Board 8 > Anagram Aces Ace Attorney: A Phoenix Wright Playthrough Topic (spoilers)

(+) Yeah! (+)

Underleveled posted...

AJ is easily the most straightforward.

Eh, the two most recent AA games are very straightforward, but they're also written by different people than the OT.

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- We call Samus Aran to the witness stand.
- I love her glasses exploding when shes surprised, but I love even more how she puts on a spare pair. Thats genius.
- Im going to pin you down, Ms. Andrews!
- Theres a law It says I cant be forced to testify about something if it can incriminate me! I mean, first of all, thats news in this universe, second of all, that law only applies to the chief of police, third of all, you were already testifying this whole time and it needs to be invoked before you testify, fourth of all, that only applies if youre the defendant, and fifth and most important of all, you invoked this law when Phoenix asked how tall you are, which is something that can be easily measured without your testimony. Phoenix is then like Franziska gave her that idea, but I mean, pleading the fifth isnt that rare of an idea, a random person could plausibly choose to do it.
- I like Edgeworth helping because he realizes something is up. Semi-friendly Edgeworth is the best Edgeworth.
- I mean Phoenix was going to have his case thrown out because he had no definitive evidence, and only had circumstance evidence, but he wins it because She poured the juice after seeing a knife sticking out of the guys body, so she must have known he was dead? I mean, sure, but thats no more definitive than anything else hes said.
- Usually, the real killer confesses to his or her guilt. Thank God Phoenix Wright is too young to remember OJ Simpson.
- Adrien: Please! Please stop! I beg you! If people find out If people find out Ill Edgeworth: If youre going to say you would choose death, that is of no concern to me. Stone ****ing cold. That alone is going to make Edgeworth jump over von Karma for best prosecutor.
- Adrien has admitted that she put all of the evidence on Matt, how is this even still a trial? Theres literally nothing pointing to Matt at this point except a motive.
- I didnt even realize the judge had a chair behind him.

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Anagram posted...

- I love her glasses exploding when shes surprised, but I love even more how she puts on a spare pair. Thats genius.

Top tier damage animation

Anagram posted...

second of all, that law only applies to the chief of police

technically the Chief of Police can refuse to testify for any reason at all, not just if it can incriminate him

but yeah Edgeworth calling Adrian's bluff is a top tier moment in 2-4

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Edgeworth is indeed the greatest

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Adrian <3

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- Edgeworth is like lol theres a professional assassin who leaves these cards that Samus Aran was playing with, also your client hired him.
- We go to Matt Engardes house to feed his cat, only to find the assassin there. But Phoenix doesnt know hes the assassin. So, Phoenix Are you not going to mention how the butlers face is split in the middle? Okay then.
- I like how in Corridas room, the guitar case is still wet, and an alarm clock says its 8 oclock when its still bright outside.
- I had to highlight the bear statues eyeball? Shut up, game.
- Hold on a second, Im gonna consult myself, okay?
- I actually expected Matt Engarde to behind everything because he was otherwise too boring and pointless, but I didnt expect his transformation. Now thats a turnabout. Also, I like the glass of wine he pulls from nowhere. Actually, thinking about it, my logic was flawed anyway, because Will Powers was also boring and pointless and he was still the defendant once. Oh well.
- Im sorry, game. I can accept that Phoenix can identify a cat meow he heard one time over a radio, sure. Im fine with that. But I dont accept that the police never searched the house of a murder suspect.

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The Matt Engarde reveal is just one of the best moments of the series. It still gives me chills even after several replays.

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Aww yeah Shoe

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The Engarde reveal is probably a top 10 moment in videogames for me if I cared to rank them

It's just so good

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THE HAlRFLIP

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Meow!

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The hair flip is so good. 2-4 is the best.

Also why are you surprised at police incompetence at this point?

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And Engarde's reveal shows there's an inherent loophole with the Magatama because Phoenix asked if he killed Juan. Matt said no, and nothing appeared because technically he didn't. It can fail if you don't ask the right questions.

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Leonhart4 posted...

And Engarde's reveal shows there's an inherent loophole with the Magatama because Phoenix asked if he killed Juan. Matt said no, and nothing appeared because technically he didn't. It can fail if you don't ask the right questions.

Still better than going off of nothing!

Leonhart4 posted...

Also why are you surprised at police incompetence at this point?

That, at least, is true.

