Board 8 > Politics Containment Topic 171: Crazy Like a Fox (& Friends)

(+) Yeah! (+)

The "Maybe she's born with it, maybe it's lies" line can reference Huckabee's looks if you go by the original Maybelline phrase insinuating either you're born with good looks or you added a layer of their product for good looks. In that way, she could be insulted there as a liar who's ugly underneath her smoky eye lie-shadow.

But really though, the point was clearly about Huckabee not being trustworthy.
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While we're talking about attacks on looks though:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Inx7WgtQ4Pk" data-time="

Here's the President attacking Rand Paul on his looks much more directly than Wolf attacked Huckabee on her looks.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s9lcr-wsYOk" data-time="

Here's the President attacking Rosie O'Donnell on her looks much more directly than Wolf attacked Huckabee on her looks.

Both videos were from the 2016 Republican Primaries and are examples of what got Donald nominated in the first place. If someone didn't like what Wolf said, to each their own. That said, a comedian hired to roast a no-show shouldn't be held to a higher standard than the President himself.
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our comedians are held to higher ethical standards than our president

welcome to 2018

I mean Billy Bush lost his job for just listening to what Donald said. Meanwhile, Donald said the phrase locker room talk like twenty times and we made him president.

So thats sort of where our standards are at the moment.
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I think a lot of people miss the point of comedy.

If you're making a joke, saying "You're momma's so ugly" it's funny.
If you're just saying "You're momma's so ugly" you're an asshole.

It's like Ricky Gervais. His transgender joke about transitioning into a monkey. A lot of people found it offensive. Though to be fair, I think that's mostly because a lot of people will take it seriously and be like "Yeah, I totally agree!" and take it as a serious argument.

Now, jokes CAN go too far. Especially if you're bad at it. (See: Trump's attempt in 2016 at comedy). I don't think Michelle Wolf's jokes went very far. Especially when everyone's complaining about how PC we've become.
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Maybe they're jealous that Wolf did their job by calling out SHS for being a fucking liar
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Ashethan posted...

I think a lot of people miss the point of comedy.

If you're making a joke, saying "You're momma's so ugly" it's funny.
If you're just saying "You're momma's so ugly" you're an asshole.

It's like Ricky Gervais. His transgender joke about transitioning into a monkey. A lot of people found it offensive. Though to be fair, I think that's mostly because a lot of people will take it seriously and be like "Yeah, I totally agree!" and take it as a serious argument.

Now, jokes CAN go too far. Especially if you're bad at it. (See: Trump's attempt in 2016 at comedy). I don't think Michelle Wolf's jokes went very far. Especially when everyone's complaining about how PC we've become.

That is, in general the issue with jokes, yes: someone out there might think that you're being serious.

Like...they've done studies and found that if you allow sexist jokes in the workplace, someone will actually take them seriously and be like "Yeah, that guy's on my side, I guess I can do whatever I want to my female coworkers".

And I can confirm that this applies to a much wider variety of jokes too. My very first job, back when I was still kind of clueless about how jobs worked, I had a coworker who would regularly make jokes to the boss about "hey, you don't mind if I just slack off all day today, right?" And I thought he was serious. I thought it was cool if some days we came in and just slacked off and didn't get much done. That didn't end well.

Really well constructed jokes are jokes where nothing really bad happens if people take you literally.
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To be blunt, there's also some degree of knowing your audience.

Lamenting about how people are too PC to laugh at your jokes just tells me that you're a stale comedian who can't adapt with the times.

Granted, roasts are a specific form of comedy, and in that sense, knowing your audience has a different meaning. And Wolf did her job well.
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metroid composite posted...

And I can confirm that this applies to a much wider variety of jokes too. My very first job, back when I was still kind of clueless about how jobs worked, I had a coworker who would regularly make jokes to the boss about "hey, you don't mind if I just slack off all day today, right?" And I thought he was serious. I thought it was cool if some days we came in and just slacked off and didn't get much done. That didn't end well.

Okay, I was with you until this example.
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Kenri posted...

Lightning Strikes posted...

It goes to show how toxic being recklessly "tough" on illegal immigration can be - oops accidentally deported a bunch of legal immigrants who had been here their entire lives. You need to be careful about this stuff.

It's a feature, not a bug. Like take the US, historically we definitely don't check to see if Mexicans are legally here/native-born before deporting them. Or if they're even Mexican before dropping them off in Mexico.

Exactly, though it's worth noting that this didn't come in until May became Home Sec in 2010.

