Board 8 > ~ The Gauntlet Crew Ranks Movie Musicals, Part 2: The Golden Age ~

(+) Yeah! (+)

22. Hedwig and the Angry Inch

Scarlet: 7
Genny: 8
KBM: 17
Johnbobb: 20
JONA: 26
Karo: 28
Inviso: 35

Scarlet - The story and meaning of Hedwig and the Angry Inch overshadow the clear lack of good music. And make no music, the music in this movie is very unremarkable. One of the rare movies that is uplifted by good writing on this list.
Best Song: Wicked Little Town

Genny - Hedwig and the Angry Inch was a surprise for me: I'd honestly never even heard of it before this list, but I ended up enjoying it immensely (obviously). I admire the overall theme it had to offer about wearing your scars and flaws with pride regardless of what others might think about you. If only I could be as confident as Hedwig I could accomplish so much more than I have. The way Hedwig tells their life story makes it exceedingly difficult to feel sorry for them, because they spend so little time feeling sorry for themselves which is precisely why those moments when Hedwig does show even the smallest vulnerabilities are that much more poignant.

KBM - Why I Chose It: The original 1998 Off-Broadway production of Hedwig and the Angry Inch, with music and lyrics by Stephen Trask and John Cameron Mitchell and starring Mitchell in the title role, proved a pretty large cult success on the stage, winning the Obie and the Outer Critics Circle Award for Best Musical and spawning hundreds of worldwide productions including at the West End. It didn't take long after the original production closed for Mitchell himself to write, direct, and star in a film adaptation of his show. However, despite a positive reception from critics and the audiences who saw it, including multiple awards at the Sundance Film Festival and a Golden Globe nomination for Mitchell's performance, the movie was a box office bomb, only making $3.6 million on a $6 million budget. Despite its lack of financial success, it lives on as a cult classic.

My Thoughts: I'm of two minds regarding this movie. I certainly had a good time watching it, and that counts for a lot when a lot of the stuff towards the bottom of my list was either genuinely boring or actively bad. At the same time, for a musical, the MUSIC element in this is... not as good as it could have been. Certainly not as good as a Rocky Horror Picture Show or a Xanadu or other similar cult classics we've watched; there are a few pretty strong rockers but not quite enough to convince me that this person is as big an underground rock success as they are portrayed. It's also a fairly PrObLeMaTiC story, for reasons I won't go very far into here (let's just say John Cameron Mitchell isn't exactly the most trans-friendly artist out there and leave it at that). Despite that, there is a pure subversive joy here that proves pretty contagious, and though I have my quibbles with the forced-transition story and the way Hedwig is portrayed, the performances from the leads, gleeful subversiveness, and the pure kinetic energy on display here prove just enough to turn my mixed feelings into mostly positive ones.

Favorite Song: Wig in a Box

Johnbobb - This was... not quite as good as I was hoping it would be. I mean, it's an interesting concept, and I (for the most part) dug the music and characters, but something about it just felt... incomplete. It definitely struck me as something that needs to be viewed live compared to some of the other movie musicals on the list, some of which benefitted from larger production values and effects than the stage would've allowed for. I enjoyed it but was hoping for a little more.
Favorite song: Tear Me Down

JONA - I feel bad for not liking this movie because there are aspects of the movie I like, and I see how this movie could be something special to someone. I remember seeing this get compared to The Rocky Horror Picture Show, which was in the first list and I didnt like. However, what makes me like this movie more is that it does have an interesting story to tell. Seeing Hedwigs life is intriguing even if it still has shades of the obnoxious weirdness of Rocky Horror. I did get some enjoyability out of the weirdness, but it did take me out of the story of Hedwig. The soundtrack was forgettable besides The Origin of Love. If you liked this, more power to you, but this just wasnt for me.
Favorite Song: The Origin of Love

Karo - So there's a young boy in east berlin who befriends an american soldier who for some odd reason is allowed free reign to walk all around on the commie side of the wall. This weirdo offers to take the boy to the states as his sex slave, but only if he becomes a girl first, and thanks to the efforts of glorious communist medicine Hedwig and her angry inch are born.
As for story, there is not a lot. Hedwig's other ex-boyfriend has stolen her music and so they follow his tour around singing obnoxious songs to screw with him or whatever while they do flashbacks to the dubiously legal beginnings of their relationship.
Things get ever more confusing the longer the film goes on, culminating in a bizarre finale where Hedwig eats some bad shrooms or something and ends up wandering naked though the alleys of new york. Hurrah.
The movie wants way too hard to be artsy and edgy and ends up with its head stuck its own ass half the time, and stuck in an oven the other half.
It is simply nothing more than an unpleasant and disjointed experience that can't even lay claim to the title of being the best rock musical about a transsexual, and the only angry inch this movie needs is a good solid middle finger.

Score: 42/100

Best Song: 'The Origin of Love'

Inviso - Every single character in this film was unpleasant, and the style of music was completely unpleasant to listen to, to the point where it made a ninety-minute film feel like it was drag for hours. There isnt even a good story to go along with this. There have been bad stories on this list so farbut this was just awful. Its like a biopic for an awful person who treats those around themselves like utter shit. And the problem is that there are so many metaphors and flashbacks that I cant follow whats supposed to be going on in this story. I justthis wasnt even remotely enjoyable to behold, and I dont even understand what the point of this film was, other than some weird, gross-out scenes involving the guy from The Cube, and what I ASSUME was an underaged boy. No thanks on ever watching this again.

Oh wow.

Would have had another top 10 if I was included!

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The Outlier of Love

Genny: 126
Karo: 113
Scarlet: 108
Inviso: 97
Johnbobb: 89
KBM: 85
JONA: 81

Inviso breathes a sigh of relief upon being the last person to lose their #35, and rises one spot in the standings. (It might have been two spots, but Scarlet's own recency bias is showing*.) Other than that, things stay as they were.

