Board 8 > Yes! A Great Ace Attorney Chronicles playthrough topic

(+) Yeah! (+)

Well, there was more case left than I thought. Drebber's testimony isn't difficult to dismantle. I see everyone here likes him, and I do find him to be an interesting character, but he has this one animation that takes too long and is far too frequent. Speaking of animations, the Masked Disciple plays a very amusing support to van Zieks's theatrics throughout these proceedings. van Zieks himself is objecting a lot more than normal, and I think this is the first time we hear his 'Hold it!', he's definitely flustered with the Professor waxwork staring out at him.

In what is maybe a first in AA history, the judge is ready to rule in our favour despite us not having proven who the killer actually is (oh wait the same thing happened in the last game's third case too, albeit in very different circumstances). It is pretty funny that we intentionally delay the verdict to find out what happened, this is certainly not in the best interests of our client! Though Harebrayne is, in my opinion, the least interesting character in this whole case so I'm happy to keep things going.

I have a very hard time presenting the right evidence to nail Sithe. I was thinking the reveal would be that she orchestrated the whole thing rather than being coerced by Drebber, and that the truth behind the Professor case would come out. But it's much more mundane, she simply killed the victim herself. I don't know why we have to find a weird personal motive for this, when surely we could argue that she killed the guy to keep in line with Drebber's wishes and the blackmail had over her. If Asman had lived to tell the tale then Drebber's game would be up, and so would Sithe's. This finale is a bit anticlimactic considering how much fun I'd had getting here, but I guess they're saving the Professor for later.

Also this is a minor nitpick but are we really supposed to believe that Asman didn't recognise Drebber when they met? He's a very conspicuous individual! Maybe he took out his monocle and dyed his hair for the meeting or something.

Regardless, we get our Not Guilty verdict and van Zieks trails to 0-5 against us. Is he the least successful prosecutor in the series in terms of losses?? Hm, I haven't played all the games but I imagine Winston Payne lost 6, though he has the one win at the start of 3-3. Still, two more cases left could take our guy to 0-7! He has a nice word with Albert and then insists he leaves the country to protect his life. Well, if you hadn't insisted on prosecuting the case then his life wouldn't be in danger, Barok! And there is Gina, still.

The trial may be over, but our journey for the day isn't. And the final scenes here are massive. And largely voiced! The Professor is unmasked as a Japanese man, and for a moment I'm a bit disappointed thinking all this intrigue was simply to provide Barok with a racism origin story. But then, his disciple speaks! The twist here is not that Kazuma is van Zieks' disciple, but that the Professor was Kazuma's father! I did not see this one coming!!

Kazuma has a really great scene here and I'm immediately reminded of how much I missed his presence. He's so cool. And with a new remix to his theme, the title of which spoiled me in the first place >_>! I guess maybe he really did have amnesia? Or he could've been faking. Whatever the circumstances, I'm glad he's with us again. ...For two minutes. In that time, he slices his father's model in two, so I doubt his grand mission was to avenge his dad. But it has to be connected, and we're told he'd made a promise to his father... Hm. The thought occurs to me that with his victims all being aristocracy/royalty, and Asogi Sr. presumably being a smart guy who was colleagues with Mikotoba and a third Japanese man (Jigoku?), maybe the Professor was the original Reaper? That'd be a nice wrinkle, I dunno. What could his motives be for the murders? And what could Kazuma's motives possibly be if not to avenge him? And what role will he fill from this point on? So many questions.

Barok seems angry that the son of his brother's killer is alive. Perhaps Lord Stronghart's motives aren't complex at all, and he's simply a huge troll who gets his kicks out of messing with his #1 prosecutor. Ryunosuke and Susato are left with conflicting emotions I assume, but at least our best boy is back! Hooray for Kazuma!

This case was a lot of fun! I loved everything to do with the Professor. We still have two cases left, which is exciting given that this one appeared to largely be setting up for the finale. What will the next case bring :O

G2-3 is incredible and is probably my favorite non-finale case. Drebber is a really fascinating character and the rest of the cast is just as good, outside of the jury and Trial 1 witnesses. Though, I'm much higher on Harebrayne than you are!

