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Board 8 > Hollow Knight: Silksong - Special Announcement

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foolm0r0n
09/08/25 5:38:28 PM
#351:


The ants are not especially optional or challenging compared to other upper areas. But it is true that you can always go somewhere else when you're stuck. People who refused to accept that about Elden Ring also got pissed.

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Xiahou_Shake
09/08/25 6:18:43 PM
#352:


Healing absolutely feels easier than HK IMO - there are entire attack sequences that are designed for you to be able to dodge by healing now, nevermind the actual downtime that you can still make use of.

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Kotetsu534
09/08/25 6:44:56 PM
#353:


Hardest boss fight I've found yet. At least 15 attempts. Broodmother.

One thing I will say is that normal exploration is so much safer once you have a full kit of tools / charms & some extra health. The difference in risk of death in routine situations between 5 health and no quick heal and 7 with it is massive. I actually find the platforming sections are actually tougher (mostly because of dumb mistakes).

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azuarc
09/08/25 7:21:40 PM
#354:


Xiahou_Shake posted...
there are entire attack sequences that are designed for you to be able to dodge by healing now

Explain, please.

The only thing that I find easier about healing in this game is that it can be done in mid-air, which might lend itself to what you're referencing. One of Widow's attacks is a time waster you can climb to the side and heal. Is that what you're referencing?

Kotetsu534 posted...
The difference... between 5 health and no quick heal and 7 with it is massive.

Sure would be nice. So far I've only found like 1 mask shard. And there's one on a vendor that I can't afford. Don't know anything about a quick heal, either.

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Xiahou_Shake
09/08/25 7:27:50 PM
#355:


azuarc posted...
Explain, please.
So, using the same boss you mentioned, one example is the attack where she scampers across the arena and then spikes progressively erupt in four sections of the arena. Normally you'd jump and glide to dodge, but you can also just jump and heal mid air, safely dodging the whole thing and healing with zero chance of reprisal. All of the most recent bosses I've fought have at least one instance of this but there are ample opportunities to heal if you know how to recognize them.

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foolm0r0n
09/08/25 7:35:27 PM
#356:


Xiahou_Shake posted...
there are entire attack sequences that are designed for you to be able to dodge by healing now
The only time I've really felt this was with that one Widow attack. The rest of the bosses and the vast majority of enemies punish you for staying still, even in the air.

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KamikazePotato
09/08/25 7:40:20 PM
#357:


Game is bringing back some discussions we haven't seen since Elden Ring.

https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/a/forum/b/b8799e5c.jpg

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Xiahou_Shake
09/08/25 7:40:53 PM
#358:


foolm0r0n posted...
The only time I've really felt this was with that one Widow attack. The rest of the bosses and the vast majority of enemies punish you for staying still, even in the air.
Enemies definitely don't provide this specific kind of opening very often but bosses definitely do. I did it just last night several times on both Last Judge and Clockwork Dancers, just as two very recent examples - understand the latter is a bit cheeky given how it works but it worked on three of the former's attacks even in Phase 2!

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WazzupGenius00
09/08/25 7:41:50 PM
#359:


Moorwing also has a pretty clean one but only in the later phases

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kevwaffles
09/08/25 8:01:22 PM
#360:


KamikazePotato posted...
Game is bringing back some discussions we haven't seen since Elden Ring.

https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/a/forum/b/b8799e5c.jpg

I like Pat but you can't just drop a quote from him like it's something a regular person said.

Or, rather, like it's someone not ready to say the most deranged take you've ever heard on a semi-regular basis.

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Kotetsu534
09/08/25 8:03:32 PM
#361:


azuarc posted...
Sure would be nice. So far I've only found like 1 mask shard. And there's one on a vendor that I can't afford. Don't know anything about a quick heal, either.

The trinket that reduces your healing animation time is the Injector Band, found in Whiteward, which can be accessed early in Act 2 (you need to use a key to open the door to the place, then delve a bit deeper, but the key is lying in an open spot a few screens above in Choral Chambers (the first main area in Act 2).

My biggest criticism of the game (which I think is incredible, one of the best I've played in a very long time - I can't stop playing!) is that it could dish out better upgrades a bit more freely in the first 5 or so areas. I think that would've helped more people stay with it for longer.