* - oh god i'm just teasing please don't yell at me too much for this it's just a joke

TotallyNotMI posted...

Oh wow.

Would have had another top 10 if I was included!

I didn't intentionally exclude you! I just wasn't very good about letting people who don't regularly hang out in the Gauntlet Discord know that it was happening. Sorry!

No worries, I didn't mean for it to sound that way! More just lamenting that I could have gotten it a higher ranking!

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No second ranking tonight - two tomorrow though (which served as the first of our two ties!)

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21. Fame

Inviso: 4
JONA: 10
KBM: 15
Johnbobb: 19
Genny: 27
Scarlet: 27
Karo: 34

Inviso - After a string of weird-ass musicals from the seventies, I didnt go into Fame with high expectations. After all, 1980 is only one year removed from the seventies. But then I actually watched the movie, and it managed to tick all the boxes of stuff I like. The film centers around a handful of students, all trying to make their way in a prestigious performing arts high school, and it tracks their progress from initial auditions, all the way through their senior year, in a series of vignettes. We get to, in essence, watch these kids grow up and deal with the pressures of being put onto a high pedestal early on in life. Youve got relationship drama with Doris and Ralph (and Monty), youve got the unexpected bond between Leroy and his English teacher, youve got overachiever Coco crashing down to Earth, and all of this is amazingly well-told. I never felt bored while watching this film, and thats impressive for something as long as Fame was. Extremely good film overall.

JONA - A really neat slice-of-life movie that follows a bunch of characters. All their conflicts are intriguing and help show their struggles when it comes to following their dreams and seeing what the future will hold for them. The movie does a great job when it comes to providing the setting. It makes the high school and the future seem so intimidating. The songs are great, and I actually like how theres not that many of them.
Favorite Song: Fame

KBM - Why I Chose It: Fame was the brainchild of Hollywood producer David De Silva, who was partially inspired by the musical A Chorus Line, in which New York's High School of Performing Arts is mentioned. De Silva commissioned playwright Christopher Gore and director Alan Parker to help make the film (the latter, then best known for his film Bugsy Malone, would go on to direct the movie adaptation of Evita). Filming was plagued with various troubles: among them, there were union concerns over (among other things) foreign crew members working without permits, the High School of Performing Arts disallowed filming access in their building due to concerns with the sexual and drug-related content of the script, and the NYPD demanded the cast and crew cut the filming of the title number short due to complaints about traffic blockages. Despite the production's many issues, and the initially mixed reviews (which became more favorable over time), Fame went on to be nominated for six Academy Awards, with Michael Gore winning Best Original Score and Best Original Song for the title number. It was also a commercial success, and spawned multiple TV series, a stage musical in 1988, and a remake in 2009.

My Thoughts: Fame is certainly a bit long, and a bit unfocused from a narrative perspective (leaving a lot of plot threads unresolved by the end), but for the most part, I found this to be a pretty endearing movie. The slice-of-life approach doesn't always work to the film's advantage, but for the most part it does, allowing the audience not to expect everything to be wrapped up in a neat little bow by the end, and instead just showing us the stories of several different characters from a single graduating class across their four years at the High School of Performing Arts. A lot of the characters are extremely likeable, and as someone who pursued an education and career in performing arts myself, I found many of the character arcs quite relatable, whether from my own personal experience or from friends and acquaintances. The Michael Gore soundtrack and songs kick ass (as Michael Gore's work usually does), and even if there are a few things about the film that are dated in a very 80s way I'm thinking especially of the peeping Toms scenes that it seems are supposed to be endearing but are actually super creepy for the most part, this is a story that holds up in a more-or-less timeless way. The fact that it doesn't shy away from profanity, sex, and drug use as being a part of coming of age also works to the story's advantage, as the more serious storylines end up being the most compelling parts of the film outside of the musical numbers (which are sparse, but quite impactful when they occur). So this one gets a mixed, but mostly positive review from me.

Favorite Song: Fame

Johnbobb - I enjoyed Fame while watching it, but thinking back, there were a lot of things that rubbed me the wrong way. The suicide fakeout, Coco's sexual abuse getting kind of glossed over at the end, really all of the plots just kinda getting forced into happy endings that didn't really feel earned. In particular, Ralph stood out as a pretty bad character, kind of being all over the place through most of the film but then going full intolerable toward the end, when after doing a single comedy act for his friends, it immediately goes to his head and he becomes a complete jackass.
Favorite song: Hot Lunch Jam

Genny - Fame follows the lives of... far too many performance art students to possibly care about. There's three main ones yes, and like ten other side stories. I would've appreciated it more if the focus was really narrowed to just Doris, Ralph, and Montgomery despite fantastic performances from Coco and the other supporting castmembers.

Scarlet - I want to live forever. And, sitting through Fame, it feels like I am.
Best Song: Flashdance

Karo - So hey there's these kids who go to artsy talent high school and a great lot of stupidity was had.
We've got like five different storylines featuring various unlikable characters, half of the time it is like some shitty nickelodeon tv show, and the other half is like someone spliced together unused footage from America's Got Talent and tried to call it a movie.
The atrocious writing sees many of the introduced plot points not given a proper conclusion, and some are just straight up forgotten completely because lol.
It all boils down to being a mindless exercise in sequential chaos that has too many characters and too little narrative, and no idea what the hell is the point.

Score: 24/100

Best Song: 'Fame'

Outlier on My Own

Genny: 132
Karo: 126
Inviso: 114
Scarlet: 114
JONA: 92
Johnbobb: 91
KBM: 91

Some shuffling around, as we end up with two ties (rather appropriate, considering Fame was also tied in point value with our #20).

Okay, Jesus Christ. Can we PLEASE eliminate the one-two shit punch from the start of the millennium already?

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Gee, I wonder what movie Inviso is talking about!

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MovieS.

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Fame is definitely a musical where I would think of it and be like, "yeah, that was a musical"

and yes Fame gets stuck in my head all the time now since watching, so thanks for that KBM

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JONALEON1 posted...