Yeah, I thought the Sithe stuff fell a bit flat, too, but the Professor reveal at the end more than made up for it.

andylt posted...

though he has the one win at the start of 3-3

Haha, I forgot about this.

G2-3 is also my favorite non-finale case. I have it ranked 5th all-time behind 6-5, 2-4, 3-5, and 5-DLC.

You might notice a pattern in those cases. Other than 2-4, all those other cases in my list still have tons of intrigue and mystery going into the final day of trial. I'm typically not a big fan of cases where a bunch of time is wasted at the end simply proving stuff. G2-3 is the only case ever that has actually fooled me into thinking it was basically over. The final twist got me real good.

Yeah, as much as I like that prelude to pursuit moment where the music starts to build and Ryonusuke goes after the true killer even though he's already won, going after Sithe honestly feels a bit mundane - it would be a lot more interesting if she had more buildup before this and it was a genuine surprise. Casualty of not doing a trilogy imo - I feel like this case was probably planned to be a finale case at one point.

Bitto posted...

Though, I'm much higher on Harebrayne than you are!

FWIW I don't majorly dislike him. I came around to him at the end of the first trial day, but then he faded into the background for the rest of the case (not uncommon for defendants tbf) and more interesting characters took centre stage.

Paratroopa1 posted...

it would be a lot more interesting if she had more buildup before this and it was a genuine surprise. Casualty of not doing a trilogy imo - I feel like this case was probably planned to be a finale case at one point.

Ah, this is interesting. When she showed up I thought they were introducing a recurring character, so I was surprised when it became clear she was to be taken down in this case. I keep forgetting this was supposed to be a trilogy.

Come to think of it she does still have that weird daughter who must come into play, so maybe Courtney isn't done yet...

andylt posted...

I have a very hard time presenting the right evidence to nail Sithe. I was thinking the reveal would be that she orchestrated the whole thing rather than being coerced by Drebber, and that the truth behind the Professor case would come out. But it's much more mundane, she simply killed the victim herself. I don't know why we have to find a weird personal motive for this, when surely we could argue that she killed the guy to keep in line with Drebber's wishes and the blackmail had over her. If Asman had lived to tell the tale then Drebber's game would be up, and so would Sithe's. This finale is a bit anticlimactic considering how much fun I'd had getting here, but I guess they're saving the Professor for later.

entirely agreed on this nitpick. everything about this case is so damn mysterious and near-epic, and then this ending is like... what?

SeabassDebeste posted...

entirely agreed on this nitpick. everything about this case is so damn mysterious and near-epic, and then this ending is like... what?

I'm glad others are with me on this! The game hypes itself up so much going into the finale of the trial and it's a bit of a damp squib at the very end. That is probs my only knock against this case being top tier but with it being the climax it does bother me. Although thankfully it cleans itself up with the post-trial scene.

Case 4 begins on the eve of Stronghart's Symposium, with our Japanese characters arriving in London. The Professor, now known as Genshin Asogi, and Kazuma are also still in the foreground. The game's not holding its cards back! I thought this stuff might be saved for the finale, though we could be in for a Dual Destinies scenario where the last two cases are basically two halves of the same one.

Mikotoba and Jigoku arrive with new outfits. It still feels surreal to see a judge out and about in the world, like seeing a teacher outside of school. I wonder why Seishiro exists in this game, and is continuously mentioned alongside Yujin. He must fill some narrative role that Yujin cannot or he'd be completely extraneous, maybe he'll be a future victim or maybe we'll need two judges at one point or something.

Yujin acknowledges that he knew of Kazuma's missing body, but doesn't offer us much more than that. He does tease his own backstory, mentioning that something awful happened 16 years ago right as Susato was born that resulted in him abandoning his family for Britain. And he tries to ask Ryunosuke for a favour but we're interrupted before he gets it out. He's not seeming overtly villainous, so maybe I was on the wrong path earlier, but I'm keeping my eye on him!

