Board 8 > ~FIGHT!~ Kerrigan/Grabner/Zero/Yuri/Diablo vs Big Boss/Joanna/Cloud/Kefka/Revan

(+) Yeah! (+)

Kerrigan/Grabner/Zero/Yuri/Diablo have challenged Big Boss/Joanna/Cloud/Kefka/Revan to a fight! Location of the fight: Xen (Half-Life) - The first area of the alien world in Half-Life. Small, roughly circular platforms circle around and above a larger platform with two levels and three tall, thin spires. The lower level leads into the interior of the platform, which is a roughly circular room with strangely organic-looking walls, sharp rocks projecting from the ground and ceiling, and shin-deep fetid-looking liquid. The teleporter in the centre of the room is non-functional. The entire area is under the effect of low gravity. No aliens are present, and access to the rest of Xen (Gonarch's Lair, the Interloper stage, Nihilanth's room) is banned. Which side will win?

Guidelines

- The fight will occur in real-time (like an FMV sequence). Gameplay mechanics are less important than how the characters would function in a real-time environment.

- The members of each team are ideal teammates capable of a pre-selected plan of battle.

- "Broken" refers to a lot of things, including insta-death, auto-effects, a variety of status effects (e.g., Imp, Silence, Stop, *not* Poison), and revival. Unless stated otherwise, nobody has them, though do use your own discretion.

- There may be SPOILERS from all of the games the characters are from.



Rules for Voting

- Bold your votes (using <b> and </b>).

- Provide a justification for why you think the selected team would win. Fanboy logic, ignoring character assumptions or rules, and vague or unintelligible justifications are all grounds for having your vote disqualified.

- If you want to switch your votes simply bold the change; there's no need to delete your post, though you may if you wish.

- This match will end in 24 hours.



Yuri Hyuga is as he appears in Shadow Hearts: Covenant. He has access to all of his fusions except for (Neo) Amon and Dark Seraphim, though his healing moves may not revive anyone. All his fusions are fully upgraded, and he begins in his Fides form.

Diablo is as he appears at the end of Diablo 2, with all of his various attacks.

Zero is as he appears in the Mega Man Zero series, in his Ultimate Form as seen in Zero 2. He has his Saber, Buster, Shield Boomerang, and Chain Rod, as well as the EX skills from Mega Man Zero 2. He has the elemental chips and the only effects from Cyber Elves he has are those from Grandie, Kelon, Atti, Jettah, and Fubuffa, (double life, increased jumping, running speed, climbing speed, no backlash recoil).

Kerrigan is solely as she appears at the end of the original Starcraft, in her Infested state. She can't mind control people, does not have the rest of the Zerg, and can use Psionic Storm only twice in the battle.

Albert Grabner and his Wanzer, the X-D "Dragoon", are as seen in Front Mission: Gun Hazard. The Dragoon has the best shield, dash, and vernier units equipped (SHD-04, RD-400, and VU-50 respectively), and its primary weapon is VG-05. Secondary equipment on it includes an EAP-50 (Armor Plate), HNP-50 (Hard Knuckle), HMS-50, DCY-50, and FBG-50. Grabner himself is fully equipped with his jetpack, HAV-05, HGR-05, and HHG-05 (armor, grenades, and handgun).

Joanna Dark is as she appears in Perfect Dark. She is equipped with a Crossbow, Laser, a handful of combat knives, RC-P120, Sniper Rifle, Laptop Gun, Shotgun, Tranquilizers, N Bombs, Slayer. Additional gear on her includes a Shield, Bombspy, Drugspy, Horizon Scanner, X-Ray Scanner, Cloaking Device and Combat Boost.

Big Boss is as seen in Metal Gear Solid: Peace Walker in his Battle Dress w/ Helmet. He has his M47, PTRS1941, M134, EZ Gun, K Pistol, Claymores, Stun Grenades, Bandana, Stealth Camo and Stun Bomb Box.

Cloud is as he appears in FF7 and the KH games. He can glide freely and has limited flight. Cloud has access to all his limit breaks, the three main elements, Comet 1&2, Flare, Ultima, the Cure spells, Bio, Berserk, Esuna, and various buffs and debuffs.

Revan is as he appears in Star Wars: KOTOR. He is a male villainous scout guardian, has access to his best non-broken equipment and access to all his Force powers as seen in KOTOR save for those in the Persuasion, Stun, Shutdown, Strangulation, and Fear chains.