Just took down another bastard of a boss. Savage Beastfly, round two. With mega annoying minions that are 50x more deadly than he is.

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KamikazePotato
09/08/25 8:03:40 PM
#362:


As someone who chooses Hard mode on every game I play nowadays, 'a difficulty curve that's exhilarating for me is a nightmare for 90% of players' is an issue that speaks straight from my heart.

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Dels
09/08/25 8:08:10 PM
#363:


wow I just did the Cogwork Core and uh the base game of hollow knight did *not* have anything that hard did it? isn't that like white palace level? I can handle it but I imagine that's going to cause issues for more people once they get here
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#364
Post #364 was unavailable or deleted.
pyresword
09/08/25 9:03:41 PM
#365:


foolm0r0n posted...
The only time I've really felt this was with that one Widow attack.

You might be right but this one was also very easy to dodge by slow-falling with the glide. I didn't feel the window was particularly tight for this.

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foolm0r0n
09/08/25 9:13:04 PM
#366:


pyresword posted...
You might be right but this one was also very easy to dodge by slow-falling with the glide. I didn't feel the window was particularly tight for this.
Didn't think about that for some reason. I just did a regular jump then dash, which works but only with pretty good timing

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pyresword
09/08/25 9:19:25 PM
#367:


Well actually can you get to that fight before getting the glide? Now I'm not sure. I think I needed wall jump in order to get to the fight arena, and that ability definitely needed glide to unlock the way I did it. Which is...probably the only non-sequence-break way? But you never know with this type of game I feel like when you're still only partway through. Also might just be wrong about the first part.

Edit: spoiler marking more just to be safe

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azuarc
09/08/25 9:39:46 PM
#368:


I just clung to the wall. Why make it difficult?

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#369
Post #369 was unavailable or deleted.
MacArrowny
09/08/25 10:07:49 PM
#370:


Dels posted...
wow I just did the Cogwork Core and uh the base game of hollow knight did *not* have anything that hard did it? isn't that like white palace level? I can handle it but I imagine that's going to cause issues for more people once they get here
I died a couple times there, but it's not that hard? Though I was annoyed I couldn't do the save and reload trick to get back out lol.

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HeroDelTiempo17
09/09/25 12:27:51 AM
#371:


Doing True End stuff now. After I got the normal end I said I wasn't sure which game was better between this and the original. I spoke too soon and am now calling it in favor of Silksong. Apologies to Team Cherry, I didn't realize how hard they'd been cooking.

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pyresword
09/09/25 1:24:18 AM
#372:


(towards the end of act 1? I don't know) Well I don't like The Slab at all. I can see what they're going for and I'm sure people who are into this kind of thing it's going to be their favorite part of the game, but this is just not what I signed up for. Also mind-boggling to me that apparently this sequence is totally optional. Of course optional is the wrong word because I sure didn't choose this and have no ability to opt-out, but whatever.

edit: Turned out I thought the section had a long while left when I made the post, but I was basically already at the end. So it was annoying but not horrible.

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Xiahou_Shake
09/09/25 1:52:05 AM
#373:


Holy crap the road to getting the double jump is maybe my favorite section of the game so far and it giving you frost immunity and letting you slide down the whole mountain at the same time is such an excellent cherry on top

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Dels
09/09/25 3:09:11 AM
#374:


pyresword posted...
(towards the end of act 1? I don't know) Well I don't like The Slab at all. I can see what they're going for and I'm sure people who are into this kind of thing it's going to be their favorite part of the game, but this is just not what I signed up for. Also mind-boggling to me that apparently this sequence is totally optional. Of course optional is the wrong word because I sure didn't choose this and have no ability to opt-out, but whatever.

edit: Turned out I thought the section had a long while left when I made the post, but I was basically already at the end. So it was annoying but not horrible.

i'm curious, what was your way of finding this? i was also wondering about this and how optional it is or isn't. i got there via... an enemy in a place that was hidden off the map and that i still can't get the map for. and i wonder if it was the same for you if there's some other way to get there.
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Mobilezoid
09/09/25 6:28:06 AM
#375:


Saw some upcoming patch notes on reddit, they're apparently nerfing the boss who made me quit Sister Splinter so maybe I can try again once that's out.