Stronghart also offers an explanation for Kazuma, and I don't buy that one for a second. He found a completely unidentifiable eastern man and just decided to make him van Zieks's apprentice? After he enquired so thoroughly with us about Kazuma last game? Nah. I like him here, though, he's as sinister as ever but any fury he has towards us or Barok is unspoken, he claims not to resent us for taking down Sithe. I might believe him on that one, given that she only went down because both Ryunosuke and Barok were the lawyers in that trial, and that both of us were only there because he personally ordered us to take on the case. What is your game plan, Mael? I believe him when he states his goal about becoming Attorney General and making Britain's judicial system a world leader, but I don't see how his actions behind the scenes are leading to that.

Sholmes also also tells us something about Kazuma, but not really. I like you, Sholmes, but the eventual explanation had better be fantastic for you to have unnecessarily traumatised Ryunosuke and Susato like that for so long (and continue to lie to us). Oh, he is a redhead, now, too. The Red Headed League will come into play later, I guess, though the introduction of the two characters isn't very promising (and wow Gina has completely become a cop with no empathy for those on the side she was once on, a shame).

London is a very small place, we see more jurors wandering around every day. Evie Vigil introduces herself as looking for her missing husband Daley, who works at the prison where the Professor was held and killed. After a bit of back and forth with Yujin we talk to his boss Barry Caidin and learn that he hasn't worked in the prison for 10 years, and was made to leave after helping an inmate escape the gallows. ...How exactly did the Professor wind up in that grave, then? Hmm.

During proceedings we find out some more about Genshin. His Japanese compatriots didn't understand the killings, but we're told by Stronghart that he targeted 'blights' of society and was celebrated by some. Oh hell yeah, he really was the Reaper 1.0! Now this could be great.

The first explanation I thought of is that Kazuma has killed Daley because of his role in his father's death. Kazuma regained his memory 8 days ago and disappeared 2 days ago, and Daley disappeared yesterday. But now that we know Daley helped Genshin escape, that seems very unlikely. Still, both of them disappearing together isn't a coincidence, I'm sure.

Hmmm

The intro to this case is pretty strong

Hmmm some more.

These hmmms have me feeling foolish and nervous!

My post was all I could say without going "Hmmm"

uh

WHAT

Hmmm

I am completely taken aback, I truly did not see this development coming in the slightest.

Sholmes has blue hair now.

Oh shit, you finally arrived at the shocking plot twist of Sholmes's blue hair

Well, RIP Gregsy. What a bonkers twist to drop on us like that! We'd already settled into the early goings of a case, with new plot threads and ongoing intrigue on the way, and then bam! Out of nowhere a major character dies offscreen, and everything is turned on its head just like that. Bold is the word.

Gregson had defaulted back to his gruff but friendly supporting role so far in the second game, I had assumed they were going to build up to his shadier stuff later on, with The List and all that. But no, he's just gone! I mean I assume we'll get answers on that anyway, but... wow. I did not feel like this is a character who had run his course, not in the slightest. And it feels like a very un-AA move! All bets are off, now!?

And that's not all, of course. Gregson has been killed, van Zieks has been arrested for the murder and will be our client in the upcoming trial, and Kazuma will be the prosecutor. And this isn't even the finale! Honestly so much happens here that I'm kind of in a daze with it all. We learn more of Gregson's history. Apparently he was a legendary detective; Stronghart, Gina, van Zieks, and all the nameless officers are full of nothing but effusive praise for the man, and this is absolutely not how he has been treated up until now lol. I know this is intentional, I don't doubt that much of this praise is because he's just died, but it's interesting how quickly people's perceptions can change.

Kazuma, for one, appears a very different man to the one we once knew. He blows hot and cold with Ryunosuke, is buddies with Stronghart, and throws cryptic clues at us more than ever. There are glimpses of his old amicable self, which makes it all the more heartbreaking that there's many glaring signposts pointing him on a very dark path. I really hope he doesn't sink into the darkness! Barok is convinced Kazuma is out to avenge his father, and I worry that that's exactly what he's doing, but to a greater extent than even Barok realises. But this game is clearly able to surprise me in a number of ways, so I'm not giving up hope for Asogi Jr.

