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Current Events > Online debatebro Destiny declares deaths during a war don't count for genocide

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Doe
02/08/24 12:30:24 PM
#1:


https://twitter.com/TheOmniLiberal/status/1755423926824362242

Israels best and brightest are on the case. Bring this guy to the Hague

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__starsnostars
02/08/24 12:33:51 PM
#2:


That's a stupid argument which can and should be shut down by mentioning that the holocaust also happened during a time of active war. In fact most of the heinous atrocities happen during wars.

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K181
02/08/24 12:34:59 PM
#3:


Turkey is furiously taking notes.

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Bass
02/08/24 12:41:11 PM
#4:


https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/a/forum/b/b82588f0.jpg

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#5
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Zikten
02/08/24 12:42:27 PM
#6:


Someone tell him it's not a war when 1 side is just slaughtering the other side. And most of the deaths on the slaughtered side are not soldiers

Fuck Destiny. Even Hasan hates that guy
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Zero_Destroyer
02/08/24 12:42:36 PM
#7:


This is the same guy that wanted to debate a literal scholar on the subject and prepped via reading wikipedia articles

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Doe
02/08/24 12:43:14 PM
#8:


Zikten posted...
Someone tell him it's not a war when 1 side is just slaughtering the other side. And most of the deaths on the slaughtered side are not soldiers

Fuck Destiny. Even Hasan hates that guy
Hasan and Destiny arent that close on the political spectrum if thats what you mean.

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ai123
02/08/24 12:44:47 PM
#9:


So if you declare war on a people and start eliminating them, it doesn't count as genocide.

I don't know who Destiny is, but it seems like posting weak drivel is his gimmick.

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bnui_ransder
02/08/24 12:46:46 PM
#10:


Ridiculous

What's with all the excuse making for what's happening??

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Doe
02/08/24 12:55:54 PM
#11:


Ive been trying to formulate my thoughts on this type of argument for a while. Its not the first time I saw it.

the crux is the belief that for something to be an atrocity, it has to be completely open about what it intends to do and completely direct about how it accomplishes it. For something to be an ethnic cleansing, for example, a president has to get on TV and say it is now government policy to cleanse X group.

Obviously (or I guess not since people like Destiny dont get this), the loophole here is to maintain international decorum and give justifications for actions that will happen to also have the result of diminishing the targeted group.

And you dont even have to be super crafty about it. Israels ambassadors have come on TV and literally claimed that Hamas tunnels are connected to every second home in Gaza, to justify wiping out all civilian infrastructure. And Netanyahu and his ministers have coined voluntary emigration on top of that.


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#12
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Gwynevere
02/08/24 1:00:08 PM
#13:


Destiny is a fucking idiot and always has been

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emblem-man
02/08/24 1:00:40 PM
#14:


Doe posted...
the crux is the belief that for something to be an atrocity, it has to be completely open about what it intends to do and completely direct about how it accomplishes it. For something to be an ethnic cleansing, for example, a president has to get on TV and say it is now government policy to cleanse X group.
I don't he's saying it has to be explicitly said, considering he concedes that china is commiting genocide to the Uyghurs.

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Prestoff
02/08/24 1:01:24 PM
#15:


Is this the same Destiny that debated Jontron?

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#16
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#17
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#18
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Gwynevere
02/08/24 1:03:14 PM
#19:


Prestoff posted...
Is this the same Destiny that debated Jontron?
Yes

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Hospy
02/08/24 1:12:11 PM
#20:


How to stop genocide with this one easy loophole!
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LeCh0nk
02/08/24 1:55:26 PM
#21:


Fucking blue checkmarks

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willythemailboy
02/08/24 2:27:30 PM
#22:


Doe posted...
Ive been trying to formulate my thoughts on this type of argument for a while. Its not the first time I saw it.

the crux is the belief that for something to be an atrocity, it has to be completely open about what it intends to do and completely direct about how it accomplishes it. For something to be an ethnic cleansing, for example, a president has to get on TV and say it is now government policy to cleanse X group.

Obviously (or I guess not since people like Destiny dont get this), the loophole here is to maintain international decorum and give justifications for actions that will happen to also have the result of diminishing the targeted group.