Gee, I wonder what movie Inviso is talking about!

I'm not seeing it

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Inviso posted...

MovieS.

Did you miss your last place movie dropping somehow

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I did.

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20. Rent

Inviso: 12
JONA: 15
Johnbobb: 16
Karo: 17
Scarlet: 22
Genny: 26
KBM: 28

Inviso - This is another musical that Ive had the opportunity to see in a theater, and I passed it up. So, this was my first real encounter with Rent, outside of the cultural mind, where everyone knows 525,600 Minutes. And it kept my attention. It felt like a true screen-adaptation of a stage musical, transitioning from song to song with only brief interludes. And the songs felt diverse in their tone and sound. For a musical dealing with some severe hardships (namely: Angel having AIDS and dying over the course of a montage, and Mimi dealing with drug addiction and getting kicked out of her apartment), it manages to maintain a light and hopeful atmosphere. I appreciate that, given some of the headier movies on this list and how dour they are in their handling of the subject matter. Ultimately though, this feels like a good movie that just happens to be filler. Its watchable and enjoyablebut I just dont come out of it with any memorability.

JONA - I had no idea where to rank this. I dont like most of the characters. I found them generally to be pretentious and entitled. Even though I didnt like them, I was engrossed with their problems though. The problems ended up being a bit ridiculous due to how many characters are dealing with the same problem. What really saved this movie for me was the music. It really is fantastic and is worthy of its praise. Even then, it has its problems. Since this is a movie, it needs to do things which are bigger than the stage version. When the song Rent was playing, I was confused on whether or not everyone in the neighborhood had problems due to the other buildings coming into play during the number. In Tango: Maureen, theres a big dance sequence and Maureen shows up there. I didnt find that to be a good decision because for me, one of the appeals of the song was imagining what Maureen is like. It feels like there are a bunch of unnecessary things added. That could just be me talking out of my ass since Ive never seen the stage version though. The music carries this movie incredibly hard but since its a musical I guess that makes me a bit more forgiving.
Favorite Song: Tango: Maureen

Johnbobb - yeah it's pretty decent I guess, pay your damn rent though
Favorite song: La Vie Boheme

Karo - As the title says, this is about a lovable group of misfits who cant pay the rent for their ghetto apartments and so they sing a bunch a weird songs.
That's pretty much the whole story, the bunch of them doing stuff together and occasionally protesting the removal of a homeless camp or dying of aids.
A lot of the things they try are very musically... uh.. avant-garde, and they don't always work. I shouldn't ever need to ask myself is this a musical number, or did someone forget to take their medication.
The movie goes on for what seems a bit too long and could have benefited from both a little of trimming of the fat and a better effort at congealing the various songs into a coherent narrative, but it still makes the cast likeable and that is a whole lot more than can be said for so many other films in this project.

Score: 63/100

Best Song: 'Seasons of Love'

Scarlet - Two conflicting opinions - one, that the stage musical Rent is phenomenal. Two, that the movie version of Rent feels look, I dont want to make the joke. I really dont. The cast line-up is of course, phenomenal. Jesse Martin, Taye Diggs, Menzel the music remains the anchor of the musical, but when you transition to film from stage, you have to keep in mind that the power of musicals portrayed live lose the raw charisma and need to rely on a stronger presentation of story that doesnt slog for two and a half hours.
Best Song: Season of Love, specifically when Jesse Martin is awesome.

Genny - I really like Seasons of Love, but Rent as a whole is a little much if I'm being honest. It suffers the same syndrome as another four letter musical in that it follows a lot of characters, but these people are at the very least already interconnected by something other than attending the same school. Still, it's a lot and while I realize it's a major theme the focus on HIV/AIDS made me a bit uncomfortable. I suppose that was the idea and helps to raise awareness, but I can't say I enjoyed it in all honesty.

KBM - Why I Chose It: The original musical from 1996, adapted by Jonathan Larson from Giacomo Puccini's opera La Bohme, was one of the defining Broadway successes of the '90s. It won four Tony Awards, including for Best Musical, and the Pulitzer Prize for Drama, and its 12-year Broadway run made it the 11th longest running Broadway show in history. However, when the Chris Columbus-helmed film adaptation of Rent was released nine years later, starring much of the original Broadway cast, it was met mostly with indifference, flopping at the box office and getting middling reviews from critics. Still, the film is noteworthy for being a fairly accurate adaptation of the stage musical, and did enable the popular show to reach an even broader audience.

My Thoughts: I would like to say I've never really liked Rent, but that's not entirely true. When I was an impressionable young teenager, I thought it was the shit. Between its unapologetic representation of queer people and its fuck-the-system attitude, it was very appealing to a kid like me. As I've grown older, however, the show's flaws have become more and more clear, and the movie only serves to amplify them to the nth degree. First and foremost is the fact that almost none of these characters are in any way likeable; they're basically all entitled brats who just want to live a Bohemian lifestyle for the ART and ROMANCE of it all. Even the more likeable characters have problems Angel murders a dog for money and we're supposed to find it endearing, Mimi is a codependent addict who tries to get a sober guy back on drugs, Mark is an asshole who appropriates other people's suffering for his own (terrible) art, Maureen is a sociopathic abuser... the list goes on. My second major problem is that only about half the music is all that good to begin with. The big production numbers, like Rent, La Vie Bohme, Take Me or Leave Me - these are all great, and reasons I revisit the soundtrack and even the live show time and time again, despite not being a huge fan of it. It's the connecting threads, though, that leave something to be desired, with some really bad spoken-word poetry lyrics that really fall flat (see especially the atrocious song I Should Tell You for more details). My third problem here is exclusive to th

Outlier Tonight

Genny: 138
Karo: 129
Inviso: 122
Scarlet: 116
KBM: 99
JONA: 97
Johnbobb: 95

With middling rankings across the board, only I manage to jump a couple spots, while everyone else holds their position.