Kefka is as he appears in Final Fantasy 6 (Advance) in the last battle. He does not have access to Trine, Heartless Angel, or Hyperdrive, but he does have all his other moves used in the boss fight. He additionally has all his Brave and HP attacks from Dissidia: Final Fantasy, as well as the Exhilarating Magic skill, and these attacks all function as "normal attacks," i.e., there's no weird Brave mechanics involved.

team big boss argues -


So I'll be the first to admit my team is at a slight disadvantage powerwise here. It also doesn't matter, due to this fight taking place on Xen and its floating platforms way the hell above a death drop into space. Anyone who comes after my side, Revan TK shoves right off, and if they can't fly (which might very well be everyone besides Kerrigan, not sure if she can or not), they are dead. Meanwhile, Kefka most certainly does have flight and provides homing spell harassment to the poor suckers trying to navigate the platforms (Diablo, for example, is too damn big and bulky to manage this at all and probably isn't even going to be able to join the fight proper, since he can't manage the platform hops), Joanna and Big Boss find somewhere to go invisible and snipe, Cloud provides more harassment by swooping around the platforms, buffing my side and healing. They don't really have to outpower the other team, they only need to use their far superior movement on the terrain, and gravity will take care of the rest.

The match takes place on Xen, basically some floating platforms. Grabner has a pretty neat upgrade known as decoy, which does this according to the FAQ: “Fires a sphere which stays in mid-air for a limited time, projecting a gravity well which attracts bullets shot by enemies.” On top of this, which protects them from Big Boss/Joanna from the getgo, Yuri/Kerrigan/Grabner can all fly and are very durable, and Zero can easily jump and climb the platforms. Physically, Big Boss/Joanna/Kefka/Revan are weak, and Cloud isn’t much better (Yes I give cloud the most durability respect). Once they get in close, Kerrigan/Yuri/Grabner/Zero can make short work of the other team in no time flat. Revan could try to force push, but it could realistically only hit Zero, who could likely jump it anyway. Everyone else can fly over it. Diablo can’t really join the main battle as well as he’d like, but he still has all his Diablo 2 boss battle range magic and if the other team ignores him will be a major problem. He’s also tanky as hell and won’t go down fast. If things actually start looking bad somehow, Kerrigan can always use psionic storm to show revan how shockwaves are really done around here.

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boring and mundane signature
Now with more bold! Less Italics due to bold

Yeah, Kerrigan/Grabner/Zero do *not* want to engage in a melee fight with Revan. He'll hamburger em (particularly Zero, as any kind of robot going up against a Jedi is bad news for the robot)

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We are thought, and reality, and concept, and the unimaginable

Luckily, Grabner typically fights with machine guns and rocket launchers, and kerrigan uses her psychic prowess to obliterate people. Zero could hold his own imo, but he'd probably be taking down some of these snipers standing around on the open platform

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Now with more bold! Less Italics due to bold

Big Boss and Joanna are basically rooted to their startout platform and are pretty easily dealt with by any of the opposition. Cloud's heavily outclassed by everyone there too, and Revan's force powers are kinda laughable compared to Kerrigan's psionic powers. Likewise, Kefka's not gonna stand a chance against Diablo.

Kerrigan and one of Yuri, Diablo, or Grabner would be more than enough to take this match, since one Psionic Storm to the platform Big Boss's team starts on would clean house pretty bad, enough that cleanup's easy between Kerrigan's other psionic storm and powers and the sheer power (even at a range) and durability of the other guy. With the whole team, that's just a stomp.

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I have no idea who you are, but I thank you for arousing me. - Beruga
Brawl FC: 3823-8243-5663

For starters, Kerrigan isn't going to be starting anywhere near close enough to open up with a psistorm, given the size of the terrain. For a second thing, there's nothing keeping Big Boss or Joanna on their starting platform. They'd be far better suited to pop invisibility, hop over to one of the other random platforms, then snipe from a location where no one is going to notice them until it's too late. Big Boss's M47 would put a severe hurt on most of them

No, this isn't your cue to make a ridiculous argument about the M47 being limited to its real world version because you want my team to lose

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We are thought, and reality, and concept, and the unimaginable

Man, the fact you're still on about that is a joke.

http://metalgear.wikia.com/wiki/M47_Dragon
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/M47_Dragon

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I have no idea who you are, but I thank you for arousing me. - Beruga
Brawl FC: 3823-8243-5663

"No, this isn't your cue to make a ridiculous argument about the M47 being limited to its real world version because you want my team to lose"

"yeah well, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/M47_Dragon"

"

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You beat yourself up with your past. Don't blame yourself, blame the world. Blame God. Blame me.

