Current Events > Bloodborne has the worst fans of any Souls game

(+) Yeah! (+)

Objectively true

Elden Ring

It's Sony exclusive so the logic makes sense.

Like, no souls fans are really that bad though period.

Oh yeah? Based on what?

CoyoteTheGreat posted...

Like, no souls fans are really that bad though period.

Theyre the worst. Well, tied for the worst. Its like a 90-way tie.

Fans of what I don't like are bad and cringe, fans of what I do like are cool and based: the topic

*steals TC's insight*

voldothegr8 posted...

It's Sony exclusive so the logic makes sense.

This
CoyoteTheGreat posted...

Like, no souls fans are really that bad though period.

But also this

Skankhair posted...

Theyre the worst. Well, tied for the worst. Its like a 90-way tie.

Its a game where 80% of the PVP begins with people bowing to each other and trying to duel honorably and there are no comms to fling racial slurs around. It isn't even in the top 1000 bad fanbases.

Im sure the list of people who only like bloodborne and hate the other souls games is really that big that this topic will be verified.

OP speaks the brave truth.

I played BB and I liked it. I even did the full secret ending.

But, man, the people who love BB are a different breed.

Elden Ring is up for grabs for worst community, but going to the Playstation board and even do any form of criticism of the game gets you attacked by the fans like you personally offended their loved ones.

FlyEaglesFly24 posted...

Im sure the list of people who only like bloodborne and hate the other souls games is really that big that this topic will be verified.

Correct

Even a single person liking the second game means that it has the worst fans by default

hockeybub89 posted...

Elden Ring

Prestoff posted...

Elden Ring is up for grabs for worst community, but going to the Playstation board and even do any form of criticism of the game gets you attacked by the fans like you personally offended their loved ones.

Why are Elden Ring fans supposedly so bad or at least worse than others? They all seem to be like that. Just curious because ER is my first FS game so I don't know the history outside of the bits I hear about easy modes and such.

It's an exclusive so they have to stick up for it unconditionally.
But also elden might be a contender.

Southernfatman posted...

Why are Elden Ring fans supposedly so bad or at least worse than others? They all seem to be like that. Just curious because ER is my first FS game so I don't know the history outside of the bits I hear about easy modes and such.

I find the Elden Ring fanbase toxic, but a lot of the complaints I have with the fanbase I also find in other super popular franchises like Call of Duty and League of Legends, it's just super popular so you're more likely to find toxic people in it. The most annoying thing about Elden Ring fanbase is the only fanbase I know that argues any form of QoL will destroy their game, like holy shit I've seen it too many times even here on CE lol.

as a big souls fan, souls fans are shit.

Eh, I would say they're all pretty much interchangeable. For the most part, the venn diagram of souls games fans is a circle

The only thing the Fanbase does is say "Git good"

pauIie posted...

as a big souls fan, souls fans are shit.

^. The worst are still the DS1 mega fans though.

No game with Bed of Chaos in it is a masterpiece, even if we're willing to forgive almost every area after Anor Londo being dogshit that'd be constantly torn apart by those same fans if their aspects were in any of the others.

KajeI posted...

^. The worst are still the DS1 mega fans though.

No game with Bed of Chaos in it is a masterpiece, even if we're willing to forgive almost every area after Anor Londo being dogshit that'd be constantly torn apart by those same fans if their aspects were in any of the others.

Yeah seriously. DS1s only real strength is it's interconnectivity. People wanna talk about DS2 being a broken mess when half of DS1 is rushed and/or unfinished.

OudeGeuze posted...

Yeah seriously. DS1s only real strength is it's interconnectivity. People wanna talk about DS2 being a broken mess when half of DS1 is rushed and/or unfinished.

The sad thing though is even the rushed and unfinished content of DS1 is still better than the vast majority of DS2. It is pretty much why the DS2 fans can barely even say anything good about thier beloved game, they have to try to bring other titles to thier level. They are like, yeah, almost our entire game is bad, but DS1 had the demon ruins/lost izalith, so checkmate DS1 apologists, even though DS2 has a whole horde of shitty levels such as the frigid outskirts, shrine of amara, iron keep, the poison level trio, you name it. I don't understand why people insist on polishing the turd that is DS2, since there is barely anything redeemable about it, but polish they try

CoyoteTheGreat posted...