Jesus

That would have been my #1!


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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=StPTCo5qk8E

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19. Phantom of the Paradise

KBM: 3
Johnbobb: 8
Scarlet: 13
Genny: 22
JONA: 25
Inviso: 28
Karo: 32

KBM - Why I Chose It: Like many (if not most) cult classics, Brian De Palma's 1974 rock opera-horror-comedy Phantom of the Paradise was a box office failure and received negative reviews upon its release, despite its Paul Williams score going over well and receiving both an Oscar nomination and a Golden Globe win. Over time, the film has been looked at much more fondly, with a widespread cult following that is particularly strong in Winnipeg; the film's more notable fans include Sbastien Tellier, Bret Easton Ellis, and Daft Punk.

My Thoughts: It's hard for me to even explain why I love this movie so much, but as I covered above, it's clear that I'm not alone. The singular, peculiar blend of a young Brian De Palma's fearless bravura direction, the absolutely batty storyline combination of Phantom of the Opera and Faust, the strange yet unforgettable performances from William Finley and Jessica Harper, and the pure drug-infused SEVENTIES of it all along with Paul Williams' truly excellent music and surprisingly great acting all of it just make this a winner for me and both my favorite De Palma film and my favorite Phantom adaptation (if you can even call it that). I don't know that it's necessarily even a good movie, but it's a wildly entertaining experience; one that I've absolutely fallen in love with and would have no problem watching time and time again.

Favorite Song: Faust (Swan)

Johnbobb - I can't place what it was that I liked about this movie. I feel like it could've been downright awful, and maybe should've been, but instead it was all sorts of funny and bizarre. The opening song was fantastic, as was the Phantom himself. It reminded me a lot of Rocky Horror Picture Show, never hesitating to go over the top and constanyly referencing classic horror bits. Just a really fun experience.
Favorite song: Goodbye, Eddie, Goodbye

Scarlet - The only film I had to watch for this list, having never seen it before, I found Phantom of the Paradise to be a weird, wonderful parody of the 70s music scene and the music industry as a whole. Definitely rough around the edges, there was at least a significant amount of originality here that was lost to a lot of this list. And look, if Bret Easton Ellis says this is one of his favorite movies, it cant be too bad.
Best Song: Faust

Genny - Phantom of the Paradise is reminiscent of Rocky Horror Picture Show if it never quite reached that same cult status. I would much rather watch the other, but I could see myself giving this another looksee when I'm in a particular mood. I appreciated the many nods to the classical literature Phantom borrows from, and the humor detracted from several bittersweet musicals I endured for the sake of this project.

JONA - While its an interesting take on the Phantom of the Opera, it has the problem of having a mixed tone. The mix of comedy, horror and musical numbers never quite found its footing for me. The drama between Wardlow, Beth Phoenix and Rich Swann was something I never found too engaging. I was interested in the Phantom getting his revenge. I was intrigued on how he would get his revenge. Once he joined forces with Swan, the movie lost a bit of my interest. The reveal of Swan making a pact with the devil is just so absurd. While it has interesting ideas, the execution could have been a lot better.
Favorite Song: The Hell Of It

Inviso - All I can say is that this was a very SEVENTIES kind of movie. The entire atmosphere of the film feels like the kind of drug trip, fever dream insanity that are emblematic of the artistic sentiments revolving around the decade. As a result, this was not my cup of tea. I found it bland and uninspiring for the most part. The tone is strange, featuring a dramatic shift from bizarre comedy (Winslow getting crapped on, falsely imprisoned, had his teeth replaced, and then got caught in a record press), only for the whole film to take a turn into some bizarre shit about the Devil. The songs are completely unmemorable, the soundtrack is obnoxious in its use of glam rock, and really, the only thing that even slightly salvages the movie for me is the fact that the acting of Winslow and Beef in particularis pretty campy and over-the-top to the point where its NEARLY amusing.

Karo - So this is a retelling of the Phantom of the Opera in the 70's music industry or something, only somewhere along the lines it got mixed up with the story of Faust and a lot of marijuana.
This version of the 'phantom' is a struggling songwriter who got his head stuck in a record press while he was trying to blow up a recording studio that stole his song and he so he ends up making a deal with Satan and c'mon guys, really?
Why the hell did they think it was a good idea to take a character as cool as the Phantom and give him the backstory of a fourth-tier gotham rogue, an outfit that looks like he's cosplaying as an old japanese superhero, and talk like DOMO ARIGATO MISTER ROBOTO. Shit on a motherfucking stick.
There are a few satirical shots taken at the entertainment industry, but the director couldnt be bothered to put down his bong and flesh them out into something with any real teeth.
The budget is low, the music sucks, and it seems nothing more than a cheap attempt to make a classic story seem cool to the youth of the time.

Score: 27/100

Best Song: 'Old Souls'

Faustlier

Karo: 142
Genny: 141
Inviso: 131
Scarlet: 122
KBM: 115
Johnbobb: 106
JONA: 103

And with that, assuming my calculations have all been correct, everyone's outlier score is over 100. Karo overtakes Genny for top outlier by one point, and JONA settles into last place. I, meanwhile, am sorrowful at losing my #3.

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I forgot that was even still in. Glad it's out though.

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Oh no my outlier

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Also Seasons of Love is one of the most overrated songs in the entire musical theatre canon there, I said it.

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We need a Halloween ranking.

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HanOfTheNekos posted...

Also Seasons of Love is one of the most overrated songs in the entire musical theatre canon there, I said it.

WOW.

Here I thought we were friends.

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TotallyNotMI posted...

WOW.

Here I thought we were friends.

