Current Events > Did anyone see the full video of the Daniel Shaver killing.

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cjsdowg 12/08/17 8:32:25 AM #1:	ast year's fatal shooting of a Texas man by Arizona police was caught on body-camera video and showed him sobbing with his hands up, begging for his life in his final moments. Jurors who watched the full video showing Daniel Shaver's final moments during an emotional six-weeklong murder trial agreed Thursday to acquit former Mesa officer Philip Mitchell Brailsford. The former officer faced as much as 25 years in prison for the second-degree murder charge. https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/daniel-shaver-shooting-ex-arizona-police-officer-not-guilty-murder-n827641 --- I am not posting the full video since he shows someone being killed and I am pretty sure that violates the TOS. But it was a damn shame. --- Bender: Well, everybody, I just saved a turtle. What have you done with your lives? <cite>cjsdowg posted [p:891814819] in Did anyone... [t:76075309]...</cite> <quote><quote>ast year's fatal shooting of a Texas man by Arizona police was caught on body-camera video and showed him sobbing with his hands up, begging for his life in his final moments. Jurors who watched the full video showing Daniel Shaver's final moments during an emotional six-weeklong murder trial agreed Thursday to acquit former Mesa officer Philip Mitchell Brailsford. The former officer faced as much as 25 years in prison for the second-degree murder charge. </quote> https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/daniel-shaver-shooting-ex-arizona-police-officer-not-guilty-murder-n827641 --- I am not posting the full video since he shows someone being killed and I am pretty sure that violates the TOS. But it was a damn shame.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
_OujiDoza_ 12/08/17 8:37:06 AM #2:	Fucking horrible. Also, because the guy killed was white, the usual suspects won't have a thing to say other than "see we are killed by the cops, too" which then sheds light on an even bigger problem and why cops will always get away with this bullshit. --- R.I.P. Bilbo-Swaggins: Victim of the CommunistFAQS Regime \|Brian-Dawkins\|http://i.imgtc.com/5yil6xS.jpg. <cite>_OujiDoza_ posted [p:891814962] in Did anyone... [t:76075309]...</cite> <quote>Fucking horrible. Also, because the guy killed was white, the usual suspects won't have a thing to say other than "see we are killed by the cops, too" which then sheds light on an even bigger problem and why cops will always get away with this bullshit.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
trappedunderice 12/08/17 9:10:22 AM #3:	Wow the piece of shit cop had the dude crawling on his knees begging not to be shot, clearly the officer wasn't in any danger, he should be behind bars, what a joke. --- You can't beat a classic. <cite>trappedunderice posted [p:891816119] in Did anyone... [t:76075309]...</cite> <quote>Wow the piece of shit cop had the dude crawling on his knees begging not to be shot, clearly the officer wasn't in any danger, he should be behind bars, what a joke.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Ushiromiya 12/08/17 9:11:57 AM #4:	That section of the article alone is incredibly depressing --- http://i.imgur.com/11wM01O.gif http://i.imgur.com/2IO7osX.png <cite>Ushiromiya posted [p:891816187] in Did anyone... [t:76075309]...</cite> <quote>That section of the article alone is incredibly depressing</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
TheVipaGTS 12/08/17 9:15:29 AM #5:	On the ground, begging for his life, told to crawl, does so....and the officer still "feared for his life"....and the jury bought that shit? Fuckin horrible..../ --- Dallas Cowboys: 1 - 1 <cite>TheVipaGTS posted [p:891816304] in Did anyone... [t:76075309]...</cite> <quote>On the ground, begging for his life, told to crawl, does so....and the officer still "feared for his life"....and the jury bought that shit? Fuckin horrible..../</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
That_Happened 12/08/17 9:17:15 AM #6:	TheVipaGTS posted... On the ground, begging for his life, told to crawl, does so....and the officer still "feared for his life"....and the jury bought that shit? Fuckin horrible..../ Because he reached toward his waistband, which was probably just to pull up his pants that were falling because the police told him to crawl to them. Fucking cops. --- http://fusionanomaly.net/magnoliabutitdidhappen.jpg <cite>That_Happened posted [p:891816373] in Did anyone... [t:76075309]...</cite> <quote><cite>TheVipaGTS posted...</cite> <quote>On the ground, begging for his life, told to crawl, does so....and the officer still "feared for his life"....and the jury bought that shit? Fuckin horrible..../</quote> Because he reached toward his waistband, which was probably just to pull up his pants that were falling because the police told him to crawl to them. Fucking cops.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
eston 12/08/17 9:18:46 AM #7:	Why the fuck were they making him crawl? What purpose did that serve? --- http://i73.photobucket.com/albums/i215/estonc/grizzly_bear_chairs_2.jpg http://i.imgur.com/8kjZU.jpg <cite>eston posted [p:891816428] in Did anyone... [t:76075309]...</cite> <quote>Why the fuck were they making him crawl? What purpose did that serve?</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
k darkfire 12/08/17 9:21:03 AM #8:	He shouldn't have ignored orders. LEO feared he had a gu. <cite>k darkfire posted [p:891816525] in Did anyone... [t:76075309]...</cite> <quote>He shouldn't have ignored orders. LEO feared he had a gu.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
That_Happened 12/08/17 9:22:22 AM #9:	k darkfire posted... LEO feared he had a gu. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JQmfgHTiZQ8 --- http://fusionanomaly.net/magnoliabutitdidhappen.jpg <cite>That_Happened posted [p:891816575] in Did anyone... [t:76075309]...</cite> <quote><cite>k darkfire posted...</cite> <quote>LEO feared he had a gu.</quote> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JQmfgHTiZQ8</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Delirious_Beard 12/08/17 6:03:45 PM #10:	fucking disgusting --- http://i.imgur.com/5UL2v5u.gif "Does our ruin benefit the earth? Does it help the grass to grow, the sun to shine? Is this darkness in you, too?" <cite>Delirious_Beard posted [p:891845140] in Did anyone... [t:76075309]...</cite> <quote>fucking disgusting</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Solar_Crimson 12/08/17 6:08:39 PM #11:	Delirious_Beard posted... fucking disgusting --- http://i.imgur.com/wKOoZkP.jpg http://i.imgur.com/mipFVFw.png http://backloggery.com/SolarCrimson <cite>Solar_Crimson posted [p:891845361] in Did anyone... [t:76075309]...</cite> <quote><cite>Delirious_Beard posted...</cite> <quote>fucking disgusting</quote></quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Giant_Aspirin 12/08/17 6:14:58 PM #12:	this is absolutely indefensible. that cop is a complete asshole on a power trip like nothing i've seen before. the fact he was acquitted is nothing short of appalling --- Now Playing: South Park: FbW (PC), Cuphead (PC) *(~);} - Get out the pans, don't just stand there dreamin' - {;(~)* <cite>Giant_Aspirin posted [p:891845684] in Did anyone... [t:76075309]...</cite> <quote>this is absolutely indefensible. that cop is a complete asshole on a power trip like nothing i've seen before. the fact he was acquitted is nothing short of appalling</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
_RETS_ 12/08/17 6:16:50 PM #13:	Copy and pasted from the other topic Yes it is a high tension situation. It is for the officer as well. Reports were the guy was armed because he was seen with a gun. There was no indication that he had no gun on him. He reached suddenly for his waistband. If you're the cop, 10 times of 10 you would shoot as well. You wait long enough to see what the suspect is rapidly reaching for and you're dead. That's why it is ill advised to make rapid movements at all, much less reach for your waist. I'm not calling what I saw emotional appeal. I'm saying headlines saying "man crying for his life shot dead by police" is emotional appeal to manipulate people into immediately siding against the police. Nothing about crying limits someone from still reaching for a gun or firing on an officer. The crying and begging part is irrelevant. The only relevant points are: - Man is seen in hotel window with rifle with another person - other patrons see this and justifiably call the police -police respond to reported armed suspect - police order suspect down and then suspect is ordered to crawl toward officer for apprehension - suspect, still justifiably presumed to be armed, reached rapidly for waist band - officer fires upon seeing this action These are the objective facts. Any hurt, knowing these facts and seeing them in video would also acquit. It is a horrible outcome, but the jury made the right call. It wasn't murder. It was a cop reacting to a reportedly armed suspect that reached for their waist. <cite>_RETS_ posted [p:891845783] in Did anyone... [t:76075309]...</cite> <quote>Copy and pasted from the other topic Yes it is a high tension situation. It is for the officer as well. Reports were the guy was armed because he was seen with a gun. There was no indication that he had no gun on him. He reached suddenly for his waistband. If you're the cop, 10 times of 10 you would shoot as well. You wait long enough to see what the suspect is rapidly reaching for and you're dead. That's why it is ill advised to make rapid movements at all, much less reach for your waist. I'm not calling what I saw emotional appeal. I'm saying headlines saying "man crying for his life shot dead by police" is emotional appeal to manipulate people into immediately siding against the police. Nothing about crying limits someone from still reaching for a gun or firing on an officer. The crying and begging part is irrelevant. The only relevant points are: - Man is seen in hotel window with rifle with another person - other patrons see this and justifiably call the police -police respond to reported armed suspect - police order suspect down and then suspect is ordered to crawl toward officer for apprehension - suspect, still justifiably presumed to be armed, reached rapidly for waist band - officer fires upon seeing this action These are the objective facts. Any hurt, knowing these facts and seeing them in video would also acquit. It is a horrible outcome, but the jury made the right call. It wasn't murder. It was a cop reacting to a reportedly armed suspect that reached for their waist.