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I think it worked out better that way because, like Phoenix, I wanted to believe Engarde was innocent despite all the evidence piling up against him that second day, clinging to that moment when he asked if he killed Juan and no Psyche-Locks appeared. It made the hair flip that much harder of a gut punch when it happened.

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- I like how Phoenixs nightmare only acknowledges the existence of one judge in the world. Which is a bit interesting. You could have easily made these games to have plenty of wacky judges like every other character; they must have consciously chosen to have one judge throughout every case.
- Wait, Phoenix told Gumshoe about Engarde being evil? Because Gumshoe was sure as hell not there when we learned that.
- After Gumshoe told Phoenix to draw everything out as long as possible, I somehow misread Mias You have something money can never buy. Friendship. as You have to babble about something. Friendship. I dont know how I did that, but I like my version better.
- I enjoy Will Powers assuming that Phoenix is always trying to turn the witness into a bad guy.
- Mr. Edgeworth! I blame you for leading me down this route!
- I cant remember, is this the first time a witness has been called twice in a case?
- Mia is called by Maya to see where she is, and describes looking out of a small window in an office building third floor. But office buildings have giant windows because thats the entire design! Theres no office building with small windows. Bad move, game.
- I like the touch of the people watching still arguing when Phoenix is talking, which has never happened before, because his client is so obviously evil.
- So am I not allowed to ask why the suicide note was left in the bear instead of being pulled out of it?
- The game really won me over with Phoenix saying I have an objection, Edgeworth complaining that that very weak, and Phoenix raising his finger and doing the OBJECTION thing.
- Holy god, that was the most amazing throw in history. Phoenix saying TAKE THAT and then a spinning sprite of the cell phone they didnt even remove from the gray box around evidence, and no movement on Edgeworth at all This is some kind of strange form of art.
- Didnt see Edgeworth calling de Killer coming, I expected him to call Engarde. Why do they never call the defendants to the stand? And dont you dare say that you cant call a defendant to the stand in real life, Larry Butz disproved that in the first case of the first game.
- Anyway, that radio reveal, that is A+ material. That beats the parrot easily. I saw the parrot coming from a mile away, this I did not. I also like how when the radio moves, its just being stretched out with photoshop in the laziest way imaginable.
- Im just going to say it: the game would be better if the judge had a shocked face like the lawyers. Sometimes you get Phoenix and Edgeworth freaking out and the judge also freaks out, but he still just looks normal.
- If you cant believe the word of a professional assassin, who can you believe?
- I like Phoenix fake objecting and Edgeworth fake apologizing.
- Im a little confused about how de Killer could know so much about what happens in the trial without knowing Adrien Andrews gender, but fine.
- The radio exploding and sweating oil is nice, but somehow its not on the level of glasses or puppets exploding, and its certainly not lightning Gant.
- Oh god, her name was Adrian the whole time? Thats how I normally spell it, I spelled it with an E because I could have sworn I saw it spelled that way in the game, ugh.
- What do you think, Ms. von Karma? Well, I was just shot. I got a bad ending on purpose because I wanted to see what would happen. Wait, this is the game that gave us the miracle never happen? Because if so, the Steam version corrected the tense.
- I cant help but notice how no one actually shows de Killer the tape. Im sure they wanted to dodge around how this was a radio transceiver, but cmon.
- I like Maya complaining that shes referred to as an item.
- I cant help but notice how the judge didnt actually declare Engarde guilty.
- Wow, I didnt realize how much taller than Maya Phoenix is. Shes very short.
- Im honestly shocked that they bothered to make a coatless Gumshoe sprite.
- So Edgeworth uses the transceiver to track down Franziska while shes at the airport, eh? Here is the most nitpicky thing I will ever nitpick: if this was LA, that would make this airport LAX, and theres no way you could ever park at LAX in time to reach Franziska while she was still at the terminal because the traffic for a mile around the airport in every direction is always completely stopped. Alternatively: this is the Burbank Airport, which you can find fast parking for, but I dont think Burbank has international flights.
- I like Mayas picture at the end. Thats very touching, and its extra touching that Franziska takes it. I like how Franziska spends the whole game trying to have a very specific persona, only to finally drop it for one second at the end with her adoptive brother. Ill talk more about this in my overview, though.

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Anagram posted...

- I cant remember, is this the first time a witness has been called twice in a case?

Yogi was called twice in 1-4.