Incidentally the new Home Sec is Sajid Javid. He's the son of a Windrush migrant, and has been very outspoken on this issue so hopefully that's the end of that. He's also a remainer so keeps the brexit balance in the cabinet which is good.
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Just wanna frame the Correspondents' Dinner conversation in a new way:

Comedian Michelle Wolf this week about Sarah Huckabee Sanders: "She burns facts and then she uses that ash to create a perfect smoky eye. Like maybe shes born with it, maybe its lies. Its probably lies.

President Donald Trump last week about Chuck Todd: "Sleepy Eyes Chuck Todd of Fake News NBC."

Both jokes are about liars and how someone's eyes look. Why are people speaking up on Wolf's joke about lies and appearances during a roast more than Trump's joke about lies and appearances during his Presidency?

Partly because Donald has really Git-R-Dun'd "fake news" and her joke was funnier.
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metroid composite posted...

Like...they've done studies and found that if you allow sexist jokes in the workplace, someone will actually take them seriously and be like "Yeah, that guy's on my side, I guess I can do whatever I want to my female coworkers".

That's the thing though. There's a time and place for comedy. At work there's an expectation of decorum. For example, I could say "And with the first pick of the 2018 NFL Draft the Cleveland Browns end the career of Baker Mayfield." But I couldn't for example say "Jenna Jameson recommended the Browns draft Josh Allen. The two do have a lot in common. For example, they both suck hard and they're always fucked." That'd be off color, and inappropriate in that setting.

Joking during standup is entirely different. It's why self depreciation jokes are a big thing. Of course jokes that are in poor taste have to be a lot funnier than other jokes for them to be accepted. But with standup, you go in knowing it's a joke.

Michelle Wolf was obviously telling jokes. Some probably hit a bit close to home for Republicans. Of course they were the same people who spent years calling for Barack Obama's birth certificate and calling him a Muslim--without joking--and now get mad when SHS gets called out on being a liar by a comedian.

I find it silly how Republicans want to stop political correctness... outside of comedy. No expectation of decorum. "Grab em' by the pussy'. "Gays are going to hell' etc... etc... but as soon as a comedian makes fun of them they're the little bitch snowflakes they call liberals all the fucking time. Then again they did feel Mike Pence needed a safe space after Hamilton, so maybe it's not just restricted to comedy, and they just want political correctness without having to show equal respect to libruls.

Also want to add, like someone else asked: When did the perfect smokey eyes become an INSULT to your appearance? I see advertisements for Maybelline way more than I'd like, and they're like "Get the perfect smokey eyes!" (Which is the point of the whole commercial)
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I can see how the image-insult can be imagined from "Maybe shes born with it, maybe its lies. Its probably lies." Still, to focus on that disregards the intent of her joke and one of the recurring themes of her set: it's the lies.

Not that intent is always a good barrier to hide behind for jokes, but Chris Christy took a fat joke with a smile and a spoon in his mouth. Huckabee will be fine.
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Ashethan posted...

they're the little bitch snowflakes they call liberals all the fucking time.

Republicans are masters of projection
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https://twitter.com/realdonaldtrump/status/990928644100034561?s=21

Numerous countries are being considered for the MEETING, but would Peace House/Freedom House, on the Border of North & South Korea, be a more Representative, Important and Lasting site than a third party country? Just asking!

Trump wants YOUR feedback!
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http://thehill.com/homenews/administration/385553-nbc-white-house-chief-of-staff-told-aides-women-more-emotional-than

This is funny considering that Trump might be the most emotional human on Earth
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Not_an_Owl posted...

I feel the same about George Carlin. He was a brilliant philosopher but I find his stuff is just not funny at all.

THANK YOU. whenever i say don't like carlin in the freedom topic, the regulars insist that he's the funniest comedian ever and that "his jokes just don't work for europeans."

i especially hate it when i look up frank zappa stuff on youtube and the people in the comments are like "OMG I MISS ZAPPA AND CARLIN SO MUCH." stop shoving carlin into my zappa discussions, dammit.

(also, i wouldn't call him a "brilliant philosopher" either. never heard him say anything that was all that deep.)
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From what (fairly little) I've seen of his work, Carlin was pretty funny when not trying to be political or philosophical, and worse in terms of both humour and insight than your average youtube comment section troll when he was.
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I really couldn't understand the appeal of any of the Carlin I've seen. When I finally was in a room to watch a full show of his a few years ago I was incredibly confused. I remember asking if I was wrong in my assumption that he was supposed to be a comedian.
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I think he was pretty funny in his younger days. Once the 90s hit, he did way too much angry preaching from the pulpit, not enough actual comedy. About 10-20 years ago, he was one of the go-to guys for enlightened atheists to show everyone else how smart they were. His clips got linked a lot.
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I haven't listened to any of Carlin's acts but from what I'm hearing here, his humor is just not my style.

