Lurker > squexa

Kinda interesting that there's a lot of variation that stems from earlier questions (eg how much bandwagon Zelda got) that's going to snowball as we go into the lower divisions.
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1. Zero
2. Red
3. Sora
4. Auron
5. Ryu
6. Big Boss
7. Charizard
8. Mewtwo
9. Aerith
10. Dante
11. DK
12. Squall

If we're doing Zero twice, are we doing that for any other characters? I'd take Terra and Amaterasu among others over Squall.
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1. Crono
2. Mega Man
3. Pikachu
4. Sephiroth
5. Tifa
6. Mega Man X
7. Bowser
8. Luigi
9. Yoshi
10. Ganondorf
11. Kirby
12. Sonic
13. Alucard
14. Vivi
15. Zero
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hombad46 posted...

squexa posted...

Pokemon Trainer Blue

But he has won matches?

Damn, you guys are fast. I realized and deleted within 5 seconds lol.
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Magikarp
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1. Mario
2. Samus
3. Cloud
4. Snake
5. Zelda
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creativename posted...

squexa posted...

Wow you really are against a movie idea huh.. tell me why this is a bad idea. We'll have 0 xstats and it will be cool to see which movies this site likes, since the field is completely open.

Why is contest with fictionals not more fun.

Tell me. Go on. Im waiting. Since thats what your post seemed to be implying.

I'm only proposing a movie contest, as a counterpart to the games contest.

Idea: Best movie (with video game adaptations).
- It's related to video games because the movies must have an official game based on it
- Most movies aren't even eligible. Casablanca? Citizen Kane? No games, no entry.
- Most post-90s action movies are in
- Movies are f***ing awesome

1 v 1. 24 hours. We can have a loser's bracket with proper seeding.

Field is open. 0 x-stats. Anyone can win. I have yet seen anyone counter this idea with anything other than asking an unrelated question.
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Wow you really are against a movie idea huh.. tell me why this is a bad idea. We'll have 0 xstats and it will be cool to see which movies this site likes, since the field is completely open.
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Let's just have a best movie contest featuring characters that have at least some ties to video games. We'll have 0 xstats and it will be very fresh. Anyone against it is against fun.

Back to the Future vs Iron Man II let's go.
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Lopen posted...

Donkey Kong vs Aya Brea is probably in the running of percentage swings even if it doesn't change the result

Not sure what it actually x-stats to from this contest's results but I could definitely see DK breaking 75% this time around.

Shame we didn't get Gordon Freeman vs Tina part 2 when Gordon actually had some strength on this site. That could've done it.

Actually if you want a sneaky pick for biggest swing I really think a Wario vs Shadow the Hedgehog rematch would be a strong contender. Wario putting up 60% is plausible I think.

Also DK vs Tommy Vercetti could have a crazy swing in a rematch.
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I'm guessing the difference is that the majority of the people voting Geralt are voting because of the games and not the books. Same with Lu Bu from 2013. Whereas, if JFK got in because he technically was in Civ Revolution 2, everyone will be voting for him as a historical figure.

When we get to Voldemort vs George Washington match, I doubt anyone's voting with video games in mind. At that point, why not just host a Best Movies Contest too while we're at it.
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creativename posted...

Would you really be shocked if Snake beat Cloud though?

I think that Samus match is really messing up peoples views of Snake. Especially as Samus might just be that damn strong, and only gets messed up by Mario.

I think Mario thrashing Samus in 2K5 caused people to underrate Samus in terms of the perception of her strength, since it was such an embarrassing and notorious defeat. I think you can see this in how continually surprised we are when Samus stomps other elites.

I think getting beat down by Samus is causing people to underrate Snake.

Maybe, but Samus only did 59% on Tifa, who is barely stronger than Luigi. If we assume that Snake actually beats Cloud, then Luigi is beating Crono/Mega Man and is much stronger than Yoshi/Bowser.
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Team Rocket Elite posted...

squexa posted...

Hypothetical mini-contest: Characters that have never appeared in a CB before.

Do we have enough untapped midcarders to make this actually interesting? Field could be wide open, although it seems like Pokemon could run wild and this could just turn into a big proxy war for the other franchises.

Linkle, Dark Samus and various Gen 1 Pokemon will have a field day.

Yeah, Dark Link especially and maybe Paper Mario and MegaMan.Exe too, so alternate forms would probably be banned and the Gen 1 Pokemon would be restricted to a couple of slots.

The plus side is that Charizard and Mewtwo didn't look that great this contest so a Blastoise vs Chocobo/Red XIII/etc match could potentially be in doubt I suppose.
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Hypothetical mini-contest: Characters that have never appeared in a CB before.

Do we have enough untapped midcarders to make this actually interesting? Field could be wide open, although it seems like Pokemon could run wild and this could just turn into a big proxy war for the other franchises.
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snake_5036 posted...

squexa posted...

