Board 8 > Politics Containment Topic 191: Hey Now, You're a Lodestar

(+) Yeah! (+)

friendly reminder that trump is still linking to breitbart articles.
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Oh man someone farted again
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LordoftheMorons posted...

Dancedreamer posted...

As for judicial, I'd say that Supreme Court seats should NOT be for life. Instead, each justice should get a 10 year term. After that, they can't be a supreme court justice anymore.

Life terms do a lot to prevent Justices from being beholden to anyone else (whether voters for a future office, or one of the parties in a case who could potentially offer them a lucrative job).

Also with 10 year terms you'd often have Supreme courts that are split like 7-2 or 8-1 R-D or vice versa.

This is a good point. With terms we would have whichever party won the last election in complete control of the court.... Until the next election. That would politicize it.

The courts here are still world renowned for being fair and impartial between political parties, among countries with judiciaries that have political power. And the courts have a lot of power here - since they are the arbiter of what the Constitution means, effectively they can overrule the other 2 branches short of extreme remedies like impeachment. The courts achieved this level of power over 200 years of careful husbandry, taking great care to appear fair and neutral in the eyes of the people, while the other 2 branches have not covered themselves in glory.
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ChaosTonyV4 posted...

Ok so everyone knows about his

Happy 9/11 even to the haters and losers tweet, but I just found out that this shit is real:

I mean, I think the worst of the Trump's 9/11 comments is this one:

https://twitter.com/NumbersMuncher/status/1039483911779348481

Wherein he feels the need to comment on how he has the tallest building in downtown Manhattan after the towers fell.

~~~

Meanwhile, in the present day, in talking about preparations for Hurricane Florence that Puerto Rico was an "incredible, unsung success" and "one of the best jobs ever."

Nearly 3000 people died.

~~~

And another instance of Kavanaugh lying under oath:

https://twitter.com/SenatorDurbin/status/1039630250106408963
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https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/manafort-in-talks-with-prosecutors-about-possible-plea- [SPACE] according-to-people-familiar-with-the-discussions/2018/09/11/5b98b64c-b60e-11e8-a7b5-adaaa5b2a57f_story.html

Delete the space of course. Damn WaPo links

I wonder if Trump told him no pardon is coming
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https://twitter.com/maddowblog/status/1039685670959280128?s=21

BREAKING: Document shows Trump admin took $10 million from FEMA, gave it to ICE for detentions, ahead of 2018 hurricane season.

Oh good call Donnie
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http://thehill.com/policy/finance/406040-federal-deficit-soars-32-percent-to-895b

The federal deficit hit $895 billion in the first 11 months of fiscal 2018, an increase of $222 billion, or 32 percent, over the same period the previous year, according to the Congressional Budget Office (CBO).

The nonpartisan CBO reported that the central drivers of the increasing deficit were the Republican tax law and the bipartisan agreement to increase spending. As a result, revenue only rose 1 percent, failing to keep up with a 7 percent surge in spending, it added.

Oh hey great job fiscal conservatives
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Jakyl25 posted...

Oh hey great job fiscal conservatives

Well, yeah, if their goal was actually fiscal conservatism.

But given their goal is the dismantling of government they'll now say we have to cut programs and when the Democrats take power they'll say we can't afford any of their policies.

remember, "deficits don't matter*"

*if you're a republican
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UltimaterializerX posted...

Did you already forget the stories about all the undelivered aid that's now rotten and infested? Even the New York Times reported on this: https://www.nytimes.com/2018/08/10/us/puerto-rico-aid.html

From the article

"The spokeswoman said the donated material was being managed by the National Guard."

Hm, national guard huh? That sounds like something under washington's control to me and not under state control.

In a statement, the National Guard said the container captured on video was being used to hold food that had arrived after its expiration date, and had not been held back from distribution in order to protect peoples health. However, the video also showed cases of water, which was also in short supply at times after the storm.

The Guard said that the material in the trailers that isnt spoiled, including batteries, electric fans and food, will be distributed to nonprofit groups in the coming days. It did not explain why the material had not been handed out earlier.

So...seems like there may have even been good intent with these containers. Kind-of. Obviously not distributing water is bad, and not distributing batteries is bad. (Though again, these seem to have been under the control of the national guard, so it was not a state-level fuckup).
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Jakyl25 posted...

https://twitter.com/maddowblog/status/1039685670959280128?s=21

BREAKING: Document shows Trump admin took $10 million from FEMA, gave it to ICE for detentions, ahead of 2018 hurricane season.