It even says right in that wiki that Big Boss's version isn't the original, but his own that his R&D squad invented (as evidenced by the fact that BB's has none of the real world version's drawbacks, like requiring two men to operate). Way to read

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We are thought, and reality, and concept, and the unimaginable

would revan have access to destroy droid

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maybe, lol

not that i know anything about it, but to be fair, the specs listed on wiki and the mgs wiki are exactly the same, right down to muzzle velocity

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I'm too tired to drive anywhere, anyway, right now, do you care if I praise Black Turtle?
Call me numbers.

Most likely laziness from whoever made the MGS wiki, since it lists the original weapon designer, and in-game, the designer was Outer Heaven's R&D department, not McDonnell Douglas

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We are thought, and reality, and concept, and the unimaginable

That, and again, the two weapons are only superficially similar. Big Boss's version has none of the drawbacks listed on the wiki page for the 'real' M47. It's one man. It has no backblast at all. It's homing, doesn't require any manual laser guiding. Short version, it ain't the same weapon

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We are thought, and reality, and concept, and the unimaginable

It's treated literally like an M47 would be treated, except they made their own model based off of blueprints they stole from a CIA mercenary group.

The differences are minor at best, probably done so that it can be used by one person, which... shouldn't imply that it's stronger. If anything, reducing from a 2 person weapon to a 1 person weapon typically implies it's going to be either weaker or much less stable. Not that it's going to make a world of difference because it's still essentially an M47 and a real world explosive weapon.

Only reason to possibly think otherwise is if Big Boss and his army are the progenitors of Warhammer 40k orcs and can make things explode harder by sheer force of will.

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I have no idea who you are, but I thank you for arousing me. - Beruga
Brawl FC: 3823-8243-5663

I wouldn't doubt it. It's Big Boss. He can probably make things explode through nothing but manliness

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We are thought, and reality, and concept, and the unimaginable

Well I was going to argue for Diablo's team then came in and saw KJH arguing about Big Boss's weapons being the same as real world weaponry again so I think I'll just leave

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No problem!
This is a cute and pop genocide of love!

Though to put forth a real question how well is Albert Grabner protected in the X-Dragoon. Never really asked because it hasn't been relevant in any of his previous matches-- but if there's a cockpit that isn't heavily armored (or if it has any sorta weakpoint or opening) I'd guess that Boss or Joanna could snipe him off pretty easily.

Make no mistake about it the stupid gun "argument" (there isn't really one) is quite the turnoff but it is my duty to bring integrity to mercs matches these days after all so I'll try and stomach it.

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No problem!
This is a cute and pop genocide of love!

Sure looks like he isn't all that well protected. I should point out that the PTRS is an anti-tank sniper rifle specifically made to punch through armor (the gun itself is bigger than Big Boss is)

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We are thought, and reality, and concept, and the unimaginable

Id also like to point out grabner can draw bullets and assumedly rockets away from him with decoy, and he also has plenty of experience of other mechs firing rockets at him and him dodging them

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Now with more bold! Less italics due to bold.

Which would be all well and good, except Joanna and Big Boss are both invisible. He's going to be taking a beating before he knows any bullets or rockets are coming

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We are thought, and reality, and concept, and the unimaginable

I give Big Boss enough credit to take down Grabner with ease. The dude is invisible, Grabner won't know what hit him.

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maybe, lol

Grabner isn't going down to BB, that idea is laughable. The Dragoon could probably take down Rex, ZEKE, Peace Walker, Ray, and the Shagohod at the same time - it faces some seriously stiff opposition over the course of Gun Hazard (reminder: play Gun Hazard, it's an awesome game). Additionally, Decoy lasts a while and Grabner has a bunch of them. No reason not to open with one, which obsoletes BB/Joanna.