Stronghart is content to drop his #1 prosecutor in a flash. First Sithe, now van Zieks, is he clearing house for some reason? It appears half of London was involved in the super secret closed trial of Genshin Asogi- now we have Barok, Mael, and Gregson to add to the list. Anyone else? God, everyone is acting so strangely today. I know there's a good reason, it just all feels so off >_>

Well, I'll hand it to them, this may be the most surprised I've ever been at the identity of a case victim in Ace Attorney, it's at least up there with the original 1-2's. Gregson was a pretty cool character, I personally enjoyed him most in his shadiest moments in 1-5, and there's more of him to come in this case I'm sure. What happens to all of his mysteries now? I'm more confused about The List than ever. What connects these four people?! They didn't all know each other, or Kazuma would've reacted to Jezaille in the first case. Three of them have now died but they can't have all been targets of the British government, as it went out of its way to protect Brett. I suppose Shinn and Wilson could've both been involved with the Professor case somehow to connect all four, but then there's so many others who could add to the list. Why Wilson and not Sholmes, for instance. And why did Gregson try to hop away to France, as if he was on the Reaper's kill list?

For now, all we can do is pour out a cup of fish and chips in Gregsy's honour.

I do actually like the weirdness of the tonal shift from Sholmes's blue hair to the shocking news of Gregson's death and Sholmes's hair is just awkwardly still blue

Yeah, Gregson is a legitimately shocking victim.

Yeah, I had to just post nothing after the previous update because you stopped at the absolute worst part you possibly could've.

I was probably being too cheeky with my "hmmm" lol

MrSmartGuy posted...

Yeah, I had to just post nothing after the previous update because you stopped at the absolute worst part you possibly could've.

I can't believe how poor a stopping point it was lol. Literally the very next scene!

Yeah I couldn't help it, I was like wow lol

aww yeah

which AA games have you not played? there are some cool victim choices in the later ones there too

I haven't played Apollo Justice, Spirit of Justice, or the spinoffs aside from this one.

Huh, I never noticed that the even numbered mainline games all have Justice in the title

Oh I also haven't played the DLC case for Dual Destinies.

I've randomly remembered Susato tampering with the crime scene in the last game, has she just gotten away with that now lol

wtf remedy not playing DD's dlc case IMMEDIATELY

alright fine, if that's what you all want.

*Whale Noises* A Phoenix Wright: Ace Attorney- Dual Destinies DLC Case Playthrough Topic!

Some months after unmasking the Phantom; Phoenix, Apollo, and Athena head off to visit Seaworld. After some shenanigans, we wind up in ocean court defending a dolphin accused of murdering a pirate captain, or something, I've only seen a couple of screenshots of this case that's as far as I can go. No, I'm afraid I'm not ditching our GAAC gang to purchase the AJ Trilogy so I can play a single case. Even if the public demand it!

Susato's father and Sholmes drop by to wish us well in court, though they don't interact with each other. I've been waiting for Yujin to meet Herlock and Iris soon in the hope that somebody will finally break the news to the poor girl about her father, but today is not that day. We're told this case will be in a closed court, meaning no jury :( I don't know if this decision was made to make things feel more serious for the player, or if they ran out of character models for jurors or couldn't think of a good way to do a summation examination this time. I'm a bit disappointed, I like jury stuff, but hopefully it pays off!

We learn from van Zieks's testimony that he was investigating Gregson... and maybe Gregson was investigating him. What a farce! The autopsy report has a coroner listed so there's our new suspect, don't tell me Maria Gorey is that daughter of Sithe's. Well whoever she is, she's sloppy, as we have no time of death listed here. I legitimately wonder if that's a typo, but later it of course turns out to be intentional. I shouldn't be doubting this game on stuff like this by now, it's significantly better on the typo front than the OG trilogy was.

I plan to present the candelabrum after pressing all of Barok's statements, but to my surprise Kazuma beats me to it! The prosecutor fills our usual role of exposing contradictions and formulating a slightly shaky theory, and with a sick new remix of his theme to boot! Kazuma is so cool. I wonder if the dialogue changes if you present the candelabrum before he gets a chance to.

