Board 8 > Ace Attorney Topic Part 3: The Maddening (Spoilers for AA1-6, AAI1-2)

(+) Yeah! (+)

I really like a lot of the remixes of Great Revival myself. Edgeworth's objection theme, the cross-examination themes, the AAI ending theme, and the more subdued/refined version that plays when he reappears in the main series. I definitely don't think an Edgeworth/von Karma theme should have stayed exclusive to JFA when the characters are so important in other games too!

Now, evil Engarde's theme (it has some very generic name I think, but you all know which one I mean), that one I don't think I'd have brought back.
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NeoElfboy posted...

Now, evil Engarde's theme (it has some very generic name I think, but you all know which one I mean), that one I don't think I'd have brought back.

I mean it's an investigation theme

they never brought back the real Engarde theme

SeabassDebeste posted...

i'd say day 2 is the best!

I meant 2-4 as a whole
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investigation - core is excellent
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End of 6-5 Investigation 2. Things are about to get crazy and I think I might (partially) know how.

First of all, I think Nayna is Amara. Both have the diamond on their foreheads, and we've never gotten to see Nayna's hair. Also, Amara might be Rayfa's real mother??? The timeline does not match Nahyuta, he's said to be 25 years old and there's no way that's a two-year-old in the picture they found in the safe. It would also explain Nayna's devotion to Rayfa and hide her in plain sight.

Now this is where things get really crazy. I think Dhurke is already dead and Amara is channeling his spirit. Consider the facts:

- Khura'in royalty know the art of spirit channeling.
- Nayna (who is Amara) has been missing since an hour before the murder.
- Dhurke tells Apollo he will soon be dead even if he is found innocent. This is in fact because he already HAS died.
- When Maya channelled Tahrust Inmee, she took on his appearance except for the hair. I don't remember if this was explained or if it was just a visual gag, but even if it's a rule that spirit mediums keep their own hair, remember that we have never seen Nayna's hair. Amara had long hair, so it's a safe assumption that she still does, and there was a can of black hair dye in Inga's residence.

Ergo! When Dhurke went into Amara's tomb, Nayna/Amara must have already been there with Inga. I'm not yet sure who ended up killing Inga, but Dhurke must have also lost his life, probably to a gunshot from Inga. Amara then channeled his spirit to transform into Dhurke, and hid the real Dhurke's body inside the sarcophagus. She (or they, if Dhurke did not die immediately) came up with this plan in order to keep the flame of the rebellion burning just a little longer, because things are already on the brink and Dhurke's death could have dealt a fatal blow to the Defiant Dragons.

Now, I don't have all the pieces to the puzzle figured out, like what Inga's role is in all of this and how Amara came to be Nayna when she was supposedly being held captive, but I think Nayna being Amara and Dhurke being dead are going to be two big twists in the trial.

Obviously don't either confirm or deny any of this, I just wanted to record it for posterity and bragging rights when it turns out I was like 90% correct.
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man I love 6-5
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6-5 so good, looking forward to your commentary after the trial. it's the only 3DS case that stands up there for me.
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I do have it. it's so good. Monica's theories are also pretty fun to read.
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"The prosecution is ready...naturally."

oh man it's on
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edgeworth's burns on phoenix are unparalleled. von karma can control you, but it never feels personal. godot is fantastic but personal digs aren't his strong point. the rest of the lot more rely on verbal/physical gimmicks to establish authority. edgeworth in 2-4 just relentlessly assaults phoenix's character and it's fantastic.
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Well, Edgeworth knows Phoenix the best, so he knows how to get personal and how to get under his skin with his jabs.

"Press as much as you like. Just hurry up with your usual pointless questions."

Same with Gumshoe. He can get pretty brutal with him, too.

"Detective, I'm beginning to see why you were fired."
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man the Judge is in top form here too

Edgeworth: Is that what you're driving at?
Phoenix: That is exactly what I'm driving at!
Judge: Where are we driving? And whose car are we driving?

then later on when Oldbag calls him an amateur, he responds with, "Amateur...? Me...? What am I an amateur of...?"
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and then the queen turned into prosecutor ultimecia. that's cool
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dat transformation
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Such insolence!
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First recess.

