Board 8 > Politics Containment Topic 120: A Nationally Lampooned Vacation

(+) Yeah! (+)

kevwaffles posted...

The ramifications are nothing. Until they literally start assassinating members of other branches of government, they'd never come remotely close to being able to do that.

Sure, but the notion that 1/6 of voters are explicitly ok/supporting of textbook fascism and dictatorship is fucking creepy.
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HashtagSEP posted...

Corrik posted...

Regaro posted...

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/monkey-cage/wp/2017/08/10/in-a-new-poll-half-of-republicans-say-they-would-support-postponing-the-2020-election-if-trump-proposed-it/

Remember when people were comparing some stuff coming out of the Republican camp to fascism?

Yeah ibelieve that for a second

Are you literally saying you believe this is fake?

Yes I do not believe that poll is legit or not misleading. It is ridiculous, and if you are getting infomation from such ridiculous sources then i can see why you think Republicans are crazy.
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I'd argue that the ramifications are that executive power needs to be more heavily curbed and we need to incorporate civics into education more.
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It's the constant political narrative of the right and it just rings true; Republicans care more about party than country. America is Republican and if Republicans aren't in power than it isn't America. Democrats are a "Foreign Enemy", and to them are no different than, say, North Korea.
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Jakyl25 posted...

http://thehill.com/homenews/campaign/346000-poll-about-half-of-republicans-would-back-postponing-2020-election-if-trump?amp

This is fine

As worrying as the literal fascism is, what really bugs me is this:

Pollsters found 47 percent of Republicans think Trump won the popular vote.

A majority of Republicans, 68 percent, also thinks millions of illegal immigrants voted in the presidential election and 73 percent think voter fraud happens somewhat or very often.

How can you have rational, fact-based debates about substantive issues with people who deny facts that don't fit their narrative? Or worse, people who have been deliberately miseducated to think up is down and left is right?

I don't know how to convince someone that facts are more important than opinions.
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Corrik posted...

Yes I do not believe that poll is legit or not misleading.

...because you don't want to?
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Corrik posted...

if you are getting infomation from such ridiculous sources

WaPo huh.

Yeah, that rag.

Get some real sources, like The Enquirer.
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LapisLazuli posted...

Get some real sources, like The Enquirer.

Or Infowars!
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Not_an_Owl posted...

How can you have rational, fact-based debates about substantive issues with people who deny facts that don't fit their narrative? Or worse, people who have been deliberately miseducated to think up is down and left is right?

I don't know how to convince someone that facts are more important than opinions.

You really can't, which is why those people complain about this being a liberal echo chamber. They are convinced of their conspiracy theories.
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Show the metrics they used to get such a result. It is an assinine poll.
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Honestly the voter fraud answer is the key

If you believe that significant voter fraud is happening, it logically follows that you might be okay with suspending elections until the issues are fixed. I can't really get mad at that.

And since the POTUS is actively pursuing an aggressive investigation into voter fraud HE believes is happening, if you're a Trump supporter, why wouldn't you believe him?

Ultimately the problem is that so many people trust Donald Trump
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Corrik posted...

Show the metrics they used to get such a result. It is an assinine poll.

It's all in the WaPo article man
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Feels over reals has become an actual, unjumpable hurdle lately.
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Jakyl25 posted...

Ultimately the problem is that so many people trust Donald Trump

believe me
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Corrik posted...

Show the metrics they used to get such a result. It is an assinine poll.

The metrics are in the article.

You pulling an Ulti? Just read the title?
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Jakyl25 posted...

Ultimately the problem is that so many people trust Donald Trump

And that people who don't even trust him are convinced by him.
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Jakyl25 posted...

If you believe that significant voter fraud is happening, it logically follows that you might be okay with suspending elections until the issues are fixed. I can't really get mad at that.

You're also thoroughly divorced from any sort of facts or evidence, which is just as big of a problem.
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Corrik posted...

HashtagSEP posted...

Corrik posted...

Regaro posted...

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/monkey-cage/wp/2017/08/10/in-a-new-poll-half-of-republicans-say-they-would-support-postponing-the-2020-election-if-trump-proposed-it/

Remember when people were comparing some stuff coming out of the Republican camp to fascism?

Yeah ibelieve that for a second

Are you literally saying you believe this is fake?

Yes I do not believe that poll is legit or not misleading. It is ridiculous, and if you are getting infomation from such ridiculous sources then i can see why you think Republicans are crazy.

This is why nobody takes you seriously, Corrik.

Instead of accepting that there are actually some (obviously not all, or even necessarily a majority) Republicans that actually do think like this, and distancing yourself from those views... You just say it's all fake, it never happened, it's all lies, etc.
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Go figure. A clickbait article.

What was actually was asked was this?

If Donald Trump were to say that the 2020 presidential election should be postponed until the country can make sure that only eligible American citizens can vote, would you support or oppose postponing the election?
What if both Donald Trump and Republicans in Congress were to say that the 2020 presidential election should be postponed until the country can make sure that only eligible American citizens can vote? Would you support or oppose postponing the election?