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htaeD
09/09/25 6:46:53 AM
#376:


Lace and Fourth Chorus felt fair and doable once you figure out the pattern
I figure later bosses wont be so kind

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pyresword
09/09/25 7:55:41 AM
#377:


Dels posted...
i'm curious, what was your way of finding this? i was also wondering about this and how optional it is or isn't. i got there via... an enemy in a place that was hidden off the map and that i still can't get the map for. and i wonder if it was the same for you if there's some other way to get there.

I looked at a reddit thread. I don't think people have really figured it out yet but it looks like there's several different places the guy can spawn in. For me it was in a dead-end corner of the map in Deep Docks you need the wall jump to access near where the bottom entrance to Hunter's March is. I saw comments saying he can show up at least in Greymoor and in some place I haven't even found yet (Bilewater?) Not sure if its a random spawn or if there's a few specific places he will always show up. You can just kill the jailer enemy and avoid the sequence but people have also said they killed 1 and then got trapped in a second location by another one

Dude just immediately traps me in glue which was my first time encountering that mechanic at all and that was all she wrote

Also seeing some people say they were ambushed on the way back to their shade and god i wonder if that would have been enough to get me to ragequit the game. Probably not, but it would have been awful

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pyresword
09/09/25 8:27:08 AM
#378:


I should also say in regards to the above post: there are definitely people who say they never saw this section at all and the first time they saw the area was by finding it normally on the map later on

Mobilezoid posted...
Saw some upcoming patch notes on reddit, they're apparently nerfing the boss who made me quit Sister Splinter so maybe I can try again once that's out.

This ended up among my favorite bosses in either game so I'm kind of glad I did it in it's current form. It's probably fair to say the difficulty curve is too steep for how early this is, especially if they intend for new players to be able to start with this game. But for me it felt like fair difficulty at least and was very satisfying to learn how to manage the fight. Most likely changing so that the additional enemies can only do 1 damage would be a good change. I just hope they don't change the actual attack patterns at all or too much.

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azuarc
09/09/25 8:36:40 AM
#379:


Mobilezoid posted...
Saw some upcoming patch notes on reddit, they're apparently nerfing the boss who made me quit Sister Splinter so maybe I can try again once that's out.

For as much as I've been complaining throughout this thread, I don't know what was a problem with that boss.

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HeroDelTiempo17
09/09/25 8:46:28 AM
#380:


It's way harder than the boss almost immediately after it, which is really weird and maybe wasn't intended? But idk, I died a lot but I think that boss is fine other than the adds and if it's one of the ones that falls on you and hurts you when stunned.

Also might be worse if you don't have Wanderer's Crest?

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WazzupGenius00
09/09/25 9:08:19 AM
#381:


I'm pretty sure I beat that one on my first try. Second at most. Her own attacks are extremely easy to avoid, you should literally never get hit by them if you're not being impatient. And since you won't need to heal from any of that you can use your silk to quickly kill the adds

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foolm0r0n
09/09/25 10:22:47 AM
#382:


I never saw the part that pyre is talking about and I'm in Act 2 already.

Also yeah that boss seriously needs a nerf. I probably did 20-30 attempts, whereas final Act 1 boss was 3 attempts. The boss and attack patterns itself are really good and fun, but the adds are just stupid. They need to do 1 damage, remove the 3 second stunlock on hit, and/or remove their invincibility when they are attacking. They only have 3 hp but they are invincible a majority of the time. If you get a lucky cycle where she doesnt summon an add, you get a huge advantage.

In general I would like them to balance the bosses so that the randomized cycles are similarly difficult. It always sucks when 1 of the 3 possible attacks is 10x harder than the other 2. Dark Souls is really careful to avoid that in most of their bosses.

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HeroDelTiempo17
09/09/25 10:23:15 AM
#383:


doing some of these optional fights where you can use tools as much as you want without having to worry about refilling them with shards is only convincing me shards should not be in the game

like I thought it was for game balance reasons, they don't want you to trivialize encounters by spamming all of your tools between rests, but this clearly shows they're able to balance around that???

