Board 8 > Discussing Mafia Mafia Topic 3 - To Be King

(+) Yeah! (+)

Sure you would. Because you never mislynch, right?

Anyway whatever. You'll never get better without introspection. I will likely kill you tomorrow, and if you're town I really want you to think about how you could have well, not goaded someone who isn't on your scum list into killing you and still made the day productive. There were ways to do it! Politely asking me to not run the games may have worked!

But I'm going to sleep on it. Maybe I'll be less annoyed tomorrow. Or maybe someone will make a super good argument for someone else. It's gonna have to be better than that Changmas agenda you've been pushing. We'll see!

I even PMed Tidus after he died exactly what he did to claim scum and how to avoid it in the future.

Not that his own team did anything for him~

Everyone mislynches sometimes, what kinda point is that?

I find it interesting that you specifically mentioned it as my suspicion of Chang when like 5 people have voiced suspicion of Chang though.

What's your read on Chang? That post was lazy as shit.

There is a difference between a mislynch and suiciding into town.

I want you to realize you caused this throw, not me, if it should happen.

Keep trying to defend a bad mislynch as much as you like.

Ya know what this game is missing, votals.

KIng Lopen, would you be kind enough to decree everyone needs to vote for someone they would lynch today if they could.

for posterity, no bearing on your kingly decision.

Obellisk posted...

Ya know what this game is missing, votals.

KIng Lopen, would you be kind enough to decree everyone needs to vote for someone they would lynch today if they could.

for posterity, no bearing on your kingly decision.

It's interesting how he's already made it clear he'd paid no attention to peoples' leanings when he talked about the "Chang agenda I've been pushing" as if I'm the only person in the game who thinks Chang is scum, whereas he didn't actually give any actual opinion of Chang himself.

Chang is an OK lynch. He has indeed been a bit lazy.

I was considering Chang, ben, red, Scare and Rana today. This is mostly just inactive people, admittedly. Ben seems to be waffling too much on trusting me for my liking. Scare in particular trying to create a chaos lynch so hard is no bueno to me. But it could also just be because I read his conceit correctly about not wanting me to be king. Taunting with killmonger was hilarious though.

My useless questions had me warming up to Plum a bit more as a lynch target though. Shame I didn't get to do more! Darn!

Rana has done absolutely nothing whatsoever and I forgot he was in the game until I just looked back at the playerlist.

I'd prefer getting him in here before arbitrarily lynching him, though even if his absence definitely gives him scum equity compared to his play last game. It's only his second game.

My last post is missing a comma and it bothers me that I can't edit it.

I mean I'm pretty sure you are guaranteed town now after this Crescent scuffle the past few pages. So there's that if you're still worried about me not trusting you

PunishedBen posted...

I mean I'm pretty sure you are guaranteed town now after this Crescent scuffle the past few pages. So there's that if you're still worried about me not trusting you

This was addressed at lopen

Crescent-Moon posted...

It's interesting how he's already made it clear he'd paid no attention to peoples' leanings when he talked about the "Chang agenda I've been pushing" as if I'm the only person in the game who thinks Chang is scum, whereas he didn't actually give any actual opinion of Chang himself.

i..I... don't know what this means in relation to votals... so should we put you down for Chang then?
I'm, confusued?

Lopen posted...

Chang is an OK lynch. He has indeed been a bit lazy.

I was considering Chang, ben, red, Scare and Rana today. This is mostly just inactive people, admittedly. Ben seems to be waffling too much on trusting me for my liking. Scare in particular trying to create a chaos lynch so hard is no bueno to me. But it could also just be because I read his conceit correctly about not wanting me to be king. Taunting with killmonger was hilarious though.

My useless questions had me warming up to Plum a bit more as a lynch target though. Shame I didn't get to do more! Darn!

It's not like I was stopping you from asking them to people who aren't me.

Though Red wouldn't have answered either.

Not sure about anyone else though.

Having the kings ear... it just makes you feel warm inside.

Obellisk posted...

i..I... don't know what this means in relation to votals... so should we put you down for Chang then?
I'm, confusued?

I made it clear last page that Chang has taken over as my #1 based on doing virtually nothing since my initial suspicion of him.

I think Chang has mostly just been hiding out for a significant amount of the day.

Keep in mind I may just kill Crescent anyway but votes for other people can't hurt her chances!! Ho ho ho...

Also if I recall right, he also tried to completely ignore Death's suspicion of him and Death called him out on it and made him answer.

This whole king stuff is quite a letdown I must say

Eh, I think you were kinda pushing it. I don't think anyone here agrees with your reasons for executing Crescent.