And the poll sample size was relatively small, as well as the questions a tad misleading in nature.

Go figure.
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HashtagSEP posted...

Corrik posted...

HashtagSEP posted...

Corrik posted...

Regaro posted...

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/monkey-cage/wp/2017/08/10/in-a-new-poll-half-of-republicans-say-they-would-support-postponing-the-2020-election-if-trump-proposed-it/

Remember when people were comparing some stuff coming out of the Republican camp to fascism?

Yeah ibelieve that for a second

Are you literally saying you believe this is fake?

Yes I do not believe that poll is legit or not misleading. It is ridiculous, and if you are getting infomation from such ridiculous sources then i can see why you think Republicans are crazy.

This is why nobody takes you seriously, Corrik.

Instead of accepting that there are actually some (obviously not all, or even necessarily a majority) Republicans that actually do think like this, and distancing yourself from those views... You just say it's all fake, it never happened, it's all lies, etc.

Then don't take me serious because a misleading clickbait article was misleading and clickbait.
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LapisLazuli posted...

Corrik posted...

Show the metrics they used to get such a result. It is an assinine poll.

The metrics are in the article.

You pulling an Ulti? Just read the title?

I mean, I did just read the title and saw how stupid it was so I didn't waste my time reading it.

And, when I did it was just clickbait anyways.
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Corrik posted...

And the poll sample size was relatively small

As a statistician, your ignorance is bothersome.
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...How the hell is it misleading?
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Here we have one of the most standout examples of why this place leans so liberal and Republicans are looked down upon. Our most notable reds are total jokes.

You do a disservice to your party, Corrik.
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Corrik posted...

Go figure. A clickbait article.

What was actually was asked was this?

If Donald Trump were to say that the 2020 presidential election should be postponed until the country can make sure that only eligible American citizens can vote, would you support or oppose postponing the election?
What if both Donald Trump and Republicans in Congress were to say that the 2020 presidential election should be postponed until the country can make sure that only eligible American citizens can vote? Would you support or oppose postponing the election?



And the poll sample size was relatively small, as well as the questions a tad misleading in nature.

Go figure.

~1325 is actually a normal poll size representation of a large population. Your accuracy experiences vastly diminishing returns after that so it's pretty much pointless.

Source: I actually studied statistics in college.
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you guys can't help yourselves at all
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it's a slow day at work, ffd
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HashtagSEP posted...

...How the hell is it misleading?

Would you consider postponing elections to only eligible Americans could vote if you thought it could be attained?

That is basically your question.

The article title literally omits all caveats of the question polled. It is clickbait.
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Peace___Frog posted...

it's a slow day at work, ffd

I know people say stuff like this, but it's not really an excuse for constantly engaging someone who has a history of never arguing in good faith about anything
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FFDragon posted...

you guys can't help yourselves at all

To be fair this isn't like a Seph or an Ulti where they're just trolling. Corrik is full koolaid.
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Seriously, ignore Corrik about any discussion involving statistics. He thinks anything short of a census has too small a sample size.
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Itrdl23 posted...

Corrik posted...

Go figure. A clickbait article.

What was actually was asked was this?

If Donald Trump were to say that the 2020 presidential election should be postponed until the country can make sure that only eligible American citizens can vote, would you support or oppose postponing the election?
What if both Donald Trump and Republicans in Congress were to say that the 2020 presidential election should be postponed until the country can make sure that only eligible American citizens can vote? Would you support or oppose postponing the election?



And the poll sample size was relatively small, as well as the questions a tad misleading in nature.

Go figure.

~1325 is actually a normal poll size representation of a large population. Your accuracy experiences vastly diminishing returns after that so it's pretty much pointless.

Source: I actually studied statistics in college.

Pretty sure it says they polled 1325 and focused on like 650 of respondents for the poll.

Makes no mention of where these respondents came from. Which is important.
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Corrik posted...

Pretrt sure it says the polled 1325 and focused on like 650 of respondents for the poll.

Yes. They focus on the 650 that lean or are Republican.

Holy crap you're dumb.
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The Mana Sword posted...

Peace___Frog posted...

it's a slow day at work, ffd

I know people say stuff like this, but it's not really an excuse for constantly engaging someone who has a history of never arguing in good faith about anything

You're right. I should have learned my lesson when he first demonstrated his inability to understand statistical sciences over a year ago, and has made no efforts to understand anything beyond his nose. I just keep thinking that one day he'll learn something.
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I can't read the article, because WaPo, but did they give the % for the democrats that answered?
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If you have never taken a statistics course you shouldnt talk about sample size requirements. The amount of people who see a study of 200 people, or 2000 people, etc and then say "idk thats pretty small" do not understand how its not.