2B deserves props as well

I really don't think so

Ness is irrelevant outside of the 10 people who still want Mother 3 and her first round opponent was.... I have no idea who it was. That Mass Effect dude? Destiny?

Losing to Bowser should have been considered a lock on this board.

Yes, but 2B did way better than anyone expected, especially when new characters were s***ing the bed everywhere. In fact, she might be the strongest character that debuted since the early-mid 00s.
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2B deserves props as well
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Not_Wylvane posted...

It was nice of Link to take a few minutes to pretend this match may be respectable before promptly kicking Cloud's shit in.

That's what Cloud gets for messing with Link's girl
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Yeah, great job to the crew, the guest and Lopen for their great write-ups every match!
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Samus is worth about 60% on Luigi through Tifa while Cloud is worth about 59% on Bowser through Alucard and even more through Crono.

Samus wrecking Cloud would mean Luigi is much stronger than Bowser now which seems a bit odd to me.
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garetha200 posted...

Zelda way overperformed on Samus in that match. The strength gap between them before Zelda boosted this year was probably somewhere between the 2006 match and the 2010 match where Samus broke 63%.

Well Zelda overperformed in 2006 period, including her match with Aeris. I'm not even sure whether she'll beat Aeris in 2010 considering how bad she looked all contest and they finished almost right next to each other in the x-stats.
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Zelda got 56% on Aerith the same year that she got 45% on Samus, so it doesn't seem that weird.

Aerith looked "weaker" since 2006, but all her matches were SFF fests or that weird match with Shepard (who got fed to Draven round 2), so it's possible she didn't decline that much. Not to mention she overperformed against Fox.
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Team Rocket Elite posted...

Is Zelda still getting bandwagoned? Against Link, Zelda dropped about 10 percentage points from the freeze until now. Against Cloud, Zelda only dropped 2.

Like Luster said, it's possible there's some rally spillover for Cloud since Cloud started with close to 60% against Zelda and the Cloud/Zelda match had 91 more votes than Cloud/Mario did at the freeze.
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XIII_rocks posted...

I'd rather we hold back the n9 matches until they come up in an actual contest setting.

Agreed.

We should save some of the debates (Can Samus beat Cloud, etc) for the next contest, where the matches will actually matter.

Let's just do something dumb like "favorite version of Link" or "Link vs Linkle" and call it a contest.
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Too bad it's hard to care much for this match since we've already seen Link massacre them both...
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Linkle vs Cross dressing Cloud
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ZeldaTPLink posted...

But if you assume Mario/Samus is an SFF mess and instead extrapolate though Zelda/Mario and Zelda/Snake, then Cloud only gets 50.7% on Snake.

If you extrapolate through Zelda/Mario and Zelda/Snake, then Snake should be stronger than Cloud since Zelda beat Mario harder than she beat Snake.
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KamikazePotato posted...

KamikazePotato posted...

squexa posted...

So about retiring Link...

Give it another half an hour.

And that's all she wrote.

Still worth it!
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ZeldaTPLink posted...

I mean I am going to play some things I missed. Eventually. But it's hard to venture out of series I'm used to, genres I'm used to, etc. Even as a little kid I preferred Mario over fighting games.

Also for the last 10 years I kind of reduced my overall gaming input. Less time, living outside parents' house, getting used to free nerdy stuff like reading mangas and playing mafia. Or spending 3 years playing Team Fortress every day (yeah I did that). I'm not really that kind of guy who plays 15 new games a year anymore. So I'm very picky lately. You'll probably have an easier time selling me into a sexy indie like A Hat in Time than some PSX hallmark.

And there's nothing wrong with that. Enjoy what you like and explore other stuff at your leisure and just ignore the laughable elitism in this thread. I went through that whole phase too back in high school.
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Lol the elitism in this thread is lulzworthy
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Spirit Tracks...
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So about retiring Link...
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LusterSoldier posted...

Samus has a very good reason to improve her performance against Mario in the rematch. The first match had sprite pictures. While the sprite for Samus is certainly recognizable for sure, Mario is perhaps the king of sprites by having the most iconic sprites in video games. Even without ZSS, I think Samus should look better in the rematch.

We'll have to see. I suspect people treat ZSS and Samus as separate characters in the same way that they treat Zelda and Sheik as separate characters and if ZSS = Samus, it means that Snake is almost on par with Tifa and Sonic has fallen way below Luigi, both of which seems odd.

Either way, this ZSS performance seems like a Link lite beating and it's not entirely clear whether Snake is weaker than Cloud. If ZSS goes on a bandwagon run tearing through losers and SFFs Zelda hard, she can put the fear of god into Link.
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KamikazePotato posted...

So here's a question - at what point do we think that Samus overperforming here? Because I kind of doubt that Tifa almost beats Snake.

My guess is that ZSS is much stronger than Samus. If we can get a ZSS vs Mario rematch, we should hopefully be able to measure how much stronger ZSS is.
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Zero Suit Samus will destroy Mario and potentially challenge Link.