It's so boring tho

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18. Hair

Genny: 5
Scarlet: 9
Johnbobb: 11
Inviso: 14
KBM: 22
Karo: 29
JONA: 33

Genny - I don't think any of these movies displays such wild moodswings as Hair. There is a scene where a bunch of hippies pool together all the change they presumably begged for just to rent a horse so one of them could make some rich girls uncomfortable by telling them naughty words. There's also a scene where a major character is KIA because of mistaken identity and gets a Vietnam War memorial that his hippie friends visit. I mean it really is all over the place and I can't help but love it. The soundtrack has too many hits to count, but Sodomy is my guilty pleasure. Equal parts fun with its upbeat soundtrack and clever with its social commentary on racial and class disparity, Hair is bizarre in the best way.

Scarlet - Considering where this film falls in history, and more specifically the musical it is based on, you have to respect the cries of protest that Hair embodies and symbolizes in one of the most tumultuous periods of social change in our history. The movie is more of a representation of a movement than a musical in and of itself, but I can respect it as a shred of art that stands for a time. And I do love that Fifth Dimension-style of music.
Best Song: Aquarius

Johnbobb - I'll admit, I'm kind of a sucker for hippie counterculture. Aquarius is a fantastic song.
Favorite song: Aquarius

Inviso - Im honestly surprised at how high I wound up ranking this film, because for like, 80% of its runtime, it was just kinda stupid and aimless, in my opinion. Sure, you had some interesting musical numbers (namely those where the writers feel like theyre throwing everything at the wall for laughs, just to see what sticks), but it just feels like a bunch of characters mashing together with seemingly little purpose for their existence. Its almost like a parody of hippie culture being too wild and untamed. However, that last section really ties the whole film together. Through the whole movie, Berger is portrayed as this reckless hippie leader, who constantly questions authority and comes up with cockamamie schemes, although ultimately hes a good guy. So for him to get utterly fucked over in a prince and the pauper situationits brutal, and suddenly the movie gains new meaning. Suddenly, the message becomes all about the pain and cruelty of the Vietnam War (to the point where no one even really notices Berger taking Claudes place in the army, until after hes already dead.) Thats deep, and fucked up, and it salvages the film just a little.

KBM - Why I Chose It: This 1979 adaptation of the 1968 musical Hair: An American Tribal Love-Rock Musical was met with favorable reviews, and two Golden Globe nominations, for Best Musical or Comedy and New Star of the Year for Treat Williams. Milo Forman was also nominated for a Csar Award for his work. The creators of the original show were less fond of it, lamenting the many changes to the story and score.

My Thoughts: I really, REALLY want to like the movie adaptation of Hair better than I do. It gets the music right, with some of the best recordings of these songs ever done. It gets pretty much else super wrong. By trying to turn Hair into something with a coherent three-act structure, Milo Forman falls into the same trap that Tom Hooper has recently fallen into with his recent adaptation of Cats (except, y'know, this is nowhere near as bad as that). As much as I love the soundtrack this film gave us, the movie turns out to be pretty toothless, at least up until the very very end when Berger dies in Vietnam in place of John Savage (the one change from the show that actually kind of works, although I still prefer Claude being a member of the tribe to begin with instead of a fresh-faced draftee from Oklahoma). Frankly, I think I would have preferred more of just a hang-out slice-of-life movie with hippies being hippies to this somewhat watered-down take on the original show. But, as I said, the music is great across the board, and at least it's a good movie to rock out to, even if the connecting thread isn't there. I'll stick with listening to the soundtrack album though.

Favorite Song: Black Boys/White Boys

Karo - The barely followable plot of this movie is about this country boy who falls in with this 'lovable' group of hippies who commit multiple felonies, bully anyone who stands in the way of their fun (or just because they are there), and basically justify every terrible thing Eric Cartman has said about them.
These dipshits are accompanied by the most bizarre set of songs ever put in a movie, and not really in a good way. One song is just a string of racial epithets, one is a song literally about singing a song (SING! SONG! SING! SONG!), and another that's probably on the playlist of every catholic priest in the country. What a mess.
Due to stupidity on the part of the hippies and incompetence on the part of the military, one of them gets accidentally sent to Vietnam where he finally ceases to be a strain on the planet's oxygen reserves. The movie then abruptly ends with everyone randomly singing antiwar protest songs because of course it would.
After two hours of this shit the only significant thing one takes away is that there was way too many drugs involved in the making of this movie. Because seriously, the writers, composers, actors, everyone, were clearly stoned out of their fucking minds.
If you are like some 70 year old hippie who wants to get all misty eyed (and high) while reminiscing about the good ol' days when you used to pick flowers, take LSD, protest Vietnam, and still had hair, then this movie is for you.
I however, am not, and I want a movie that is more than an incoherent mess of unlikable characters doing arbitrary things while singing about masturbation and zodiac signs.

Score: 36/100

Best Song: 'Hair'

JONA - Is this really an anti-war film? The characters make it seem like the opposite since I wanted to see them get drafted. I really hate the hippies in this movie. They dont even seem like real hippies to me. They are very antagonistic, and they beg for money. The leader of the group even hits Claude. I thought they were supposed to be peaceful. By the time they have the Good Berger take Claudes place its far too late for me to start caring about him. I also found the pacing to be quite slow. At least the songs are pretty good.
Favorite Song: Aquarius

The Age of Aquoutlierius

Genny: 154
Karo: 153
Inviso: 135
Scarlet: 131
KBM: 119
JONA: 118
Johnbobb: 113

Genny gets her outlier back, as she and Karo continue to duke it out by one point. Johnbobb also takes back last place.

man this might be the most unpredictable list so far

which is especially weird given that now I'm somehow in last for outlier

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only one of my bottom ten remaining, lets get rid of it real quick

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PrinceKaro posted...

only one of my bottom ten remaining, lets get rid of it real quick

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17. Guys and Dolls

JONA: 7
Johnbobb: 9
Inviso: 11
Scarlet: 19
Genny: 20
Karo: 24
KBM: 30

JONA - The opening to the movie has some great gags. Marlon Brando and Gene Simmons have great chemistry. Their date is a really fun scene and actually has a bad but charming fight scene. There are also some funny shenanigans with the gangsters and their gambling. Its just all-around engaging with its comedy and romance with no parts that really dragged for me.
Favorite Song: Luck Be a Lady