Amara = Nayna theory still going strong. Amara channeling Dhurke theory is slightly more shaky now that it seems certain that Inga was already dead, but it's still possible if it's some kind of convoluted gambit by Dhurke to sacrifice himself in order to take down Ga'ran and reinstate Amara on the throne. Anyway, the "Dhurke" in the seance vision must be a plain old disguise because he definitely was still alive at that point.

I thought of prosopagnosia when I saw Inga's notepad, way to crib a plot point from a certain other mystery VN. Not sure about who was channeling 2:30 Inga, but I guess I'll find out soon enough.

That's all for today unfortunately, gotta sleep.
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Mia: Phoenix, drop all of your presumptions. What was in the guitar case was not the bright red guitar.
Phoenix: (You don't mean...it was a bright WHITE guitar?! Wait, that's not right either...)

Phoenix: Let's suppose for a second that the bright red guitar was not the only thing that could have been in the case.
Judge: The bright red guitar not being the only thing...? You don't mean to suggest that a bright BLACK guitar was...

man I love this case
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Edgeworth: Wh-what are you mumbling to yourself about now?! Have you just been rambling all this time without any sense of inner monologue?!

LeonhartFour posted...

man I love this case

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One of my favorite things about the Live Action Ace Attorney movie was that damn stinger at the end with Miles Edgeworth busting out the bright RED guitar
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whew 2-4 trial day 1 over after a whopping ten testimonies

man that final moment with Phoenix sitting there with his head in his hands is so great

also after only half the case 2-4 already has more lines than 1-3 and nearly as many as E1-4
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You could take a couple days off from this playthrough, and actually play the rest as it happens in the timeline if you wanted.
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"People are not always who they appear to be."

that's kind of like the tagline for the entire case because it applies to most of the major players
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Using the bug sweeper to look for the listening device is a fun segment if you're thorough because there's a lot of good banter between Phoenix and Pearl. I feel like I discover a new convo every time I play 2-4.

also I enjoy the mental image of Edgeworth carrying that giant stuffed bear out of the hotel room
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oh my word I just discovered the most amazing exchange that I've somehow missed all these years in 2-4

I've always assumed that once you lock something behind a Psyche-Lock, if you click on the option again with the lock on it, the dialogue will be the same, but it's not! At least not in JFA.

So if you click on Matt's Psyche-Lock option after it appears and Phoenix asks him about the his secret, Engarde goes, "Hang on. I'm gonna consult my lawyer, OK?" and Phoenix's phone actually starts ringing. Validation that the wrist phone actually works!

anyway time to initiate the Hair Flip
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2-4 investigation day 2 complete

Still a strong contender for best investigation day in the series.
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also Phoenix has officially broken the 10,000 lines mark which puts him nearly 4 times ahead of second place now

and it's probably going to be cutting it close as to whether 2-4 passes 1-5 in total lines by the end
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LeonhartFour posted...

oh my word I just discovered the most amazing exchange that I've somehow missed all these years in 2-4

I've always assumed that once you lock something behind a Psyche-Lock, if you click on the option again with the lock on it, the dialogue will be the same, but it's not! At least not in JFA.

So if you click on Matt's Psyche-Lock option after it appears and Phoenix asks him about the his secret, Engarde goes, "Hang on. I'm gonna consult my lawyer, OK?" and Phoenix's phone actually starts ringing. Validation that the wrist phone actually works!

anyway time to initiate the Hair Flip

Hey this is awesome
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Sounds like it's time for a recount for scientific accuracy
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LeonhartFour posted...

I've always assumed that once you lock something behind a Psyche-Lock, if you click on the option again with the lock on it, the dialogue will be the same, but it's not! At least not in JFA.

So if you click on Matt's Psyche-Lock option after it appears and Phoenix asks him about the his secret, Engarde goes, "Hang on. I'm gonna consult my lawyer, OK?" and Phoenix's phone actually starts ringing. Validation that the wrist phone actually works!

i actually remember this! the first time playing through, i was massively inefficient and really bad at psyche-locks, so i wouldn't know when i had everything ready. immensely frustrating, but i did get this "you shall not pass" text!