Oh good call Donnie

What a piece of shit
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The National Guard is usually under state control unless the federal authorities assume that control. That being said, that very well may have been the case for disaster relief.
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Still a moron.
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And yet none of that excuses his horrible choices to run this country. Or are you going to be the first person in recorded history to defend Betsy DeVos.

This is why I am voting for Andrew Gillum for Florida Governor and why we need to send a strong message to the democratic party - please become more liberal and stop being pussies to the Republicans because it is largely your fault we have someone who has no idea how to run a country in charge. Stop being pussies.
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UltimaterializerX posted...

lordloki12 posted...

Still a moron.

And this the the typical tralala leftist response. Have you accomplished anything on that list?

I have also never stared directly at a solar eclipse or thrown paper towels at people who have had their entire lives destroyed by a natural disaster. But those are the type of decisions only a stable genius could make. It certainly wouldn't be the true nature of a moron who was carried to every accomplishment on your list by others.
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xp1337 posted...

Jakyl25 posted...

Oh hey great job fiscal conservatives

Well, yeah, if their goal was actually fiscal conservatism.

But given their goal is the dismantling of government they'll now say we have to cut programs and when the Democrats take power they'll say we can't afford any of their policies.

remember, "deficits don't matter*"

*if you're a republican

Mission accomplished.
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UltimaterializerX posted...

-take a one million dollar loan and become a billionaire

He uh, inherited a lot more than that.

He's estimated to have started with $40 million when he became president of his dad's real estate company in 1974 (the company itself was estimated at $200 million).

There are also a lot of debates about whether he was a billionaire before he got elected. He never released his tax returns so we don't know...although he lost a lawsuit where he sued someone for claiming he wasn't a billionaire...which if he was a billionaire should be really easy to prove:

https://abcnews.go.com/Business/story?id=8100467&page=1

(He no doubt is making a fuckton of money now that he is president, but that's because he's being obviously corrupt about it. Encouraging foreign ambassadors to stay in Trump hotels. Showing up at Mar a Lago frequently and requiring his secret service to pay for their own rooms and then jacking up the room prices. You know, obvious conflict of interest stuff. He was supposed to divest all his businesses to avoid the appearance of conflict of interest, but near as I can tell he literally doesn't give a fuck about corruption).

But uhh anyway, could I start with a company worth 200 million, and end up with a net worth of 150 million to 250 million after 40 years in business? Yes. Yes I could.
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UltimaterializerX posted...

Obama himself said these numbers would require a magic wand

No he didn't

Might want to use a source other than the world's most prolific liar to get your info
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DoomTheGyarados posted...

And yet none of that excuses his horrible choices to run this country. Or are you going to be the first person in recorded history to defend Betsy DeVos.

This is why I am voting for Andrew Gillum for Florida Governor and why we need to send a strong message to the democratic party - please become more liberal and stop being pussies to the Republicans because it is largely your fault we have someone who has no idea how to run a country in charge. Stop being pussies.

The more liberal your candidate is the more likely you are to lose an election in most areas.
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Let's put that to the test. That's what I keep hearing but frankly Obama, and he is sane and intelligent so god bless him, got little done the two years they had a majority in both houses of congress because only one side knows what the word compromise means and for all of the things I disagree with Republicans on you have to admire their willingness to say fuck you until their near dying breath.

So I guess we will see. I think the Florida election in November will be a telling one. Gillum is incredibly liberal. Let's see who Florida votes for, it's only the most important swing state in the union.
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DoomTheGyarados posted...

Let's put that to the test. That's what I keep hearing but frankly Obama, and he is sane and intelligent so god bless him, got little done the two years they had a majority in both houses of congress because only one side knows what the word compromise means and for all of the things I disagree with Republicans on you have to admire their willingness to say fuck you until their near dying breath.

So I guess we will see. I think the Florida election in November will be a telling one. Gillum is incredibly liberal. Let's see who Florida votes for, it's only the most important swing state in the union.

Neither side is really willing to compromise. They both are only willing to compromise on some details whenever their party is dictating the path.

Democrats comrpromised just as little under Trump as Republicans have under Obama.

During Bush, bipartisan efforts had to happen due to 9/11. The country was too shook to not come together, but we saw how that looked towards the end.

The problem is that the spectrum is like this.

Far Left - Left Center - Center - Right Center - Far Right

The majority of voters fall into the left to right center.

You have a much smaller amount on the Far Left who many either vote Democrat or are fuck political parties types. And you have the Far Right which is much smaller also (smaller than the Far Left) but will vote R no matter what.

So then you have the two parties fighting for that center.