Before long we meet our new witnesses Venus, Gossip, and Beppo! Who is now going by the name Sandwich! And is a poor philosopher or something, I guess that McGilded money didn't take him very far. These three are every stereotype of the usual unhelpful zany day 1 witness combined, to a point that it's definitely intentional. Venus in particular lies for absolutely no reason and freely admits it several times, which I do get a chuckle out of. For the first time we see Gregson's corpse in a photo, though the sadness is rather undercut by the hilarious wig he is wearing. Didn't dye his moustache, though, showing a distinct lack of commitment to the bit. Also I'm a bit upset there's no spilled cup of fish and chips in the corner.

With some board moving shenanigans we eventually realise that Gregson could have been killed up to a day beforehand. I'm reminded of Sholmes yesterday saying he invited Gregson over to arrest the redheads but receiving no reply... Oof. It takes me three goes to present the right evidence to show what case Gregson was working on- I first try the notice board to imply the Professor, and then the photo of Mrs Vigil, before the wig. My bad!

After presenting our theory, Kazuma breaks into good-natured laughter, and praises Ryunosuke's growth as a lawyer, before making clear his own resolve to find the truth, and openly smack talking the British justice system in a court filled with judicial representatives of the country. Oh hell yeah, there's the Kazuma I know and love! I'm so glad he's back with us. Thankfully I now very much doubt he did this crime or that he is out for basic revenge, instead his mission is probably to expose the corruption in the courts of this country, and he'll be using Stronghart until he has enough evidence to take him down. Go, Kazuma!

Time for recess, hopefully this is a good stopping point and Gina isn't going to get immediately stabbed in the defendant's lobby when I next play this.

Kazuma's prosecutor theme is such a banger

andylt posted...

Time for recess, hopefully this is a good stopping point and Gina isn't going to get immediately stabbed in the defendant's lobby when I next play this.

??? But what happened to the dolphin?

Leonhart4 posted...

Kazuma's prosecutor theme is such a banger

I would look it up but don't want to accidentally spoil myself again! That'll have to wait until I've beaten the game.

Dels posted...

??? But what happened to the dolphin?

Acquitted of all charges, only to be found mauled to death by a Reaper Cuttlefish three days later.

andylt posted...

Acquitted of all charges, only to be found mauled to death by a Reaper Cuttlefish three days later.

wtf i thought you said you stopped looking at spoilers for cases you haven't played...!

i like kazuma's prosecutor theme but his original is way better tbh

They're two of the best songs in these two games, so you can't go wrong either way.

TheRock1525 posted...

So be honest: Barok van Zieks' theme.

Great prosecutor theme?
Or greatest prosecutor theme?

There is now a challenger to this title!

Our next witnesses are even zanier than the last. Fabien de Rousseau and Peppino de Rossi are comic criminals in the Skulkin style, with Peppino constantly implicating them both without thinking, and being seemingly unaware of the gravity of the situation around them. Sadly they're not as enjoyable as the Skulkins, I don't mind them but these are pretty well-tread archetypes now. Peppino in particular somehow manages to hit new heights of national stereotyping for the series!

The cross-examinations are fine, and eventually lead us to a twist I did not see coming. Gossip is not a random pedlar at all, but is actually Hugh Boone, the renter of the property Gregson's body was found in. And shortly after that we find out he's actually our missing Daly Vigil! Looking now I can see the resemblance in the pictures, and we had explicitly been told that Daly's face had no distinguishing characteristics. I'm a bit annoyed at myself for not catching this one, I had taken Gossip's appearance completely at face value. I really like this twist, the game completely tricked me into thinking he was an inconsequential comedy witness with a distinct character design, and the reversal from 'he couldn't possibly disguise himself given his appearance' to 'his appearance is the disguise' is done well. Good job, game!

Looking back, we were incredibly lucky that Evie went to Sholmes when she did so we had all the info we needed. Pretty unlucky for Daly not to get away with this! The ensuing tale is interesting, hell yeah Shady Gregson is back! He hired Daly to pretend to be him many times (I don't know how Mr Vigil provided for his family in the years before Gregsy showed up), and seems to have been secretly working on the Reaper case himself. I wonder how this ties in to his Paris trip, did he think he'd have the case solved by then or did he realise his time would be up soon somehow? He mentions the possibility of his own death to Daly, in any case.