And you dont even have to be super crafty about it. Israels ambassadors have come on TV and literally claimed that Hamas tunnels are connected to every second home in Gaza, to justify wiping out all civilian infrastructure. And Netanyahu and his ministers have coined voluntary emigration on top of that.
I'm going to be somewhat generous in assuming this Destiny guy meant something rational like civilian casualties caused by the prosecution of a war shouldn't automatically be considered genocide. That is, things like the Nazi Blitz against Britain or any of the Allied bombing campaigns against Germany or Japan were not acts of genocide against the British, Germans, or Japanese respectively. He seems to be arguing that the Convention on Genocide requires intent and not only acts which have the results.

I've not watched any of his content, so he could just as well be an idiot.

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Zero_Destroyer
02/09/24 8:45:14 PM
#23:


bump

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Vampire_Chicken
02/13/24 6:06:46 AM
#24:


willythemailboy posted...
He seems to be arguing that the Convention on Genocide requires intent
Which is technically correct. Article II of the Convention states: "In the present Convention, genocide means any of the following acts committed with intent to destroy, in whole or in part, a national, ethnical, racial or religious group..."

Unfortunately, intent is notoriously difficult to prove; the requirement raises the bar so high that it'd be extremely difficult to obtain a conviction in a courtroom. (Deniers of the Rwandan genocide point to the inability of the ICTR to prove beyond all reasonable doubt that the mass killings were premeditated, planned and prepared at the highest levels of government as "proof" that there was "no genocide".) And there's a knotty legal problem with interpreting precisely how "in part" is to be defined or measured: how many deaths does it take before it becomes genocide?

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cuttin_in_farm
02/13/24 6:46:37 AM
#25:


I dont personally think we can claim hes an idiot because out of a 100 things, 1 thing is dumb.

Destiny, for the most part, is intelligent and is very transparent about his research since he literally streams it. He attempts to organize his thoughts and creates fucking essays for debates.

Destiny, however, is a giant fucking child emotionally. And gets upset for the smallest shit.

But I think its weird people are jumping on him for this. I really doubt he thinks a genocide cant happen in a war.

Destiny doesnt believe a genocide is happening because Israel is fighting against Palestine. The intentional desire for genocide isnt there, in his view.

The topic title is not what Destiny is even claiming.

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CountCorvinus
02/13/24 6:59:48 AM
#26:


Nick Fuentes' friend?

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deoxxys
02/13/24 7:07:43 AM
#27:


People only ever try to make that argument when its soldiers killed, not civilians, doesnt he realize that?

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Vampire_Chicken
02/13/24 7:32:31 AM
#28:


cuttin_in_farm posted...
Destiny doesnt believe a genocide is happening because Israel is fighting against Palestine. The intentional desire for genocide isnt there, in his view.
I'd say if there's a policy to "neutralize" the Gazan Palestinians as a threat in the longer term by reducing the resident population to "manageable proportions" by destroying so much of their infrastructure and housing that the Strip will remain largely uninhabitable (I expect the Israeli government to try to block funding for reconstruction), and this policy is known to be killing tens of thousands of civilians either directly through violence, or through hunger, disease, exposure, denial of aid, and the targeting of their healthcare facilities, it's pretty damn genocidal in effect and intent.

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cuttin_in_farm
02/13/24 7:47:36 AM
#29:


Vampire_Chicken posted...
I'd say if there's a policy to "neutralize" the Gazan Palestinians as a threat in the longer term by reducing the resident population to "manageable proportions" by destroying so much of their infrastructure and housing that the Strip will remain largely uninhabitable (I expect the Israeli government to try to block funding for reconstruction), and this policy is known to be killing tens of thousands of civilians either directly through violence, or through hunger, disease, exposure, and the targeting of their healthcare facilities, it's pretty damn genocidal in effect and intent.

Sure, Im just clarifying Destinys statement from the topic title.

Destiny is a debatebro, so he enjoys being technical.

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Guns_of_Verdun
02/13/24 7:48:17 AM
#30:


Bass posted...
https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/a/forum/b/b82588f0.jpg


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