I'm starting to think that Zelda can do some bizarre waifu rSFF against Link and ZSS can potentially too.
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Lead down to 104. Europe vote should slightly favor Mario so looks like Mario will take the lead at some point.
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She looked like a near-elite in the early 2000s and I wonder if her strength was underrated since then. She ran into Squall immediately in 2007, missed 2008 and ran into Auron immediately in 2010, so we didn't get any non-SFF reads on her. In 2013, she ran into Shepard who immediately ran into Draven, so we don't have any good reads on her there either.
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LusterSoldier posted...

My idea was for some bonus polls involving only Noble Niners that have never faced each other in a 1v1 match. That requirement limits the pool of potential matches to the following:

Cloud/Mega Man
Crono/Samus
Crono/Sephiroth
Mario/Sonic
Mega Man/Samus
Sephiroth/Sonic

Mario/Sonic is the obvious match that most people want. I'd also choose Crono/Sephiroth to get a better read on Sephiroth's strength (and how he compares to Cloud). Cloud/Mega Man could technically happen in the Loser bracket if everything goes right, so it could be removed from consideration if Mega Man beats Crono.

However, we would have to avoid using the same character in more than one match if we're going to run multiple matches at the same time.

Wish we got Mario/Sonic back in the early 2000s... feel like it's too much of a one sided beating these days unfortunately. And Cloud/Mega Man can still happen in the loser's bracket.
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Safer_777 posted...

Bonus poll should be for the 3rd position.

Bonus polls I want to see:

Link/Zelda (assuming Zelda loses to Mario)
Tifa/Cloud
Ganon/Seph (Got Villains finals rematch, alternatively Bowser/Seph and Bowser/Ganon will be great as well)
Mega Man/Mega Man X (need to settle this debate)
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Wreath posted...

The part where people argue over a dead legion?

Ya but noble 9 are live cause ************???

It's just for fun dude.

I think this topic is great!
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ZeldaTPLink posted...

I love how Cloud could be either #2 or #6 right now.

Yup, this is what makes this contest so fun. I think we're going to have a lot of great matches coming up! Both losers matches next round are both completely debatable right now and the entire bottom half of the losers is a complete toss up.
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transience posted...

I'm with you on that. Zelda might do the best vs. Link of all of these guys. (she also might do the worst!)

it's sorta sad that a huge smash game comes out in the last week of the contest and it doesn't really shake anything up because literally everyone is already in it

Poor Crono :(
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I mean Link will probably still win this too
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I've seen this proposed many times, but I think the main issue with a couples contest is there will be tons of troll/joke nominations. Forget Aeris or Tifa, I can bet that crossdressing Cloud/Barret will win and that Aeris will be paired with Masamune...
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charmander6000 posted...

Are we going back to Persona being the second strongest, non-Nintendo RPG?

Probably need to add non-Square (since KH, Chrono and FF are all stronger) and Japanese (since Skyrim, Fallout, potentially KOTOR, etc are stronger).

And even then... ugh... watching Persona 3 lose to DQVIII makes it hard to have much confidence in the franchise. Persona 4 and 5 should be much stronger than 3, especially after Joker got in Smash + Persona 5 Switch rumors, but it's hard to say.

I think the only games challenging it for the title are Tales of Symphonia and Dark Souls.
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Are you missing the Cloud vs Crono match? Cloud should have a win and Crono a loss.
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Team Rocket Elite posted...

squexa posted...

The biggest wildcard to me is Skyward Sword. On one hand, nobody really seems to like it, but it is a 3D Zelda game, so there has to be a limit to low it can go right?

https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/poll/5193-character-battle-ix-division-6-round-1-groose-vs-lu-bu-vs

To be fair, Groose is only a side character and Midna has always looked pretty terrible as well despite TP being fairly strong.
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The biggest wildcard to me is Skyward Sword. On one hand, nobody really seems to like it, but it is a 3D Zelda game, so there has to be a limit to low it can go right?
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I don't have much confidence in Persona 5. We seem to always overrate how strong Persona is every contest, but the series is still really niche..

Instead, I'd suggest A Link Between Worlds as a potential top 10 GotD2 game.
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Advokaiser posted...

ZeldaTPLink posted...

Crono gets 52.3% now

Not liking his chances, unless Link is SFFing Cloud due to Smash

I can't see Cloud actually being SFF'd because of Smash. If anything, it should be the other way around. He's top-tier in Smash 4 and I don't see myself buying a new game Cloud is in just to somehow find out Link is cooler there.

I think it's more like this: During Cloud vs Alucard or Cloud vs Crono, Cloud gets votes from apathetic Nintendo fans who recognize him from Smash and don't really know who the other guys are. But when Cloud goes up against a beloved Nintendo icon like Link, Mario, etc, his Smash boost collapses, hence the "Smash SFF".
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So just how strong is BotW? If it can turn Zelda into Snake and Link into ... this... is it a top 10 game? Even higher?
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