If democrats move further left. They risk losing the center and even maybe some center left at the possible benefit of trying to gain the Far Left. Does the vote benefit justify the move? The answer is likely not. You are trying to woo the fuck political parties end into voting Democrat at the expense of maybe losing the center.

In a perfect world they would retain that center and pick up the Far Left, but it's a huge risk and generally just not a good choice. Democrats can win easily enough in the center-area for the most part. They do win in this area in many races. It is just can they woo the true center and fringe opposite end center better than the other party.

You throw away any fringe opposite end spectrum in that move further down the end. And possibly lose the center. It is just a huge huge and costly risk.

It works in Democratic bastions some, but not so much in more evenly proportionated areas. Democrats hold the numbers in registered voters as is where they are.
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I think honestly if Trump didn't talk the way he did and didn't use Twitter and just made all his decisions with written press releases made by professional writers that Trump's presidency would be viewed much differently.

I mean, the Left will hate him regardless because of how polarizing the election is, but a lot of his decisions I think are sound (tho some aren't). It is just the theatrics around them that makes it too easy to bash.
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I see no defense of Betsy DeVos there. Which is the point. He is gutting key agencies.

Anyway that spectrum is only true in the USA at all. To most of the rest of the world Bernie Sanders would be closer to the center and we've just been so far to the right for so long it is hard for us to see that. If the "center" of this country can't get behind some of the crazy far left stuff like Medicare for all (hint Obama getting behind it means the democratic party is finally ready to accept this) then fine, I don't want to win if that means that is the case.

But.

I have a funny feeling that given most of the 'far left' opinions poll well it is about the messagers not the message.
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DoomTheGyarados posted...

I see no defense of Betsy DeVos there. Which is the point. He is gutting key agencies.

Anyway that spectrum is only true in the USA at all. To most of the rest of the world Bernie Sanders would be closer to the center and we've just been so far to the right for so long it is hard for us to see that. If the "center" of this country can't get behind some of the crazy far left stuff like Medicare for all (hint Obama getting behind it means the democratic party is finally ready to accept this) then fine, I don't want to win if that means that is the case.

But.

I have a funny feeling that given most of the 'far left' opinions poll well it is about the messagers not the message.

Well, yes. I showed a UK political spectrum of the United States and how both parties trot out basically conservative candidates and everyone couldn't handle it. Bernie was liberal, while Clinton and Obama weren't in actuality.

You basically have two conservatives under different guises fighting on a few key different issues most elections.

You saw how much the Democratic Party lined up against letting Sanders win the nomination.

Part of it was that they thought he simply couldn't win (and he probably couldn't if anyone but Trump wins the nomination on the R side). And part of it was the Democratic party simply isn't really as Far to the Left as they want to appear to attract the actual left voters.

As far as Devos, Jeb Bush supported her as a good choice, and I trust his thinking. As far as what Devos has done, I do not know enough about it personally. But, I don't trust what CNN and people in this topic say about her. Many in here literally can't summon an unbiased mind for even a minute in their furor to bash Trump and anything associated to him 24/7. So, I mean, I give her the benefit of the doubt.

As far as Trump gutting agencies, it was something he basically ran on. His goal was to in many ways install heads who were against the agencies in order for them to have an idea of how the agency was overreaching and bring them more into line with what they were supposed to be doing and cut costs in doing so.

While you support the EPA and it's reach I am sure, many agree the EPA is the prime example of an agency overreaching big time in what it was doing.
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DoomTheGyarados posted...

Let's put that to the test. That's what I keep hearing but frankly Obama, and he is sane and intelligent so god bless him, got little done the two years they had a majority in both houses of congress because only one side knows what the word compromise means and for all of the things I disagree with Republicans on you have to admire their willingness to say fuck you until their near dying breath.

To be clear, they had the supermajority for like four months. During that time, they were focused on the ACA and recovering from the recession. The other 20 months of that two years, they had to deal with the Republicans using the filibuster and blocking fucking everything they could.

I think you understand this without me saying it, but I still want it to be said because I have seen too many idiots trot out the "two year supermajority and they got nothing done hurr durr" talking point

itt you're not stupid if you've hosted a reality tv show
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https://www.cnn.com/2018/09/11/politics/kyrsten-sinema-defend-arizona-gop-attack-ad/index.html
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I like Betsy DeVos. She could have treated Omarosa better, but still I like Betsy's school choice advocacy. (even if her critics say it's just a front for promoting religious education.)

Down with homogenized public school systems. They're not much better than the re-education camps the Communist Chinese are herding the Muslims into.
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psaltery posted...

Down with homogenized public school systems. They're not much better than the re-education camps the Communist Chinese are herding the Muslims into.