Now, really, this doesn't matter much. The problem here is Kerrigan: I've yet to see a compelling argument for any merc, and I mean any merc, surviving Psistorm. Except maybe Seraphic Radiance, but that totally doesn't count because it happens once in a blue moon. My respect for psionics is really high considering almost nobody has good mental defenses. Any reason she could just turn everybody's brains into hamburger?

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Currently playing: League of Legends, Chrono Cross.
Current Projects: Fool's Overture, CYOA: http://www.gamefaqs.com/boards/8-gamefaqs-contests/60143513

Psistorm isn't even a psychic attack, so what mental defenses would have to do with it is beyond me (it's a bunch of telekinetic lightning. Hence why it hurts vehicles, which wouldn't make a hell of a lot of sense if it were telepathy)

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We are thought, and reality, and concept, and the unimaginable

It also has a highly telegraphed windup, the attack itself is a static cloud that doesn't go anywhere and can be avoided by typical Starcraft marines by just kind of walking out of it, and again, Kerrigan isn't starting out next to my team, so she isn't likely to catch any of them bunched together

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We are thought, and reality, and concept, and the unimaginable

In Dante's last match, I seem to recall Psistorm being argued as having a mostly vertical AoE, which is why it would be so effective in Tick Tock Clock. Has that changed?


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You put your RESOLVE HAT back on, which conveniently is the same hat as your NORMAL HAT.
{Drakeryn}

Team Kerrigan

I mean really now.

I have as much revan respect as anyone but he isn't even the second best merc on the field.

Kerrigan, Diablo, and Zero outclass every merc on the opposing side without exception.

Yuri is damn good.

I'll be honest I know very little about Grabner but he doesn't even matter.

To call this a 'slight' power disadvantage is hilarious. Kerrigan and Zero are forces on this terrain still, Diablo can basically tank anything that can be thrown at him aside from Revan and maybe some of Kefka's stuff.

Big Boss/Joanna/Cloud are just terribly, terribly outclassed by at least four of the five on the opposing side.

Just simply too strong.

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Sir Chris
http://img.imgcake.com/Chris2pngas.png

Diablo can't even get to the damn fight. If my guys start somewhere on the floating islands and Diablo presumably starts somewhere below, he's too laughably bulky to make any accurate platform hops

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We are thought, and reality, and concept, and the unimaginable

Diablo can't even get to the damn fight. If my guys start somewhere on the floating islands and Diablo presumably starts somewhere below, he's too laughably bulky to make any accurate platform hops

Wouldn't you guys start on the large platform below, while the attackers start on the floating islands?

Not that it helps Diablo's platforming skills either way.


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You put your RESOLVE HAT back on, which conveniently is the same hat as your NORMAL HAT.
{Drakeryn}

As you said, it really doesn't matter much, since either way Diablo is going to take a dive off into space as soon as he even tries to go anywhere on this terrain

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We are thought, and reality, and concept, and the unimaginable

Diablo's tankiness is also nothing special, considering he gets offed by what amounts to some guy with a sword in the first Diablo (Dark Wanderer was canonically the Warrior), and then again in the second by whoever the canon character was supposed to be. No reason at all to assume he could stand up to an anti-tank sniper rifle

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We are thought, and reality, and concept, and the unimaginable

Does Diablo have long-range attacks?


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You put your RESOLVE HAT back on, which conveniently is the same hat as your NORMAL HAT.
{Drakeryn}

Best he has is Red Lightning Hose. Which from what I remember is more 'Hit things in the same room as you', not the sort of thing he could use to hit people way the hell away

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We are thought, and reality, and concept, and the unimaginable

It's at :17. Nice damage if it hits, but it's bloody slow (the best defense versus it is to just walk in a circle around Diablo. Revan would laugh at it and cut his head off)

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We are thought, and reality, and concept, and the unimaginable

From: DeathChicken | #034
Best he has is Red Lightning Hose. Which from what I remember is more 'Hit things in the same room as you', not the sort of thing he could use to hit people way the hell away

Armageddon. Meteors, which...well, the meteors fall down from the sky.

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Currently playing: League of Legends, Chrono Cross.
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i want to make a diablo platformer game

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I'm too tired to drive anywhere, anyway, right now, do you care if I praise Black Turtle?
Call me numbers.