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Giant_Aspirin 12/08/17 6:20:20 PM #14:	_RETS_ posted... Copy and pasted from the other topic Yes it is a high tension situation. It is for the officer as well. Reports were the guy was armed because he was seen with a gun. There was no indication that he had no gun on him. He reached suddenly for his waistband. If you're the cop, 10 times of 10 you would shoot as well. You wait long enough to see what the suspect is rapidly reaching for and you're dead. That's why it is ill advised to make rapid movements at all, much less reach for your waist. I'm not calling what I saw emotional appeal. I'm saying headlines saying "man crying for his life shot dead by police" is emotional appeal to manipulate people into immediately siding against the police. Nothing about crying limits someone from still reaching for a gun or firing on an officer. The crying and begging part is irrelevant. The only relevant points are: - Man is seen in hotel window with rifle with another person - other patrons see this and justifiably call the police -police respond to reported armed suspect - police order suspect down and then suspect is ordered to crawl toward officer for apprehension - suspect, still justifiably presumed to be armed, reached rapidly for waist band - officer fires upon seeing this action These are the objective facts. Any hurt, knowing these facts and seeing them in video would also acquit. It is a horrible outcome, but the jury made the right call. It wasn't murder. It was a cop reacting to a reportedly armed suspect that reached for their waist. any cop who legitimately thought that guy was hiding a rifle behind his back is unqualified for even the most basic of jobs involving intelligent thought. you have got to be fucking kidding me if they really thought he was hiding a fucking rifle behind his back why not just have him do a 360 spin to show them there was nothing there? --- Now Playing: South Park: FbW (PC), Cuphead (PC) *(~);} - Get out the pans, don't just stand there dreamin' - {;(~)* <cite>Giant_Aspirin posted [p:891845969] in Did anyone... [t:76075309]...</cite> <quote><cite>_RETS_ posted...</cite> <quote>Copy and pasted from the other topic Yes it is a high tension situation. It is for the officer as well. Reports were the guy was armed because he was seen with a gun. There was no indication that he had no gun on him. He reached suddenly for his waistband. If you're the cop, 10 times of 10 you would shoot as well. You wait long enough to see what the suspect is rapidly reaching for and you're dead. That's why it is ill advised to make rapid movements at all, much less reach for your waist. I'm not calling what I saw emotional appeal. I'm saying headlines saying "man crying for his life shot dead by police" is emotional appeal to manipulate people into immediately siding against the police. Nothing about crying limits someone from still reaching for a gun or firing on an officer. The crying and begging part is irrelevant. The only relevant points are: - Man is seen in hotel window with rifle with another person - other patrons see this and justifiably call the police -police respond to reported armed suspect - police order suspect down and then suspect is ordered to crawl toward officer for apprehension - suspect, still justifiably presumed to be armed, reached rapidly for waist band - officer fires upon seeing this action These are the objective facts. Any hurt, knowing these facts and seeing them in video would also acquit. It is a horrible outcome, but the jury made the right call. It wasn't murder. It was a cop reacting to a reportedly armed suspect that reached for their waist.</quote> any cop who legitimately thought that guy was hiding a rifle behind his back is unqualified for even the most basic of jobs involving intelligent thought. you have got to be fucking kidding me if they really thought he was hiding a fucking rifle behind his back why not just have him do a 360 spin to show them there was nothing there?</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Zikten 12/08/17 6:20:58 PM #15:	it's not fair that the cops get the advantage when both sides are stressed out. basically the message is that when a suspect and a cop are both stressed and freaking out, the cop always gets the benefit. both sides maybe were scared but the government sides with the cop every time. the cops are supposed to protect us, but the laws are set up so that a scared cop is allowed to murder people. the guy wasn't thinking straight. he didn't expect to be shot for pulling his pants up and he was scared out of his mind. fuck that cop. they shouldn't have made him crawl anyway. that was a poor order to make. it increased the tension and directly lead to the death. <cite>Zikten posted [p:891846005] in Did anyone... [t:76075309]...</cite> <quote>it's not fair that the cops get the advantage when both sides are stressed out. basically the message is that when a suspect and a cop are both stressed and freaking out, the cop always gets the benefit. both sides maybe were scared but the government sides with the cop every time. the cops are supposed to protect us, but the laws are set up so that a scared cop is allowed to murder people. the guy wasn't thinking straight. he didn't expect to be shot for pulling his pants up and he was scared out of his mind. fuck that cop. they shouldn't have made him crawl anyway. that was a poor order to make. it increased the tension and directly lead to the death.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
_RETS_ 12/08/17 6:22:41 PM #16:	Giant_Aspirin posted... _RETS_ posted... Copy and pasted from the other topic Yes it is a high tension situation. It is for the officer as well. Reports were the guy was armed because he was seen with a gun. There was no indication that he had no gun on him. He reached suddenly for his waistband. If you're the cop, 10 times of 10 you would shoot as well. You wait long enough to see what the suspect is rapidly reaching for and you're dead. That's why it is ill advised to make rapid movements at all, much less reach for your waist. I'm not calling what I saw emotional appeal. I'm saying headlines saying "man crying for his life shot dead by police" is emotional appeal to manipulate people into immediately siding against the police. Nothing about crying limits someone from still reaching for a gun or firing on an officer. The crying and begging part is irrelevant. The only relevant points are: - Man is seen in hotel window with rifle with another person - other patrons see this and justifiably call the police -police respond to reported armed suspect - police order suspect down and then suspect is ordered to crawl toward officer for apprehension - suspect, still justifiably presumed to be armed, reached rapidly for waist band - officer fires upon seeing this action These are the objective facts. Any hurt, knowing these facts and seeing them in video would also acquit. It is a horrible outcome, but the jury made the right call. It wasn't murder. It was a cop reacting to a reportedly armed suspect that reached for their waist. any cop who legitimately thought that guy was hiding a rifle behind his back is unqualified for even the most basic of jobs involving intelligent thought. you have got to be fucking kidding me Come on man... don't pretend to be dumb. He was seen with a rifle. If someone is reported to be armed, there is no reason to believe they only have a single weapon. In fact, you should assume they dont just have a single weapon. I doubt the officer thought he was reaching for a rifle, but there is absolutely no reason at all to assume, given the facts I laid out above, that he wouldn't also have a handgun. <cite>_RETS_ posted [p:891846098] in Did anyone... [t:76075309]...</cite> <quote><cite>Giant_Aspirin posted...</cite> <quote><cite>_RETS_ posted...</cite> <quote>Copy and pasted from the other topic Yes it is a high tension situation. It is for the officer as well. Reports were the guy was armed because he was seen with a gun. There was no indication that he had no gun on him. He reached suddenly for his waistband. If you're the cop, 10 times of 10 you would shoot as well. You wait long enough to see what the suspect is rapidly reaching for and you're dead. That's why it is ill advised to make rapid movements at all, much less reach for your waist. I'm not calling what I saw emotional appeal. I'm saying headlines saying "man crying for his life shot dead by police" is emotional appeal to manipulate people into immediately siding against the police. Nothing about crying limits someone from still reaching for a gun or firing on an officer. The crying and begging part is irrelevant. The only relevant points are: - Man is seen in hotel window with rifle with another person - other patrons see this and justifiably call the police -police respond to reported armed suspect - police order suspect down and then suspect is ordered to crawl toward officer for apprehension - suspect, still justifiably presumed to be armed, reached rapidly for waist band - officer fires upon seeing this action These are the objective facts. Any hurt, knowing these facts and seeing them in video would also acquit. It is a horrible outcome, but the jury made the right call. It wasn't murder. It was a cop reacting to a reportedly armed suspect that reached for their waist.</quote> any cop who legitimately thought that guy was hiding a rifle behind his back is unqualified for even the most basic of jobs involving intelligent thought. you have got to be fucking kidding me</quote> Come on man... don't pretend to be dumb. He was seen with a rifle. If someone is reported to be armed, there is no reason to believe they only have a single weapon. In fact, you should assume they dont just have a single weapon. I doubt the officer thought he was reaching for a rifle, but there is absolutely no reason at all to assume, given the facts I laid out above, that he wouldn't also have a handgun.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