Anagram posted...

- Anyway, that radio reveal, that is A+ material. That beats the parrot easily. I saw the parrot coming from a mile away, this I did not. I also like how when the radio moves, its just being stretched out with photoshop in the laziest way imaginable.

The radio also vaguely resembles de Killer!

Anagram posted...

- Im a little confused about how de Killer could know so much about what happens in the trial without knowing Adrien Andrews gender, but fine.

I mean you played the entire case not knowing how to spell her name...!

Anagram posted...

Wait, this is the game that gave us the miracle never happen? Because if so, the Steam version corrected the tense.

Yeah, the ports did some touchup on some of the localization errors in the original games. That's not the only one, but that's the most famous one.

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Your client...
Matt Engarde is...

> Guilty
> Not Guilty

?

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I chose guilty.

So, question. If there was no suicide note, why did Celeste have ink on her finger when the cops examined her body? I remember that being the evidence for her writing a note.

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I really love that that decision has no effect on the case; it's just a personal choice about what being a lawyer means to you.

(I chose guilty as well)

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Did you choose Guilty both times?

Also, the anime changes a ton of details in 2-4 and most of the time not for the better.

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Yeah, I did choose guilty both times. What does the anime change?

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Lotta's role gets replaced by Larry for some reason. They made Adrian and Celeste sisters for some reason. They made the suicide note real for some reason.

Oh, and they actually showed the video tape. There were some other little things (as well as just going through it too fast and not giving it room to breathe), but those were the major things.

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#notguilty

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LeonhartFour posted...

Lotta's role gets replaced by Larry for some reason. They made Adrian and Celeste sisters for some reason. They made the suicide note real for some reason.

Oh, and they actually showed the video tape. There were some other little things (as well as just going through it too fast and not giving it room to breathe), but those were the major things.

Those are all really weird changes. Not necessarily bad, but the logic behind them sounds fuzzy.

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Removing Lotta is always a positive change

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WazzupGenius00 posted...

Removing Lotta is always a positive change

That's violence against my fair self!

That's fine.

That ain't fine! That's a whip!

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Overall Thoughts:
- Im not really certain what I think of Franziska. The difference between her and Edgeworth is obvious: Edgeworth feels like your equal from the start, Franziska never does. When youre arguing with Edgeworth, you always feel like youre fighting an uphill battle against the guy who has all of the advantages, except for the times when he helps you (which is admittedly every single case hes in except 1-2). Edgeworth is always collected and dangerous, and the biggest way to show the difference between them is their surprised sprites: Edgeworth glowers and looks angry while Franziska clutches her chest and looks scared. Edgeworth even seems more professional even when mocking you (they both wag their finger, but Edgeworth does it while standing whereas she does it while leaning over the desk). She just comes off as kind of childish, which is an odd personality trait for someone whos supposed to be the antagonist for half the game. I guess what Im saying is that Franziska does not create an environment where you feel excited to defeat her or where you feel constantly up against the ropes like Edgeworth does, which makes defeating her less satisfying. Anyway, Edgeworth > von Karma > Franziska > Payne.
- 2-1 is kind of unremarkable. Theres nothing really to even say about it except that it actually has nothing to do with the plot, whereas 1-1 introduces Larry Butz and the clock.
- 2-2 is more interesting. I like getting more worldbuilding on Mayas history and Kurain Village, and I like the general idea of the mystery. The problem with it is that the mystery is incredibly obvious. You know from the second Morgan Fey shows up that shes responsible for everything, so the only actual plot twist is Ini Mineys identity, but it doesnt even matter. If shed really been Ini Miney, shed be out for revenge against the doctor, and if shes Mimi Miney, then shes trying to cover up her tracks, but either way it doesnt really matter, does it? And thats the only actual twist the case has because of how obvious everything in it is every other detail, even where the real killer was hiding, was super obvious. This wasnt a problem in any of the first games cases, which all had really complicated plots with twists that actually throw you for a loop. Maybe Im overanalyzing things here, but when I play a mystery game, I expect to be floored by some unexpected motives and real killers identities, and I technically got those things in unsatisfying ways. On the flipside, the characters themselves are all great or at least fine (Doctor Hotti excepted), so it does have that.
- 2-3 is definitely the worst case of the first two games. Its not just that the mystery is kind of lame and you instantly figure out that the murder victim was killed accidentally, its not just that the circus characters are all super lame and annoying, its that the mystery of the murder itself is really unsatisfying and defeating Acro is even less satisfying. Hes basically just a guy looking for revenge. All of the other killers had like resources or plans or accomplices to work your way through, he had a monkey and a blanket. I guess that works as a filler episode, but as a standalone story, its very weak.
- 2-4, though, is so good. Edgeworth is back and just styles all over Franziska, the case ends with all of the lawyers teaming up and defeating the villains together, de Killer has a weird sense of honor that makes him interesting, Engarde has a fantastic evil reveal and a great line (Im gonna consult myself), Franziska tears up and shows vulnerability at the end, and Phoenix learns about himself the same way Edgeworth does: by losing a case and having to come to grips with the ethical complexities of his job. Add to that a ticking clock element, a sympathetic witness, a lot of wacky shenanigans in the courtroom as Phoenix and Edgeworth work together, and the generally clever twist of having to work against your own client, and I think I can comfortably call this the best case so far.
- One thing I noticed is the deemphasis on Maya. Maya is barely in 2-1 and Pearl takes her place in 2-2 and 2-4, so Maya is really only in the game in 2-3, which surprised me. Before I played this series, I knew Maya by sight and assumed she was the main girl whos always with you, and that wasnt really the case here.
- If you asked me which game is better, Id have to give it to the first. Its mysteries just seem better thought out. AA2 is working at a disadvantage from having one fewer case, but even accounting for that, 2-3 is very weak and 2-1 is just a tutorial. 2-2 is perfectly fine, and 2-4 is the best Ive seen so far, but its not enough to push it over AA1.
- In summary, 2-4 > 1-4 > 1-5 > 1-2 = 2-2 > 1-3 > 1-1 > 2-1 > 2-3

