Board 8 > Magic the Gathering: Adventures in the Forgotten Realms

(+) Yeah! (+)

maro has directly stated in the past that they intentionally design gradual peaks and valleys in power level among standard sets

They've noted that when power levels dramatically drop all at once, nobody buys the next set. And when power levels dramatically jump all at once, the playerbase buys cards, but gets cranky and ultimately it isn't sustainable.

maro explained that kaladesh was the intended peak in late 2016/early 2017, with a slow decrease down to rivals of ixalan in early 2018.

extrapolating from there, you can see them slowly rising again to eldraine as the intended peak in 2019 (they overshot it), with a gradual decrease to what i'm tentatively marking as strixhaven in 2021

AFR doesn't count because it's intended as a core set, but i expect that the power level of sets will start creeping back up again with innistrad 3

---

they've clearly made a lot of mistakes in this past cycle (companion was such a goof, and escape was overly pushed) but you could see where they were aiming

---

Companion was a big whiff yeah, but I think they actually somehow landed on their feet. The current companion rules actually feel pretty good where companions are still viable but everyone isn't jamming them because everything else sucks

---

Book of Exalted Deeds feels to me like it could have been solved with an errata rather than a ban since there's clearly a real card there and this one particular interaction just slipped through the cracks. I guess this is only a ban for the current Standard 2022 queue on Magic Arena though, which is also a pretty small step in the grand scheme of things.
---

I hate Companion because it reminds me of Commander.

It is honestly a miracle that I ever picked up the game when the way my friends tried to introduce me to Magic was via a 4-player game of EDH. (In their defense, I had played similar card games so I didn't really need time to learn the basic rules of the game. I was more or less fine to jump straight into a game it's just that they played a format I thought was kind of dumb >.>)
---

pyresword posted...

Book of Exalted Deeds feels to me like it could have been solved with an errata rather than a ban since there's clearly a real card there and this one particular interaction just slipped through the cracks. I guess this is only a ban for the current Standard 2022 queue on Magic Arena though, which is also a pretty small step in the grand scheme of things.

book of exalted deeds is only an issue on arena because wizards has failed to implement any form of a draw system

there's no problem in paper

---

pyresword posted...

I hate Companion because it reminds me of Commander.

It is honestly a miracle that I ever picked up the game when the way my friends tried to introduce me to Magic was via a 4-player game of EDH. (In their defense, I had played similar card games so I didn't really need time to learn the basic rules of the game. I was more or less fine to jump straight into a game it's just that they played a format I thought was kind of dumb >.>)

i'm with you. not a huge fan of commander, especially to teach new players with. i think it's the most complicated and difficult to keep track of format. twice as many players, most complicated board states, most diverse set of cards, etc etc

it's also lost a little bit of its original appeal, as a "play whatever garbage cards you have and you'll be fine" format, since wizards is constantly pushing out products with ridiculously good commander-targeted cards. it's become the game's primary money maker

it's also the most political format, filled with "feel-bad" moments. i was never a huge fan of the board/card game "munchkin", and that's what commander feels like to me.

it's fine as a purely social experience if you are already good at magic and just want to drink with your friends

---

Well if that's actually the reason then I agree, though it feels like the solution should be "implement a draw system". I guess that takes time though.

Edit: on Book of Exalted Deeds that is
---

banananor posted...

book of exalted deeds is only an issue on arena because wizards has failed to implement any form of a draw system

there's no problem in paper

Right. In paper two players can declare a draw at any point for whatever reason

---

I think errataing a card is also a pretty heavy-handed solution for a "fake" format that also takes more time to implement. Even if you're talking about errating it JUST for Standard 2022 on Arena, which I think is worth considering but it still very weird.

Honestly the way MTG social media has been yelling about it they should probably just implement a BO3 2022 queue and call it a day, which will also give them data on if the book is still a problem.

---

I think book is still a 'problem' in paper, just not the same way it is on arena.

Yes, you can technically draw the game to move on, but having a soft-lock available in your standard format isn't particularly ideal either way

---

The Mana Sword posted...

I think book is still a 'problem' in paper, just not the same way it is on arena.

Yes, you can technically draw the game to move on, but having a soft-lock available in your standard format isn't particularly ideal either way

It's actually happened at least once before with Oblivion Ring! It was MUCH harder to pull off though so they didn't need to take any action, and then they later replaced it with Banishing Light once it rotated.

Point is, if it doesn't come up often enough then they don't have to do anything, and probably shouldn't.

---

yeah obviously it depends on how rampant it gets (if at all)

just another thing that probably shouldn't have slipped through playtesting is all

---

Also I think I'm about spent on this draft format after around 7 drafts. Just not really holding my interest. Bleh.