This is a really dumb thing to say and you should be ashamed of yourself for saying it.
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TheRock1525 posted...

psaltery posted...

Down with homogenized public school systems. They're not much better than the re-education camps the Communist Chinese are herding the Muslims into.

This is a really dumb thing to say and you should be ashamed of yourself for saying it.

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Well, to be fair, the recovery did start under Obama. And Obama did post impressive growth numbers.

However, America was literally in a recession when his numbers are talking about rebounding from a recession. This, his numbers should be higher. It's hard to gain going from a high point to a higher point than from a low point to a high point. There is only so low unemployment can go for example.

We can't directly compare who woulda done better if Obama was overseeing Trump's years or vice versa.

Trump's numbers are good for his term. Obama's were good for his term.
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europe bans memes
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GuessMyUserName posted...

europe bans memes

thank god
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Corrik posted...

Well, to be fair, the recovery did start under Obama. And Obama did post impressive growth numbers.

this. it's also funny how these people only attribute the economy's sucess or lack thereof to the president when it's convenient for them.

conservatives about obama: OBAMA WAS SO TERRIBLE FOR THE ECONOMY GOOD THING TRUMP FIXED EVERYTHING
conservatives about reagan: WELL THE '80S RECESSION WAS COMPLETELY BEYOND HIS CONTROL REAGAN STILL THE GOAT

not saying ALL conservatives talk like this, but i've seen this shit a lot from the dumber ones.
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UltimaterializerX posted...

metroid composite posted...

He no doubt is making a fuckton of money now that he is president, but that's because he's being obviously corrupt about it.

This inaccuracy again? Time and Forbes both reported his wealth going down 400 million since becoming president, which he knew going in. The man in no way intended to become president to get richer. This accusation is patently false.

the man thought there would be financial gains. now his Trump Organization concession stands cant even sell a single bottle of water
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"The man in no way intended to become president"

ulti says something accurate
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Mr Lasastryke posted...

Corrik posted...

Well, to be fair, the recovery did start under Obama. And Obama did post impressive growth numbers.

this. it's also funny how these people only attribute the economy's sucess or lack thereof to the president when it's convenient for them.

conservatives about obama: OBAMA WAS SO TERRIBLE FOR THE ECONOMY GOOD THING TRUMP FIXED EVERYTHING
conservatives about reagan: WELL THE '80S RECESSION WAS COMPLETELY BEYOND HIS CONTROL REAGAN STILL THE GOAT

not saying ALL conservatives talk like this, but i've seen this shit a lot from the dumber ones.

Well, in general they do say it takes a full term after (4 years) for results of a President to take effect. But, I am not sure how accurate that is tbqh. So you could argue that Bush ended the recession with his policies. Or you could argue Trump's numbers are all because of Obama right now. Either way, it is impossible to tell exactly what would have happened with them in each other's shoes.

Maybe Trump's Presidency during Obama's years would have yieled more impressive numbers, maybe worse, or maybe the same for the first term because it was all Bush.

Who the fuck really knows lol. But, it is stupid to not acknowledge the numbers during Obama's presidency. They aren't exactly gonna disappear somehow.
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trdl23 posted...

TheRock1525 posted...

psaltery posted...

Down with homogenized public school systems. They're not much better than the re-education camps the Communist Chinese are herding the Muslims into.

This is a really dumb thing to say and you should be ashamed of yourself for saying it.

It's psaltery.
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I've always wondered who uses psaltery as an alt.
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Corrik posted...

Democrats comrpromised just as little under Trump as Republicans have under Obama.

As a counter-argument, I offer Garland vs Gorsuch
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UltimaterializerX posted...

LordoftheMorons posted...

UltimaterializerX posted...

Obama himself said these numbers would require a magic wand

No he didn't

Might want to use a source other than the world's most prolific liar to get your info

Leftists are the world's most prolific liars at this point, but I digress.

PBS:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6g10WhdC2ag" data-time="

And then when Trump actually goes and makes our economy better, Obama takes credit for something he himself said wasn't possible (bringing jobs back, because "some jobs just aren't coming back").

Look I know its Ulti, shut up.

im gonna respond to this and only this so he and anyone else in this topic doesnt get confused about this shit I keep seeing spread.

Obama wasnt talking about job numbers, he was specifically, literally, talking about coal and manufacturing jobs that are obselete and or will actually never come back to the heights theyve been at in the past.

You notice how this clip is only 43 seconds long? Its because even an absolute moron would realize Obama was correct if they had the full context, so they clipped it for a GOTCHA
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