Current Events > 3D Zelda: Return to classic 3D formula or more open-air games?

(+) Yeah! (+)

I mean I love Zelda games but I'm kinda tired of building things.

I'm just not that creative. I want the developers to be creative and show me the cool shit. Not just give me a bunch of lego pieces and tell me "entertain yourself".

I prefer OoT, MM, WW, TP style. I didn't enjoy BotW and TotK that much.

I just want my dungeons back please with actual puzzles

I want TotK's building mechanics improved and expanded on, but in its own series divorced from Zelda.

BOTW, but with actual dungeons and a bit more story.

Something new would be nice.

I think there should be a little bit of both. Why not an open world to explore with unique, diverse dungeons that have to be completed to finish the game?

More open air, I love the last two games.

Plus, Nintendo clearly showed that they're pivoting to adding more traditional dungeons as well, too, so it'll be a nice combo of both worlds.

But it's all a moot point. BotW and TotK are by far the best selling installments in the series, there's next to no chance that Nintendo's abandoning the open air model after those two smash hits.

More open air. Open air Zelda has been a major success for Nintendo and I don't see them going back to traditional 3D at least with main team. Aunoma has stated they want to explore the style more. We had 5 games in traditional style in 15 years. Only 2 open air games and TotK being a direct sequel.

We are about to get a truly next gen open air Zelda that will have a whole new world. Lets please let Nintendo cook.

Or how about both. No reason Nintendo can't have Grezzo make a sort of OoT like Zelda scaled down. I'm sure main team has so many ideas they still want to do with open air and now having new hardware.

Open-air but with major dungeons. I want beefy dungeons that are like Majoras Mask length/quality, but in the open world. Obviously they dont need like 500 of these scattered like shrines. Just 5-8 is fine

I thought BOTW was okay. Not what I wanted out of Zelda but it had some charm. TOTK made things better imo, felt like there was more to do in there, but also felt like a REAL departure of Zelda. More like Banjo Nuts and Bolts which, again, not something I want in a Zelda. Dungeons are better but not particularly good.

I want them to marry the two classic with more of an open feel. A Link Between Worlds I think did it well and don't see why they can't marry the classic formula and the open air style.

I liked BOTW, but ideally I'd want a smaller, more refined open world with fewer dungeons that have more depth to them.

I like BotW and TotK, but we had two games like that. Id be down for something new.

How about a futuristic take on Zelda? Scifi, or maybe just steampunk?

I am cool with either, love both. I think more than likely we will see a continuation of BotW and TotK. I would love some hybrid of both.

I'm fine with open-air but it should be scaled down so we can have more side dungeons and stuff. I really liked BotW/TotK's shrine quests and TotK's caves and I'd rather have more stuff like that than the underground. I get people being disappointed in the sky islands but i liked them being mini puzzleboxes as well.
Also get rid of the terminals in dungeons. I'm fine with them being in any order, but the terminals suck. There's a reason the leadups in TotK felt better than the dungeons for the most part

_____Cait posted...

How about a futuristic take on Zelda? Scifi, or maybe just steampunk?

ST is there for steampunk sorta, game's underrated just because it's PH's followup and PH wasn't all that great

Kaldrenthebold posted...

I want them to marry the two classic with more of an open feel. A Link Between Worlds I think did it well and don't see why they can't marry the classic formula and the open air style.

eeeeeeeeeeeeh for me it's the opposite where I felt ALBW didn't really do it that well. Mostly due to the dungeons and difficulty, where things got incredibly easy by like the second Lorule dungeon and never really ramped up. Having all dungeons basically only need 1 item also limited things a lot

My favorite part of Zelda games are the dungeons. The time spent unlocking the next dungeon is less fun than the dungeons themselves. Even the classic games have too much time spent outside of the dungeons.

The open world/air format could work, but I'd want a smaller open world.

foxhound101 posted...

My favorite part of Zelda games are the dungeons. The time spent unlocking the next dungeon is less fun than the dungeons themselves. Even the classic games have too much time spent outside of the dungeons.

The open world/air format could work, but I'd want a smaller open world.

I feel you'd like SS since even the pre-dungeon portions play like dungeons

Open air hands down. Just improve on its flaws like the dungeons and asset management system.

