technically it's a plural of the Latin "indicium") i.e. indications or signs

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xp1337 posted...

oh my lord at the motion to intervene that trump filed with SCOTUS in Texas's lawsuit

have some excerpts:

"Indeed, a recent poll by the reputable Rasmussen polling firm"

"President Trump prevailed on nearly every historical indicia of success in presidential elections. For example, he won both Florida and Ohio; no candidate in history - Republican or Democrat - has ever lost the election after winning both States." <- as discussed here earlier this is false

I see. This must be the reason the last Steven Crowder video was called "NO RETREAT! America is about to #StopTheSteal"

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All of these are constantly caught breaking their own rules. It's why people aren't listening to them.

This is not a political divide, either. ALL of them stop wearing masks and social distancing the second the cameras are off, and this is a case where they should be leading by example.

This is the rare instance where Ulti is objectively right.

All these supposed "leaders" calling for social distancing and masks with threats of fine and prosecution are undermining themselves--and everyone's safety-- when they continue to get caught not following their own rules.

https://apnews.com/article/mexico-coronavirus-pandemic-austin-texas-26340eabdc1d450e21ba650e42060f30

https://www.latimes.com/california/story/2020-12-01/la-reinstates-covid-19-testing-upended-by-union-station-film-shoot

(yes on this one they reversed course, but the fact they did it in the first place is fucking awful)

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Corrik7 posted...

Never heard of the word indicia.

It's the plural of "indicator."

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https://twitter.com/FrankLuntz/status/1336711592700825600?s=19

I thought the gop was all about not appeasing terrorists

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https://www.nytimes.com/2020/12/08/us/politics/trump-election-challenges.html

Racist death threats filled the voice mail of Cynthia A. Johnson, a Michigan state representative.

oh hey that explains that bizarre ass video Ulti posted earlier. hopefully Ulti still believes in the right to self-defense and stuff

E: The full paragraph is much more frightening.

Supporters of the president, some of them armed, gathered outside the home of the Michigan secretary of state Saturday night. Racist death threats filled the voice mail of Cynthia A. Johnson, a Michigan state representative. Georgia election officials, mostly Republicans, say they have received threats of violence. The Republican Party of Arizona, on Twitter, twice called for supporters to be willing to die for something or give my life for this fight.

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Hunter Biden is being investigated by the US attorney for Delaware for tax issues. I am going to say, given the timing, this investigation appears to be political, and is not okay. President Trump should back off from this tit for tat war. Best way is to just issue Hunter a pardon.

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ChaosTonyV4 posted...

https://twitter.com/ghostoftr1/status/1336697917084614658?s=21

I feel like its stating the obvious but, we have to actually manage other sectors of the country to make schools safe to open.

There are a lot of kids not doing well and falling behind due to school closures. Many are already at 9 months without schooling. Our education system already sucked with in-person learning and now its worse.

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StartTheMachine posted...

Yes magically when Trump doesn't win they will come back to reality

Fine it's magic, as long as you believe it when you see it. Problem is you don't care anymore about what your own senses tell you, only what the prescribes. Hopefully Biden's inauguration can bring you back to reality too.

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BTW, I don't know if you all saw but the SCOTUS voted 6-3 to hear the lawsuit from Texas.

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oh no
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Whats the worst that could even happen.
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honestly they kind of have to. we're at 18 states getting involved.

also i'm calling bullshit on that for multiple reasons. 1) the court doesn't determine hearing cases that way. hearing a case just needs 4 usually. look up rule of four, that's the standard. 2) this case isn't an appeal case, it's a case that only the supreme court has original jurisdiction over.

anything saying 6-3 is just trolling and propaganda, not legit.

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Ted Cruz wants to argue it. Lol

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I just read somewhere else the 6-3 and agreement to hear it is fake news. Lol. So idk.

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All 50 states have officially certified their results as of an hour ago.

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it's totally fake news. original jurisdiction follows separate rules anyway but appeals cases don't get determined that way either. rule of 4 - you need 4 justices to say they want to hear the case, that's it. 6-3 is just somebody trolling, purposefully using that number for the political bend.

honestly they do have to hear it in some way, even if it'll be ultimately to say they don't have standing.

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Oh I didn't know that it was a minority position on SCOTUS that they have to accept cases under their original jurisdiction. Still, I'm sure the percentage of original jurisdiction cases accepted is vastly higher than the percentage of appeals accepted. At a minimum, it'll draw a dissent from Thomas and Alito stating that they think SCOTUS has to take the case.

Also, there's some ambiguity about what "hear" means. The Supreme Court will hear the case in the sense that they will read the supporting and opposing pleadings (they have already set a deadline for the defending states to respond) and make a decision whether to let the case proceed further. They apparently don't necessarily need to "hear" the case in the sense of having a trial or oral argument on the merits.

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original jurisdiction rules i don't know very well because it happens so rarely, when i say they have to i just mean because there's too many states involved to just completely ignore and the importance of the case. do know that it usually involves appointments to help determine what they should hear but that element probably won't be here either due to the speed, so i'm not sure what rules they'd follow to determine it. at the very least it's not going to be some sort of 6-3 ruling or whatever, that's nonsense.

rule of 4 is the standard for hearing a case, which 99.9% of the time is gonna be an appeals one, and doesn't really care about dissents. it's a pretty up or down vote and almost all are voted down.

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red13n posted...

I feel like its stating the obvious but, we have to actually manage other sectors of the country to make schools safe to open.

There are a lot of kids not doing well and falling behind due to school closures. Many are already at 9 months without schooling. Our education system already sucked with in-person learning and now its worse.

Right, that's what the science/medical professionals tend to say! And 100 days would get us to May, hopefully with increased mask usage and dozens of millions of people vaccinated. I'm thinking a lot of places will be in the green at that point.

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Schools do contribute to infections, so you dont want to have them open when things are really bad like they are right now in much of the country. On the other hand, they appear to contribute less than we thought, and having schools closed but bars and indoor dining open is just an insane prioritization.

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schools depends a bit on what grade we're talking here too.
elementary and middle - probably fine.
high school - probably not fine.
colleges - no.


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LordoftheMorons posted...

Schools do contribute to infections, so you dont want to have them open when things are really bad like they are right now in much of the country. On the other hand, they appear to contribute less than we thought, and having schools closed but bars and indoor dining open is just an insane prioritization.

Not at all, because bars and indoor dining are how millions of people make their living, and schools can be done remotely.

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LordoftheMorons posted...

having schools closed but bars and indoor dining open is just an insane prioritization.

You say it's insane, but I'd call it the most American set of priorities possible. Children are the future and all that, but it's obvious that our leaders don't give a shit about the future in any other context. Why should this one be any different?
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ChaosTonyV4 posted...

Not at all, because bars and indoor dining are how millions of people make their living, and schools can be done remotely.

The actual services are unnecessary, and children (especially younger ones) have a much harder time learning online than in person. We should be paying people in non-essential industries to stay home.

(the services being the indoor/in person part; just like schools can be held remotely, restaurants can do take out/delivery)

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