Board 8 > Rank the Tracks 160: Knower - Knower Forever

(+) Yeah! (+)

Previous results can be seen here:
https://board8.fandom.com/wiki/Rank_the_Tracks
https://board8.fandom.com/wiki/Rank_the_Tracks_Set_2
https://board8.fandom.com/wiki/Rank_the_Tracks_Set_3
https://board8.fandom.com/wiki/Rank_the_Tracks_Set_4

The rules:
1. Listen to the album in full
2. Rank every track on the album
3. For the results, there will be a curve at the top of each list; two additional points between #1 and #2, and one additional point for the next two ranks. This way, the songs that really stick out to someone get an edge that is not immediately negated by someone else putting it lower. In the case of Demon Days, someone's 15th track will get 1 point, 14th 2 points, 4th 12 points, 3rd 14 points, 2nd 16 points, and 1st 19 points. For albums with greater than 15 tracks, everything ranked below #15 will be given 0 points and the scale for the top 15 will be the same as a 15-track album. For albums with more than 20 tracks, you only have to list your top 15 (with 16-20, I still like having the average rank listed)
4. If you want to include comments for individual songs, I will compile them in the results
5. The results will be posted at the beginning of the next topic
6. The deadline to vote is Thursday, April 18th at 8:00 AM Central Time; If you do get in a vote after the deadline but before I post the results, I will probably include it.
7. Every few weeks, a nomination period will open; there may or may not be a theme. Each user can nominate one album. The following week, everyone will be able to rank their top ~5 among the choices - this will use a bottom-up scoring approach, i.e. voting for one album will give your #1 a single point, voting for five will give your #1 five points, so it is always better to vote for the maximum number of albums. The top ~5 will then be covered.
8. Skits and tracks under 40 seconds will be excluded from the rankings unless argued otherwise

Knower - Knower Forever track list:
1. Knower Forever
2. I'm the President
3. The Abyss
4. Real Nice Moment
5. It's All Nothing Until It's Everything
6. Nightmare
7. Same Smile, Different Face
8. Do Hot Girls Like Chords?
9. Ride That Dolphin
10. It Will Get Real
11. Crash the Car

Future weeks:
4/18: The Seatbelts - Cowboy Bebop (+ nominations)
4/25: Viktor Vaughn - Vaudeville Villain (+ voting on future albums)
5/2: Garbage - Version 2.0

Stevie Wonder - Innervisions results

The participants sorted by deviation from final results:
Mega_Mana (4)
MaxGalactica (10)
FoolFantastic (12)
MarkS2222222222 (14)
Sheep007 (14)
Johnbobb (16)
MetalmindStats (16)
Seanchan (16)
Fluttershy_Pony (20)
HBJDubs (20)

General Album Comments

Seanchan: I was a little disappointed and bored? Stevie Wonder has a ton of big hit singles that everyone knows and this had...maybe 2 of them but lesser ones at that? Higher Ground I think of RHCP first. Don't You Worry 'Bout a Thing has been sound clipped into too many commercials. The rest just did not grab me very much.

What was the reason behind specifically this album for Stevie? On the whole, is he more of a "singles" than an "albums" kind of artist?

FoolFantastic (responding to Seanchan): This album is ranked #48 of all time on Acclaimed Music and #96 on Rate Your Music. His album Songs in the Key of Life is even higher on both lists, but I wanted to tackle this first both because I personally prefer it and it's earlier (and also the latter is a double album). It's also massively influential on several genres.

He's definitely key to both songs and albums - he even won Album of the Year at the Grammy's 3 times, with this being his first. Not that I hold much weight in the Grammy's of all things, but this is pretty much universally regarded as one of the all-time greats.

FoolFantastic: Innervisions is such a rich, complex album. It's hard to think of anything that truly compares to Stevie Wonder at his peak. His influence on future artists is obvious, but few cover such a range all at once. Wonder is in full control of his sound; he's mainly known as a pianist, but he's tackling the drums and various synths here as well. And then there's his vocal range! Part of what makes this work so well is Wonder's sense of energy. No matter how complex a piece gets, he keeps pushing us right along. "Living for the City" is a progressive soul epic tackling broken dreams and systemic racism, but growing layers and shifts in mood make its seven minutes pass like a breeze. The blending of the synthesizers into the general sound throughout is also impressive, especially for the time.

