Not a life or death situation.
Not a life or death situation.
I don't fight.
I wouldn't be in a fight or start one in the first place. If after kindly asking them to fuck off and go away with no results I'd draw my weapon and see if if they decide to heed my warning or end up on the wrong side of my state's stand your ground law.
I'd just git gud
I take off my pants.
It's a defense mechanism.
want to give you a warning, that isn't how the stand your ground law works entirely. There has to be disparity of force, where "death or great bodily harm" would have resulted if you didn't pull the trigger. If you are more muscular or in general bigger than the guy attacking you, YOU CANNOT use lethal force to end the dispute. If Vin Diesel was being threatened hand to hand violence by Jim Parsons in a "Castle Doctrine" state, and Vin Diesel used a firearm to protect himself, Vin Diesel would go to prison and so will you in the same scenario. There has to be a disparity of force, such as someone much tougher than you attacking you, someone using a weapon (be it knife, baseball bat, crowbar, gun), or multiple attackers threatening you.
MannerSaurus posted...
want to give you a warning, that isn't how the stand your ground law works entirely. There has to be disparity of force, where "death or great bodily harm" would have resulted if you didn't pull the trigger. If you are more muscular or in general bigger than the guy attacking you, YOU CANNOT use lethal force to end the dispute. If Vin Diesel was being threatened hand to hand violence by Jim Parsons in a "Castle Doctrine" state, and Vin Diesel used a firearm to protect himself, Vin Diesel would go to prison and so will you in the same scenario. There has to be a disparity of force, such as someone much tougher than you attacking you, someone using a weapon (be it knife, baseball bat, crowbar, gun), or multiple attackers threatening you.
Someone trying to start a fight and kick your ass is plenty in this state. I have zero legal duty to retreat from somewhere I'm legally allowed to be, the size of the attacker has nothing to do with it, I have no idea what drugs the other person is on nor what his intentions are or what they might have in their pockets, just them coming at someone in an aggressive and threatening manner. What you're saying may be true in your state or further north than mine but it's acceptable here and has been proven to be true in multiple cases similar to what I described.
I'm not saying I would definitely shoot someone or am looking for a reason either, I'd hate to have to do something like that. But with an angry person in a fighting mood I'd pick my life over theirs every time.
Action53 posted...
MannerSaurus posted...
want to give you a warning, that isn't how the stand your ground law works entirely. There has to be disparity of force, where "death or great bodily harm" would have resulted if you didn't pull the trigger. If you are more muscular or in general bigger than the guy attacking you, YOU CANNOT use lethal force to end the dispute. If Vin Diesel was being threatened hand to hand violence by Jim Parsons in a "Castle Doctrine" state, and Vin Diesel used a firearm to protect himself, Vin Diesel would go to prison and so will you in the same scenario. There has to be a disparity of force, such as someone much tougher than you attacking you, someone using a weapon (be it knife, baseball bat, crowbar, gun), or multiple attackers threatening you.
Someone trying to start a fight and kick your ass is plenty in this state. I have zero legal duty to retreat from somewhere I'm legally allowed to be, the size of the attacker has nothing to do with it, I have no idea what drugs the other person is on nor what his intentions are or what they might have in their pockets, just them coming at someone in an aggressive and threatening manner. What you're saying may be true in your state or further north than mine but it's acceptable here and has been proven to be true in multiple cases similar to what I described.
I'm not saying I would definitely shoot someone or am looking for a reason either, I'd hate to have to do something like that. But with an angry person in a fighting mood I'd pick my life over theirs every time.
Any of the 50 states of the United States what I said is true. If it can be proven that your life was not in danger (say you are jacked, and the attacker was some skinny punk), or that you escalated the situation to lethal when it wasn't to begin with, you will be sitting in prison. You don't have to take my word on it. You cannot discharge a firearm in the United States of America without being legitimately afraid of "death or great bodily harm" towards you or somebody else. Some little guy wanting to break your nose in a bar fight is NOT grounds for even pulling a firearm, much less firing it, especially if you're a big enough person to handle the situation without it. Do you think a 330 pound bouncer can just pull his sidearm out and shoot a 115 pound 18 year old skater kid swinging on him? That would be a prison sentence in all 50 states. You can argue with me all you want, but I just hope you don't ever get proven wrong inside of a cell.
I'm not saying you're wrong. Size doesn't always matter in a fight. But in the eyes of the law, if it's obvious you didn't have to use your gun, you will be punished and charged. You can't just shoot your gun because you want to avoid a fist fight with Steve Urkle.
Any of the 50 states of the United States what I said is true. If it can be proven that your life was not in danger (say you are jacked, and the attacker was some skinny punk), or that you escalated the situation to lethal when it wasn't to begin with, you will be sitting in prison.
I have just as many courtroom verdict examples to prove the contrary.
At the end of the day, I hope neither of you gentlemen are in a situation where you are forced to use your firearm
The fact is, there is not a courtroom in the United States of America that would find a 330 pound bouncer shooting a 115 pound unarmed Steve Urkle to be considered innocent or self-defense or a "justified shooting." That extreme hypothetical is something I am 100% sure of.
MannerSaurus posted...
At the end of the day, I hope neither of you gentlemen are in a situation where you are forced to use your firearm
Don't have one, don't want one, would never willingly carry one, don't live in the US anyways, so this is a moot point for me on multiple levels.
MannerSaurus posted...
The fact is, there is not a courtroom in the United States of America that would find a 330 pound bouncer shooting a 115 pound unarmed Steve Urkle to be considered innocent or self-defense or a "justified shooting." That extreme hypothetical is something I am 100% sure of.
Funny thing about that...
Here's 26 examples of children and teenagers whose shooters claimed Stand Your Ground (some successfully, some not):
https://thinkprogress.org/at-least-26-children-or-teens-died-in-florida-stand-your-ground-cases-726443948a64/
And if you earnestly think that a 115 pound guy cannot pose a threat to a 330 pound guy, you don't know much about fighting. While the 330 pound guy has a distinct advantage, it is more than possible for the 115 pound guy to pose a threat to the other guy's life, whether he is armed or not.
Why am I fighting clean in the first place?
Anything that doesn't cause permanent damage is fair game by me. Aka no eyes or balls shots.
I boxed for 7 years in a gym, 13 total if you count outside of the gym in sparring in my mid-20's. I've had more "fights" (if you count sparring) in my life than many people combined, in the sport of boxing alone. I'm not even including the real ones that got me arrested or kicked out of school (older and younger examples.) 215 pounds is a CONSIDERABLE difference in weight. People of different skills and sizes can do different things in combat, but at that kind of difference you can literally just hold the guy in place (like many bouncers are trained to do) and wait for police while the scrawny wuss struggles uselessly.
Ad hominem.