Johnbobb - I really fucking hated that cat thing. This is one of the first musicals I can remember seeing live, performed by people in my grade in high school. I can't remember much from it, aside from being surprised the fairly conservative school approved the outfits for the cabaret performance and being particularly impressed by the "Sit Down, You're Rocking the Boat" sequence (which was enjoyable here too, if a little briefer than I recall). Marlon Brando is a fantastic actor. While this isn't exactly The Godfather or On the Waterfront, he still stands out here, commanding every scene he's in. Ultimately though, my biggest takeaway here is how little I have to complain about. The whole movie is just constant moments of "ha, that's pretty neat" or "I like this scene" or "hey, this song is catchy." It's the kind of movie that makes me get why showtunes are popular, even if they've never really been my thing.
Favorite song: Sit Down, You're Rockin' the Boat

Inviso - This is another film thats on the longer side, in large part because of an absurd amount of padding involved in the run time. All of Adelaides musical numbers at the Hot Box were superfluous, and the entire Take Sarah to Cuba subplot took a lot of time that could have easily been trimmed down into something more manageable. The plot is fun enough though. Its not that much unlike your standard romcom plot of guy makes a bet to get with a girl, falls in love with her, and things go awry from there. The gangster setting makes for some fun background action, what with the gambling, the hidden craps games, and the league of morality trying to convert sinners to their cause. Again though, I feel like its the musical aspect of this musical that drags it down, by padding out the run time far more than is necessary.

Scarlet - Brando. Sinatra. Despite the music aging poorly and the story being a little forgettable, you cannot ignore the powerhouses at play here. Theres something special about this film.
Best Song: Sit Down, Youre Rocking the Boat

Genny - I was completely ready to dump all over this movie based off the title and opening number alone, but it really ended up surprising me. Guys and Dolls was enjoyable almost the whole way through. The anti-gambling propaganda is a little heavy-handed, particularly in that opening number, but it's all in good fun. Why is everyone in this society so focused on getting rich quick anyway?

Karo - A bunch of gangsters looking for a place to gamble causes a series of events that leads to one of them dating a missionary in a plot that goes just about everywhere except someplace significant.
Basically what happens is one of the guys bets that his dick is so big that he can make any girl fall for him, leading to him being paired up with a frosty religious broad in an odd couple romance that is as unfunny as it is unbelievable.
There's also a secondary plot with a guy and his exotic dancer fiancee, which seems nothing more than a prop to spawn impromptu stage numbers.
The songs are dull, the story boring, none of the guys or dolls are very likable, and ends up being not much more than a lot of crap, and I am not talking about the dice games.

Score: 47/100

Best Song: 'Pet Me Poppa'

KBM - Why I Chose It: The original 1950 stage musical Guys and Dolls has proven an enduring classic, having become a staple of schools and community theaters worldwide, and continuing to receive major revivals in every decade since the '70s. Its original Broadway run won five Tony Awards, including Best Musical, and shortly after it closed in 1953, the highly-anticipated film adaptation went into production, helmed by celebrated director Joseph L. Mankiewicz (best known for 1950's Oscar darling All About Eve and 1953's Julius Caesar), and starring two of the biggest names of the day in Marlon Brando and Frank Sinatra. Production was troubled, with Mankiewicz opposing many of the studio-mandated casting decisions, and Sinatra and Brando not getting along. The finished product polarized critics, who were particularly split on the casting.

My Thoughts: I have been involved in three different productions of the stage show Guys and Dolls I played Arvide Abernathy twelve years ago in my junior year of high school, I was rehearsal accompanist and played keyboards in the pit of another production two years ago, and I am music directing yet another high school production this year. As someone who knows the source material very well, I can't say I'm particularly fond of the movie. The biggest problem, as many critics noted both when the movie came out and in the years since its release, is the casting. Brando should have been cast as Nathan Detroit, while Sinatra should have played Sky Masterson, as the former is more of an actor's role, and the latter is a role that requires a strong singer. Brando's singing voice is very weak, and his duets with Jean Simmons as Sister Sarah are particularly painful as neither of them is capable of staying in tune for very long. Meanwhile, Sinatra just doesn't have the right persona for the role of Nathan Detroit, playing the role in a very wink-wink fashion that would have been far more appropriate for Sky.

In terms of adaptation, well, this movie drags like hell. The Havana sequence in particular, one of the few parts of the movie that goes significantly off-book from the source material, is WAY too long and lacks all the energy that the sequence has on stage. There are other times, however, where the movie sticks to the source material far too literally, such as the opening dance sequence, the crap game dance number in the sewers, or the Sit Down You're Rockin' the Boat musical number, which all feel like they just set up a camera in front of the original stage production and did nothing to make it more visually appealing for film. It all just ends up kinda bland, and it's not a movie I can really recommend, as it just doesn't capture any of the magic of the stage show (which, if I'm being honest, is not one of my favorite shows, but having done it so many times I've at

Fugue for Outliers

Karo: 160
Genny: 157
Inviso: 141
Scarlet: 133
KBM: 132
JONA: 128
Johnbobb: 121

And we're back to Karo in first.

Vengeful_KBM posted...

Best Song: 'Pet Me Poppa'

dear god why

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it's honestly the only song I remembered, they all sucked

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It's a sad day for one of us, as today's first ranking will be the first #1 to drop.

I'm off to work right now, but I'll update when I get home this afternoon.