Hell, I was even hoping for a skill tree or something. Dungeons could callback to a design that doesnt actively promote the ability to skip things. Which would bring back the old school structure.

The only thing I dont want to go back to is the narrow style of Zelda that limits where you can go and travel. It would be going backwards IMO.

I have an idea for a sort of Clock Town location but on a massive scale. A huge open city on top and one huge cohesive dungeon underneath. One of my favorite parts of 3D Zelda is NPCs and villages. Hateno Village in TotK was done so well with all the small sidequests and NPC schedules. I've always wanted to see an actual city and not just village with 5 to 10 homes and few shops. It wouldn't have to be GTA size

Building and sandbox for world traversal.

Classic Zelda for everything else.

also I get Zelda isn't this super hardcore Dark Souls thing but being able to pause mid-action at any moment to heal genuinely isn't very good design. Especially with all the menu clutter and stuff

Get rid of the shrines FFS. Just make a ton of minidungeons and some actual proper dungeons (ToTK's lightning temple was pretty good given the design constraints of the systems in the game).

I haven't played either, but Echoes of Wisdom and A Link Between Worlds seemed like a good compromise.

mehmeh1 posted...

also I get Zelda isn't this super hardcore Dark Souls thing but being able to pause mid-action at any moment to heal genuinely isn't very good design. Especially with all the menu clutter and stuff

It actually wasn't meant to be like that. They had to remove a bunch of stuff once it stopped be a game designed specifically for the WiiU. That's why you literally get a WiiU tablet in game (the Sheika Slate). A bunch of stuff revolved around you having the tablet during gameplay to use items in real time. It would have been interesting to try the game as it was originally designed to play.

Have some sort of reward for completing side quests and going out of your way to uncover things instead of just a weapon that'll break after a few swings. There's no incentive to go and do those sorts of quests if you're just going to get jack shit at the end.

Kaldrenthebold posted...

I thought BOTW was okay. Not what I wanted out of Zelda but it had some charm.

This, basically. I appreciate the uniqueness of Breath of the Wild, but it played more like a Zelda-themed Minecraft than an actual Zelda game. An interesting twist, and I did have fun with it, but by the end I had definitely had my fill.

As someone who likes to 100% Zelda games, Breath of the Wild was a colossal micromanagement nightmare (and Tears of the Kingdom was that on steroids). These games being sprawling worlds for the sake of being sprawling worlds has run its course for me. Unless the next returns to a more focused, reasonably-sized adventure (which admittedly seems unlikely), I think I'm done with this series, sadly.

Trelve posted...

Have some sort of reward for completing side quests and going out of your way to uncover things instead of just a weapon that'll break after a few swings. There's no incentive to go and do those sorts of quests if you're just going to get jack shit at the end.

Yeah the durability system needs to go. Don't even try to salvage it, I've written at length multiple times how it's a complete top to bottom failure (barring a handful of sections in each game) that completely fucks over every other part of the game.

The world interactivity in botw and totk are unparalleled. I'd love to see the style of gameplay kept but not necessarily the same style of world. Before totk was announced I was hoping it would be a Majora's Mask-esque take on botw, the same mechanics but on a smaller scaled higher detailed world.

I am VERY curious about what they'll do next with big mainline Zelda.

mehmeh1 posted...

eeeeeeeeeeeeh for me it's the opposite where I felt ALBW didn't really do it that well. Mostly due to the dungeons and difficulty, where things got incredibly easy by like the second Lorule dungeon and never really ramped up. Having all dungeons basically only need 1 item also limited things a lot

I wouldn't say it was perfect by all means, but it was a definite step in the right direction. Gave me the open endedness of me picking what dungeon I wanted to and allowing me to get the items in order I want.

The 3D titles were trying so hard to be as open world as possible, and then we get an actual open world and it pisses people off.

But no, while MM is still the bar for narrative interweaving, I've had more fun with BOTW than any of the prior titles.

I would like to see a mix of both. Give us some real dungeons inside the open world.

The open-air format was a mistake and feels like Ubisoft games (Assassin's Creed: Hyrule Edition). The standard dungeon focused games (without overworlds filled with mostly nothing) represent what the series should be.

Evening_Dragon posted...

The 3D titles were trying so hard to be as open world as possible, and then we get an actual open world and it pisses people off.

