Current Events > Police show up to black man's house, he excercises his legal rights and get shot

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MabusIncarnate
08/01/21 9:59:37 PM
#151:


With his back to the camera, and his face entirely not visible the entire time, he didn't look scared, judging by the back of his head. You could really see how not scared he was by the wrinkles in the back of his neck.

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VipaGTS
08/01/21 10:02:04 PM
#152:


metallica846 posted...
He didnt look scared. He looked like he pulled a gun and fired at the cops. Smooth brain idea.
After he was fired on. So much for the 2nd amendment huh.

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#153
Post #153 was unavailable or deleted.
#154
Post #154 was unavailable or deleted.
LeoRavus
08/01/21 10:24:17 PM
#155:


He seemed to get extra angry when the white cop spoke to him. "Shut your white ass up I'm talking to this man here". "Get her white ass off my property".

Nah, dude was out of line. All he had to do was talk to the cops, but came out with a gun acting like a prick. Who the fuck does that unless they're begging to get shot.

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VipaGTS
08/01/21 10:27:19 PM
#156:


LeoRavus posted...
He seemed to get extra angry when the white cop spoke to him. "Shut your white ass up I'm talking to this man here". "Get her white ass off my property".

Nah, dude was out of line. All he had to do was talk to the cops, but came out with a gun acting like a prick. Who the fuck does that unless they're begging to get shot.
That doesnt make it ok. Just because he was rude to them shouldnt mean well what did you expect?!?..he pulled his gun after the officers continued to escalate the situation. You can give him fault, but the main issue lies with the cops and how American cops approach policing. It needs to be changed not given into.

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#157
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darkprince45
08/01/21 10:30:35 PM
#158:


Life Sympathy posted...
Texas state law permits open carry on a person if they are on their own private property. This is a rather infamous right granted by our laws that stirred other states in the nation due to its tenacity.

You can verify it here:
https://statutes.capitol.texas.gov/Docs/PE/htm/PE.46.htm#46.02
Nobody is arguing open carry. At all. If you are detained for a police investigation, you cant threaten bodily harm to a police officer, especially not with a firearm. That can be be obstructing an investigation or resisting detainment/arrest

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WingsOfGood
08/01/21 10:35:24 PM
#159:


darkprince45 posted...
Nobody is arguing open carry. At all. If you are detained for a police investigation, you cant threaten bodily harm to a police officer, especially not with a firearm. That can be be obstructing an investigation or resisting detainment/arrest

He was not detained as you yourself even admitted as you stated he could have easily just went into his house.

Bottom line, he was not stopped, they invaded his property and were told to leave.
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darkprince45
08/01/21 10:38:59 PM
#160:


WingsOfGood posted...
He was not detained as you yourself even admitted as you stated he could have easily just went into his house.

Bottom line, he was not stopped, they invaded his property and were told to leave.

you dont understand detainment. It doesnt mean hes in handcuffs or in the back of a police car. It just means an officer has stopped you for RS or PC. Many times Ive detained somebody and they just take off running. Then we get into a foot pursuit and so on. You need to articulate why you handcuff someone.

so he is stopped for an investigation. If he chose to go inside. Then a warrant can be drafted, search warrant, etc.. depends on the severity of crime at issue. But he chose to confront officers

I keep explaining these things to you but you choose to re ask the same question in another wording

and you cant invade a property if you have a LAWFUL reason to be there. Or else we would never respond. Sorry neighbor, cant show up to your neighbors domestic that you hear through the walls. Were trespassing!

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WingsOfGood
08/01/21 10:40:02 PM
#161:


darkprince45 posted...
you dont understand detainment. It doesnt mean hes in handcuffs or in the back of a police car. It just means an officer has stopped you for RS or PC. Many times Ive detained somebody and they just take off running. Then we get into a foot pursuit and so on. You need to articulate why you handcuff someone.

so he is stopped for an investigation. If he chose to go inside. Then a warrant can be drafted, search warrant, etc.. depends on the severity of crime at issue.

I keep explaining these things to you but you choose to re ask the same question in another wording

No i absolutely do. You in a post ITT admitted he can walk into his house and that be ok. A detained man could not do this.
So you admit he was not detained.
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WingsOfGood
08/01/21 10:41:00 PM
#162:


darkprince45 posted...
and you cant invade a property if you have a LAWFUL reason to be there. Or else we would never respond. Sorry neighbor, cant show up to your neighbors domestic that you through the wallsz Were trespassing!