But then my sense of humor is stupid millennial humor anyways so I'm not really in a place to judge.

Though it sounds like he might've been one of those kinds of comedians that would've called his audience too PC if they boo'd him off the stage.
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This happens to a lot of comedians as they get older.

Compare early bush years John Stewart to the last couple years of his show. The comedy/gag:political/rant ratio goes way into the rant direction.

But this is almost preferable to comedians who just go around repeating the same 10 minute bigs.
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as someone who tries makeup for cosplay I freaking wish I could pull off a smokey eye

eye makeup is impossible

(which is why there's a billion tutorials for it on youtube which are impossible to follow as easily as they appear)
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Carlin arguably has the highest number of superb specials for any comedian. Ya'll are about to make me crack some albums out just so I can remember the names of them.
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Also, Eddv's onto something. Generally for me, maybe not for everybody, but I think most comedians peak with their first album. Many do improve afterward, but a lot have their lives affected by their new celebrity status or some grander thoughts than their previous dick jokes they used to hone so well. Lots of funny stories can come from celebrity lives, don't get me wrong, but also as an example I don't really care who Anthony Jeselnik meets.

I think Steve Martin had the mentality right when he stepped away; paraphrasing here, but audiences more rigidly form their expectations around the artists after a certain point. They care less for new material and demand more of the old material they know they like, like King Tut for him and Rick James for Dave Chappelle.

(speaking of which, Chappelle's last special The Birdcage Theory is a transcendent way to address comedy and celebrity/showbiz)

tl;dr - audiences get invested in famous comedians over the years in a way where their shows are no longer as specifically just about the jokes, so then their laughs-per-minute ratios can afford a drop.
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BowserCuffs posted...

Though it sounds like he might've been one of those kinds of comedians that would've called his audience too PC if they boo'd him off the stage.

Probably, but by the same token it'd take an unusually prudish audience to boo George Carlin offstage

I feel like Carlin would have called them PC and so much more, perhaps even a full verbal thrashing like how Bill Burr flew off against Philadelphia for thirteen minutes.

(I'm not linking it because it's all the way mean and filthy, but it's kind of amazing how in-your-face Burr was at talking shit to an angry audience)
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Louis CK did a really good job at transitioning from his 'I am a poor pathetic loser' shtick to his more recent 'I'm successful and I still don't know what I'm doing with my life' routines.

And then...uh, you know.
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Seginustemple posted...

BowserCuffs posted...

Though it sounds like he might've been one of those kinds of comedians that would've called his audience too PC if they boo'd him off the stage.

Probably, but by the same token it'd take an unusually prudish audience to boo George Carlin offstage

I don't know, this is a guy who joked about being annoyed that he can't make jokes at airports about Arabic guys replacing his suitcase with a bomb, and said "I think rape is hilarious!", there's definitely a lot of people that would be offended by his routine, although they'd be conflicted because when he's not saying that stuff he's ranting about how much he hates Republicans and they'd eat that shit up.
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Panthera posted...

Seginustemple posted...

BowserCuffs posted...

Though it sounds like he might've been one of those kinds of comedians that would've called his audience too PC if they boo'd him off the stage.

Probably, but by the same token it'd take an unusually prudish audience to boo George Carlin offstage

I don't know, this is a guy who joked about being annoyed that he can't make jokes at airports about Arabic guys replacing his suitcase with a bomb, and said "I think rape is hilarious!", there's definitely a lot of people that would be offended by his routine, although they'd be conflicted because when he's not saying that stuff he's ranting about how much he hates Republicans and they'd eat that shit up.

I'm actually really annoyed at how fickle some Democrats can be.

A racist jack-ass is still a racist jack-ass whether he's bashing Republicans or Democrats.
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https://twitter.com/sarahcwestwood/status/991037723770281984

ahahahahahahahahah just burn the whcd down
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Apparently one of the people who alerted Tester about Jackson was...Pences own doctor.

https://twitter.com/cnnbrk/status/991088942098407426?s=21
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Panthera posted...

I don't know, this is a guy who joked about being annoyed that he can't make jokes at airports about Arabic guys replacing his suitcase with a bomb, and said "I think rape is hilarious!", there's definitely a lot of people that would be offended by his routine, although they'd be conflicted because when he's not saying that stuff he's ranting about how much he hates Republicans and they'd eat that shit up.