Fluttershy_Pony: Pretty good album.

Sheep007: I really liked this album, it felt like there was a ton of variety in songs' structure and themes and even the ones I didn't care all that much for sounded good. Living For the City was a particular standout.

Seanchan: I enjoyed this a lot more with my second listen. Partially that my expectations were better but mostly that I had a better listening environment (quieter and better headphones).

MaxGalactica: This album is simply fabulous. While not as strong as Songs in the Key of Life, this album is full of some real heavy-hitters, namely Living for the City, Higher Ground, and Don't You Worry 'Bout a Thing. Living for the City is funky, energetic, and full of raw emotion. Higher Ground has got an awesome clavinet riff and melody. And Don't You Worry 'Bout a Thing is one of Wonder's most memorable songs along with Superstition. The rest of the album is great too, there's not a single track I dislike here. An essential album that I'm glad we got to cover. If you enjoyed this album, then Songs in the Key of Life is pretty much required listening.

Seanchan: An album I really came around on after a tough opening listen. I know I'm out of sync with the group on Living for the City; I don't think it's a bad song, there's just others I liked more.

MetalmindStats: There's a noticeable gap between my third and fourth-ranked tracks, though I still like them all, as well as the ways they fit together.

HBJDubs: For a genre I'm not into, this was pretty good

Innervisions track ranking

9. All in Love is Fair (Track #7)
Score: 27 (Average Rank: 7.4/9)
Biggest Fan(s): Fluttershy_Pony (#3)
Biggest Detractor(s): Johnbobb, MetalmindStats, Mega_Mana (#9)

8. Visions (Track #2)
Score: 34 (Average Rank: 6.6/9)
Biggest Fan(s): HBJDubs (#4)
Biggest Detractor(s): MaxGalactica, Seanchan (#9)

7. Too High (Track #1)
Score: 37 (Average Rank: 6.4/9)
Biggest Fan(s): MetalmindStats (#3)
Biggest Detractor(s): HBJDubs (#9)

6. He's Misstra Know-It-All (Track #9)
Score: 40 (Average Rank: 6.1/9)
Biggest Fan(s): Johnbobb (#3)
Biggest Detractor(s): MarkS2222222222 (#9)

5. Jesus Children of America (Track #6)
Score: 52 (Average Rank: 5.2/9)
Biggest Fan(s): Johnbobb, HBJDubs (#2)
Biggest Detractor(s): FoolFantastic, Sheep007 (#9)

4. Don't You Worry 'Bout a Thing (Track #8)
Score: 66 (Average Rank: 4.2/9)
Biggest Fan(s): MaxGalactica, Seanchan, MarkS2222222222 (#2)
Biggest Detractor(s): Fluttershy_Pony (#9)

3. Golden Lady (Track #4)
Score: 68 (Average Rank: 4.2/9)
Biggest Fan(s): MarkS2222222222, HBJDubs (#1)
Biggest Detractor(s): MetalmindStats (#8)

2. Higher Ground (Track #5)
Score: 94 (Average Rank: 2.5/9)
Biggest Fan(s): MaxGalactica, Seanchan (#1)
Biggest Detractor(s): Johnbobb (#6)

1. Living for the City (Track #3)
Score: 102 (Average Rank: 2.4/9)
Biggest Fan(s): FoolFantastic, Fluttershy_Pony, Sheep007, Johnbobb, MetalmindStats, Mega_Mana (#1)
Biggest Detractor(s): Seanchan (#7)

MetalmindStats: Has what might be my favorite first ten seconds of any song, not that it renders the rest any less masterful to me.

I've had He's Misstra Know it all stuck in my head all week

This is a good reminder to listen to it some more! I remember really liking Do Hot Girls Like Chords? a lot when I listened upon release.

I did a first listen to this a few days ago.