I don't remember Diablo even having Armageddon. And if he does, it would still be worthless, since the meteors only fall about 5 yards away from the caster. The point of that spell is to cast it, then run up to your opponent, which Diablo can't do here

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We are thought, and reality, and concept, and the unimaginable

Only uber Diablo has Armageddon, and yeah as DC said it's worthless for range.

That being said Diablo's longest range attacks would be fire ring > firestorm > lightning hose. But the fire ring and firestorm travel along the ground so they aren't useful against guys at different vertical heights. Going by diablo "yards" the fire ring's range is pretty large though. Like a hundred yards at least. Firestorm is probably like 40 yards and lightning hose probably like 20-30.

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No problem!
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Yeah, the fire spells are impractical here, since Diablo is probably never going to be on even ground with his opponents. They're either above him or below him, and either way, he can't cover the distance without killing himself

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We are thought, and reality, and concept, and the unimaginable

Now I'm picturing diablo literally divebombing the other team and it is awesome

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I'm too tired to drive anywhere, anyway, right now, do you care if I praise Black Turtle?
Call me numbers.

Awesome when he breaks his legs from the ridiculous drop, then Marche walks up to laugh at him

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We are thought, and reality, and concept, and the unimaginable

dcs team gets disqualified for illegal fighters on the field

I win

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Boring and mundane signature informing you I'm on a Droid
Now with more bold! Less italics due to bold.

Broken legs won't stop RLH! Or BB/Joanna from going splat! Also Grabner could absolutely transport Diablo if he isn't busying spraying thousands of bullets at your team!

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I'm too tired to drive anywhere, anyway, right now, do you care if I praise Black Turtle?
Call me numbers.

obviously all of dante's team gets on the dragoon, and all of dc's team gets on kefka, and then they have a divebomb fight


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You put your RESOLVE HAT back on, which conveniently is the same hat as your NORMAL HAT.
{Drakeryn}

Diablo's not gonna break his legs look at the size of those haunches dude's built for jumping

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No problem!
This is a cute and pop genocide of love!

BB and Joanna can easily make the platform jumps. Joanna's some kind of crazy extreme sports person, Big Boss is Big Boss. It's only poor Diablo that's out of luck (well, I don't like Zero's odds either. He *could* make the jumps, but look what happens in any Mega Man game when you try to platform hop when lots of enemies are throwing crap at you. You fall down and die)

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We are thought, and reality, and concept, and the unimaginable

are you literally giving joanna dark more jump credibility than zero

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boring and mundane signature
Now with more bold! Less Italics due to bold

Anyway. Diablo's quite agile looking when he moves. Just looking at his Diablo 2 running animation can tell you that much-- he moves more like an animal than a man when he's running so yeah the talk of him being bulky or clumsy is a load of malarkey. And I looked at Zen and the platforms while small are big enough to hold him, and the space between them isn't too high. Also it's low gravity which should help him get more air. So I see him leaping between the platforms easily enough. Don't really buy Revan's force push stopping him either because 1. He'll be moving. 2. He's absolutely massive. He should be able to get close enough to use the lightning hose which is lethal on platforms with limited movement potential.

I also see psi-storm being very effective here due to the nature of the platforms. Your platform gets psi-stormed and you're pretty much dead because I don't buy jumping off the platform while in a psi-storm and not falling to your doom and staying for the duration is bad news. Hitting Revan's general area with one (they're both kinda psychic so I could see her prioritizing him-- "I feel a disturbance in the force") kinda spells the end for Revan's team's hopes of viictory. Keep in mind that Kerrigan can also go invisible to help her cope with any force push shenanigans.

Zero should also have no problem navigating platforms given he's really good at jumping (he's got jet boosters on his feet!) and is probably also pretty heavy, but he doesn't even need to get that close cause he has a buster. Yuri probably has some issue, and grabner may or may not but honestly they're not even necessary as Diablo and Kerrigan and Zero can probably win this without them serving as more than a distraction when I think about it. Psionic Storm is just too lethal on this terrain.

It's funny with all the anti-hype I see Kerrigan, Zero, and Diablo as much better at coping with the platforming than Big Boss or Joanna (or Revan but he doesn't need to move much).

Team Kerrigan

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No problem!
This is a cute and pop genocide of love!

Yet again, your Revan disrespect is downright weird. As a Guardian, he even has a specific move that goes 'Jump accurately to a point up to 10 meters away'

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We are thought, and reality, and concept, and the unimaginable