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MacArrowny
09/09/25 10:30:01 AM
#384:


htaeD posted...
Lace and Fourth Chorus felt fair and doable once you figure out the pattern
I figure later bosses wont be so kind
These are generally considered the two easiest bosses in the game, from what I've seen.

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kevwaffles
09/09/25 10:39:25 AM
#385:


I mean if we're ignoring stuff like Moss Mother, maybe.

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pjbasis
09/09/25 10:46:02 AM
#386:


they're nerfing bosses already? lame I didn't even play it yet.


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pjbasis
09/09/25 10:48:55 AM
#387:


KamikazePotato posted...
'a difficulty curve that's exhilarating for me is a nightmare for 90% of players' is an issue that speaks straight from my heart.

the worst thing is that people like us won't complain that most games are made for the other 10%, but when something is made for us the other 90% can't handle it and start making demands to get it changed

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MacArrowny
09/09/25 11:06:12 AM
#388:


The real solution is just to include difficulty levels/modifiers in the game. Nine Sols is way harder than Silksong, but it lets you adjust damage taken and done, so anyone can beat it.

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pjbasis
09/09/25 11:10:52 AM
#389:


I don't want to just slap on difficulty levels on every game for that sake.

On the other hand there aren't any games with difficulty settings that I wish didn't have them so...

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MacArrowny
09/09/25 11:12:49 AM
#390:


Are difficulty levels worse than patching bosses?

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foolm0r0n
09/09/25 11:13:59 AM
#391:


MacArrowny posted...
Are difficulty levels worse than patching bosses?
Yes

If the game is moddable to make it easier, that's often the best approach too

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MacArrowny
09/09/25 11:17:17 AM
#392:


foolm0r0n posted...
If the game is moddable to make it easier, that's often the best approach too
That does nothing for console players.

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HeroDelTiempo17
09/09/25 11:29:41 AM
#393:


Difficulty sliders like the one in 9 Sols where you can precisely tune the damage you take and give out are like the best possible approach to difficulty as long as the game allows for it. Player health isn't as granular in Hollow Knight so that wouldn't work, but still.

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azuarc
09/09/25 11:31:11 AM
#394:


HeroDelTiempo17 posted...
It's way harder than the boss almost immediately after it, which is really weird and maybe wasn't intended?

I died on both several times getting the boss down, which is to be expected, but I think I died more on the follow-up boss. I really didn't have any major problems with the boss being referenced.

There are bosses I think could be toned down, but if I had to choose out of the ones I've fought so far, that wouldn't have been my pick. It feels like a fair boss, like I have the ability to control the circumstances of the fight.

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Xiahou_Shake
09/09/25 11:52:58 AM
#395:


The two called out for nerfs in those patches seem like weird picks to me - pretty sure neither took more than two attempts compared to others that took many more - but by that same token I'm not particularly bothered that they're getting changed

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HeroDelTiempo17
09/09/25 12:30:29 PM
#396:


Honestly it's normal enemies I have more of an issue with than bosses. Nearly everything starting midgame has a combo or heavy that hits for 2 health. And this game has a huge hard on for enemy gauntlets where it can get excessive.

True ending route spoilers
It makes it a little funny that in this route every enemy gets an upgrade that makes every attack hit for 2. Like ok it was basically like that before anyways

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Xiahou_Shake
09/09/25 12:33:20 PM
#397:


I will say more than anything in this game so far the High Halls gauntlet has a distinct feeling of "holy shit are you actually kidding me with this, dude." Some legit Godhome level stuff in the main quest.

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catesdb
09/09/25 12:35:10 PM
#398:


i'm not even at the second getting-nerfed boss yet but as for the first i've heard some people say the hitboxes are off, and accidentally touching that thing burned me so many times

i got the wanderer crest now and are y'all sure it's that good?? i probably just need time to adjust, but it's so teeny

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HeroDelTiempo17
09/09/25 12:35:52 PM
#399:


(re: that gauntlet) I'm well into post-game by now and that is still the hardest (single) fight in the game! I'll let you know if that changes.

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Dels
09/09/25 12:36:09 PM
#400:


I had to look up what Sister Splinter was. I remember those adds being annoying as hell but I must've had a lucky run because I don't recall spending much time on this. The other boss they're nerfing was the worst boss in the game for me (and with the worst runback...) so, sure, go for it.
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