16. Les parapluies de Cherbourg (The Umbrellas of Cherbourg)

JONA: 1
Scarlet: 5
Genny: 11
KBM: 12
Karo: 22
Johnbobb: 30
Inviso: 32

JONA - Ive never even heard of this movie before the list but Im so glad I watched it. I admire the movie just for the fact that they even went with the style of having both songs and dialogue in time with the music. It makes every line worth paying attention to. Everything flows so well. On top of that is the story and vibe being quite dramatic. It might be a bit too overdramatic but thats also why I like this movie. I ended up being invested in the romance despite it being on the simple side. I liked that we get different perspectives and the movie does a great job at deciding when to switch perspectives. I love the bittersweet feeling of the ending.
Favorite Song: Dans le magasin de parapluies

Scarlet - This is where the list actually begins to couple good music with good writing. Umbrellas is a fascinating piece of filmography, and Catherine Deneuve has a beautiful charisma that cant be ignored.
Best Song: I Will Wait for You

Genny - Pourquoi? This one had the opposite effect on me than Dancer in the Dark where perhaps I didn't enjoy it on some levels quite as much, but the emotions it elicits felt completely deserved, raw, and real. I know why the events of the film had to unfold the way they did, but a part of me will always question why Genevive couldn't hold out for Guy just a little longer. Ah well... C'est la vie!

KBM - Why I Chose It: Winner of the Palme d'Or at the 1964 Cannes Film Festival, and nominated for five Academy Awards (interestingly, over two separate years), this French film is quite unique in that it is essentially an opera written for the screen. Entirely sung-through, the film marked an international career breakthrough for both leading lady Catherine Deneuve and composer Michel Legrand, both of whom went on to have successful careers in Hollywood as well as France. The film's main theme, known in English as I Will Wait For You, went on to become a hit and has been covered countless times by various artists, including the likes of Frank Sinatra, Cher, Tony Bennett, and Louis Armstrong. Connie Francis' version of the song was notably used in the Futurama episode Jurassic Bark.

My Thoughts: Though the plot is at times a bit thin, this movie ended up working quite well for me. I can definitely see where it wouldn't be for everyone, but between Michel Legrand's sweeping, through-sung musical score, the beautifully colorful sets and costumes, and the darker, more melancholic themes lurking just beneath the surface of what otherwise appears to be a pretty standard romance plotline, this film just has a hell of a lot going for it. Particularly heartbreaking is the way Guy is treated by pretty much everyone in his life after coming back from the war, a sad but still-relevant commentary on how soldiers are used by their government and then just expected to slip easily back into civilian life like nothing is wrong. It probably helped that I do speak a decent amount of French and didn't have to rely too heavily on the less-than-artfully translated subtitles to follow what was going on.

Favorite Song: Je ne pourrai jamais vivre sans toi (I Will Wait For You)

Karo - This French girl is the daughter of a struggling umbrella shop proprietor, which is probably having trouble because it is a store that only sells umbrellas and nothing else. I dunno, maybe you should diversify and sell like fucking galoshes or something.
Anyway she falls in love with a mechanic who gets drafted into the army, and the two of them make a promise to be faithful and meet again in two years, a pact that ends up broken for absolutely no reason whatsoever. Seriously, what happens is that this creepy 30s-something motherfucker sees our teenage protagonist one time in the shop and decides he's going to marry her. She doesn't like him or even KNOW him until one day she just decides to randomly be his bride. Her jilted lover comes back from the army and marries his mother's caretaker just because.
Indeed, all the film's romances are forced and hackneyed, lacking any sort of chemistry or even a modicum of sense of how human beings work. This guy didnt say anything bad about pregnancy? How romantic, I'm in loooove! Oh hey my girl didn't wait for me and my mom just died? Well no worries there's this random maid here I guess she'll do as a dick warmer if she tries hard enough! Jesus, even George Lucas can write better romance than this.
The musical style was interesting at first, but after an hour and a half of people talk-singing mundane french life with more melodrama than a teenage girl's diary, that was way more than enough and I almost had a headache. Sacre Bleu.

Score: 49/100

Best Song: Il n'y a pas tellement de chansons dans ce film qu'il y a des gens qui parlent chaque partie du script en couplet en parlant de croissants ou autre.

Johnbobb - Sing-talking for the entire runtime of a musical can sometimes get exhausting, but since it was all in French, everything sounded a bit more elegant (which ultimately made me laugh when the subtitles were things like "Hey, can I borrow a smoke? Gonna go see a movie after work." It's difficult to place exactly why I didn't like it all that much. Everything is done fairly well, but ultimately, I just wasn't nearly as invested in the main couple as I would've needed to be to really get something out of it. Instead, it just kind of felt like a drag after getting over the initial fascination.
Favorite song: n/a

Inviso - Full disclosure, I could not find subtitles for this film, so Im going almost entirely on emotion and a plot synopsis I read after the fact. First off, I hate the formatting of this film. The fact that it goes the Les Mis route of having everything sung, rather than having a handful of strong, set piece songsterrible. And given how slow and melodramatic the plot is, that sort of structuring just becomes all the more laggy and unbearable. The plot feels super generic too: guys falls in love and gets a girl pregnant; guy goes off the war; girl, not knowing if hes coming home, marries a sugar daddy; guy comes back and winds up hooking up with someone else when the love of his life is gone. This does not warrant a musical. Finally, all this film has going for it is the latent memories I have of Jurassic Bark, since that ending song is ALL OVER this film. So yeahbland and not worth watching as a foreign film.

Man, I can't believe we ran into the Wickle/Metropolis problem again.

I fully expected my #1 to not make the top 10 but fuck.

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Les donnes aberrantes de Cherbourg

Karo: 166
Genny: 162
Inviso: 157
Scarlet: 144
JONA: 143
KBM: 136
Johnbobb: 135

Inviso comble l'cart entre lui-mme et ceux qui se sont retrouvs les donnes aberrantes les plus hautes.

This was one of the ones I most wanted to see on the list. I'll definitely have to get around to at some point.

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JONALEON1 posted...

Man, I can't believe we ran into the Wickle/Metropolis problem again.