Initial reaction was "ugh, another of these albums". But there seemed enough variety that it shouldn't be too bad to rank.

My 2023 album of the year, looking forward to ranking this one. The lyrics are sometimes whatever but the musicianship and arrangements are insane. It's like a huge, talented band formed around Clown Core.

First listen done, but mostly in the background. Definitely need another one before even thinking about rankings. The vocals and even sometimes the lyrics remind me of Kero Kero Bonito. I don't get the same delirious euphoria from them, but I also find the songs sufferable so it's a mixed tradeoff. Also, holy shit the arrangements are wild. They had a lotttt of fun making this.

1. Do Hot Girls Like Chords
2. Crash the Car
3. It Will Get Real
4. I'm the President
5. The Abyss
6. Nightmare
7. It's All Nothing Until It's Everything
8. Ride that Dolphin
9. Real Nice Moment
10. Knower Forever
11. Same Smile, Different Face

They clearly just made this album to have a good time. It was all recorded in Cole's house with goofy videos and excessive solos that take up half of some of the songs and a good portion of the time they're intentionally making the songs stupid as fuck. And you know what? That's perfect. Sometimes straddling the boundary between shit-ass and great makes a product that can't be matched.

1: Do Hot Girls Like Chords?
2: Real Nice Moment
3: Crash the Car
4: Knower Forever
5: Same Smile, Different Face
6: I'm the President
7: Ride That Dolphin
8: The Abyss
9: Nightmare
10: It's All Nothing Until It's Everything
11: It Will Get Real

This album's selection is rather conveniently timed for me. NFUN assumed I'd be into at least one song on this album and had to gamble on which one, so I felt I'd need to look over the entire album and rank them anyway. I can now confirm that he was right & I would say "Do Hot Girls Like Chords?" is my favorite on the album, though "Real Nice Moment" is close and I might prefer it some days.

It's All Nothing Until It's Everything: I kinda love the very beautiful outro in the last 30 or so seconds of the song, but I'm really not into the rest of it. Which is possibly intentional given the title (the song is nothing, until it isn't), but doesn't make me enjoy it as a whole.

bump

Knower is always so much fun

1. I'm the President - that horn loop is so addictive
2. The Abyss
3. Do Hot Girls Like Chords?
4. Nightmare
5. It's All Nothing Until It's Everything
6. It Will Get Real
7. Real Nice Moment
8. Crash the Car
9. Ride That Dolphin
10. Knower Forever
11. Same Smile, Different Face

This might be one of the hardest albums to rank so far, three and a half listens and I don't think I'm any closer to reaching a conclusion. Just gonna throw something in that vaguely reflects my feelings. There's lots of things that are very catchy here which I don't actually like as much as the songs I find less catchy, and Artadi's voice is slowly driving me to the Kero Kero Bonito delirium I hinted at prior. This feels much more ambitious musically, overall better and bit less mind-boggling though. Despite actually leaning into weirdness through the lyrics, where KKB would be singing about like, going to school and drinking plenty of water or some shit.

Im The President
The Abyss
Nightmare
Real Nice Moment
Do Hot Girls Like Chords?
Its All Nothing Until Its Everything
Ride That Dolphin
It Will Get Real
Crash The Car
Same Smile Different Face
Knower Forever

I'll put up my ranking later today, but I'm signing on to both of Sheep's blurbs about the album.

Also, now I want to her a KKB take on I'm The President...

btw I'd recommend people look at the videos Knower does of recording the songs with full big bands in a tiny apartment, they're always a blast

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tuhe1CpHRxY

Johnbobb posted...

btw I'd recommend people look at the videos Knower does of recording the songs with full big bands in a tiny apartment, they're always a blast

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tuhe1CpHRxY

gotta love https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ois3gfcwKSA for the awesome keyboard work

1. I'm the President
2. Do Hot Girls Like Chords?
3. Real Nice Moment
4. Nightmare
5. The Abyss
6. It Will Get Real
7. Ride That Dolphin
8. It's All Nothing Until It's Everything
9. Crash the Car
10. Same Smile, Different Face
11. Knower Forever