Your lawful reason to be there goes away when the owner tells you over and over to leave.

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darkprince45
08/01/21 10:42:21 PM
#163:


WingsOfGood posted...
No i absolutely do. You in a post ITT admitted he can walk into his house and that be ok. A detained man could not do this.
So you admit he was not detained.

yes he can be ok as in, the cops probably not gonna run and burst through the door and drag him out then. But for the third time. THE CRIME DOESNT DISAPPEAR. If he would have gone inside. They most likely wouldve drafted. Warrant for his arrest. But he decided to charge officers and then pull out a gun. Thats why were at this point

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darkprince45
08/01/21 10:43:24 PM
#164:


WingsOfGood posted...
Your lawful reason to be there goes away when the owner tells you over and over to leave.
No the fuck it doesnt. Open a fucking law book? You think if we show up to a domestic call and the owner goes sorry you cant see my wife who called, get out. Oh okay, sorry sir!

doesnt work that way

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limp-bizkit-89
08/01/21 10:45:10 PM
#165:


I have a fundamental issue with the fact that they can operate like judge dreed.

were supposed to have a court system, the whole hereby I condemn you to death thing is not how its supposed to work.

plus, is death (or at least goring) by bullet wound the acceptable penalty for reckless driving?

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#166
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WingsOfGood
08/01/21 10:46:55 PM
#167:


darkprince45 posted...
yes he can be ok as in, the cops probably are gonna run and burst through the door and drag him out then.

Funny to see this admitted.

See all you posters who said the guy should have just gone inside, now you know why he didn't straight from the horses mouth. No doubt the guy figured they just gonna be abusers like this and that is why he stood his ground on his own property.

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WingsOfGood
08/01/21 10:48:17 PM
#168:


limp-bizkit-89 posted...
I have a fundamental issue with the fact that they can operate like judge dreed.

were supposed to have a court system, the whole hereby I condemn you to death thing is not how its supposed to work.

plus, is death (or at least goring) by bullet wound the acceptable penalty for reckless driving?

They aren't supposed to be but when people who don't know the law but think they do like DP self investigate, they judge that they were correct. Like just read his posts.
Now you know why internal investigations never find wrong doing and the public is baffled.
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darkprince45
08/01/21 10:50:46 PM
#169:


WingsOfGood posted...
Funny to see this admitted.

See all you posters who said the guy should have just gone inside, now you know why he didn't straight from the horses mouth. No doubt the guy figured they just gonna be abusers like this and that is why he stood his ground on his own property.
The edit says PROBABLY NOT. you lost your stupid argument so you tried to do a gotcha by picking an already older post. But if you had reading comprehension you couldve easily figured it out I meant to say not anyways

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darkprince45
08/01/21 10:51:52 PM
#170:


WingsOfGood posted...
They aren't supposed to be but when people who don't know the law but think they do like DP self investigate,

Ive actually stated the different rulings and case laws. You didnt even know what a terry stop was. You said it was a traffic stop lmao


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WingsOfGood
08/01/21 10:53:46 PM
#171:


darkprince45 posted...
The edit says PROBABLY NOT. you lost your stupid argument so you tried to do a gotcha by picking an already older post. But if you had reading comprehension you couldve easily figured it out I meant to say not anyways

So he was detained....yet could just easily walk away....

Btw, what crime would be on the warrant?
No crime was proven.
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darkprince45
08/01/21 10:56:18 PM
#172:


Yes, what dont you understand? Do you think detained means handcuffed and were sitting on top of them?

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=F4D1dXVKH8A

here is a person detained for DUI and under investigation. Notice how they are able to run? Is your mind blown now?

reckless driving and obstructing

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Axiom
08/01/21 10:56:51 PM
#173:


Pigs being pigs
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WingsOfGood
08/01/21 10:59:11 PM
#174:


My point is if he walks in his house it is basically over as there is nothing to write on the warrant.

Also, do you understand that even while detained and questioned, you can refuse to answer the questions?
How come a dude saying get off my property, go away, is not considered to you "I will not answer your questions, this is my right of silence?"

Seems pretty clear and cut that the cops should have left and drafted a warrant except you and I both know that wasn't going to happen as there is nothing, no crime to write the warrant for.

Man was harassed and shot for no reason. Admit it.
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#175
Post #175 was unavailable or deleted.
darkprince45
08/01/21 11:01:54 PM
#176:


WingsOfGood posted...
My point is if he walks in his house it is basically over as there is nothing to write on the warrant.