But no, while MM is still the bar for narrative interweaving, I've had more fun with BOTW than any of the prior titles.

It was TOO open world. I just want my cozy dungeons back.

I wouldn't mind them trying to combine the two. I absolutely fell in love with the idea of exploring anywhere I could, but it came at the cost of a lot of other aspects of Zelda not being as strong.

Vastly, vastly prefer the older formula (Link Between Worlds excluded, because that didn't quite fit either, with its open-endedness and letting you just buy the vast majority of your upgrades)

BotW feels like some other game creepily wearing a Zelda skin.

not a fan of ubi-zelda. TOTK taking like 7 years while re-using so much of BOTW is an absolute joke

Im so fucking sick of empty open worlds filled with tedious collectathon bullshit and awful fetch quests that give worthless rewards. That type of design is a horse that was beaten to death, then beaten into paste, then beaten into a crater.

Open world games were fun when you only got one every 3-5 years (and you were a kid or student with few games to play and a lot of time on your hands). As an adult with a full time job, around 1400 Steam games, and little time to play anything, I just find them tedious.

Breath of the Wild was fun until the new wore off, then it just became more and more of a chore until I completed everything besides Korok seeds (I got 450 for max equipment slots, but no way I was going for another 450 by then).

For me to enjoy an open world game now, it needs to be special in some way. For instance, Elden Ring had that whole thrill of organic exploration thing in every element of its design, and it wasnt filled with tedious fetch quests (there arent many questlines at all for its size). It wasnt filled mostly carried by the combat. Cyberpunk 2077 actually had good quests for the most part. They didnt feel like the same thing over and over, even the ones that were the same thing over and over, like Cyberpsycho Sightings. Side quest wise, thats one of the more memorable games Ive ever played.

BotW/TotK's open world exploration is kinda carried by the interactivity of it where you can pretty much do whatever you want with it all (especially in TotK), but yeah it really needs more on the character and non-fetch quests side of things

KhlavicLanguage posted...

not a fan of ubi-zelda. TOTK taking like 7 years while re-using so much of BOTW is an absolute joke

TOTK is glorified DLC. It's a great game dont get me wrong but they copy/pasted the overworld

tripleh213 posted...

TOTK is glorified DLC. It's a great game dont get me wrong but they copy/pasted the overworld

IIRC it actually started as DLC but they got too many ideas to keep it as that. It does so fairly well but yeah you can still clearly see its DLC roots. Crazy how apparently reusing the overworld made things harder at least according to Aonuma, in that they took a lot of time debating and brainstorming about what to keep the same or change, to what degree to change the areas they did want to change, etc.

I like both, but I'd prefer a return to the classic style for a few games. Doubt it will happen though. I think they'll relegate that only to 2D Zeldas and 3D Zeldas going forward will be like BoTW and ToTK.

BotW was really cool as a one-off but I was completely done with it a few hours into TotK. Over the whole thing now.

I hate that the new direction has even completely overtaken the Warriors spin-offs. It went from a celebration of the entire franchise to just BotW and now TotK. It's pretty boring and feels like everything from before is being left behind for this bold new vision.

it feels like open world is almost always at the expense of interesting design

I would like to go back to at least 8 dungeons like the old games. Technically Zelda 1 had 9 dungeons, Zelda 2 had 8. Link's Awakening had 8 dungeons, as expected. Tears of The Kingdom could have won be over more if it had the "classic" 8 dungeons. Maybe 4 underground, 4 in the sky, to emphasize exploring both.

It should also have some open-world stuff too, though. The Zelda series has always had an element of free-form exploration. Hell, Zelda 1 immediately gives you access to half the world map. Zelda 3 gives you access to almost all of the world map right at the start. "Open-world" basically started with Zelda.

I know apparently nobody played it but Echoes of Wisdom blended the two really well. That is how they should do it for 3D games going forward.

really should play EOW, only 2D single player zelda I've never played

doshindude posted...

I know apparently nobody played it but Echoes of Wisdom blended the two really well. That is how they should do it for 3D games going forward.

I need to get around to playing that. I heard it is good minus some stuff like tedious menuing.

doshindude posted...

I know apparently nobody played it but Echoes of Wisdom blended the two really well. That is how they should do it for 3D games going forward.

It's definitely closer to how I'd want the two styles to be married together for sure. Great game.