Current Events > Male athletes on equal pay: Women cannot fight this fight alone

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https://www.cnbc.com/2021/03/24/chris-paul-and-other-athletes-on-equal-pay-and-male-allyship.html

March 24 marks Equal Pay Day, the symbolic date for how far the average woman has to work into the new year to earn the same pay men earned the previous year. Women cannot fight this fight alone, Paul tells CNBC Make It. As a father with a daughter, the Phoenix Suns star says he cant imagine the limits that are on her and many other talented women because of structural disparities. When looking at the sports world specifically, Paul says he commends athletes like U.S. womens national soccer team player Megan Rapinoe for the work she and her teammates are doing to draw attention to the fact that people love womens soccer and watch it, but the advertising and salaries just arent there. In 2016 Rapinoe and other USWNT players filed a complaint with the Equal Employment Opportunity Commission for unequal pay, citing figures that showed the womens team generated nearly $20 million more in revenue the prior year than the U.S. mens team. Yet, despite this additional revenue, they were paid almost four times less. In addition to unequal pay, USWNT players sued U.S. Soccer for gender discrimination in 2019 stating inequality in work conditions, travel arrangements and medical treatment compared to their male peers. While their fight for equal pay is still ongoing, Rapinoe and her teammates did reach an agreement with the United States Soccer Federation in December 2020 to grant players equal staffing, travel, hotel accommodations and venue choices at their matches compared to the men. Its important that women are not only paid equal, but treated with equal respect, says Allen, while adding that its imperative for men to be advocates and fight for equal pay and gender equality so that his daughter has a future where she is treated fairly. In addition to Paul and Allen, several other athletes have used their platforms to voice just how important it is for men to step up and advocate for women.

Last week, players such as Golden State Warriors star Steph Curry and NBA player Kyrie Irving called out the National Collegiate Athletic Association (NCAA) for its disparity in treatment between men and women college basketball players at its March Madness tournaments. It is kind of eye-opening every single day to realize we live in a society where we kind of expect so much from men, our kings, and we go out and show an effort like that in terms of how we show our respect for our queens, going to play on a high level as well, Irving said during a press conference in response to a viral video that showed just how small the womens weight room was in comparison to the mens. Calling the difference in treatment unacceptable, the 29-year-old, who helped cover the salaries of WNBA players last year, said, I am here to follow the steps as a pioneer to continue to be a voice for change. Paul, who spent much of his time last season fighting for racial justice and working with NBA commissioner Adam Silver to improve the leagues hiring practices of women and minorities, says its important for everyone to ask themselves if things are equal and if everyone has a seat at the table. If were providing more opportunity for women and are listening to different voices, we are going to have a more inclusive environment that leads to a more level playing field.



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what if they made the pay equal by paying them the women's wages

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If you really want female athletes to be paid more then go buy a fucking ticket to see them play

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MedeaLysistrata posted...

what if they made the pay equal by paying them the women's wages

Yeah.

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The truth is that this debate is stupid and framed this way to stunt the real conversation:

which is that all of these athletes would be making considerably more money if the profit wasnt concentrated in owner hands

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Solid Snake07 posted...

If you really want female athletes to be paid more then go buy a fucking ticket to see them play

the USWNT legal argument was that people do, and they're still paid less

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Didn't the Women's soccer team get BTFO in court?

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I don't think this is exactly relevant to their point, but it's hard for me to get over people saying this who make like 30 times as much as some of their teammates

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CalypsoDoom posted...

I'd love this

Yeah, they should grant the wish like a Monkey's paw.

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AngelsNAirwav3s posted...

Didn't the Women's soccer team get BTFO in court?

Yea. They had previously negotiated a contract with higher salaries for bench players and more benefits in exchange for less profit sharing, then got all pissed when the realized they would have made more money after their championship if they had the same contract as the men's (which has way less base pay in exchange for more profit sharing). They tried to sue and were thrown out not only because they negotiated their own contract but because they were still making more than the men's team so their argument about sexism fell through completely.

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I will never understand how people get riled up on rich people not making even more

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Solid Snake07 posted...

If you really want female athletes to be paid more then go buy a fucking ticket to see them play

Seriously, women don't even give a shit about the WNBA so why do they get so upset when men do the same?