False.

WingsOfGood posted...
Also, do you understand that even while detained and questioned, you can refuse to answer the questions?
yes but they still have a crime and a lawful reason to stop him.

How come a dude saying get off my property, go away, is not considered to you "I will not answer your questions, this is my right of silence?"

That is completely your right. But they could still arrest you if there is PC. But he didnt do that. He escalated the situation by threatening violence to police officers while conducting a lawful investigation on HIM. Obstructing and resisting.

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darkprince45
08/01/21 11:02:54 PM
#177:


metallica846 posted...
Obviously this is just baiting at this point.
Yeah hes been doing this for a month or two now. He popped up out of nowhere and sealion. He has. What about for literally every question. Im trying to see if theres an end so I can block him after this topic

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WingsOfGood
08/01/21 11:03:37 PM
#178:


Also as another user pointed out, no report of alcohol in his blood. There was nothing for the cops to find.

Even had he been intoxicated, there is no proof he was driving drunk as he could have chugged one down after he got home and his vehicle stopped.

But he wasn't even drunk.

Just a man who heard about cops harassing and killing black men on his own damn property saying go away, wtf you here for.
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WingsOfGood
08/01/21 11:04:59 PM
#179:


darkprince45 posted...
Yeah hes been doing this for a month or two now. He popped up out of nowhere and sealion. He has. What about for literally every question. Im trying to see if theres an end so I can block him after this topic

I only share what I find on reddit. If this distresses you, perhaps you should ask why the public is so outraged over what seems fair to you?
That is where the heart of the matter lies. Why do you think this situation favor the cops when the public you serve disagrees?

And I did not bait you. You chose to entet this thread and defend the cop.
You even said you would stop posting ITT but kept doing so.

Block me if you want but then who will defend the cops when reddit shares more of these stories?
And aside from these reddit cop stories, do you have anything against me?
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darkphoenix181
08/01/21 11:11:04 PM
#180:


Seems problematic when regular citizens say cops don't know the law and cops say the regular citizen's don't know the law. This sounds to me like a broken system with a critical disconnect. And I am not talking hardened criminals here.
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darkprince45
08/01/21 11:12:34 PM
#181:


darkphoenix181 posted...
Seems problematic when regular citizens say cops don't know the law and cops say the regular citizen's don't know the law. This sounds to me like a broken system with a critical disconnect. And I am not talking hardened criminals here.

the problem here, hes trolling say you dont know the law! And I correctly named and gave details for the actual case law that takes two seconds to google. OP incorrectly described a case law and is still saying Im wrong


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WingsOfGood
08/01/21 11:14:20 PM
#182:


Umm google it and stop and frisk comes up.

I can screenshot it for you if you want.
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ModLogic
08/01/21 11:15:22 PM
#183:


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WingsOfGood
08/01/21 11:18:27 PM
#184:




In addition these articles mention how the doctrine was used to uphold law deemed racist fyi.
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darkprince45
08/01/21 11:19:13 PM
#185:


A Terry stop in the United States allows the police to briefly detain a person based on reasonable suspicion of involvement in criminal activity.[1][2] Reasonable suspicion is a lower standard than probable cause which is needed for arrest.

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WingsOfGood
08/01/21 11:23:29 PM
#186:


darkprince45 posted...
A Terry stop in the United States allows the police to briefly detain a person based on reasonable suspicion of involvement in criminal activity.[1][2] Reasonable suspicion is a lower standard than probable cause which is needed for arrest.

Now then, if you knock on a door and say you want to ask some questions and they say go away, do you consider this a Terry Stop?
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darkprince45
08/01/21 11:24:29 PM
#187:


WingsOfGood posted...
Now then, if you knock on a door and say you want to ask some questions and they say go away, do you consider this a Terry Stop?
Whose door?!?

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WingsOfGood
08/01/21 11:24:57 PM
#188:


darkprince45 posted...
Whose door?!?