I'm still upset you never rated my answers. I worked so hard on them! >:(

In any case, I just now realized IGCD = IfGodCouldDie, so I rescind my earlier comment of not seeing much activity from them.

Thoughts on Mzero? I think they posted in topic 1, but I don't think I heard much from them, either.

I might give thoughts later

I'll just say for now I understood your programming humor as a former Software Engineer turned IT

As for Mzero I prefer to wait a day or two to give thoughts on him. Timezone stuff means he tends to start inactiveish. This king buffoonery should give him some content to comment on at least

Probably the most condemning part about mzero is Changmas was stanning for him kinda hard earlier

I kinda was too though so like to me the logic changmas put forth wasn't exactly bad. You might want to see how much of it was derivative of my logic though.

I'm kinda put out though. I'm gonna need to reread in an hour or two.

Crescent-Moon posted...

I made it clear last page that Chang has taken over as my #1 based on doing virtually nothing since my initial suspicion of him.

I think Chang has mostly just been hiding out for a significant amount of the day.

tbh i was excited to have fun and play games under the direction of the king and then you chose to derail the game by grandstanding and refusing to participate, and that made the entire game about that/you instead of anything else.

and that started to look more like pulling teeth than anything else, so I didn't really have any motivation to post or stay engaged. I'm probably just gonna head to bed and try to come back tomorrow with a fresh start and a renewed sense of vigor for the game

Lopen posted...

Probably the most condemning part about mzero is Changmas was stanning for him kinda hard earlier

I kinda was too though so like to me the logic changmas put forth wasn't exactly bad. You might want to see how much of it was derivative of my logic though.

I'm kinda put out though. I'm gonna need to reread in an hour or two.

i have mzero radar or at least the results of the last two games would dictate that i do. once there's a bit more posts from him i'll be able to get a read on him. if he's town though I will ultra stan for him like I did in Elden Ring mafia

Alternatively everyone could have just accepted the fact Crescent was never going to participate and move on. I thought it was obvious that was going to happen regardless of her alignment. And lynching someone out of principal is an idea i will always laugh out of the room. Oh well. Let's sleep on it and get past it

I don't accept that. For a player like red refusing to participate is fine, it's like, in character dude doesn't talk a lot anyway.

For a player who literally won't shut up to not participate is just "I don't want to play the game unless I get to try and strong-arm my agenda" which to heck with that. You can call me bad all you want but I don't like a free pass for that kinda stuff.

Oh yeah I mean I don't respect the decision to not participate in THE TRIALS OF THE KING(tm) either. The same amount as not reading anything to do with the messages in Elden Ring mafia. And the same amount as policy lynching. But I did think it was in character due to that.

Hey, Ben, who do you think that Lopen should axe? I think I've seen you analyze people as Town quite a bit, but I don't think there have been many scum reads from you.

(... Yes I realize that's hypocritical coming from me but I'm really trying to formulate opinions on people >_>)

Well, I say that, but my playstyle tends to focus more on game info rather than psychoanalyzing peeps. So I probably won't have any strong opinions by the end of the day regardless.

PunishedBen posted...

But I did think it was in character due to that.

How is it relevant if it's in character though.

Okay like people have been saying Crescent is obvtown but I'm not sure that's the case here since everything she does is passed off as in character, even if it's town destructive.

What is a hypothetical scum game from Crescent looking like here. I just want to know.

Yeah, I don't see much substance in the "in-character" argument, either.

Like, I think Ben's antics near the end of the voting period are "in-character" but I don't think that necessarily points to town. I don't think it necessarily points to scum, either.

Though, I think more questions are in order. Even if you're dead-set on killing Crescent, Lopen, we should at least build some threads to use for the next day.

Or I guess you don't have to be a King to ask questions.

So I'll ask this: I'd like anyone willing to answer to pick someone they are most suspicious of and someone they trust the most to be town, then talk about the deciding moment where you were convinced they were scum/town, respectively.

I think that will give us a decent summary of some of the highlights these past few topics, which should give us some good talking points.

Lopen posted...

Scare in particular trying to create a chaos lynch so hard is no bueno to me

I actually never asked to be King, and spoke against Red who seemed like he was trying to run a chaos lynch. The only King I supported all day was Han and I asked that it *not* come to everyone agreeing on someone we didn't want just to not have you as King. I was not a fan of the agenda you were pushing

I have been thinking more on Ben, surprising no one as I try to solve my good friendo

and while he does cycle through various gimmicks, and doesn't always use the same ideas

It really is bothering me that he has not attempted much this game. Like this feels like a great Book of Town type spot for him. While Ben is an agent of chaos and fun, my personal feelings here are that in a Kingmaker situation, he would build his book of town equivalnt and ask for assurances that they not be in danger before he pushed for a King

Meh, let me know when Lopen is going to kill someone.