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Yeah, I agree with you almost entirely about Franziska, but I almost think that's kind of the point of her character. She openly declares herself to be this prodigy when she's really not (and as she admits in the ending, she's fully aware that she's not). Maya points out that they're the same age at one point in the game, and Franziska does act her age at times, even though she tries not to let anyone see it. She also has a massive inferiority complex from living in the shadow of her father and Edgeworth. It does make her much less satisfying to beat her, especially since she just whips Phoenix into unconsciousness every time she loses, but yeah, I get why they made her that way. Not a huge fan of hers overall though.

and aw yeah 2-4 the best

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Anagram posted...

- 2-4, though, is so good. Edgeworth is back and just styles all over Franziska, the case ends with all of the lawyers teaming up and defeating the villains together, de Killer has a weird sense of honor that makes him interesting, Engarde has a fantastic evil reveal and a great line (Im gonna consult myself), Franziska tears up and shows vulnerability at the end, and Phoenix learns about himself the same way Edgeworth does: by losing a case and having to come to grips with the ethical complexities of his job. Add to that a ticking clock element, a sympathetic witness, a lot of wacky shenanigans in the courtroom as Phoenix and Edgeworth work together, and the generally clever twist of having to work against your own client, and I think I can comfortably call this the best case so far.

This really nails it. So, so amazing.

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Anagram posted...

- Holy god, that was the most amazing throw in history. Phoenix saying TAKE THAT and then a spinning sprite of the cell phone they didnt even remove from the gray box around evidence, and no movement on Edgeworth at all This is some kind of strange form of art.

For all the humour PW attempts and is often successful at, this is by far the funniest thing the games have ever done

I love it. And it honestly to the game's charm in a way.

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LeonhartFour posted...

Yeah, I agree with you almost entirely about Franziska, but I almost think that's kind of the point of her character. She openly declares herself to be this prodigy when she's really not (and as she admits in the ending, she's fully aware that she's not). Maya points out that they're the same age at one point in the game, and Franziska does act her age at times, even though she tries not to let anyone see it. She also has a massive inferiority complex from living in the shadow of her father and Edgeworth. It does make her much less satisfying to beat her, especially since she just whips Phoenix into unconsciousness every time she loses, but yeah, I get why they made her that way. Not a huge fan of hers overall though.

and aw yeah 2-4 the best

I would guess she was made that way to emphasize Edgeworth's eventual return.

XIII_rocks posted...

For all the humour PW attempts and is often successful at, this is by far the funniest thing the games have ever done

I love it. And it honestly to the game's charm in a way.

I was shocked. It's so good.