---

fair warning, this is going to be super pointless and petty

my prerelease promos are the only cards in my collection i will never trade, sell, or give away. why? they bookmark my memories- it's great having an instant reminder of when & hopefully where i was and who i was with when i experienced the event.

as of strixhaven and moving forward, they don't have the prerelease date on them, only the year. it's such a minor downgrade but for some reason it's bothering me in a sentimental way. i was gearing up to go to a physical AFR prerelease, but now i'm not super sure if i'm going to go

source: https://mtg.fandom.com/wiki/Prerelease_card#Strixhaven:_School_of_Mages_onwards

for contrast:

old: https://www.cardkingdom.com/mtg/promotional/torgaar-famine-incarnate-prerelease-foil

new: https://www.cardkingdom.com/mtg/promotional/confront-the-past-prerelease-foil


---

I'm the exact same way, I don't trade promos since they're mementos of events. It feels cheaper now that they don't have dates.

---

I don't care about the promos all that much, but I agree that it's a strict downgrade and makes the cards feel less special.

---

Man limited is such absolute gutter trash. In my last 7 games I've lost 2 single-handedly to Zariel, Archduke of Avernus and 2 single-handedly to Grand Master of Flowers.
---

UltimaterializerX posted...

Swept my prerelease. 5 red rares or mythics, plus the Rakdos demon. The deck was totally absurd; Goblin puke, then Dragon puke. One of those was going to kill you eventually. I had 2 of the 2 mana goblin uncommon pumper guy, and he is just laughably broken.

Oh yeah, that goblin uncommon is nuts

---

pyresword posted...

Man limited is such absolute gutter trash. In my last 7 games I've lost 2 single-handedly to Zariel, Archduke of Avernus and 2 single-handedly to Grand Master of Flowers.

Yep, too many unbeatable bombs in this set. My opponents play paladin class, ranger class, or skeleton swarming and I go I guess I lose then

---

masterplum posted...

Yep, too many unbeatable bombs in this set. My opponents play paladin class, ranger class, or skeleton swarming and I go I guess I lose then

This is why Dawnbringer Cleric is low key the overall mvp of the set.

---

redrocket posted...

This is why Dawnbringer Cleric is low key the overall mvp of the set.

Possible!

---

lol

---

redrocket posted...

This is why Dawnbringer Cleric is low key the overall mvp of the set

Don't forget the big dumb idiot 6 mana Beholder!

---

HeroDelTiempo17 posted...

Don't forget the big dumb idiot 6 mana Beholder!

i did feel pretty dumb when i didn't have a removal spell saved, and my opponent top-decked a xanathar

it's a huge bomb, but it feels less offensive than all of the typical "ETB, spin in a circle and do 500 stuff" offenders

it gives you an entire turn to remove it before it completely ruins your life

---

banananor posted...

i did feel pretty dumb when i didn't have a removal spell saved, and my opponent top-decked a xanathar

it's a huge bomb, but it feels less offensive than all of the typical "ETB, spin in a circle and do 500 stuff" offenders

it gives you an entire turn to remove it before it completely ruins your life

I think he meant the common that can make an opponent sacrifice an enchantment

but I just got to play with Xanathar for the first time, and it fucking ruled. I didnt even consider until I got to use it that it basically allows you to control what your opponent draws. If you have enough mana, you can just cast stuff until something that wont help them remove Xanathar is on top and then you get to Xanathar forever.

my opponent drew lands like four turns in a row because I just played all his spells
---

Woot, just went 7-0 in a premium AFR draft. Went red/white equipment and I had a lot of really good games. In the last one I managed to hang on with one life after my opponent swung with his board and then finished him off with exact lethal the turn after.

I only had a single rare (Hobgoblin Bandit Lord) but I managed to get two Bruenors which did a lot of work.

---

i know i shouldn't hate other players- it's just a game- but for whatever reason, players who fake GG on arena really get to me

if i had any emote to essentially say "i know you're faking/i don't believe you" i wouldn't get tilted

but as it stands, i just imagine them smugly thinking about how clever they are, when i see right through it and lose anyway

it's always some white/azorius/jeskai control player, too.

---

also, no matter how many times this happens, every single time an opponent casts my mutate card, i get super confused. it's usually good- it's still confusing

---

MoogleKupo141 posted...

I think he meant the common that can make an opponent sacrifice an enchantment

Yeah that one. That card is frequently great for me. Enchantments are just uncommon enough that the opponent will usually only have one good enchantment out anyways.

---

you know, somehow that ability never registered in my brain! i think i had only seen the menace clause used

---

https://magic.wizards.com/en/articles/archive/news/july-21-2021-banned-and-restricted-announcement?efs

Yep. I'm mostly surprised this didn't happen sooner. Historic has been a weird format since the Archives dropped.

It's also interesting to me they aren't including any non-URx decks using Brainstorm in their reported data. I wonder if UW and UB are just negligible? At any rate, the format was warped around the card regardless of the raw numbers, so maybe it'll adjust for the better.

---

Brainstorm certainly was a pretty strong addition, not terribly surprised.

---

time to play even less arena than I was already playing

---

Not a ban, just a suspension. They don't give wild cards for suspensions, right?