_RETS_ 12/08/17 6:27:05 PM #17:	Zikten posted... it's not fair that the cops get the advantage when both sides are stressed out. basically the message is that when a suspect and a cop are both stressed and freaking out, the cop always gets the benefit. both sides maybe were scared but the government sides with the cop every time. the cops are supposed to protect us, but the laws are set up so that a scared cop is allowed to murder people. the guy wasn't thinking straight. he didn't expect to be shot for pulling his pants up and he was scared out of his mind. fuck that cop. they shouldn't have made him crawl anyway. that was a poor order to make. it increased the tension and directly lead to the death. The government didn't acquit him. We, meaning citizens, did. The guy reaching for his waist was reasonably perceived to be a threat. You would have shot too. As for the crawl order, could easily be to get the guy away from his hotel room door, since there were 2 people seen when patrons saw him with the rifle. The order would be right so it doesn't put the cop in front of the room that can be reasonably assumed, given the reports, to contain a second armed individual. Everyone needs to pump the breaks on the fake outrage and apply some thought. Literally every single one of you ITT would shoot the guy who you have been told is armed and reaches for his waistband. Every single fucking one of you. <cite>_RETS_ posted [p:891846336] in Did anyone... [t:76075309]...</cite> <quote><cite>Zikten posted...</cite> <quote>it's not fair that the cops get the advantage when both sides are stressed out. basically the message is that when a suspect and a cop are both stressed and freaking out, the cop always gets the benefit. both sides maybe were scared but the government sides with the cop every time. the cops are supposed to protect us, but the laws are set up so that a scared cop is allowed to murder people. the guy wasn't thinking straight. he didn't expect to be shot for pulling his pants up and he was scared out of his mind. fuck that cop. they shouldn't have made him crawl anyway. that was a poor order to make. it increased the tension and directly lead to the death.</quote> The government didn't acquit him. We, meaning citizens, did. The guy reaching for his waist was reasonably perceived to be a threat. You would have shot too. As for the crawl order, could easily be to get the guy away from his hotel room door, since there were 2 people seen when patrons saw him with the rifle. The order would be right so it doesn't put the cop in front of the room that can be reasonably assumed, given the reports, to contain a second armed individual. Everyone needs to pump the breaks on the fake outrage and apply some thought. Literally every single one of you ITT would shoot the guy who you have been told is armed and reaches for his waistband. Every single fucking one of you.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Giant_Aspirin 12/08/17 6:28:50 PM #18:	_RETS_ posted... Giant_Aspirin posted... _RETS_ posted... Copy and pasted from the other topic Yes it is a high tension situation. It is for the officer as well. Reports were the guy was armed because he was seen with a gun. There was no indication that he had no gun on him. He reached suddenly for his waistband. If you're the cop, 10 times of 10 you would shoot as well. You wait long enough to see what the suspect is rapidly reaching for and you're dead. That's why it is ill advised to make rapid movements at all, much less reach for your waist. I'm not calling what I saw emotional appeal. I'm saying headlines saying "man crying for his life shot dead by police" is emotional appeal to manipulate people into immediately siding against the police. Nothing about crying limits someone from still reaching for a gun or firing on an officer. The crying and begging part is irrelevant. The only relevant points are: - Man is seen in hotel window with rifle with another person - other patrons see this and justifiably call the police -police respond to reported armed suspect - police order suspect down and then suspect is ordered to crawl toward officer for apprehension - suspect, still justifiably presumed to be armed, reached rapidly for waist band - officer fires upon seeing this action These are the objective facts. Any hurt, knowing these facts and seeing them in video would also acquit. It is a horrible outcome, but the jury made the right call. It wasn't murder. It was a cop reacting to a reportedly armed suspect that reached for their waist. any cop who legitimately thought that guy was hiding a rifle behind his back is unqualified for even the most basic of jobs involving intelligent thought. you have got to be fucking kidding me Come on man... don't pretend to be dumb. He was seen with a rifle. If someone is reported to be armed, there is no reason to believe they only have a single weapon. In fact, you should assume they dont just have a single weapon. I doubt the officer thought he was reaching for a rifle, but there is absolutely no reason at all to assume, given the facts I laid out above, that he wouldn't also have a handgun. valid point about another gun being a possibility. regardless, if i was on that jury i would have found the cop guilty based on watching that video. --- Now Playing: South Park: FbW (PC), Cuphead (PC) *(~);} - Get out the pans, don't just stand there dreamin' - {;(~)* <cite>Giant_Aspirin posted [p:891846427] in Did anyone... [t:76075309]...</cite> <quote><cite>_RETS_ posted...</cite> <quote><cite>Giant_Aspirin posted...</cite> <quote><cite>_RETS_ posted...</cite> <quote>Copy and pasted from the other topic Yes it is a high tension situation. It is for the officer as well. Reports were the guy was armed because he was seen with a gun. There was no indication that he had no gun on him. He reached suddenly for his waistband. If you're the cop, 10 times of 10 you would shoot as well. You wait long enough to see what the suspect is rapidly reaching for and you're dead. That's why it is ill advised to make rapid movements at all, much less reach for your waist. I'm not calling what I saw emotional appeal. I'm saying headlines saying "man crying for his life shot dead by police" is emotional appeal to manipulate people into immediately siding against the police. Nothing about crying limits someone from still reaching for a gun or firing on an officer. The crying and begging part is irrelevant. The only relevant points are: - Man is seen in hotel window with rifle with another person - other patrons see this and justifiably call the police -police respond to reported armed suspect - police order suspect down and then suspect is ordered to crawl toward officer for apprehension - suspect, still justifiably presumed to be armed, reached rapidly for waist band - officer fires upon seeing this action These are the objective facts. Any hurt, knowing these facts and seeing them in video would also acquit. It is a horrible outcome, but the jury made the right call. It wasn't murder. It was a cop reacting to a reportedly armed suspect that reached for their waist.</quote> any cop who legitimately thought that guy was hiding a rifle behind his back is unqualified for even the most basic of jobs involving intelligent thought. you have got to be fucking kidding me</quote> Come on man... don't pretend to be dumb. He was seen with a rifle. If someone is reported to be armed, there is no reason to believe they only have a single weapon. In fact, you should assume they dont just have a single weapon. I doubt the officer thought he was reaching for a rifle, but there is absolutely no reason at all to assume, given the facts I laid out above, that he wouldn't also have a handgun.</quote> valid point about another gun being a possibility. regardless, if i was on that jury i would have found the cop guilty based on watching that video.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Zikten 12/08/17 6:29:27 PM #19:	I could not and would not shoot a man begging for his life. <cite>Zikten posted [p:891846463] in Did anyone... [t:76075309]...</cite> <quote>I could not and would not shoot a man begging for his life.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
billcom6 12/08/17 6:30:15 PM #20:	How has Admiral defended this? Cause I know he will somehow. --- Because most days are bad days... --- Steam and XBOX Live: billcom6 My Teams: The Ohio State Buckeyes, New York Yankees, Buffalo Bills, The CBJ, Cavs <cite>billcom6 posted [p:891846510] in Did anyone... [t:76075309]...</cite> <quote>How has Admiral defended this? Cause I know he will somehow.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
_RETS_ 12/08/17 6:31:20 PM #21:	Zikten posted... I could not and would not shoot a man begging for his life. This suggests that it is entirely unprecedented and impossible for a suspect to feign cooperation before drawing a gun. The cop didn't shoot a man begging for his life. He shot a man, credibly believed to be armed, reaching rapidly toward his waistband. You are being extremely dishonest. <cite>_RETS_ posted [p:891846565] in Did anyone... [t:76075309]...</cite> <quote><cite>Zikten posted...</cite> <quote>I could not and would not shoot a man begging for his life.</quote> This suggests that it is entirely unprecedented and impossible for a suspect to feign cooperation before drawing a gun. The cop didn't shoot a man begging for his life. He shot a man, credibly believed to be armed, reaching rapidly toward his waistband. You are being extremely dishonest.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