LeonhartFour posted...

2-4 investigation day 2 complete

Still a strong contender for best investigation day in the series.

i think only 3-5 day 1 and 6-5 day 1 can compete! though 6-5's is mainly because of the ending.
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4-4 day 2 is the right answer but I know you hate it!
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oh, ignoring 4-0 (which isn't really investigation), i did really like that, too. best part of that game by far.
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transience posted...

4-4 day 2 is the right answer but I know you hate it!

MASON System is great, but I don't think it's #1. Top 5 though.
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I made this list once. I think 3-5 day 2, 4-4 day 2 and 2-4 day 2 are probably the top 3 in some order. 2-4 day 2 is probably the top, if only because it probably is better than trial day 2.
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then again, 4-4 trial day 2

but that barely counts
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transience posted...

then again, 4-4 trial day 2

but that barely counts

the fact that it barely registers is exactly why 4-4 day 2 as an overall day isn't up there near the top
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3-5 day 2 investigation...?
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SeabassDebeste posted...

3-5 day 2 investigation...?

I mean yeah it's a great investigation day

I know you loathe giving 3-5 any sort of credit as a top tier case but yeah
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LeonhartFour posted...

SeabassDebeste posted...

3-5 day 2 investigation...?

I mean yeah it's a great investigation day

I know you loathe giving 3-5 any sort of credit as a top tier case but yeah

SeabassDebeste posted...

i think only 3-5 day 1 and 6-5 day 1 can compete!

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3-5 day 1 can't compete with day 2. it only resonates because of the novelty of Edgeworth, I think.
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3-5 Day 1 is great because it's glorious fanservice, but it's also subtly misleading because very little that happens on day 1 with Edgeworth actually matters in the grand scheme of the case.
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I might even go further and say that day 0 is better than day 1?
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3-5 is definitely the best prologue. Of course, most prologues aren't as in-depth as that one, but yeah.
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am i being trolled here? that prologue was awful
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SeabassDebeste posted...

am i being trolled here? that prologue was awful

in other words you only like the Edgeworth stuff

man I didn't see that coming
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the edgeworth stuff alone is enough to make it a borderline top-10 case

but a boring location with another maya-is-missing storyline and a super-obvious victim?

also identical twins as a plot device ugh
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Hazakura Temple is a great location, even if only because you immediately make the connection to 3-4 as soon as you see Dusky Bridge.

I actually didn't figure out Elise was Misty Fey until you find the charm and it literally goes into the Court Record as Kurain Master Talisman, which was just an "oh I guess I was supposed to know already" moment.

also who cares if they use a cliche as a plot device if they use it effectively (which 3-5 did)

as soon as I saw the picture of Iris in the magazine I was all in on 3-5
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yeah there is a ton of good in that intro. I didn't get misty fey at all -- I should have with the talisman but I dunno.

the bikini lock, the earthquake, the five locks, Godot shutting down Franziska, Pearl's lock.. yeah, day 2 is great. probably not as good as 2-4 day 2 though just because the big moments of that case take place there, whereas the big moments of 3-5 are in trial day 2.
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I love how Will Powers freezes up in the very first press in the very first testimony because he's utterly terrified Phoenix is going to make him out to be the killer

also I liked the callback to the 2-1 intro at the beginning of this segment
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the powers testimony is probably the best part of trial day 2

the 2-1 intro is pretty pointless without the callback - pretty sure it was put at the beginning of 2-1 with full intent to be recalled in 2-4
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I love Will Powers's appearance in 2-4, it's really understated but he really adds a lot to the case I think.

the 2-1 intro was just a cool thing for them to show off with and for them to connect with Wellington's ringtone in preparation for Phoenix nailing him at the end with it

also it wouldn't even matter if the intro was pointless because believe it or not it's okay to put cool stuff in just to be cool

and no Will isn't the best part of trial day 2 but he's great because all of trial day 2 is great
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