I fully expected my #1 to not make the top 10 but fuck.

Right? Honestly I don't know why anyone would watch a film in a language they don't know without subtitles. Don't y'all watch anime? Isn't this a regular occurrence?

I TRIED to find subtitles. And I found subtitles for Metropolis. But I just couldn't for this one.

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Sorry, I didn't mean to imply that you hadn't looked - just that the first version I found had subtitles included (as well as everyone else finding versions with such), and I could very easily have pointed you in the right direction had you asked. Ah, well, what's done is done.

15. 1776

Inviso: 8
Scarlet: 11
Karo: 13
KBM: 13
Johnbobb: 17
JONA: 22
Genny: 28

Inviso - Honestly? The ONE thing that holds this film back from being even better is the musical aspect. The storyline is really engaging, and there are long sections that are strictly dialogue and debate, and manage to impress the importance of the events upon the viewers. I know its not necessarily historically accurate, but just watching John Adams fight for every concession he could earnit was exciting. It reminds me of Lincoln, and how interesting the legislative process can be at times, when you craft a story of a divisive issues, and all of the work that went into getting it through congress. But like I said, the songs themselves are what really slow the momentum and reduce my enjoyment of the movie. I dont think any of them are especially memorable, and the end result is the movie being bloated to nearly three hours, when you couldve had a tight, solid story even without the music.

Scarlet - Mister Feeny saves America with musical democracy. Highlight of the movie: King George has diddled these colonies. We wouldnt have Hamilton without 1776, people. Give it the credit its due.
Best Song: Sit Down, John

Karo - Also known as 'that other musical about america's founding fathers', it is a somewhat comical rendition of the events behind the signing of the declaration of independence back when congress was only slightly less dysfunctional than it is now.
It is bloated with a bit too much filler that really didnt have anything to do with the declaration, when a movie is coming up damn near to 3 hours of runtime somebody should have had the nerve to ask if they really needed to include every single song from the stage play.
It is interesting from a historical perspective and is competently enough made, but with the extreme length and lacking of any memorable songs is it something I'd really ever want to watch again? I'll have to abstain. Courteously.

Score: 67/100

Best Song: 'Cool, Cool, Considerate Men'

KBM - Why I Chose It: The musical 1776 is largely remembered today as being the progenitor of the recent smash hit Hamilton. However, 1776 was a rather big hit in its own right, winning three 1969 Tony Awards including Best Musical, and it only took three years after opening on Broadway for the stage show's playwright Peter Stone, director Peter Hunt, and composer Sherman Edwards to adapt their own original 1969 Broadway musical for the screen. The film, which therefore hewed very closely to the stage show and also starred many of the original Broadway cast, was met with mostly positive reviews, with an Oscar nomination for Best Cinematography and a Golden Globe nomination for Best Musical or Comedy. 1776 is also notable for using the exact text from letters and memoirs of the historical figures therein portrayed, in portions of both the dialogue and the lyrics. The show is set to get a new Broadway revival in 2021.

My Thoughts: It's quite possible I'm biased because I grew up with both the show and the movie, but I find 1776 pretty delightful. I still remember seeing the stage show in fourth grade and being absolutely captivated, and then discovering there was a movie and introducing it to my dad, who was similarly impressed. The songs are underrated, with witty lyrics and memorable tunes, the performances are great, and the film really doesn't lose much if anything in translation, which is kind of rare among musicals adapted directly from the screen. This means the film DOES retain the show's tendency to drag a bit at times, especially during the infamous 45-minute chunk in the middle of the show's first act which features no music at all, but for the most part, the script retains just enough knowing humor and gives the characters enough, well, character, that the thing remains at the very least watchable throughout, and often downright compelling. John Adams is probably my favorite Revolutionary-era personality, speaking as a history buff, and he's done proud here. Plus, the show set the stage for such disparate classics as Bloody Bloody Andrew Jackson, Hamilton (of course), and arguably even the likes of Evita, so at the very least you have to give it mad respect for that as, at the time, a lot of people thought writing a successful and engaging stage musical about politicians deliberating over legislation simply couldn't be done.

Favorite Song: Molasses to Rum (Honorable mention to The Lees of Old Virginia which is just outright hilarious especially in the Director's Cut when Lee materializes from a bush to sing one last verse.)

Johnbobb - This is possibly the only musical where the musical sequences are my least favorite part. That's not to say the songs are bad; they're okay. At worst, kind of dull, and at best, overall pleasant. The one exception is Molasses to Rum, which is both an excellent villain song and absolutley ridiculous. The debates, however, are the real meat of the film. The writing is great, the arguments are both compelling and hilarious (despite obviously knowing in advance where it'll end up). Also, gotta mention that Thomas Jefferson of all people being the primary advocate for aboloshing slavery is just bonkers.
Favorite song: Molasses to Rum

JONA - Going in, I knew this just was not gonna be my thing. The movie being really long also didnt help things. I wont deny that there is witty and funny dialogue here, but it just couldnt hold my attention. There are movies I ranked above this which I would say are objectively worse, but I just got more entertainment out of those movies than this. I wish I could somehow abstain from ranking this like the New Yorker I am.
Favorite Song: But, Mr. Adams

Genny - Actually the performances were great, particularly the vocals. However this was just entirely too long to hold my attention the whole way through. I think I'd prefer a different format for my historical documentaries, thanks.

Molasses to Rum to Outliers

Genny: 175
Karo: 168
Inviso: 165
JONA: 150
Scarlet: 148
KBM: 138
Johnbobb: 137

Genny and Karo continue to leapfrog each other with every other ranking or so, leaving Genny once again in front after one of her remaining bottom 10 drops.

Is Dancer in the Dark still in and I just missed it like with Hedwig?

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Dancer in the Dark is still in, yes

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Fun facts: You know we're nearing the upper echelons of the list now because tomorrow's ranking is the first to have three top ten placements.

Is it Dancer in the Dwrk

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