Assuming the sampling is not all from one region (say everyone in that sample is from one state, then using that as a sample for the nation) of the country, 1325 is very much a large enough sample size

I have a masters in statistics if "whats your qualifications" comes up.
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HashtagSEP posted...

Corrik posted...

Pretrt sure it says the polled 1325 and focused on like 650 of respondents for the poll.

Yes. They focus on the 650 that lean or are Republican.

Holy crap you're dumb.

"Poll is from 1325 respondents"
Actually poll numbers are from the 650.

"Holy crap you're dumb"
Lmfao


Seriously?

That's like saying I polled 2 billion people but only focused on 500 responses from flamingo cosplayers and saying I polled 2 billion people for my results. I just threw out over 99% of the poll. I can't still claim them as part of the poll.

And, yes, holy crap I am dumb.
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Peace___Frog posted...

The Mana Sword posted...

Peace___Frog posted...

it's a slow day at work, ffd

I know people say stuff like this, but it's not really an excuse for constantly engaging someone who has a history of never arguing in good faith about anything

You're right. I should have learned my lesson when he first demonstrated his inability to understand statistical sciences over a year ago, and has made no efforts to understand anything beyond his nose. I just keep thinking that one day he'll learn something.

Yeah, I should know better from when he couldn't seem to grasp the idea that 10% of 1000 people is more than 50% of 50 people, and showed no signs of even wanting to understand why it was important.
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http://www.calculator.net/sample-size-calculator.html
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Corrik posted...

"Poll is from 1325 respondents"
Actually poll numbers are from the 650.

"Holy crap you're dumb"
Lmfao


Seriously?

That's like saying I polled 2 billion people but only focused on 500 responses from flamingo cosplayers and saying I polled 2 billion people for my results. I just threw out over 99% of the poll. I can't still claim them as part of the poll.

And, yes, holy crap I am dumb.

Yes. Thanks for showing that you have no idea how polling or anything works.

If they're looking for a specific type of person for response, then obviously they're only going to use the responses from those. However, they still have to list how many initial respondents they had. They can't just say "650 Republicans," because... Where did the 650 Republicans come from? From a pool of 1325 respondents.
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Metal_DK posted...

If you have never taken a statistics course you shouldnt talk about sample size requirements. The amount of people who see a study of 200 people, or 2000 people, etc and then say "idk thats pretty small" do not understand how its not.

Assuming the sampling is not all from one region (say everyone in that sample is from one state, then using that as a sample for the nation) of the country, 1325 is very much a large enough sample size

I have a masters in statistics if "whats your qualifications" comes up.

Was not a 1325 sample size. As already stated, they threw out over half the survey for being invalid.

They did not poll registered republicans by their own admission by saying they used those who "identified with or leaned republican". Which is a big difference.

And they do not state in any way the metrics of the poll satisfactorily. You polled based on ratios of sex, age etc... based on your initial 1325. Which you threw out more than half of.


The poll is beyond flawed and if you have a masters in stats and can't conclude that then I am baffled.
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This is impossible. He just straight up doesn't understand.

Corrik posted...

And, yes, holy crap I am dumb.

Yeah no shit.
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Willful ignorance is a hell of a drug.
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Corrik posted...

And, yes, holy crap I am dumb.

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I, uh,..I kinda wanna know how flamingo cosplayers actually vote.

I hope in costume.
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Misleading poll from democratic source with clickbait title. I mean, that is obvious to me, but hey, you all do you. Nothing further to discuss about it because it is just ridiculous.

Anywho.
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Corrik posted...

Was not a 1325 sample size. As already stated, they threw out over half the survey for being invalid.

They did not poll registered republicans by their own admission by saying they used those who "identified with or leaned republican". Which is a big difference.

And they do not state in any way the metrics of the poll satisfactorily. You polled based on ratios of sex, age etc... based on your initial 1325. Which you threw out more than half of.


The poll is beyond flawed and if you have a masters in stats and can't conclude that then I am baffled.

I didn't read the entire poll so I don't know about any sampling biases like age or something. But if you think 1325 is not large enough of a sample (which i believe you said), then you are being ignorant. Which was what you are originally saying. You are kinda backtracking here because you went from "too small" to "well its this thing".

I was talking specifically about sample size. Yes, 1325 (and even only half or whatever crap you are claiming) is large enough.
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Corrik posted...

if you have a masters in stats and can't conclude that then I am baffled.

Perhaps you should just admit that mathematics isn't your strong suit
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Corrik posted...

Misleading poll from democratic source with clickbait title. I mean, that is obvious to me, but hey, you all do you. Nothing further to discuss about it because it is just ridiculous.

Anywho.

"(Holy shit I look like a moron and can't flip it bail bail bail)"

"Let's move on, ehhhhhhh?"
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Yeah I'm gonna just ignore Corrik and move on

I thought he was better than Ulti and Seph since they just troll, whereas he's just super deep into the koolaid, but he's purposely not even trying to get a better understanding of anything. He just goes "Nope, it's fake! Fake news, fake news!"
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