Person you want to question's door
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darkprince45
08/01/21 11:25:56 PM
#189:


If a person comes out and they are suspected of a crime then yes technically

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#190
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WingsOfGood
08/01/21 11:26:35 PM
#191:


darkprince45 posted...
technically

hmm, technically

that seems suspicious
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darkprince45
08/01/21 11:27:31 PM
#192:


No, its just expanded beyond the scope of just a terry stop. But in its most basic definition, its still a terry stop in its core

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Zikten
08/01/21 11:29:14 PM
#193:


Sounds cops always have a way to detain people if they wish. They can make up any Probable Cause they want
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WingsOfGood
08/01/21 11:37:04 PM
#194:


https://casetext.com/analysis/search-and-seizure-terry-stop-what-constitutes-a-seizure

United States v. Johnson, 620 F.3d 685 (6th Cir. 2010)
The police received a call that there were suspicious people at an apartment complex. The police went to the scene and saw the defendant, carrying a bag, walking calmly from the yard of the complex to a car. The police ordered him to stop; he kept walking. The police ordered him to stop again; he kept walking until he arrived at the car, opened the passenger door, threw the bag in and then stood still at the open door. The Sixth Circuit held that when he finally stopped, he had been seized. Because there was no articulable suspicion to justify the seizure, the resulting frisk and search was unconstitutional and evidence should have been suppressed.

United States v. Fox, 600 F.3d 1253 (10th Cir. 2010)
The defendants wife pulled up to her house and was approached by a police officer who was conducting surveillance of the house (in particular, the defendant). The officer entered the wifes car and directed her to drive across the street to a parking lot. She was questioned and then asked for consent to search her car. Ultimately, she consented to a search of the house. The Tenth Circuit held that the wife was detained; there was no basis for the detention and the consent to search was the product of this detention. The gun found in the house, therefore, should have been suppressed at the defendants trial.

United States v. Johnson, 427 F.3d 1053 (7th Cir. 2005)
The police received an anonymous tip that the defendant was a cocaine dealer and that he lived at a particular location. The police went to the defendants house and when the defendants girlfriend came out, she was asked by the police to knock on the door. She did so and the defendant came to the door. The police talked to him briefly, after which he turned around and started walking away, back down the hall. The police pulled out a gun, pointed it at the ground, and cautioned that this was a matter of officer safety. The defendant stopped in his tracks and returned to the door. He then consented to a search. The Seventh Circuit held, (1) this did amount to a detention; (2) there was no articulable suspicion supporting the detention; (3) the consent to search was a fruit of the unlawful detention.

United States v. Hall, 978 F.2d 616 (10th Cir. 1992)
Based on a tip, the police met the defendant when her train arrived at the station. She was asked for consent to search her luggage which she refused. She had purchased a one-way ticket from Flagstaff to Harrisburg, Pa. She appeared nervous when questioned. On this basis, the officers seized the luggage, but allowed the defendant to leave. This was unlawful. In order to seize the luggage, the police must have the same level of information reasonable suspicion as is required to seize the person. United States v. Place, 462 U.S. 696 (1983). The facts in this case did not amount to reasonable suspicion.

Seeing a pattern here. Sounds like the officers going on a tip to detain someone are breaking the law based on case law.
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darkprince45
08/01/21 11:38:51 PM
#195:


News at 10: cops are human beings that are wrong too

Doesnt apply to this. Subject was called in and officers observed it

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Zikten
08/01/21 11:41:07 PM
#196:


Cops seem to be wrong a lot

Also 9 times out of 10 when they are wrong, they never answer for it. That is why people hate cops
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darkprince45
08/01/21 11:42:04 PM
#197:


Zikten posted...
Cops seem to be wrong a lot
If you compare the yearly average of 100million unique contacts. Not really

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WingsOfGood
08/01/21 11:42:25 PM
#198:


darkprince45 posted...
News at 10: cops are human beings that are wrong too

Doesnt apply to this. Subject was called in and officers observed it

It applies due to the circumstances.

These are ruled unlawful because cops detained people for stupid reasons like a phonecall saying a dude was a cocaine dealer.

The police received an anonymous tip that the defendant was a cocaine dealer and that he lived at a particular location.

And here there was a tip that the dude was driving recklessly.

They had no right to detain him, on his own property no less. Call it a terry stop if you want, that doesn't make it lawful as seen in these case law excerpts.

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darkprince45
08/01/21 11:43:39 PM
#199:


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WingsOfGood
08/01/21 11:45:37 PM
#200:


darkprince45 posted...
I mean youre just flat out wrong

  1. Phone-call that dude was cocaine dealer
  2. So they go to his house
  3. He comes outside and they determine he is now detained because he is outside his house and they ask him questions.
  4. Court says these cops did not know the law and this was unlawful and no evidence from this can be used in court


As we can then clearly see, there was no point to harass this black man as even had he cooperated and they found something, a court would just thrown it out anyways.
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