I forgot to mention the one thing 2-3 does that I liked. Because it comes after 2-2, it understands the player is predisposed to suspecting airheaded people as the killer, so to reveal that Regina is really all surface is a good twist.

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I just looked up the games after AA3 because I wanted to know why they aren't on Steam. So they're all DS/3DS/iOS exclusive, huh? Stupid Nintendo gimmicks making it hard to port things.

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Anagram posted...

I just looked up the games after AA3 because I wanted to know why they aren't on Steam. So they're all DS/3DS/iOS exclusive, huh? Stupid Nintendo gimmicks making it hard to port things.

Yep, they all use touch screen features in some way.

Although 1-5 did too and they found a way around that, so I wouldn't be surprised if AA4-6 get ported to other systems at some point.

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I believe they're on android too

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Anagram posted...

- I actually expected Matt Engarde to behind everything because he was otherwise too boring and pointless, but I didnt expect his transformation. Now thats a turnabout. Also, I like the glass of wine he pulls from nowhere. Actually, thinking about it, my logic was flawed anyway, because Will Powers was also boring and pointless and he was still the defendant once. Oh well.

Well, that paraellel to 1-3 is very much intentional. The case involves an actor playing a costumed character allegedly stabbing another actor in the Steel Samurai universe. There is a photograph that incriminates the actor, except for a small detail on the character's leg. The most suspicious person is an emotionally cold woman. You even have Oldbag working security who eventually gets placated with an autograph from the deceased.

A lot of that is to get you thinking 2-4 is going to play out just as 1-3 did, until they go in the direction of the actor actually being guilty.

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Anagram posted...

Wait, this is the game that gave us the miracle never happen?

Yes, which is why the phrase is normally used when Phoenix is losing to characters with actual contest strength.

Though in the last contest, the miracle actually happen.

I admit I don't quite understand people picking Guilty for the final choice in 2-4. It just felt when I played it like the narrative really wanted you to choose Not Guilty and it was the stronger conclusion.

Anyway looking forward to your playthrough of Trials and Tribulations. I actually played it before any of the other games, because I found it used, but it remains my favorite by a large margin.

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Sceptilesolar posted...

I admit I don't quite understand people picking Guilty for the final choice in 2-4. It just felt when I played it like the narrative really wanted you to choose Not Guilty and it was the stronger conclusion.

then you missed the point

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LeonhartFour posted...

then you missed the point

Yes, I literally said 'I don't understand', thanks.

It's a satisfying comeuppance to force the criminal to admit his own guilt, as punishment for a character who you've been made to hate for their actions. I never chose Guilty so maybe the justification on that side is also good.

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I mean, I don't pick "not guilty" because of "what it means to be a lawyer" or whatever, I pick not guilty because it's so much more of an awesome fuck you to Engarde

Yeah I also picked Not Guilty to spite Matt lol.

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I was thinking more of the first choice when I said that! (Which is a better moment than the second imo)

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LeonhartFour posted...

then you missed the point

Phoenix and Mia's and Armando's refrain through the series is to always believe in your client, no matter what, and to never give up, giving your brightest smiles when things look the darkest.

Edgeworth became a compelling character when he started to prioritize the truth over winning, differentiating himself from his teacher. He increasingly works as a foil, providing opposition to the defense so that the truth could be revealed.

Lawyers defend their clients no matter what. Prosecutors seek truth and justice.

#notguilty

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NFUN posted...

Lawyers defend their clients no matter what.

2-4's all about exploring what it means to defend someone and that it's not solely about the verdict they receive.

Mia's creed applies to the situation with Maya in 2-4, not Engarde.

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2-4's about making Matt suffer

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I mean, honestly, even if you still think Phoenix's job is to get a not guilty verdict no matter what, you could still argue that Matt isn't really a client, since Phoenix was forced to take him.

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I mean Matt suffers either way

the type of humiliation varies depending on what you choose

but yeah if it was strictly about always going for not guilty verdicts no matter what then Phoenix failed in 2-4 and the game clearly doesn't portray it that way

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Anagram posted...

I mean, honestly, even if you still think Phoenix's job is to get a not guilty verdict no matter what, you could still argue that Matt isn't really a client, since Phoenix was forced to take him.

you could argue that de Killer was the client...!

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I picked Guilty just to make 100% sure Adrian didn't get executed cuz who fuckin knows in this universe!

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