Like, no souls fans are really that bad though period.

The ones who went wobbly over difficulty settings are some of the worst of any fanbase.

Prestoff posted...

Elden Ring is up for grabs for worst community, but going to the Playstation board and even do any form of criticism of the game gets you attacked by the fans like you personally offended their loved ones.

What kind of criticism? Something like disliking recycling bosses or why does upgrading somber vs. regular seem so unbalanced? Or is it the typical new player whining style about needing an easy mode and combat should be more like DmC with no stamina bar?

Nah, original Dark Souls fans are the worst. Bloodborne fans might be clamoring for a sequel, but you also have talent coming out of that fanbase with the PS1-style Bloodborne demake that came out.

The peak of "git gud" and calling other people scrubs was probably the initial explosion of popularity that the first game had. The DS1 fans shit all over DS2, then DS3 wasn't as good as DS1 (as well-received as it was), then you have people like a former friend of mine who couldn't grasp that the point of Bloodborne was to be more aggressive than your usual Dark Souls builds. The main annoying contingent of Soulslike fans for Sekiro were people going batfuck ballistic over the thought of a FromSoft game having an easy mode, which imo is a way bigger and stupider contingent of game fans than just people buttmad about Sekiro editorials. Then Elden Ring and pretty much everyone loved it as far as I can tell.

I think the group of people who are still the most ride or die for Dark Souls 1 over every other FromSoft soulslike game are the most annoying fandom out of any Souls game. They were initially one of the most toxic fanbases in general, then later games were never good enough for them.

Here's some good things about DS2.

It works right out the box on PC, unlike the old version of DS1 (and maybe ripoff remaster from a few years ago).

The best Poise system, which no other game has gotten right.

Enemy variety (though all the games are pretty good about that to be fair).
Boss variety (same as above).
Environmental variety (same as above).

Moveset variety. (Santier's Spear has moves from like 4+ weapon types for instance, same with Yorgh's.)
Weapon and build variety for both PVE and PVP, for a wide variety of reasons.
STILL has the best PVP in the series.

Has tons of armor with unique effects, which is something DS3 and ER have been weird about.
It was the first to have 8 way rolling while locked on, and sprinting away while locked on, which are MASSIVE changes for the better.
Is the only Souls game to have a built in hard mode, which frankly should've come back in DS3 and ER.

Has actual changes in NG+ instead of it just being a universal stat bump, including NG+ exclusive items that are actually worth acquiring instead of Rings+3 that are just a 2-4% increase over the previous (and as a cherry on top if you don't want to do NG+ you can just use Ascetics. Speaking of which...).

You can refight/respawn the bosses and elite enemies you like an unlimited amount of times without having to redo the entire fucking game. Technically this also means you can redo entire areas the same way if there's one you particularly like clearing through for whatever reason.

It was the first to have respecs, and you get a pretty good number of them per NG cycle (DS3 limits you to 5 because L O R E and ER gives you like 14 per cycle).

It has the best covenants, with the best rewards (and those rewards all either have really easy fallback ways to farm them that won't take a full fucking workday like farming ears in DS3, or let you get the rewards by going to merchants in NG+ and NG++), and STILL has the best online rules (allowing invading into people on their own by default, and letting people be invaded and co-op even in areas they've already "finished", and if people don't want to be invaded then they can turn it off without having to turn off their online connection entirely) to actually facilitate progressing in those covenants regardless of how far you've progressed.

The connection system they use also actually fucking works (and I'm pretty sure it's the same one they use for DS3 and ER), unlike DS1 where it was notorious for you trying to summon someone using their sign that's right there on the ground and then making you wait for 10+ seconds and then telling you it couldn't bring them in. And despite the bitching about SM and no unlimited cracked eye orb, I was invaded more on my first run in DS2 than in my first run in every other one of these games combined. Even now when I go revisit I'm still able to find people in the arena and invasions within minutes at most, sure as fuck can't say the same's ever been true for DS1.

Powerstancing (which DS3 imitated with paired weapons, except there was like 6 of those total, and ER brought back in half baked way that doesn't allow for the freedom DS2's version had).