_RETS_ 12/08/17 6:32:13 PM #22:	Giant_Aspirin posted... _RETS_ posted... Giant_Aspirin posted... _RETS_ posted... Copy and pasted from the other topic Yes it is a high tension situation. It is for the officer as well. Reports were the guy was armed because he was seen with a gun. There was no indication that he had no gun on him. He reached suddenly for his waistband. If you're the cop, 10 times of 10 you would shoot as well. You wait long enough to see what the suspect is rapidly reaching for and you're dead. That's why it is ill advised to make rapid movements at all, much less reach for your waist. I'm not calling what I saw emotional appeal. I'm saying headlines saying "man crying for his life shot dead by police" is emotional appeal to manipulate people into immediately siding against the police. Nothing about crying limits someone from still reaching for a gun or firing on an officer. The crying and begging part is irrelevant. The only relevant points are: - Man is seen in hotel window with rifle with another person - other patrons see this and justifiably call the police -police respond to reported armed suspect - police order suspect down and then suspect is ordered to crawl toward officer for apprehension - suspect, still justifiably presumed to be armed, reached rapidly for waist band - officer fires upon seeing this action These are the objective facts. Any hurt, knowing these facts and seeing them in video would also acquit. It is a horrible outcome, but the jury made the right call. It wasn't murder. It was a cop reacting to a reportedly armed suspect that reached for their waist. any cop who legitimately thought that guy was hiding a rifle behind his back is unqualified for even the most basic of jobs involving intelligent thought. you have got to be fucking kidding me Come on man... don't pretend to be dumb. He was seen with a rifle. If someone is reported to be armed, there is no reason to believe they only have a single weapon. In fact, you should assume they dont just have a single weapon. I doubt the officer thought he was reaching for a rifle, but there is absolutely no reason at all to assume, given the facts I laid out above, that he wouldn't also have a handgun. valid point about another gun being a possibility. regardless, if i was on that jury i would have found the cop guilty based on watching that video. Guilty of What? He was charged with murder right? He was objectively not guilty of murder. <cite>_RETS_ posted [p:891846615] in Did anyone... [t:76075309]...</cite> <quote><cite>Giant_Aspirin posted...</cite> <quote><cite>_RETS_ posted...</cite> <quote><cite>Giant_Aspirin posted...</cite> <quote><cite>_RETS_ posted...</cite> <quote>Copy and pasted from the other topic Yes it is a high tension situation. It is for the officer as well. Reports were the guy was armed because he was seen with a gun. There was no indication that he had no gun on him. He reached suddenly for his waistband. If you're the cop, 10 times of 10 you would shoot as well. You wait long enough to see what the suspect is rapidly reaching for and you're dead. That's why it is ill advised to make rapid movements at all, much less reach for your waist. I'm not calling what I saw emotional appeal. I'm saying headlines saying "man crying for his life shot dead by police" is emotional appeal to manipulate people into immediately siding against the police. Nothing about crying limits someone from still reaching for a gun or firing on an officer. The crying and begging part is irrelevant. The only relevant points are: - Man is seen in hotel window with rifle with another person - other patrons see this and justifiably call the police -police respond to reported armed suspect - police order suspect down and then suspect is ordered to crawl toward officer for apprehension - suspect, still justifiably presumed to be armed, reached rapidly for waist band - officer fires upon seeing this action These are the objective facts. Any hurt, knowing these facts and seeing them in video would also acquit. It is a horrible outcome, but the jury made the right call. It wasn't murder. It was a cop reacting to a reportedly armed suspect that reached for their waist.</quote> any cop who legitimately thought that guy was hiding a rifle behind his back is unqualified for even the most basic of jobs involving intelligent thought. you have got to be fucking kidding me</quote> Come on man... don't pretend to be dumb. He was seen with a rifle. If someone is reported to be armed, there is no reason to believe they only have a single weapon. In fact, you should assume they dont just have a single weapon. I doubt the officer thought he was reaching for a rifle, but there is absolutely no reason at all to assume, given the facts I laid out above, that he wouldn't also have a handgun.</quote> valid point about another gun being a possibility. regardless, if i was on that jury i would have found the cop guilty based on watching that video.</quote> Guilty of What? He was charged with murder right? He was objectively not guilty of murder.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
EnterTheTekken 12/08/17 6:34:19 PM #23:	LOL at the national media finally caring about this story, which has been out for MONTHS. It finally took Mark Geragos representing the family to get this some pub. <cite>EnterTheTekken posted [p:891846704] in Did anyone... [t:76075309]...</cite> <quote>LOL at the national media finally caring about this story, which has been out for MONTHS. It finally took Mark Geragos representing the family to get this some pub.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Giant_Aspirin 12/08/17 6:34:38 PM #24:	_RETS_ posted... Guilty of What? He was charged with murder right? He was objectively not guilty of murder. agree to disagree i guess, i consider that cold blooded murder. --- Now Playing: South Park: FbW (PC), Cuphead (PC) *(~);} - Get out the pans, don't just stand there dreamin' - {;(~)* <cite>Giant_Aspirin posted [p:891846724] in Did anyone... [t:76075309]...</cite> <quote><cite>_RETS_ posted...</cite> <quote>Guilty of What? He was charged with murder right? He was objectively not guilty of murder.</quote> agree to disagree i guess, i consider that cold blooded murder.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Zikten 12/08/17 6:36:48 PM #25:	_RETS_ posted... You are being extremely dishonest. you can think that but I could never bring myself to kill someone in that position. maybe it would be a ruse and I'd get killed. whatever. I guess I'd just die then I couldn't live with myself after if the guy was innocent and I blew him away <cite>Zikten posted [p:891846853] in Did anyone... [t:76075309]...</cite> <quote><cite>_RETS_ posted...</cite> <quote>You are being extremely dishonest.</quote> you can think that but I could never bring myself to kill someone in that position. maybe it would be a ruse and I'd get killed. whatever. I guess I'd just die then I couldn't live with myself after if the guy was innocent and I blew him away</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Keith_Valentine 12/08/17 6:40:51 PM #26:	As a cop, you are trained to use critical analysis. Not just your gun. Overweight sobbing kid. Why did he need to crawl? Why didn't they just order him lying facedown, arms and legs spread? Then secure him that way. If they keep letting these cops off, they will keep killing people. It has to stop. This is voluntary manslaughter, I don't care what excuse they use. He should serve prison time. <cite>Keith_Valentine posted [p:891847088] in Did anyone... [t:76075309]...</cite> <quote>As a cop, you are trained to use critical analysis. Not just your gun. Overweight sobbing kid. Why did he need to crawl? Why didn't they just order him lying facedown, arms and legs spread? Then secure him that way. If they keep letting these cops off, they will keep killing people. It has to stop. This is voluntary manslaughter, I don't care what excuse they use. He should serve prison time.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
_RETS_ 12/08/17 6:40:57 PM #27:	Giant_Aspirin posted... _RETS_ posted... Guilty of What? He was charged with murder right? He was objectively not guilty of murder. agree to disagree i guess, i consider that cold blooded murder. If you relent the possibility the guy could have another gun, and you see that guy reaching for his waist, you can't possibly think it's cold blooded murder with any degree of honesty. It is horrible the guy died because of the whole fucked up scenario, but it is not an unjustifiable cold blooded murder that everyone is pretending it is. <cite>_RETS_ posted [p:891847093] in Did anyone... [t:76075309]...</cite> <quote><cite>Giant_Aspirin posted...</cite> <quote><cite>_RETS_ posted...</cite> <quote>Guilty of What? He was charged with murder right? He was objectively not guilty of murder.</quote> agree to disagree i guess, i consider that cold blooded murder.</quote> If you relent the possibility the guy could have another gun, and you see that guy reaching for his waist, you can't possibly think it's cold blooded murder with any degree of honesty. It is horrible the guy died because of the whole fucked up scenario, but it is not an unjustifiable cold blooded murder that everyone is pretending it is.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
_RETS_ 12/08/17 6:41:48 PM #28:	Zikten posted... _RETS_ posted... You are being extremely dishonest. you can think that but I could never bring myself to kill someone in that position. maybe it would be a ruse and I'd get killed. whatever. I guess I'd just die then I couldn't live with myself after if the guy was innocent and I blew him away How honorable of you. Not everyone is so willing to die in the line of duty if they can prevent it. <cite>_RETS_ posted [p:891847136] in Did anyone... [t:76075309]...</cite> <quote><cite>Zikten posted...</cite> <quote><cite>_RETS_ posted...</cite> <quote>You are being extremely dishonest.</quote> you can think that but I could never bring myself to kill someone in that position. maybe it would be a ruse and I'd get killed. whatever. I guess I'd just die then I couldn't live with myself after if the guy was innocent and I blew him away</quote> How honorable of you. Not everyone is so willing to die in the line of duty if they can prevent it.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Zikten 12/08/17 6:42:01 PM #29:	wasn't this cop fired? he got fired if I remember right, right after the shooting. and then had the trial. that means even his fellow cops thought it was fucked up <cite>Zikten posted [p:891847143] in Did anyone... [t:76075309]...</cite> <quote>wasn't this cop fired? he got fired if I remember right, right after the shooting. and then had the trial. that means even his fellow cops thought it was fucked up</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