KNOWER FOREVER is a pretty significant departure from their previous electropop/glitch pop style with a major focus on more orchestral sounds paired with funk and a heavy emphasis on crazy solos. Oftentimes a departure like this for an artist leads to a weak entry in a style that's outside of their comfort zone. In KNOWER's case, they created the best album they've made to date. Every track is engaging, the solos are wild, the production is top-notch, and the sheer technical prowess on display is admirable (Louis Cole's drum-playing is out of this world). The only thing that keeps me from rating it higher is that Genevieve Artadi doesn't exactly have my favorite voice out there, but I guess it works well enough to not detract from the overall experience too much. Great album all in all.

have you heard their first album?

NFUN posted...

have you heard their first album?

Yes. That one's kinda different from the rest too. I like Window Shop and Like a Storm a lot from it.

I'm the President
The Abyss
Crash the Car
Nightmare
Do Hot Girls Like Chords?
Real Nice Moment
It Will Get Real
It's All Nothing Until It's Everything
Ride That Dolphin
Same Smile, Different Face
Knower Forever

1) Do Hot Girls Like Chords? - Is Knower popular? Does purgatory have snacks? I dunno, but this song kicks a lot of ass. God-tier guitar solo and drum fills, holy shit.
2) It Will Get Real - Great energy in this one, really fun groove and outro fill from Louis. I love the keyboard solo near the end, it's so freaking fun. Then Sam Gendel comes in and almost matches it.
3) Ride That Dolphin - Extra groovy. Opening is Vulfpeck af. YEAH YEAH.
4) It's All Nothing Until It's Everything - absolutely sick, stupid, insane rhythm, with the playing and the stuff. It's so ridiculous you almost laugh, but so locked in and technically impressive you can't help but be into it.
5) Real Nice Moment - a much needed breather before 'It's All Nothing.' Relaxing groove, but also with a hint of melancholy, reflecting on the fleetingness of time.
6) Nightmare - The half time electronic break in the middle is so fucking cool, as is the extended outro with those offbeat hits and Genevieve's silky smooth tones. The first couple minutes is just 'OK' in comparison, musically, but the lyrics are great. A better kind of fear, cuz real life is not here.
7) I'm the President - Landslide-fucking-Genevieve. I can't believe I have to put 'President' this low, it's like a 9/10 song, and the outro always makes me smile (WHO CARES) - this was one of my favorite jams last summer. But then the rest of the album came out and blew me away.
8) Crash the Car - strong & existential finale, almost haunting - the strings are beautiful.
9) Same Smile, Different Face - very bittersweet, there's times when I can't listen to it cuz it'll make me too sad. Strong "Yesterday" Beatles vibes.
10) The Abyss - almost borders on too weird for me, but it's still fun. I want to hear more of the slow motion outro tbh.
11) Knower Forever

NFUN posted...

they're intentionally making the songs stupid as f***. And you know what? That's perfect. Sometimes straddling the boundary between s***-ass and great makes a product that can't be matched.

True there are moments like that, but I think that more describes Clown Core - this is on another level, this is Louis Cole in his final form.

Sheep007 posted...

KKB would be singing about like, going to school and drinking plenty of water or some s***.

Lol that's about right

clowncore is too far into the shit-ass zone

1. I'm the President
2. Nightmare
3. Do Hot Girls Like Chords?
4. Crash the Car
5. The Abyss
6. Knower Forever
7. Ride That Dolphin
8. It's All Nothing Until It's Everything
9. Real Nice Morning
10. It Will Get Real
11. Same Smile, Different Face

Fun album! Lots of variety, which made ranking individual songs easier for me than it normally is for these topics. There was one song above an 8 and one song below a 5. The variety actually makes for a cohesive album experience. This was my second time listening; this time the vocals didn't bother me like they did before and I think I appreciated more of the instrumentation.

edit: I also want to add that, despite everyone saying the lyrics are nonsense, Ride That Dolphin has an all-time great line in "Things are more real when they're hard to believe."

That is a good one yeah