The weapon upgrade system, weapon infusion system, and boss weapon system all became something actually sane and were brought back in DS3 and ER.

It did a bunch of creative shit I wish would come back like having rickety wooden doors that you could break down instead of finding the key, or that one door in the basement of the Forest of Fallen Giants where the only way to open it is to hit it with a weapon so the enemy inside aggros you and opens the door for you, or how Santier's Spear is normally a mediocre spear that's abnormally heavy and is the only thing not liable to break with 10 minutes of combat, but if you DO break it then it becomes an absolute blender of a weapon.

SoTFS adds even more like the invisible hollows you need torches to see, or how the Aerie "forces" you to do a bunch of honor duels with the enemies there if you don't want to get ganked by all the dragon cultists (which is a reference to how the Dragon Covenant PVP works), or how there's (pretty basic admittedly) environmental puzzles.

It has trapped chests that aren't mimics, so even hitting a chest doesn't mean it's safe, which keeps you on your toes and it has wooden chests to punish you for mimic checking with something too big. And the traps come in multiple flavors like crossbow shots to the gut, an explosion, a AoE enemy aggro, and poison fog.

In addition to the usual "pay for your sins to be forgiven" mechanic it has the gravestone mechanic where if you kill a NPC, after X amount of in-game time has passed a gravestone will show up where they were and you can pay a fee to let you interact with them in case you need to for some reason, but it won't let you progress their quests or whatever because, you know, they're still dead. This is a mechanic that's never shown up again and that most people don't even see or realize is in the game even if they HAVE been killing NPCs.

Its lore is actually really coherent (at least with itself, unlike DS3 where it's a top to bottom complete fucking mess) and a lot of its ideas were reused in Elden Ring. For example, Quella, the god of dreams that's associated with the Spirit Tree items. (In fact, ER has a lot of specifically DS2's influence in it, originally DS2 was supposed to be a more open world game and have all sorts of things that ended up having to be cut because they realized the hardware wasn't there yet and they'd bitten off more than they could chew and had to panic restructure and fire that director you've never heard of because he was botching it so hard).

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And here's a "hot take" that's completely true. It has the most complex boss design of the PS3 gen games and it's not even close. DeS boss AI trees are fucking JOKES, they're lucky when they have 5 attacks they can do at all, and their gimmick (if they have one, which they mostly do) is usually completely 1 dimensional. False Allant is easily the hardest and most complex boss in DeS and he's got less going on than a single Ruin Sentinel, let alone something like the Pursuer or Flexile Sentry.

Meanwhile in DS1 (without DLC) you top out at Gwyn, who's still fucked because he swings and moves so fast that most mage builds have to cheese him by getting him caught on geometry, has too much poise for light weapon builds to stagger, but turns into a total joke (just like the rest of the game) if you use poisetank builds because you can just mindlessly heal-tank him to death because of how the Estus flask + poise systems work. Not to mention how the entire reason he's so easily parried (and the only boss in the entire game that can be parried IIRC) is because the devs literally admitted that they ran out of time to balance him and couldn't think of any other way to make sure he'd be beatable by anyone regardless of which type of build they were running.

The DLC bosses aren't gimped though, but they're the exception. Those still hold up even now, FROM plateaued on that front and they've just been using the extra power in the new gens to make the trees bigger (ER's got enemies branching mid-combo on the regular now) even though the AI is still just as dumb.

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I could go on about how the average level quality of DS2 is actually pretty standard for the series, or more in depth about how the majority of its mechanics are superior to DeS and DS1, or debunk any number of stupid shit that's said about it like "boss reuse" or "too many dudes", but I won't because I've done this song and dance way too many times already and it always goes the same.