Scare you have my blessing to test Ben as you see fit. I will enforce some sort of dastardly challenge upon him if you so choose it.

I don't have much in mind at the moment, not to take away further the fun of being King. It has not been good to you I have seen.

Despite Ben telegraphing his support for you for an end of day vote, he did keep his hands clean until it was put up or shut up time. I won't hold it against him that he did not listen to me as I did a poor job of pushing for Han, and it will sound like I am contradicting myself with this, but it felt like him voting to tie things up/ during the tie was actually a 'safe' move for him to do. And along the way he did enough to end up in your good graces

And yes, I see that he is under scrutiny still. But I also am sure he'd have some confidence in trying to find a way out of your ire if there was someone at least in range of you considering otherwise

ScareChan posted...

And yes, I see that he is under scrutiny still. But I also am sure he'd have some confidence in trying to find a way out of your ire if there was someone at least in range of you considering otherwise

For example

I barely touched on Sbell today other than to say I did not like what I saw, and I gave basically no context about it. I think as King I still probably lynch SBell today even with having talked so much about my concerns about Ben. I don't think I could convince myself to pull the trigger on him so soon.

Beyond Ben

I don't like what you ended up doing as King. I understand it, and I get the questions. I very much am a 'questions don't always need to be great ones to lead to something' supporter. I imagine making a ton of questions to go with would be difficult, I gave no effort in trying to think of any 'better' question you could have asked, or a better system to use to go with it. It seems fun, I just... don't feel it's doing much for me personally to gain any reads.

And not to derail the topic or make further comments, but obviously I understand the frustrations with Crescent. I gave up a previous game because I just didn't want to play in it anymore. I get it. But you get one shot here. It might feel great in the moment as long as you don't feel foolish later.

To clarify that last part is not me saying 'you should shoot crescent' it is saying if you really want to shoot her and you are thinking she is town while doing it, make sure it would really be worth it

I don't think Crescent is confirmed town. If she was 100% confirmed town, I wouldn't consider the lynch. Play to win, objective #1. Like yes she has had "town vibes" to a lot of people the problem is I've never heard a concrete definition of what scum Crescent actually is. It's always "that's just what she does." I dislike that so many people said how townish she was yet almost no one voted her either. I think scum would be hesitant to start trains on their own in this format, so someone getting a lot of buzz for being townish yet having no drive to push for them is little weird.

But that being said I don't think she's scum either. Like is she my top priority to shoot on a purely scum chance basis? No.

I just want some sign of remorse or something. Some acknowledgement like "hey maybe being a jerk and throwing a tantrum and leaving because I didn't like what the king was doing wasn't helping solve the game"

I also don't want the narrative to be I threw the game if I get it wrong. I'm not saying it had to be all Crescent but I actually do take pride in trying to play this game well and I don't want the story to be how I lost the game. Because frankly I don't think it's my fault to begin with if I lynch her.

And I think that killing her might be net positive for the town even if she flips town. I do not think she is approaching this format with a good mindset and I think she is flooding the town with junk and making it hard to follow for people.

But mostly above all else I'm probably trying to rationalize a reason to vote her because I'm legit annoyed that I lost so much energy to be a power hungry dictator, so no I can honestly say I wouldn't be super upset to end her, her flip town, then get lynched tomorrow. And then like if she's scum, the audacity to just go for it and be right, that would be great. Risk-reward I'm still considering it because to me the risk just isn't that high.

However I think because we didn't really have proper scum hunting the first half of day 1 it's a waste to just waste this king phase with a quick execution. So like, may as well just let people say what they want even if I'm gonna kill a fool.

This is me venting, not scumhunting. Flooding with bad information. Whatever. Just go find scum. I will help however I can.

The King can still be super useful today. It's just unfortunate that things like Kirby vocalizing you wouldn't follow through on killing Crescent and then day hitting a wall combined into sucking some of the life from the game, and thus venom from the throne.

Titus played ball for you. Make him do more when he is here, even if you think he's town. Twist him. Make other people interject that it's obvious he's town.

Death should be showing up soon enough. Tell him not to even catch up, you need him to participate and answer a few things.

Chang is someone you have talked about that I think will play ball with you if you're throwing the right pitches

Also talking about 'throwing the game' day 1 is silly. You'll eat criticism from people if you whiff regardless of who it's on. You won't be vilified for a mislynch though.