Poll of the Day > These 5 KIDS face LIFE in Prison for throwing 20 ROCKS that KILLED a Man!!!

(+) Yeah! (+)

Doctor Foxx posted...

the rocks were intent to cause a violent act, not intent to murder.

I might agree if they were throwing rocks at a wall and one happened to bounce off and kill someone. They were throwing rocks at moving vehicles, most of which do not yet drive themselves.

Dont care what you charge them with, but give them 15-20 years. They will probably be out in 7-10 anyway. I'd rather that people this stupid are not allowed to go out and celebrate their 21st birthday in the traditional drink your ass off way because they were only given 5 years and got out in 3.

Oh and to those arguing for manslaughter

Killings after an Act Intended to Cause Serious Bodily Harm

A second category of acts that constitute second degree murder are acts where the perpetrator intends to cause serious bodily harm with the full knowledge that death is a possible result of the act. The killer might not necessarily intend to kill the victim, but knows that death is a likely outcome.

For example, in the situation above, instead of shooting Bill, Adam grabs a shovel and hits Bill on the head with all his strength. Adam didn't explicitly intend to kill Bill when he hit him, but he did intend to hit him with the shovel, and he knew that such a blow to the head carried with it a distinct possibility of death. Adams killing of Bill in this instance also constitutes second degree murder.

http://criminal.findlaw.com/criminal-charges/second-degree-murder-overview.html
They didn't intend to kill him, but they did intend to throw giant rocks at their heads.

Meanwhile
http://www.attorneys.com/homicide/jail-time-for-types-of-manslaughter
As this was a violent crime turned into a murder, this doesn't specifically fit the manslaughter types.

So while they probably will get manslaughter, 2nd degree murder is not out of the realm of possibility.
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Definitely deserve a significant chunk of time, even if it's not necessarily life. I understand that some things can be accidents, but if you don't have the foresight to see the blatant risk involved with something like that, you probably shouldn't have too much autonomy in the first place.
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Holy fuck thats a fucking boulder if that first rock pick is accurate. Fuck them and they should all rot
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I don't think they should get the death penalty but I have zero sympathy for them and wouldn't care if they did. That's an incredibly shitty thing to do. Even if the rock itself was not the cause of death, people swerving to avoid the falling and stationary rocks could also cause a terrible accident. And those aren't exactly pebbles either. How can they not see something like that happening?
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Zeus posted...

PKMNsony posted...

Can we just have a public vote? I vote death by stoning, next week.

But seriously, we live in a civilized society. We don't do that shit.

And that is a goddamn shame. In the good old days, when someone acted like a piece of human garbage you could just pull them into the streets and road haul them until they were nothing but a torso wearing a belt.

wwinterj25 posted...

I really don't understand this "save everyone" mentality. While it's possible some folk go on to be better people some will commit the same crime again. I personally believe some folk don't deserve a second chance.

This would be an oddly specific crime for somebody to commit again.

Yellow posted...

Full Throttle posted...

The teens are 15-17 years old and are charged as ADULTS.

That's pretty stupid.

wwinterj25 posted...

I really don't understand this "save everyone" mentality. While it's possible some folk go on to be better people some will commit the same crime again. I personally believe some folk don't deserve a second chance.

Well they're children. They most likely would never do anything like this ever again.

And murder? Really?? This is clear-cut manslaughter. Do we even care about facts and laws anymore or is our system just total nonsense and emotions?

Is winter even American, though?
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mooreandrew58 posted...

Doctor Foxx posted...

streamofthesky posted...

"I'm gonna fire off my gun in the middle of the city to celebrate my sports team winning!"
"What? A stray bullet hit and killed some guy? I TOTALLY didn't intend to kill anybody! i was just having fun...."

if you shoot it in the air and the bullet lands and kills someone you would be charged with involuntary manslaughter at worst.

It's not saying the act was smart. or safe. just that it was not an act done to intentionally murder, and not legally the same as murder.

manslaughter and unlawful discharge of a firearm depending on local laws.

Plus a ton of counts of reckless endangerment.
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wwinterj25 posted...

Yellow posted...

They're children

15-17 isn't children.

It is in the eyes of the law. And they were involved in a stupid, childish prank. I can understand trying kids as adults when they commit certain adult crimes (like kidnapping and raping somebody), but this is the kind of stupid shit kids do. While they should have known better, kids have poor impulse control.

Kyuubi4269 posted...

Doctor Foxx posted...

This is manslaughter. that is why manslaughter exists. Specifically this is involuntary manslaughter

Murder requires murderous intent. Even drunk driving--something everyone knows is a lot more rangerous than dropping rocks--only gets you involuntary manslaughter when you kill someone.

Wikipedia

Because murder is generally defined in law as an intent to cause serious harm or injury (alone or with others), combined with a death arising from that intention, there are certain circumstances where a death will be treated as murder even if the defendant did not wish to kill the actual victim.

They were dropping massive rocks on speeding vehicles, they may not have meant to kill, but they intended to hurt people.

They acted maliciously and killed a guy, it was murder.

It's highly unlikely that they intended death, they were likely interested in property damage or freaking people out.

jaxy15 posted...

What they did was horrible and they definitely should've known better, but life in prison is a bit too much. The fact that some people are actually suggesting the death penalty is just sickening.