_RETS_ 12/08/17 6:42:42 PM #30:	Keith_Valentine posted... As a cop, you are trained to use critical analysis. Not just your gun. Overweight sobbing kid. Why did he need to crawl? Why didn't they just order him lying facedown, arms and legs spread? Then secure him that way. If they keep letting these cops off, they will keep killing people. It has to stop. This is voluntary manslaughter, I don't care what excuse they use. He should serve prison time. I already explained possible justification for having him crawl. I can repost it if youd like. <cite>_RETS_ posted [p:891847185] in Did anyone... [t:76075309]...</cite> <quote><cite>Keith_Valentine posted...</cite> <quote>As a cop, you are trained to use critical analysis. Not just your gun. Overweight sobbing kid. Why did he need to crawl? Why didn't they just order him lying facedown, arms and legs spread? Then secure him that way. If they keep letting these cops off, they will keep killing people. It has to stop. This is voluntary manslaughter, I don't care what excuse they use. He should serve prison time.</quote> I already explained possible justification for having him crawl. I can repost it if youd like.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Keith_Valentine 12/08/17 6:43:54 PM #31:	Zikten posted... wasn't this cop fired? he got fired if I remember right, right after the shooting. and then had the trial. that means even his fellow cops thought it was fucked up Fired two months later for multiple offenses , including unsatisfactory performance. <cite>Keith_Valentine posted [p:891847257] in Did anyone... [t:76075309]...</cite> <quote><cite>Zikten posted...</cite> <quote>wasn't this cop fired? he got fired if I remember right, right after the shooting. and then had the trial. that means even his fellow cops thought it was fucked up</quote> Fired two months later for multiple offenses , including unsatisfactory performance.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
_RETS_ 12/08/17 6:43:56 PM #32:	Zikten posted... wasn't this cop fired? he got fired if I remember right, right after the shooting. and then had the trial. that means even his fellow cops thought it was fucked up Being fired for something doesn't make it illegal and it doesn't make it murder. But, and I'm not sure about this, I think he was fired for unrelated reasons anyway. <cite>_RETS_ posted [p:891847264] in Did anyone... [t:76075309]...</cite> <quote><cite>Zikten posted...</cite> <quote>wasn't this cop fired? he got fired if I remember right, right after the shooting. and then had the trial. that means even his fellow cops thought it was fucked up</quote> Being fired for something doesn't make it illegal and it doesn't make it murder. But, and I'm not sure about this, I think he was fired for unrelated reasons anyway.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Keith_Valentine 12/08/17 6:44:20 PM #33:	_RETS_ posted... Keith_Valentine posted... As a cop, you are trained to use critical analysis. Not just your gun. Overweight sobbing kid. Why did he need to crawl? Why didn't they just order him lying facedown, arms and legs spread? Then secure him that way. If they keep letting these cops off, they will keep killing people. It has to stop. This is voluntary manslaughter, I don't care what excuse they use. He should serve prison time. I already explained possible justification for having him crawl. I can repost it if youd like. I don't need your explanation. I'm telling you. <cite>Keith_Valentine posted [p:891847290] in Did anyone... [t:76075309]...</cite> <quote><cite>_RETS_ posted...</cite> <quote><cite>Keith_Valentine posted...</cite> <quote>As a cop, you are trained to use critical analysis. Not just your gun. Overweight sobbing kid. Why did he need to crawl? Why didn't they just order him lying facedown, arms and legs spread? Then secure him that way. If they keep letting these cops off, they will keep killing people. It has to stop. This is voluntary manslaughter, I don't care what excuse they use. He should serve prison time.</quote> I already explained possible justification for having him crawl. I can repost it if youd like.</quote> I don't need your explanation. I'm telling you.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
berlyman101 12/08/17 6:45:03 PM #34:	_RETS_ posted... Zikten posted... I could not and would not shoot a man begging for his life. This suggests that it is entirely unprecedented and impossible for a suspect to feign cooperation before drawing a gun. The cop didn't shoot a man begging for his life. He shot a man, credibly believed to be armed, reaching rapidly toward his waistband. You are being extremely dishonest. That the police assume this right away despite and are legally protected with it and use it to shoot down innocent citizens with assault rifles is beyond a joke and horrifying. I don't know why you're defending his actions. If you can see why he would shoot the man, you can see why he failed horribly to ensure his own safety and that of his officers. You could see that his orders were contradictory and clumsy, and that his communication was ineffective. You could see why the guy who got shot begging on his knees and sobbing was put in a situation to fail. All of this culminated in a situation where he chose to infer that he needed to use deadly force. Unfortunately this is the standard. Yet you think there's nothing wrong with any of what the police did? You think there's nothing wrong with laws that support shooting someone who could have been neutralized but was instead terrorized? Need I remind you that shortly after they sacked the guy for sucking at his job? Is there nothing there that sheds light on any of this? --- http://www.lukesurl.com/comics/2010-02-24-determinism.png <cite>berlyman101 posted [p:891847331] in Did anyone... [t:76075309]...</cite> <quote><cite>_RETS_ posted...</cite> <quote><cite>Zikten posted...</cite> <quote>I could not and would not shoot a man begging for his life.</quote> This suggests that it is entirely unprecedented and impossible for a suspect to feign cooperation before drawing a gun. The cop didn't shoot a man begging for his life. He shot a man, credibly believed to be armed, reaching rapidly toward his waistband. You are being extremely dishonest.</quote> That the police assume this right away despite and are legally protected with it and use it to shoot down innocent citizens with assault rifles is beyond a joke and horrifying. I don't know why you're defending his actions. If you can see why he would shoot the man, you can see why he failed horribly to ensure his own safety and that of his officers. You could see that his orders were contradictory and clumsy, and that his communication was ineffective. You could see why the guy who got shot begging on his knees and sobbing was put in a situation to fail. All of this culminated in a situation where he chose to infer that he needed to use deadly force. Unfortunately this is the standard. Yet you think there's nothing wrong with any of what the police did? You think there's nothing wrong with laws that support shooting someone who could have been neutralized but was instead terrorized? Need I remind you that shortly after they sacked the guy for sucking at his job? Is there nothing there that sheds light on any of this?</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Keith_Valentine 12/08/17 6:46:07 PM #35:	_RETS_ posted... Giant_Aspirin posted... _RETS_ posted... Guilty of What? He was charged with murder right? He was objectively not guilty of murder. agree to disagree i guess, i consider that cold blooded murder. If you relent the possibility the guy could have another gun, and you see that guy reaching for his waist, you can't possibly think it's cold blooded murder with any degree of honesty. It is horrible the guy died because of the whole fucked up scenario, but it is not an unjustifiable cold blooded murder that everyone is pretending it is. This dudes right. It's not murder. Murder requires motivation and intent. This is voluntary manslaughter in law. A killing. There's a difference. It would be a murder if the cop knew this guy , and was looking for an excuse to kill him. Shit like that. <cite>Keith_Valentine posted [p:891847385] in Did anyone... [t:76075309]...</cite> <quote><cite>_RETS_ posted...</cite> <quote><cite>Giant_Aspirin posted...</cite> <quote><cite>_RETS_ posted...</cite> <quote>Guilty of What? He was charged with murder right? He was objectively not guilty of murder.</quote> agree to disagree i guess, i consider that cold blooded murder.</quote> If you relent the possibility the guy could have another gun, and you see that guy reaching for his waist, you can't possibly think it's cold blooded murder with any degree of honesty. It is horrible the guy died because of the whole fucked up scenario, but it is not an unjustifiable cold blooded murder that everyone is pretending it is.</quote> This dudes right. It's not murder. Murder requires motivation and intent. This is voluntary manslaughter in law. A killing. There's a difference. It would be a murder if the cop knew this guy , and was looking for an excuse to kill him. Shit like that.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