The data they produced really doesn't mean much, the more copies of a given deck there are the more mirror matches there are and thus the closer to 50% win rate they get anyway. Then they talk about how the URx decks are less played on the ladder than at tournaments (of course) but don't talk about the win % there compared to tournaments. And yeah, they didn't talk about Brainstorm outside of those two decks. They literally didn't give any data anyone could use to extrapolate anything, then they said they didn't want to ban the card because the data wasn't clear.

Mealy mouthed bullshit, that's what that is.

---

Brainstorm is such a busted card. Not surprised

---

ChichiriMuyo posted...

Not a ban, just a suspension. They don't give wild cards for suspensions, right?

They don't (except on accident) but they've said in the past they try to move things from suspended to banned/legal after a month.

Also I do agree with the overall assessment that they don't WANT to ban brainstorm. Everything about how they're handling this says to me that they really wanted Historic to be the non-Legacy/Vintage Brainstorm format, but it's not working out at all. So I guess we'll see if it's just suspended indefinitely. Really shouldn't be though!

---

Part of me wants to say this should change very little. For the most part I think that the community as a whole has made some serious misevaluations about the Historic format overall and about Brainstorm specifically. That said, there probably are real changes just because the one deck that I think may actually be hurt by this also happens to be the most played deck.

Izzet Phoenix probably is hurt by this, less so because of Brainstorm specifically but more because there just isn't really another 1 mana cantrip. If you could play copies 5-8 of Opt instead then the deck is nearly the same. You can play Crash Through but that actually does feel like it might be too weak. If the mana for Abundant Harvest can work then that's also an option, but I suspect that may not possible. (For the record, I could easily see Crash Through being good enough anyways, though I could also see that not panning out)

Jeskai/Dimir control and Temur Creativity can no longer protect their hands from Thoughtseize, which is something. I don't think it's a huge loss, but in any case my opinion is that these decks were all basically unplayable anyways and will continue to be unplayable. Ironically banning Brainstorm may put these decks in a better place just because Izzet Phoenix is likely hurt more than they were. (Edit: Combo-esque decks like Creativity are hit harder than this suggests, yes. I was sort of ignoring it just because I think that deck is spectacularly bad anyways even in comparison, but I guess it's worth mentioning)

Jund Food is probably the #1 deck right now. I don't necessarily expect people to realize that since it's still been #2 since the release of Strixhaven and no one seemed to catch on, but who knows maybe people leaving blue decks in droves will be enough of a spark.
---

I definitely lean on the side of thinking that people were overrating how much Brainstorm was actually warping the format. I don't really think this does much to hurt Phoenix, the control decks just go back to playing Opt, and UR(x) decks continue being extremely good because those colors got way more goodies from the mystical archive than the others. Time will tell, but I suppose this will sate the people howling for a ban for a few weeks.

---

Well, the game designers seem to agree with you!

https://twitter.com/mtg_lee/status/1417866811568058370?s=19

Even if the pros don't!

https://twitter.com/BasicMountain/status/1417885472102125569?s=19

I do think you are seriously underestimating how much better Brainstorm is than Opt, but you're right in that the playable decks will make substitutions and still be playable.

---

My intention wasn't to compare Opt to Brainstorm in power level, obviously Brainstorm is significantly better. Just that the card quality in those decks is already so high that having to sub out Brainstorm isn't going to hurt them too much.

---

I don't think the control decks even want to be playing Opt, though as my previous post suggests I'm not convinced they should have been playing Brainstorm either.

One other thing I guess this will do is early discard will be much better positioned again. (This is bad from a player experience standpoint, but whatever...) Maybe Orzhov Auras and Rakdos Arcanist can make a comeback now or something. Mono-black was also playable anyways and may be positioned to break into tier 1 now.

For the record yes I think the pros are wrong here and I trust my own testing experience more than I trust however they came to their own conclusions.
---

The Mana Sword posted...

My intention wasn't to compare Opt to Brainstorm in power level, obviously Brainstorm is significantly better. Just that the card quality in those decks is already so high that having to sub out Brainstorm isn't going to hurt them too much.

Well Brainstorm was really good in decks with high card quality because it's a powerful card selection tool. These decks are being hit on consistency, not power level. They'll function fine, just without the ability to cast Brainstorm and play a fabled passage and just so happen to have perfect sequencing.

---

We'll see what happens. I'd prefer the card stay in the format because I enjoy playing with it, but that's admittedly selfish and because I hate Thoughtseize. I do wish my 4 wildcards weren't going to held in limbo for a month before they decide to ban it proper. The suspension system is kinda dumb.

---

Hmm I guess I will back off a little since I think I'm coming off stronger than I really feel about this. I do think Brainstorm is stronger than Opt and if push comes to shove I do think I would say it's a good inclusion in the decks are that are running it (it's just that the debate isn't settled in my head yet). It's more that I just don't think it's the format-warping menace that a lot of people seem to say it is.

My comment about the pros specifically was more that I think the pro players are overrating how strong Jeskai Control and Dimir Control are right now, which I think is not so much about Brainstorm as it is that I just don't think the overall shell of those decks is good enough right now.
---