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pure_temper posted...

which is that all of these athletes would be making considerably more money if the profit wasnt concentrated in owner hands

What, do we nationalize sports leagues and stadiums?

AngelsNAirwav3s posted...

Didn't the Women's soccer team get BTFO in court?

kind of- USSF was able to demonstrate that they negotiated for a fixed income contract instead of a pay-to-play contract, so the judge ruled that the lawsuit had to concentrate on working conditions instead, where they were able to prove significant disparities existed (but obviously far less money was at stake).

s0nicfan posted...

They tried to sue and were thrown out

the case wasn't thrown out- the salary part was rejected and is being appealed, and the working conditions part reached a settlement in dec 2020

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Most women's sports do not deserve equal pay because they are not generating near equal revenue.

The USWNT for soccer likely deserves much more than they are making, because they have made a lot of money for US soccer.

WNBA players likely don't deserve a raise.


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s0nicfan posted...

Yea. They had previously negotiated a contract with higher salaries for bench players and more benefits in exchange for less profit sharing, then got all pissed when the realized they would have made more money after their championship if they had the same contract as the men's (which has way less base pay in exchange for more profit sharing). They tried to sue and were thrown out not only because they negotiated their own contract but because they were still making more than the men's team so their argument about sexism fell through completely.

LMAO damn.

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KILBOTz posted...

The USWNT for soccer likely deserves much more than they are making, because they have made a lot of money for US soccer.

That's their own damn fault, for shitty collective bargaining.

Questionmarktarius posted...

What, do we nationalize sports leagues and stadiums?

we need a more educated and informed audience so that they start telling the coaches and the owners they demand better pay for all the players and less pay for the fat hogs at the top

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They don't play on the same teams, they're different products.

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BignutzisBack posted...

Seriously, women don't even give a shit about the WNBA so why do they get so upset when men do the same?

Nah, this article talks about the women's us soccer team bringing in twice the revenue of the men's soccer team, but they get paid 1/4 of what the men get paid. That definitely sounds like an issue.

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NoxObscuras posted...

Nah, this article talks about the women's us soccer team bringing in twice the revenue of the men's soccer team, but they get paid 1/4 of what the men get paid. That definitely sounds like an issue.

It isn't:
s0nicfan posted...

Yea. They had previously negotiated a contract with higher salaries for bench players and more benefits in exchange for less profit sharing, then got all pissed when the realized they would have made more money after their championship if they had the same contract as the men's (which has way less base pay in exchange for more profit sharing). They tried to sue and were thrown out not only because they negotiated their own contract but because they were still making more than the men's team so their argument about sexism fell through completely.

https://www.npr.org/2020/05/02/849492863/federal-judge-dismisses-u-s-womens-soccer-team-s-equal-pay-claim

The lawsuit argued in part that "the female players have been consistently paid less money than their male counterparts. This is true even though their performance has been superior to that of the male players."

"The WNT [Women's National Team] rejected an offer to be paid under the same pay-to-play structure as the MNT [Men's National Team] and ... the WNT was willing to forgo higher bonuses for other benefits, such as greater base compensation and the guarantee of a higher number of contracted players," Klausner wrote. "Accordingly, Plaintiffs cannot now retroactively deem their CBA worse than the MNT CBA by reference to what they would have made had they been paid under the MNT's pay-to-play structure when they themselves rejected such a structure."

https://apnews.com/article/959dffc7fbe64f11a207a89a922b4054

According to a letter released Monday by U.S. Soccer President Carlos Cordeiro, the federation paid out $34.1 million in salary and game bonuses to the women between 2010 and 2018 as opposed to $26.4 million paid to the men. The total does not include the value of benefits received only by the women, like health care.

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KILBOTz posted...

WNBA players likely don't deserve a raise.

They want a similar revenue percentage that the NBA players get. Not the same amount of money.

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I4NRulez posted...

They want a similar revenue percentage that the NBA players get. Not the same amount of money.

isn't the WNBA a net loser though? I thought it was entirely supported by the NBA

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I4NRulez posted...

They want a similar revenue percentage that the NBA players get. Not the same amount of money.

The NBA subsidizes the WNBA, they haven't made a profit a single year in their entire existence

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@s0nicfan Oh. That's GG then. They negotiated a bad contract and now they want to change it lol. I thought they were just getting shafted.