Considering their actions, prison sounds just right. Not even Sweden gives community service for killing somebody.
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Zeus posted...

this is the kind of stupid shit kids do. While they should have known better, kids have poor impulse control.

Sounds like Zeus was dangerously stupid as a teen.

Zeus posted...

It's highly unlikely that they intended death, they were likely interested in property damage or freaking people out.

A 5 year old knows that freaking out a speeding motorist with stones is immensely dangerous, these "kids" are 10 years older, they knew full well what they were doing would kill somebody very quickly.
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No sympathy. And don't give me that "they are just kids".

Plenty of kids have been able to play around without killing anybody.
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Zeus posted...

This would be an oddly specific crime for somebody to commit again.

True enough but I was talking about crimes in general some folk get locked up for.

Zeus posted...

Is winter even American, though?

No, no he is not.

Zeus posted...

It is in the eyes of the law.

Always thought the law refers to them as minors. Minors =/= just children as far as I'm aware. It covers children and teens over here in the UK. I suppose in the USA it covers young adults too(up to the age of 21) on some things but I won't pretend I know anything about that or law that much tbf.

Zeus posted...

And they were involved in a stupid, childish prank.

A prank in my eyes is something that probably won't hurt anyone. A trick if you like. Not doing something that you know probably will hurt someone.

Zeus posted...

I can understand trying kids as adults when they commit certain adult crimes (like kidnapping and raping somebody), but this is the kind of stupid shit kids do. While they should have known better, kids have poor impulse control.

Again this might actually work if the "kids" were under the age of 12 at best. Not 15-17.
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Highschool age is plenty old enough to know better.

I swear as technology advances age of accountability only goes up.

Id lol if when its the norm to live till age 150 that the age of adulthood went up to 25.

If we just did pain punishments still they could easily get off with 39 lashes.

Assholes the lot of them. And maybe at least one of them could be psychotic.
Though neurological studies have shown that part of the brain that fully understands consequences doesn't fully develop in the male brain until after the age of 20 (a couple yrs less for females).

So no, I don't see this as murder.

This reminded me of the movie The Good Son.
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dioxxys posted...

Highschool age is plenty old enough to know better.

I swear as technology advances age of accountability only goes up.

Id lol if when its the norm to live till age 150 that the age of adulthood went up to 25.

If we just did pain punishments still they could easily, 39 lashes!

yeah if physical punishment where a thing, i'd go with that for these kids. or serving a little bit of time doing some hard labor. when I say hard labor I mean the bust your ass, sweat your ass off, go to bed aching kinda hard labor.
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mooreandrew58 posted...

when I say hard labor I mean the bust your ass, sweat your ass off, go to bed aching kinda hard labor.

Force them to join the Army. -_-
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wwinterj25 posted...

mooreandrew58 posted...

when I say hard labor I mean the bust your ass, sweat your ass off, go to bed aching kinda hard labor.

Force them to join the Army. -_-

i'm not fond of the idea of putting criminals in the military in any capacity other than front lines canon fodder. and thats a bit extreme in this case considering they aren't old enough to join otherwise. i'd say make them do something useful to this country. just something that involved back breaking work even if thats only achieved through really long hours.
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mooreandrew58 posted...

i'm not fond of the idea of putting criminals in the military in any capacity other than front lines canon fodder.

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Kyuubi4269 posted...

Zeus posted...

this is the kind of stupid shit kids do. While they should have known better, kids have poor impulse control.

Sounds like Zeus was dangerously stupid as a teen.

Sounds like Kyuubi grew up secluded in a cabin in the woods and never met any teens during his entire life considering that, had you gone to a public high school, you'd know how stupid and reckless teens can be.

Kyuubi4269 posted...

Zeus posted...

It's highly unlikely that they intended death, they were likely interested in property damage or freaking people out.

A 5 year old knows that freaking out a speeding motorist with stones is immensely dangerous, these "kids" are 10 years older, they knew full well what they were doing would kill somebody very quickly.

If your argument was that they were intending to knowingly kill a random person, then it's a fucking stupid argument. Kids throw shit because they think it's funny, particularly when they're drunk or stoned. If they were just trying to kill somebody, they would have done it in a way they wouldn't be quickly caught.

wwinterj25 posted...

True enough but I was talking about crimes in general some folk get locked up for.

Also seems unlikely because it's a stupid, reckless activity. Crimes like theft, molestation, etc, are more the things which get repeated.

wwinterj25 posted...

Always thought the law refers to them as minors. Minors =/= just children as far as I'm aware. It covers children and teens over here in the UK. I suppose in the USA it covers young adults too(up to the age of 21) on some things but I won't pretend I know anything about that or law that much tbf.

No, it ends at 18 although sentencing can be more lenient on young people in general. And some crimes which demonstrate an adult understanding will result in them being tried as an adult. This, by contrast, is a little kid prank which happened to get somebody killed.

wwinterj25 posted...

Again this might actually work if the "kids" were under the age of 12 at best. Not 15-17.

Still kids and they were doing a stupid kid thing.
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dioxxys posted...

Highschool age is plenty old enough to know better.

I swear as technology advances age of accountability only goes up.

Id lol if when its the norm to live till age 150 that the age of adulthood went up to 25.

If we just did pain punishments still they could easily get off with 39 lashes.

Maturation is less based on age than it is on responsibility. Because we stick kids in the education system so long before having them be responsible for themselves, self-sufficiency and accountability are delayed.
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