I mean, they made bloodborne kart so... this topic can't be right:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VDeVT0UWWB0

DragonClaw01 posted...

the turd that is DS2, since there is barely anything redeemable about it, but polish they try

nah ds2 is dank. best pvp, best mechanics, most replayable, best aesthetics. ds3 was a disgrace to both ds1 and 2, it feels like a discouraged fromsoft reluctantly trying to recapture the ds1 magic and instead coming out with a half baked store brand bloodborne.

shrine of amana is beautiful and only a problem if you somehow still havent figured out how to sidestep a projectile or deal with a few trash mobs this late in the game. or series, honestly, because who plays ds2 first? iron keep is an instant classic too. funny how you only complain about the "hard" areas, like why not criticize shaded woods or something?

the poison trio, blue smelter area, and frigid outskirts are meme coop side areas that are totally optional. frigid outskirts is great though, no other level like it. you get the content you deserve!

but seriously, ds2 excels at variety. it's well balanced so most builds are effective, and there are a ton of equipment and spells. the game also has advanced tech to spice up the gameplay: quickrolls bring dodging to near bloodborne speeds, quick attacks make powerstancing relevant again, and stance swaps allow you to chain/combo between 1 handed and 2 handed movesets which keeps gameplay interesting. these techs combined with good balance and loadout variety have kept pvp alive for almost 10 years now.
it has bosses ranging from fume knight (who was basically a prototype ds3 boss, with decently complex ai and movesets) to the braindead covetous demon. ng+ cycles add enemies (even up to ng+7 - there is a black phantom archer added to the fire dlc near a chain you run across). it has complex levels with multiple paths like lost bastille, as well as short and simple levels like heide's tower of flame.

but even the simple stuff is actually pretty cool. heides tower functions as a great pvp arena and even has some cool trick jumps. covetous demon has a secret puzzle mechanic where you can break the jars above him and release dreglings, which he will ignore you to eat - then he might eat you, and take all your clothes off! flexile sentry has rising water, you can knock dragonrider off his tiny platform or make it bigger so you don't fall, pursuer "follows" you to later areas (with a final showdown in the throne room on ng+) and has rare attacks to keep you on your toes, mytha's poison pool can be drained, and so on. even the last giant has a second phase.

you can ignore those little details because the bosses are easy, but that's not really the point. it might seem meaningless, but it's just there for fun. and i think this attitude is what makes ds2 not just a great game but also a great sequel.

where ds1 is "prepare to die", ds2 is "go beyond death". it's not just ds1 (or des) again, it's a response. ds2's response to ds1's carefully crafted world is to embrace disorientation and a dreamlike absurdity. ds1's aesthetic was rather, uh, dark, and ds2's response is to look bright and goofy, almost cartoony. ds2 responds to ds1's nihilism by fully embracing meaninglessness.

"Your past. Your future. Your very light.
None will have meaning, and you won't even care...

Long ago, in a walled off land, far to the north, a great king built a great kingdom...

But one day, you will stand before its decrepit gate.
Without really knowing why..."

i would even go so far as to say ds2 is lampooning ds1. where else but in the world of dark souls could "laddersmith" be a profession?

dark souls 2 isn't just the black sheep of the series, it's also the best. people always say "ds2 is a good game, it's just not a good souls game". the truth is that dark souls 2 is a great game because it is not just another good souls game. it has everything and nothing to say all at once, and fromsoft will never make another game quite like it.

I played through Bloodborne (base game, no DLC) a few years ago and at literally no point did I have any idea what was going on or why I was doing anything in the game. It just felt like running from location to location with no real direction or context behind the world, my character, or my actions.

Later when I told my friend how much I hated the lack of story in the game, he told me "oh no, it's there, you just have to watch this very long YouTube video to understand it" and I told him any game that required you to watch somebody's analysis on fucking YouTube to know what happened in it just has really, really shitty writing to begin with and isn't worth watching the video.

TMOG posted...

I played through Bloodborne (base game, no DLC) a few years ago and at literally no point did I have any idea what was going on or why I was doing anything in the game. It just felt like running from location to location with no real direction or context behind the world, my character, or my actions.

Later when I told my friend how much I hated the lack of story in the game, he told me "oh no, it's there, you just have to watch this very long YouTube video to understand it" and I told him any game that required you to watch somebody's analysis on fucking YouTube to know what happened in it just has really, really shitty writing to begin with and isn't worth watching the video.

100% this. Its even worse in Elden Ring

It's a different method of story telling. It requires you to investigate and get pretty invested in the game, then you form theories. The guy with the hour long video does just that.