Just as things appear to be winding down for the day, it's time for the Kazuma show to recommence. Woo! Asogi Jr is hellbent on finding out the truth behind his father's death, pushing Mr Vigil into remembering horrors he had buried very deep into himself. Kazuma's determination is a little frightening for Ryunosuke, and his speech about the human spirit being crushed is worrying to say the least. Nonetheless we help our friend, and poor Daly collapses after being forced to remember what looks like his own suicide attempt. Jeez. Part of me wants Ryunosuke to pull Kazuma back from the brink before it's too late, and another part of me wants to see just how far he can go and how much he can accomplish on his mission.

Heck yeah the Gossip reveal is so good.

The Gossip reveal makes that section worth it because I generally did not enjoy it. Venus in particular is pretty annoying.

Well, I should clarify. I didn't enjoy the Gossip/Venus/Sandwich part. The redheads were pretty entertaining.

I thought Gossip's hair made it obvious

Finally caught up on this topic

Either I haven't played enough Ace Attorney games or I've played too many, but I didn't bat an eye at Gossip's appearance!

Our second afternoon of investigating doesn't have much to do with Gregson's murder itself, but we learn a lot of very interesting info. First, van Zieks tells us that Gregson himself was the Reaper, to an extent. 'The Reaper' is an organisation of many people, and Tobias gave the orders to kill to Asa Shinn. Well, those are two big bombshells! I'm glad Gregson is as complex as I'd hoped he was, and this gives us a brand new connection between two names on The List. Though Jezaille seemed terrible, did she believe in the Reaper's mission or was she just a contracted killer? And of course this raises all sorts of questions about why she killed Dr Wilson, and why Kazuma's name is on the list with the three of them. Also, I wonder how Barok came across this information.

Gregson was kind of a badass, huh. This revelation doesn't come as a surprise to everyone else we talk to though, Kazuma seems to have figured it out already. Our talk with Kazuma is long overdue and clears up many things (though he's still a little frosty at times). I'm now convinced that Genshin was innocent, with how he protected Barok's life ('Klint would never forgive me', he says), how everybody says it didn't seem in character, and a lot of the intrigue makes more sense if we think he was framed. But of course, who was he framed by? There's no shortage of suspects. It could be either of the other Japanese students- is this why Jigoku exists? If the Reaper organisation was already intact, it could have been Gregson. Or Stronghart, if he's the one who was giving Gregson the orders.

Stronghart's shadowy behaviour is coming closer and closer to the light, as we learn he pressured Dr Gorey to alter the autopsy report. Perhaps he had Gregson killed for wanting to leave the reaping line of work to move to Paris. Maybe he's not the final boss of the game, and we'll take him down here?

Mikotoba Sr finally meets Iris, and the gang continue to shelter her from learning about her father's murder. Look, I know they mean well but it's been a year now, how much longer do we plan on hiding this from her? You're supposed to be all about pursuing the truth, Ryunosuke! Interestingly, Yujin tells us with some confidence that John Wilson was not Sholmes' partner back then. I don't know who could have been, then, but I suppose it's another lie from Herlock to add to the list. Yujin also asks Ryunosuke to go back to Japan, which I guess will be the epilogue of the game and Susato will choose to go with him instead of staying with Kazuma (if Kazuma stays, or is even still around). Sholmes also has an unknown message to send to Japan.

Daley gives us his version of events 10 years ago, insisting he didn't let Genshin escape. Another flashback has Genshin say 'I'm guilty of the unforgivable crime of ending another human's life, yes.'. A choice of words that does not equate to guilt for the mass murders, of course, but I wonder who he killed. And we receive info on a new mysteriously missing item, Gensin's alleged will known as the 'Asogi papers'. More pieces of the puzzle, we're on our way.

That's all for today, if someone promptly dies in the next scene I swear I'm not doing this on purpose.

Hmmm

noooo don't doom me again!

Hmmmmm