_RETS_ 12/08/17 6:46:40 PM #36:	Keith_Valentine posted... _RETS_ posted... Keith_Valentine posted... As a cop, you are trained to use critical analysis. Not just your gun. Overweight sobbing kid. Why did he need to crawl? Why didn't they just order him lying facedown, arms and legs spread? Then secure him that way. If they keep letting these cops off, they will keep killing people. It has to stop. This is voluntary manslaughter, I don't care what excuse they use. He should serve prison time. I already explained possible justification for having him crawl. I can repost it if youd like. I don't need your explanation. I'm telling you. "I have already decided to be outraged because the media tells me I should be, so I refuse to apply any critical thought or look at the scenario objectively." Thanks for saving me the trouble. <cite>_RETS_ posted [p:891847418] in Did anyone... [t:76075309]...</cite> <quote><cite>Keith_Valentine posted...</cite> <quote><cite>_RETS_ posted...</cite> <quote><cite>Keith_Valentine posted...</cite> <quote>As a cop, you are trained to use critical analysis. Not just your gun. Overweight sobbing kid. Why did he need to crawl? Why didn't they just order him lying facedown, arms and legs spread? Then secure him that way. If they keep letting these cops off, they will keep killing people. It has to stop. This is voluntary manslaughter, I don't care what excuse they use. He should serve prison time.</quote> I already explained possible justification for having him crawl. I can repost it if youd like.</quote> I don't need your explanation. I'm telling you.</quote> "I have already decided to be outraged because the media tells me I should be, so I refuse to apply any critical thought or look at the scenario objectively." Thanks for saving me the trouble.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Zikten 12/08/17 6:46:41 PM #37:	berlyman101 posted... _RETS_ posted... Zikten posted... I could not and would not shoot a man begging for his life. This suggests that it is entirely unprecedented and impossible for a suspect to feign cooperation before drawing a gun. The cop didn't shoot a man begging for his life. He shot a man, credibly believed to be armed, reaching rapidly toward his waistband. You are being extremely dishonest. That the police assume this right away despite and are legally protected with it and use it to shoot down innocent citizens with assault rifles is beyond a joke and horrifying. I don't know why you're defending his actions. If you can see why he would shoot the man, you can see why he failed horribly to ensure his own safety and that of his officers. You could see that his orders were contradictory and clumsy, and that his communication was ineffective. You could see why the guy who got shot begging on his knees and sobbing was put in a situation to fail. All of this culminated in a situation where he chose to infer that he needed to use deadly force. Unfortunately this is the standard. Yet you think there's nothing wrong with any of what the police did? You think there's nothing wrong with laws that support shooting someone who could have been neutralized but was instead terrorized? Need I remind you that shortly after they sacked the guy for sucking at his job? Is there nothing there that sheds light on any of this? this, so hard basically, in these situations people love to victim blame. but the cop is the one with high tension training. the victim is just a normal citizen. so why do people blame the victim when it happens? the cop is the one with the training and should be acting better <cite>Zikten posted [p:891847421] in Did anyone... [t:76075309]...</cite> <quote><cite>berlyman101 posted...</cite> <quote><cite>_RETS_ posted...</cite> <quote><cite>Zikten posted...</cite> <quote>I could not and would not shoot a man begging for his life.</quote> This suggests that it is entirely unprecedented and impossible for a suspect to feign cooperation before drawing a gun. The cop didn't shoot a man begging for his life. He shot a man, credibly believed to be armed, reaching rapidly toward his waistband. You are being extremely dishonest.</quote> That the police assume this right away despite and are legally protected with it and use it to shoot down innocent citizens with assault rifles is beyond a joke and horrifying. I don't know why you're defending his actions. If you can see why he would shoot the man, you can see why he failed horribly to ensure his own safety and that of his officers. You could see that his orders were contradictory and clumsy, and that his communication was ineffective. You could see why the guy who got shot begging on his knees and sobbing was put in a situation to fail. All of this culminated in a situation where he chose to infer that he needed to use deadly force. Unfortunately this is the standard. Yet you think there's nothing wrong with any of what the police did? You think there's nothing wrong with laws that support shooting someone who could have been neutralized but was instead terrorized? Need I remind you that shortly after they sacked the guy for sucking at his job? Is there nothing there that sheds light on any of this?</quote> this, so hard basically, in these situations people love to victim blame. but the cop is the one with high tension training. the victim is just a normal citizen. so why do people blame the victim when it happens? the cop is the one with the training and should be acting better</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
_RETS_ 12/08/17 6:49:43 PM #38:	berlyman101 posted... _RETS_ posted... Zikten posted... I could not and would not shoot a man begging for his life. This suggests that it is entirely unprecedented and impossible for a suspect to feign cooperation before drawing a gun. The cop didn't shoot a man begging for his life. He shot a man, credibly believed to be armed, reaching rapidly toward his waistband. You are being extremely dishonest. That the police assume this right away despite and are legally protected with it and use it to shoot down innocent citizens with assault rifles is beyond a joke and horrifying. I don't know why you're defending his actions. If you can see why he would shoot the man, you can see why he failed horribly to ensure his own safety and that of his officers. You could see that his orders were contradictory and clumsy, and that his communication was ineffective. You could see why the guy who got shot begging on his knees and sobbing was put in a situation to fail. All of this culminated in a situation where he chose to infer that he needed to use deadly force. Unfortunately this is the standard. Yet you think there's nothing wrong with any of what the police did? You think there's nothing wrong with laws that support shooting someone who could have been neutralized but was instead terrorized? Need I remind you that shortly after they sacked the guy for sucking at his job? Is there nothing there that sheds light on any of this? The guy was doing just fine crawling. He acknowledged that he understood the order and complied. Then he reached for his waistband. The cop has no way of knowing if he was pulling up his pants, reaching for a gun, whatever. But given the situation, it is more reasonable to assume the latter and you have to make a split second decision. The cop should have never been charged with murder. <cite>_RETS_ posted [p:891847556] in Did anyone... [t:76075309]...</cite> <quote><cite>berlyman101 posted...</cite> <quote><cite>_RETS_ posted...</cite> <quote><cite>Zikten posted...</cite> <quote>I could not and would not shoot a man begging for his life.</quote> This suggests that it is entirely unprecedented and impossible for a suspect to feign cooperation before drawing a gun. The cop didn't shoot a man begging for his life. He shot a man, credibly believed to be armed, reaching rapidly toward his waistband. You are being extremely dishonest.</quote> That the police assume this right away despite and are legally protected with it and use it to shoot down innocent citizens with assault rifles is beyond a joke and horrifying. I don't know why you're defending his actions. If you can see why he would shoot the man, you can see why he failed horribly to ensure his own safety and that of his officers. You could see that his orders were contradictory and clumsy, and that his communication was ineffective. You could see why the guy who got shot begging on his knees and sobbing was put in a situation to fail. All of this culminated in a situation where he chose to infer that he needed to use deadly force. Unfortunately this is the standard. Yet you think there's nothing wrong with any of what the police did? You think there's nothing wrong with laws that support shooting someone who could have been neutralized but was instead terrorized? Need I remind you that shortly after they sacked the guy for sucking at his job? Is there nothing there that sheds light on any of this?</quote> The guy was doing just fine crawling. He acknowledged that he understood the order and complied. Then he reached for his waistband. The cop has no way of knowing if he was pulling up his pants, reaching for a gun, whatever. But given the situation, it is more reasonable to assume the latter and you have to make a split second decision. The cop should have never been charged with murder.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
ScazarMeltex 12/08/17 6:52:02 PM #39:	The worship of police in this country has to stop. The victim in this scenario has no training on how to deal with twitchy asshole cops. The police officer has had plenty of training on how to deal with situations like this. Excusing this lapse of judgment that ended with an innocent man dead is exactly why this shit will keep on happening. --- "If you wish to converse with me define your terms" Voltaire <cite>ScazarMeltex posted [p:891847647] in Did anyone... [t:76075309]...</cite> <quote>The worship of police in this country has to stop. The victim in this scenario has no training on how to deal with twitchy asshole cops. The police officer has had plenty of training on how to deal with situations like this. Excusing this lapse of judgment that ended with an innocent man dead is exactly why this shit will keep on happening.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
_RETS_ 12/08/17 6:53:12 PM #40:	ScazarMeltex posted... The worship of police in this country has to stop. The victim in this scenario has no training on how to deal with twitchy asshole cops. The police officer has had plenty of training on how to deal with situations like this. Excusing this lapse of judgment that ended with an innocent man dead is exactly why this shit will keep on happening. Reportedly armed suspect reaches quickly for waistband. Murder was the wrong charge. <cite>_RETS_ posted [p:891847706] in Did anyone... [t:76075309]...</cite> <quote><cite>ScazarMeltex posted...</cite> <quote>The worship of police in this country has to stop. The victim in this scenario has no training on how to deal with twitchy asshole cops. The police officer has had plenty of training on how to deal with situations like this. Excusing this lapse of judgment that ended with an innocent man dead is exactly why this shit will keep on happening.</quote> Reportedly armed suspect reaches quickly for waistband. Murder was the wrong charge.