I think Carlin is hilarious, and I don't think either of those jokes are particularly offensive. I can see how people can get offended by them -- but I think they're blowing it out of proportion. I mean out of context both of those jokes sound like they'd be offensive, but Carlin worked them well imo.
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https://twitter.com/bartongellman/status/991055531237396482?s=21

As evidence that Kelly does not condescend to women, a spokesman says K admonishes aides who swear at meetings that a lady is present. Asked about Ks claim that women are more emotional than men, spox says, well, they are. #nothelping bgell.me/2JCgOZd @NBCNews

PFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFT what a loser
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CelesMyUserName posted...

https://twitter.com/sarahcwestwood/status/991037723770281984

ahahahahahahahahah just burn the whcd down

"conservative comedian" is the funniest joke I've heard today

Paratroopa1 posted...

CelesMyUserName posted...

https://twitter.com/sarahcwestwood/status/991037723770281984

ahahahahahahahahah just burn the whcd down

"conservative comedian" is the funniest joke I've heard today

I refer you to the king of comedy Mike Huckabee
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Paratroopa1 posted...

CelesMyUserName posted...

https://twitter.com/sarahcwestwood/status/991037723770281984

ahahahahahahahahah just burn the whcd down

"conservative comedian" is the funniest joke I've heard today

"Conservative humor" is a fantastic oxymoron. Somebody on another forum I'm on managed to snag it as his handle.
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I mean...there's that cancelled Tim Allen show, right? And that new Roseane.
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So these topics are all basically "Corrik comes up with some insane justification for an equally batshit insane position" and everyone else argues for two pages why Corrik is nuts but he never budges...right?

Granted I only read the first few posts of the last few topics, but this seems to be the longest running theme of this topic series.
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Yep.
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Oh great, WHCD wants to recreate Tough Crowd.

If you thought Wolf planned a rough set of jokes, get two professional comedians going one-on-one in a position where they feel like they have to prove their superior wit and politics on national television in front of the President (lol Donald showing up but you get the point). This won't get personal AT ALL.

This could be like an annual Greg Giraldo VS Denis Leary.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_iFGyN37UPs" data-time="

and then WHCD can call this free speech when they successfully distract the comedians from the staff they traditionally roast
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https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/politics/sen-rubio-corporations-arent-investing-tax-cuts-in-jobs/ar-AAwyUs3

Rubio says corporations arent investing their gains from the tax cuts, and instead are giving executives bonuses.

I cant Imagine anyone could have predicted this.
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Dat Trickle Down.
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ChaosTonyV4 posted...

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/politics/sen-rubio-corporations-arent-investing-tax-cuts-in-jobs/ar-AAwyUs3

Rubio says corporations arent investing their gains from the tax cuts, and instead are giving executives bonuses.

I cant Imagine anyone could have predicted this.

If the goal of the tax cut bill was to give money to the lower classes it would have been accompanied with a significant minimum wage increase.
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https://www.cnn.com/2018/03/30/politics/donald-trump-national-sexual-assault-awareness-month/index.html

"Sexual assault crimes remain tragically common in our society, and offenders too often evade accountability. These heinous crimes are committed indiscriminately: in intimate relationships, in public spaces, and in the workplace," the presidential proclamation from the White House states.

Not the Onion
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ChaosTonyV4 posted...

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/politics/sen-rubio-corporations-arent-investing-tax-cuts-in-jobs/ar-AAwyUs3

Rubio says corporations arent investing their gains from the tax cuts, and instead are giving executives bonuses.

I cant Imagine anyone could have predicted this.

This dumb shit voted for it! Why is he surprised this happened?
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I think the point of that article is that hes not surprised

But yeah he still voted for it lol
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KamikazePotato posted...

Louis CK did a really good job at transitioning from his 'I am a poor pathetic loser' shtick to his more recent 'I'm successful and I still don't know what I'm doing with my life' routines.

And then...uh, you know.

Its a problem he actively discusses in Louie - back before he traveled a lot he had a lot experiences that were common to his audiences, fatherhood, aging, existential angst etc, but as his life became more about the road and traveling....not a lot of people live that way and perhaps ironically even fewer of them do in Tulsa than they do in New York.

I hate that hes such a dirtbag because his material really is top shelf. At least we still have Mark Maron.
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Jakyl25 posted...

I think the point of that article is that hes not surprised

But yeah he still voted for it lol

Rubio is a decently savvy politician. He knows as well as anyone that being Rand Paul or Ted Cruz doesn't win the argument. And once he does win the argument he needs to be able to play the team player card.
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"Team player" that's what they're calling it now. Really.
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