Personally as a big souls fan, I couldn't care less about the stories. Some sidequest stories are pretty cool, but that's as far as it gets. I don't think it's a point against the games, it's just one more thing that gives gaming the variety it has.

Are Souls fans really that bad? I mean, sure they are the stereotypical git gud Gamers, but aside from that

*remembers that Souls fans actively defend the lack of a pause option*

oh yeah, toss that fanbase into a fire.

K181 posted...

Are Souls fans really that bad? I mean, sure they are the stereotypical gif gud Gamers, but aside from that

*remembers that Souls fans actively defend the lack of a pause option*

oh yeah, toss that fanbase into a fire.

Huh, I didnt even know about that. Between that and difficulty settings, they need a reality check. Its a video game, not an extreme sport.

Dark_Arbron posted...

Huh, I didnt even know about that. Between that and difficulty settings, they need a reality check. Its a video game, not an extreme sport.

Heck, people get yelled at for playing Souls games "the wrong way". Not even exploiting the game or begging for changes, just like... throwing fire at an enemy weak to fire.

hockeybub89 posted...

Heck, people get yelled at for playing Souls games "the wrong way". Not even exploiting the game or begging for changes, just like... throwing fire at an enemy weak to fire.

Sounds like a strong example of people investing part of their identity into a corporate product. Hence why any basic change or update they dont approve of comes across as a moral insult worth threatening or harassing people over.

We give Nintendo fanboys shit for it all the time and rightly so, but DS fans often go unacknowledged.

K181 posted...

Are Souls fans really that bad? I mean, sure they are the stereotypical git gud Gamers, but aside from that

*remembers that Souls fans actively defend the lack of a pause option*

oh yeah, toss that fanbase into a fire.

They're not. TC is just shitposting for the hell of it and people are taking bait.

Gwynevere posted...

Fans of what I don't like are bad and cringe, fans of what I do like are cool and based: the topic

Fans who behave like douchebags but like what I like are still douchebags.

Fans who like what I dont like but conduct themselves decently are just people.

Prestoff posted...

I find the Elden Ring fanbase toxic, but a lot of the complaints I have with the fanbase I also find in other super popular franchises like Call of Duty and League of Legends, it's just super popular so you're more likely to find toxic people in it. The most annoying thing about Elden Ring fanbase is the only fanbase I know that argues any form of QoL will destroy their game, like holy shit I've seen it too many times even here on CE lol.

Isn't that every soulsbourne fanbase though?

K181 posted...

*remembers that Souls fans actively defend the lack of a pause option*

Always the dumbest thing.

"But that's how the developers want you to play it! If you actually have a life and have things to do or just have to go to the bathroom, you should just git gud!"

You can always tell how toxic a fanbase is when their defense of bad game design/option is "Well that's how the devs wanted it to be!" rather than any explanation of why it's beneficial.

If the next From soft game didn't have subtitle or graphical options, the same people would passionately defend that too. Because they are "Real" gamers who like "Objectively good" games.

The defense I've seen of Bloodborne's obvious framerate issues usually is very nasty with plenty of ad hominem. I can buy it about the fans being the worst of the genre.

UnfairRepresent posted...

You can always tell how toxic a fanbase is when their defense of bad game design/option is "Well that's how the devs wanted it to be!" rather than any explanation of why it's beneficial.

If the next From soft game didn't have subtitle or graphical options, the same people would passionately defend that too. Because they are "Real" gamers who like "Objectively good" games.

And of course youd be surprised how often thats how the devs wanted it! comes unravelled when the story includes a gay character. Then its shoving an agenda down our throats.

Nah

if you cant defeat a gay character then you just need to git gud

Dark_Arbron posted...

And of course youd be surprised how often thats how the devs wanted it! comes unravelled when the story includes a gay character. Then its shoving an agenda down our throats.

See: Starfield's pronoun options

The same people who defend Dark Souls "That's how the devs wanted it" create mods to remove the option to chose your pronouns.

OudeGeuze posted...

Yeah seriously. DS1s only real strength is it's interconnectivity. People wanna talk about DS2 being a broken mess when half of DS1 is rushed and/or unfinished.

Love me some Scholar. Playing a Strength build with a Great Axe and dollop of magic for Magic Weapon and Repair sorcery's. Shits tight.