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Keith_Valentine 12/08/17 6:55:20 PM #41:	_RETS_ posted... Keith_Valentine posted... _RETS_ posted... Keith_Valentine posted... As a cop, you are trained to use critical analysis. Not just your gun. Overweight sobbing kid. Why did he need to crawl? Why didn't they just order him lying facedown, arms and legs spread? Then secure him that way. If they keep letting these cops off, they will keep killing people. It has to stop. This is voluntary manslaughter, I don't care what excuse they use. He should serve prison time. I already explained possible justification for having him crawl. I can repost it if youd like. I don't need your explanation. I'm telling you. "I have already decided to be outraged because the media tells me I should be, so I refuse to apply any critical thought or look at the scenario objectively." Thanks for saving me the trouble. No, I will answer you seriously. We've been in dangerous situations. This guy is a cop , he is trained to be in dangerous situations. It's part of the job of enforcing the law. I've seen some shit, dealt with plenty of cops. I get the threat of a weapon . This cop is screaming at this kid 'I will kill you'. Right off the bat that's wrong. You don't get to threaten to kill people. You WARN them that you will use force and shoot if t hey take any aggressive action. You order them facedown, arms and legs spread wide. His partner was there securing the target. Approach and secure his hands and feet. There were no other threats. Now the analysis. This perp is sobbing and scared, because the cop is telling him he will kill him. Extremely unprofessional. Then he kills the guy on top of it while he's drunkenly crawling at him. Not ok, totally unacceptable behavior from an officer. He needs to be punished as an example that you can't get trigger happy everytime you're scared. He deserves prison time for how badly he fucked that up. <cite>Keith_Valentine posted [p:891847813] in Did anyone... [t:76075309]...</cite> <quote><cite>_RETS_ posted...</cite> <quote><cite>Keith_Valentine posted...</cite> <quote><cite>_RETS_ posted...</cite> <quote><cite>Keith_Valentine posted...</cite> <quote>As a cop, you are trained to use critical analysis. Not just your gun. Overweight sobbing kid. Why did he need to crawl? Why didn't they just order him lying facedown, arms and legs spread? Then secure him that way. If they keep letting these cops off, they will keep killing people. It has to stop. This is voluntary manslaughter, I don't care what excuse they use. He should serve prison time.</quote> I already explained possible justification for having him crawl. I can repost it if youd like.</quote> I don't need your explanation. I'm telling you.</quote> "I have already decided to be outraged because the media tells me I should be, so I refuse to apply any critical thought or look at the scenario objectively." Thanks for saving me the trouble.</quote> No, I will answer you seriously. We've been in dangerous situations. This guy is a cop , he is trained to be in dangerous situations. It's part of the job of enforcing the law. I've seen some shit, dealt with plenty of cops. I get the threat of a weapon . This cop is screaming at this kid 'I will kill you'. Right off the bat that's wrong. You don't get to threaten to kill people. You WARN them that you will use force and shoot if t hey take any aggressive action. You order them facedown, arms and legs spread wide. His partner was there securing the target. Approach and secure his hands and feet. There were no other threats. Now the analysis. This perp is sobbing and scared, because the cop is telling him he will kill him. Extremely unprofessional. Then he kills the guy on top of it while he's drunkenly crawling at him. Not ok, totally unacceptable behavior from an officer. He needs to be punished as an example that you can't get trigger happy everytime you're scared. He deserves prison time for how badly he fucked that up.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Keith_Valentine 12/08/17 6:57:22 PM #42:	_RETS_ posted... ScazarMeltex posted... The worship of police in this country has to stop. The victim in this scenario has no training on how to deal with twitchy asshole cops. The police officer has had plenty of training on how to deal with situations like this. Excusing this lapse of judgment that ended with an innocent man dead is exactly why this shit will keep on happening. Reportedly armed suspect reaches quickly for waistband. Murder was the wrong charge. Voluntary manslaughter, as I've been saying. Trying to charge him with murder for max sentence was grand standing and stupid. Proly some asshole trying to make a name <cite>Keith_Valentine posted [p:891847931] in Did anyone... [t:76075309]...</cite> <quote><cite>_RETS_ posted...</cite> <quote><cite>ScazarMeltex posted...</cite> <quote>The worship of police in this country has to stop. The victim in this scenario has no training on how to deal with twitchy asshole cops. The police officer has had plenty of training on how to deal with situations like this. Excusing this lapse of judgment that ended with an innocent man dead is exactly why this shit will keep on happening.</quote> Reportedly armed suspect reaches quickly for waistband. Murder was the wrong charge.</quote> Voluntary manslaughter, as I've been saying. Trying to charge him with murder for max sentence was grand standing and stupid. Proly some asshole trying to make a name</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
_RETS_ 12/08/17 6:58:29 PM #43:	Keith_Valentine posted... _RETS_ posted... Keith_Valentine posted... _RETS_ posted... Keith_Valentine posted... As a cop, you are trained to use critical analysis. Not just your gun. Overweight sobbing kid. Why did he need to crawl? Why didn't they just order him lying facedown, arms and legs spread? Then secure him that way. If they keep letting these cops off, they will keep killing people. It has to stop. This is voluntary manslaughter, I don't care what excuse they use. He should serve prison time. I already explained possible justification for having him crawl. I can repost it if youd like. I don't need your explanation. I'm telling you. "I have already decided to be outraged because the media tells me I should be, so I refuse to apply any critical thought or look at the scenario objectively." Thanks for saving me the trouble. No, I will answer you seriously. We've been in dangerous situations. This guy is a cop , he is trained to be in dangerous situations. It's part of the job of enforcing the law. I've seen some shit, dealt with plenty of cops. I get the threat of a weapon . This cop is screaming at this kid 'I will kill you'. Right off the bat that's wrong. You don't get to threaten to kill people. You WARN them that you will use force and shoot if t hey take any aggressive action. You order them facedown, arms and legs spread wide. His partner was there securing the target. Approach and secure his hands and feet. There were no other threats. Now the analysis. This perp is sobbing and scared, because the cop is telling him he will kill him. Extremely unprofessional. Then he kills the guy on top of it while he's drunkenly crawling at him. Not ok, totally unacceptable behavior from an officer. He needs to be punished as an example that you can't get trigger happy everytime you're scared. He deserves prison time for how badly he fucked that up. I agree with unprofessionalism. But that isn't illegal and it isn't murder. Did there happen to be no other second party? Yes. But the guy was seen in his room with someone else with a visible rifle. As an officer, I (and you as well) would want this guy away from his room that can be reasonably suspected, given the reports, to contain another armed individual. <cite>_RETS_ posted [p:891847989] in Did anyone... [t:76075309]...</cite> <quote><cite>Keith_Valentine posted...</cite> <quote><cite>_RETS_ posted...</cite> <quote><cite>Keith_Valentine posted...</cite> <quote><cite>_RETS_ posted...</cite> <quote><cite>Keith_Valentine posted...</cite> <quote>As a cop, you are trained to use critical analysis. Not just your gun. Overweight sobbing kid. Why did he need to crawl? Why didn't they just order him lying facedown, arms and legs spread? Then secure him that way. If they keep letting these cops off, they will keep killing people. It has to stop. This is voluntary manslaughter, I don't care what excuse they use. He should serve prison time.</quote> I already explained possible justification for having him crawl. I can repost it if youd like.</quote> I don't need your explanation. I'm telling you.</quote> "I have already decided to be outraged because the media tells me I should be, so I refuse to apply any critical thought or look at the scenario objectively." Thanks for saving me the trouble.</quote> No, I will answer you seriously. We've been in dangerous situations. This guy is a cop , he is trained to be in dangerous situations. It's part of the job of enforcing the law. I've seen some shit, dealt with plenty of cops. I get the threat of a weapon . This cop is screaming at this kid 'I will kill you'. Right off the bat that's wrong. You don't get to threaten to kill people. You WARN them that you will use force and shoot if t hey take any aggressive action. You order them facedown, arms and legs spread wide. His partner was there securing the target. Approach and secure his hands and feet. There were no other threats. Now the analysis. This perp is sobbing and scared, because the cop is telling him he will kill him. Extremely unprofessional. Then he kills the guy on top of it while he's drunkenly crawling at him. Not ok, totally unacceptable behavior from an officer. He needs to be punished as an example that you can't get trigger happy everytime you're scared. He deserves prison time for how badly he fucked that up.</quote> I agree with unprofessionalism. But that isn't illegal and it isn't murder. Did there happen to be no other second party? Yes. But the guy was seen in his room with someone else with a visible rifle. As an officer, I (and you as well) would want this guy away from his room that can be reasonably suspected, given the reports, to contain another armed individual.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
