Current Events > Ok Lord of the Rings makes no sense. Spoilers

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How does saruman get punked out by a bunch of walking trees? Shouldn't fire arrows make short work of them? He couldn't have gotten all his nameless orc soldiers to just shoot a deluge of arrows tipped with fire and thus burned up all the ents?

That's all it took to defeat Saruman when even Gandalf couldn't defeat him?

Tolkien just wrote what he thought seemed cool. Making sense wasnt important.

some fantasy races are resistant to magic, most often dwarves. probably the trees were resistant to Saruman

The point is they caught Saruman off guard. Once the dam was broken, fire arrows would be useless.

Revisited posted...

How does saruman get punked out by a bunch of walking trees? Shouldn't fire arrows make short work of them? He couldn't have gotten all his nameless orc soldiers to just shoot a deluge of arrows tipped with fire and thus burned up all the ents?

Trees that are properly hydrated don't just catch at the slightest touch of flame. I don't know about the books, but in the movie one of them got engulfed in flame and lasted long enough to douse himself at the end of the battle in the water from the broken dam.

They tried fire. All they got as a result was a giant flaming tree kicking their asses.

Revisited posted...

How does saruman get punked out by a bunch of walking trees? Shouldn't fire arrows make short work of them? He couldn't have gotten all his nameless orc soldiers to just shoot a deluge of arrows tipped with fire and thus burned up all the ents?

That's all it took to defeat Saruman when even Gandalf couldn't defeat him?

Have you ever tried to start a fire? It's not super easy. A flaming arrow doesn't guarantee that the entire Ent would go up in flames. Anyway, the Ents destroyed the dam and unleashed a river. The Ents that were on fire just took a dip and everything was fine.

One of Sarumans powers was the ability to charm basically anyone he wanted with his voice, but that doesn't seem to work well against Ents.

No one expected the ents to get involved, basically Saruman was blindsided.

Overconfidence. He didn't think they were an issue and put zero effort towards the Ents.

He was also not all powerful. Just powerful and his concentration was on other things.

I think it's pretty obvious that TC has never tried to start a fire outdoors before. A flaming arrow isn't even going to burn the bark of most living trees.

My disappointment in LotR movies is that the wizards doesn't do wizardly things like casting fireball or thunderbolt.

Revisited posted...

How does saruman get punked out by a bunch of walking trees? Shouldn't fire arrows make short work of them? He couldn't have gotten all his nameless orc soldiers to just shoot a deluge of arrows tipped with fire and thus burned up all the ents?

That's all it took to defeat Saruman when even Gandalf couldn't defeat him?

He emptied out Isenguard of Urai-Kai. He assumed that he would win at helms deep and no one would return. So when the Ents rampaged there is no one there to really fight them. I want to say there were goblins but at least in the books it's been so long I'm not too sure. I remember some burning though. You had alot of Ents and just 1 Ent can do alot of damage. Just think of what 50 could do.

No quidditch? No thanks.

[LFAQs-redacted-quote]


I thought they always can, but not allowed to do so in interfering with middle earth issues.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8d_oSWH4pMQ&ab_channel=sesepe

Ricemills posted...

I thought they always can, but not allowed to do so in interfering with middle earth issues.

You're right. He wasn't allowed to use his full power to help Middle Earth.

radical_rhino posted...

Tolkien just wrote what he thought seemed cool. Making sense wasnt important.

Okay so you didn't read the book. Neither did TC.

To clarify, Saruman did use fire traps, and managed to kill at least one Ent this way. That only succeeded in pissing off the rest of them, and Ents are goddamn terrifying when roused to anger.

HornyLevel posted...

You're right. He wasn't allowed to use his full power to help Middle Earth.

So it's not because it predates the "modern concept of wizard"?

Revisited posted...

Shouldn't fire arrows make short work of them

I think maybe they aren't "Trees", or at least don't burn like trees do. They are ents! they are not trees!

Ricemills posted...

My disappointment in LotR movies is that the wizards doesn't do wizardly things like casting fireball or thunderbolt.

Once Gandalf starts throwing around fireballs, all bets are off and Morgoth's underlings get to do whatever they want.