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I4NRulez posted...

They want a similar revenue percentage that the NBA players get.

Wouldn't the typical WNBA player lose money in that deal?

I4NRulez posted...

They want a similar revenue percentage that the NBA players get. Not the same amount of money.

And that is utter insanity. In order to do that they would need to fire basically all stadium staff, all support staff, maybe even all coaching staff. In order for them to get 51% of revenue they would bankrupt the league.


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Questionmarktarius posted...

Wouldn't the typical WNBA player lose money in that deal?

whatever money is coming to the players and owners the players get a smaller cut of it.

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I just want to make note that I'm not trying to attack all women's sports, I don't know the details of any other women's sports league but the WNBA.

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BignutzisBack posted...

The NBA subsidizes the WNBA, they haven't made a profit a single year in their entire existence

and the players get a shit cut of it. Just because they are women doesnt mean they need to be taken advantage of

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Here is the only question that matters - how much are the owners and coaches making?

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NoxObscuras posted...

Oh. That's GG then. They negotiated a bad contract and now they want to change it lol. I thought they were just getting shafted.

Yea, most people don't know the details of that particular story which is why ~9 months later stories like in the OP are still uncritically repeating their claim that they are unfairly being paid less.

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I4NRulez posted...

and the players get a shit cut of it. Just because they are women doesnt mean they need to be taken advantage of

Will you stop with your delusional shitposting? The owner of the Minnesota Timberwolves Glen Taylor also owns the Minnesota Lynx. They had a dynasty going about six seven years ago and he still lost money on the WNBA side. There are only a small handful of WNBA owners who turn a profit, the rest of them just use them to market products.

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MedeaLysistrata posted...

what if they made the pay equal by paying them the women's wages

Great idea

Maybe just meet in the middle?

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BignutzisBack posted...

Will you stop with your delusional shitposting? The owner of the Minnesota Timberwolves Glen Taylor also owns the Minnesota Lynx. They had a dynasty going about six seven years ago and he still lost money on the WNBA side. There are only a small handful of WNBA owners who turn a profit, the rest of them just use them to market products.

https://herhoopstats.substack.com/p/wnba-team-values-sale-worth-2021

Additionally, not all WNBA teams are reportedly losing money. Twin Cities Business reported ahead of the 2019 season that the Lynx have been profitable since they started winning per Lynx and Timberwolves CEO Ethan Casson. Back in August 2014, it was reported by Sports Business Daily that the WNBA expects to see at least six of its 12 teams post a profit for 2014, the same number of clubs as last year. With the WNBA rights deal with ESPN improving from roughly $12 million annually in 2013 to about $25 million beginning in 2016 and potentially increasing further in the future, it seems quite reasonable to expect more teams could turn a profit in the coming years.

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Also, lots of NBA teams regularly lose money too, and it's the same situation with owners making the money back by owning, like, the arena they play in


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BignutzisBack posted...

Will you stop with your delusional shitposting? The owner of the Minnesota Timberwolves Glen Taylor also owns the Minnesota Lynx. They had a dynasty going about six seven years ago and he still lost money on the WNBA side. There are only a small handful of WNBA owners who turn a profit, the rest of them just use them to market products.

Well, then they should fold it but they havent. So because of that, the players should get a fair cut of the deal.

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Balrog0 posted...

https://herhoopstats.substack.com/p/wnba-team-values-sale-worth-2021

Additionally, not all WNBA teams are reportedly losing money. Twin Cities Business reported ahead of the 2019 season that the Lynx have been profitable since they started winning per Lynx and Timberwolves CEO Ethan Casson. Back in August 2014, it was reported by Sports Business Daily that the WNBA expects to see at least six of its 12 teams post a profit for 2014, the same number of clubs as last year. With the WNBA rights deal with ESPN improving from roughly $12 million annually in 2013 to about $25 million beginning in 2016 and potentially increasing further in the future, it seems quite reasonable to expect more teams could turn a profit in the coming years.

Well you got me there

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Bad_Mojo posted...

Great idea

Maybe just meet in the middle?

I mean, on the other hand it's good that athletes make a lot of money because some of them reinvest that in communities, so maybe more rich athletes can be good rather just "great, more rich people"

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