_RETS_ 12/08/17 6:59:46 PM #44:	Keith_Valentine posted... _RETS_ posted... ScazarMeltex posted... The worship of police in this country has to stop. The victim in this scenario has no training on how to deal with twitchy asshole cops. The police officer has had plenty of training on how to deal with situations like this. Excusing this lapse of judgment that ended with an innocent man dead is exactly why this shit will keep on happening. Reportedly armed suspect reaches quickly for waistband. Murder was the wrong charge. Voluntary manslaughter, as I've been saying. Trying to charge him with murder for max sentence was grand standing and stupid. Proly some asshole trying to make a name I agree. It sucks because a guy is dead who happened to be unarmed and it feels like someone should be held accountable, but charging him with murder was uncalled for <cite>_RETS_ posted [p:891848050] in Did anyone... [t:76075309]...</cite> <quote><cite>Keith_Valentine posted...</cite> <quote><cite>_RETS_ posted...</cite> <quote><cite>ScazarMeltex posted...</cite> <quote>The worship of police in this country has to stop. The victim in this scenario has no training on how to deal with twitchy asshole cops. The police officer has had plenty of training on how to deal with situations like this. Excusing this lapse of judgment that ended with an innocent man dead is exactly why this shit will keep on happening.</quote> Reportedly armed suspect reaches quickly for waistband. Murder was the wrong charge.</quote> Voluntary manslaughter, as I've been saying. Trying to charge him with murder for max sentence was grand standing and stupid. Proly some asshole trying to make a name</quote> I agree. It sucks because a guy is dead who happened to be unarmed and it feels like someone should be held accountable, but charging him with murder was uncalled for</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Letron_James 12/08/17 7:02:02 PM #45:	We should stop having beta ass trigger happy racist piece of shit cops honestly but hurr durr the bad apples who slaughter hundreds of civilians a year are the only problem, not the fact that the entire system is set up to forgive murders as long as they wear blue --- Ask me if I would eat da booty. <cite>Letron_James posted [p:891848162] in Did anyone... [t:76075309]...</cite> <quote>We should stop having beta ass trigger happy racist piece of shit cops honestly but hurr durr the bad apples who slaughter hundreds of civilians a year are the only problem, not the fact that the entire system is set up to forgive murders as long as they wear blue</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
_RETS_ 12/08/17 7:03:35 PM #46:	Letron_James posted... We should stop having beta ass trigger happy racist piece of shit cops honestly but hurr durr the bad apples who slaughter hundreds of civilians a year are the only problem, not the fact that the entire system is set up to forgive murders as long as they wear blue Racist seems like an odd word to use in this scenario <cite>_RETS_ posted [p:891848254] in Did anyone... [t:76075309]...</cite> <quote><cite>Letron_James posted...</cite> <quote>We should stop having beta ass trigger happy racist piece of shit cops honestly but hurr durr the bad apples who slaughter hundreds of civilians a year are the only problem, not the fact that the entire system is set up to forgive murders as long as they wear blue</quote> Racist seems like an odd word to use in this scenario</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Giant_Aspirin 12/08/17 7:07:21 PM #47:	_RETS_ posted... If you relent the possibility the guy could have another gun, and you see that guy reaching for his waist, you can't possibly think it's cold blooded murder with any degree of honesty. stop telling me what i think, you can't possibly know that. don't be so arrogant. also, you can't just say "objectively, <insert my views here>" and make yourself right, you know. and saying things like "don't play dumb" is incredibly condescending and not conducive to a healthy discussion. the cop could have done so many things differently. he made a series of poor decisions rooted in his power trip which lead to the death of an innocent man. --- Now Playing: South Park: FbW (PC), Cuphead (PC) *(~);} - Get out the pans, don't just stand there dreamin' - {;(~)* <cite>Giant_Aspirin posted [p:891848447] in Did anyone... [t:76075309]...</cite> <quote><cite>_RETS_ posted...</cite> <quote>If you relent the possibility the guy could have another gun, and you see that guy reaching for his waist, you can't possibly think it's cold blooded murder with any degree of honesty. </quote> stop telling me what i think, you can't possibly know that. don't be so arrogant. also, you can't just say "objectively, <insert my views here>" and make yourself right, you know. and saying things like "don't play dumb" is incredibly condescending and not conducive to a healthy discussion. the cop could have done so many things differently. he made a series of poor decisions rooted in his power trip which lead to the death of an innocent man.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
berlyman101 12/08/17 7:07:58 PM #48:	He was acquitted of manslaughter as well. The verdict happened. It was an incredibly grave injustice. Police should not be given impunity for shit like this. It happens all the time and nothing changes. It's wrong. Since there are many people who choose to zoom in on the moment of shooting him in this case and many others, the systematic failure and incompetence that leads to unjust executions will continue. It's unfitting for a country like this and it's a travesty for a force that claims to serve and protect. --- http://www.lukesurl.com/comics/2010-02-24-determinism.png <cite>berlyman101 posted [p:891848482] in Did anyone... [t:76075309]...</cite> <quote>He was acquitted of manslaughter as well. The verdict happened. It was an incredibly grave injustice. Police should not be given impunity for shit like this. It happens all the time and nothing changes. It's wrong. Since there are many people who choose to zoom in on the moment of shooting him in this case and many others, the systematic failure and incompetence that leads to unjust executions will continue. It's unfitting for a country like this and it's a travesty for a force that claims to serve and protect.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Keith_Valentine 12/08/17 7:08:01 PM #49:	_RETS_ posted... Letron_James posted... We should stop having beta ass trigger happy racist piece of shit cops honestly but hurr durr the bad apples who slaughter hundreds of civilians a year are the only problem, not the fact that the entire system is set up to forgive murders as long as they wear blue Racist seems like an odd word to use in this scenario Knee-jerk reaction :P with the anti cop anarchists. Antifa kids I respect cops , I appreciate cops. And bad cops who kill people shame real police and should be held accountable. Reminds me of the African guy that got shot in new York years ago. Immigrant , didn't speak English very well yet. Matches description of a perp so cops flag him. Guy doesn't understand English so cops are screaming to get down, he reaches for his wallet to show some id. They shot him around 25 times. Like.... what...??? Not even a leg shot to take him down , just UNLOADING their clips into an innocent man. <cite>Keith_Valentine posted [p:891848489] in Did anyone... [t:76075309]...</cite> <quote><cite>_RETS_ posted...</cite> <quote><cite>Letron_James posted...</cite> <quote>We should stop having beta ass trigger happy racist piece of shit cops honestly but hurr durr the bad apples who slaughter hundreds of civilians a year are the only problem, not the fact that the entire system is set up to forgive murders as long as they wear blue</quote> Racist seems like an odd word to use in this scenario</quote> Knee-jerk reaction :P with the anti cop anarchists. Antifa kids I respect cops , I appreciate cops. And bad cops who kill people shame real police and should be held accountable. Reminds me of the African guy that got shot in new York years ago. Immigrant , didn't speak English very well yet. Matches description of a perp so cops flag him. Guy doesn't understand English so cops are screaming to get down, he reaches for his wallet to show some id. They shot him around 25 times. Like.... what...??? Not even a leg shot to take him down , just UNLOADING their clips into an innocent man.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
_RETS_ 12/08/17 7:09:37 PM #50:	Giant_Aspirin posted... _RETS_ posted... If you relent the possibility the guy could have another gun, and you see that guy reaching for his waist, you can't possibly think it's cold blooded murder with any degree of honesty. stop telling me what i think, you can't possibly know that. don't be so arrogant. also, you can't just say "objectively, <insert my views here>" and make yourself right, you know. and saying things like "don't play dumb" is incredibly condescending and not conducive to a healthy discussion. the cop could have done so many things differently. he made a series of poor decisions rooted in his power trip which lead to the death of an innocent man. You yourself relented the possibility of another gun. That reasonable assumption alone would make it not cold blooded murder. I'm using your own words, not telling you what you think. Chill. And Yes, he acted horrible unprofessional, but that's not illegal and it isnt murder. Murder was the wrong charge and it's right that he was acquitted of it. <cite>_RETS_ posted [p:891848589] in Did anyone... [t:76075309]...</cite> <quote><cite>Giant_Aspirin posted...</cite> <quote><cite>_RETS_ posted...</cite> <quote>If you relent the possibility the guy could have another gun, and you see that guy reaching for his waist, you can't possibly think it's cold blooded murder with any degree of honesty. </quote> stop telling me what i think, you can't possibly know that. don't be so arrogant. also, you can't just say "objectively, <insert my views here>" and make yourself right, you know. and saying things like "don't play dumb" is incredibly condescending and not conducive to a healthy discussion. the cop could have done so many things differently. he made a series of poor decisions rooted in his power trip which lead to the death of an innocent man.</quote> You yourself relented the possibility of another gun. That reasonable assumption alone would make it not cold blooded murder. I'm using your own words, not telling you what you think. Chill. And Yes, he acted horrible unprofessional, but that's not illegal and it isnt murder. Murder was the wrong charge and it's right that he was acquitted of it.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
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Current Events > Did anyone see the full video of the Daniel Shaver killing. (+) Yeah! (+)

Current Events > Did anyone see the full video of the Daniel Shaver killing.