The books do mention some ents getting burned by Sarumans works. It just made the ents more mad. And in the books the ents and trees diverted rivers to flood Isengard (not breaking a dam like the movies) so that helps with not getting caught on fire.

Ricemills posted...

My disappointment in LotR movies is that the wizards doesn't do wizardly things like casting fireball or thunderbolt.

Gandalf does both in the books when he fights the Nazgl on Weathertop. Strider and the hobbits can see the smoke and lightning from miles away

Just a bunch of walking trees? Those ents were hurling boulders like dodgeballs. They are op except for the fact they are slow as fuck in doing anything.

Shoot a flaming arrow at a tree in real life. Does it burn and die immediately? Now imagine if that tree had arms and could pull that arrow out and step on you. Now imagine thousands of those giants fuckers stampeding a herd of tiny orcs with arrows.

It takes immense heat and a very strong flame to burn living healthy trees, simple fire arrows likely would be unable to light a tree on fire.

And you literally see them flood Isengard lol, how is fire gonna help

there's like 50 ents or so vs whatever skeleton crew left in Isengard.

thats a good point too

This dude running to dunk his head in water lol

https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/a/user_image/7/1/6/AAPV5JAAE8lM.jpg

He's the Usain Bolt of Ents

Wait till you hear about the eagles

Yazarogi posted...

No one expected the ents to get involved, basically Saruman was blindsided.

Are we sure they were Ents, and not the Spanish Inquisition?

Revisited posted...

How does saruman get punked out by a bunch of walking trees? Shouldn't fire arrows make short work of them? He couldn't have gotten all his nameless orc soldiers to just shoot a deluge of arrows tipped with fire and thus burned up all the ents?

That's all it took to defeat Saruman when even Gandalf couldn't defeat him?

Since no one else mentioned this...when Gandalf confronted Saruman the first time he was just a grey wizard. Lower in rank to Saruman. He was literally weaker then him. After Gandalf became Gandalf the White then he had a bit more power then Saruman but the Ents blindsided Saruman and they were PISSED. Also the Ents aren't trees!!

TetsuoS2 posted...

there's like 50 ents or so vs whatever skeleton crew left in Isengard.

That's another important part: Isengard was basically empty of forces after Saruman sent his entire army into Rohan.

Magic is more subtle in Lord of the Rings, it's not like Dungeons and Dragons where a level 27 Wizard can rain flaming meteor storms down six times a day.

Torgo posted...

Dungeons and Dragons where a level 27 Wizard can

A level 27 wizard can't anything in D&D because it only goes up to 20

Seeing rotk extended in theaters today

Saruman's mind was gone at that point too so he wasn't thinking rationally in the first place.

Torgo posted...

Magic is more subtle in Lord of the Rings, it's not like Dungeons and Dragons where a level 27 Wizard can rain flaming meteor storms down six times a day.

Also this. The Wizards aren't supposed to just cut loose and rain fireballs. The only times Gandalf does this is at Weathertop against the Nazgl and against Durin's Bane.

I mean, players are basically Gods at level 20...

I only read the first book, and that was several years ago, but one part that stood out to me was Gandalf's reluctance to use even a tiny bit of his power if it could be helped. IIRC, he was hesitant to start a campfire while everyone was freezing on the huge mountain Caradhras. His rationale was that using his magic even for something that simple would give his (and thus the Fellowship's) location away.

ironman2009 posted...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8d_oSWH4pMQ&ab_channel=sesepe

I was wondering if I should watch the clerks movies since people seem to like them but that clip saved me a lot of time

YoBlazer posted...

I only read the first book, and that was several years ago, but one part that stood out to me was Gandalf's reluctance to use even a tiny bit of his power if it could be helped. IIRC, he was hesitant to start a campfire while everyone was freezing on the huge mountain Caradhras. His rationale was that using his magic even for something that simple would give his (and thus the Fellowship's) location away.

Didnt a breakfast campfire give their location away earlier in the book?

Foppe posted...

Didnt a breakfast campfire give their location away earlier in the book?

No, that's an invention of the movie.

That actually does make a lot of sense