Current Events > Why do people always suggest trade labour as if everyone is going to be good

(+) Yeah! (+)

at it. like any skilled position, most people will suck at the job. but no one is ever going to say "don't do trades unless you're super passionate and decent at them", because that goes against received opinion.

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Also not considering the effect of millions of people suddenly trying to become plumbers and welders

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What we should really be doing is employeeing people to rebuild our crumbling infrastructure. (Which, I guess plumbers and electricians would be part of that but thered also be simpler work that anyone could do.)

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Depends on the trade really. Most people can be the kind of carpentry that goes into framing a house. Doesn't mean they can be cabinet builders or hangers. Trades require a wide array of skill levels and talent.

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ScazarMeltex posted...

Depends on the trade really. Most people can be the kind of carpentry that goes into framing a house. Doesn't mean they can be cabinet builders or hangers. Trades require a wide array of skill levels and talent.

Yeah but this seems like kneecapping yourself if you won't ever become decent at the job because it's not suited to the person

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"Don't go to college, get into a trade instead" is really stupid and too many are saying it. High schools push college too heavily and trades should definitely be promoted as an option, but people don't realize that they're being just as destructive when they push it so hard.

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This is just something they say to dumb as shit people and they can't just say "You can't read Timmy, go work at Starbucks and make fat people drinks out of packages. Because that is the most you are capable of."

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MedeaLysistrata posted...

Yeah but this seems like kneecapping yourself if you won't ever become decent at the job because it's not suited to the person

Yes and no. If you like hard physical labor or at least don't mind it, framing houses as a union carpenter is damn good money. You just go into the part of the trade that fits your level of interest and ability. Trades are broader than most people who aren't blue collar workers realize. Electrician is another good example. You could be pulling wires in a new construction or you could be working on a transformer. Different levels of skill or interest.

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ScazarMeltex posted...

Yes and no. If you like hard physical labor or at least don't mind it, framing houses as a union carpenter is damn good money. You just go into the part of the trade that fits your level of interest and ability. Trades are broader than most people who aren't blue collar workers realize. Electrician is another good example. You could be pulling wires in a new construction or you could be working on a transformer. Different levels of skill or interest.

Hm, ok

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Its suggested because the market is over saturated with useless college degrees.

MedeaLysistrata posted...

Yeah but this seems like kneecapping yourself if you won't ever become decent at the job because it's not suited to the person

Except no.

There are many different kinds of carpentry and most people tend to work mainly in a general area... carpenters aren't cabinet makers.

You dont expect a doctor to master every field of their profession do you? Its similar for carpenters.

Just because you're building with wood it doesn't mean it's an aspect of carpentry.

You can make good money exclusively framing. Or doing small renovation.

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ScazarMeltex posted...

Yes and no. If you like hard physical labor or at least don't mind it, framing houses as a union carpenter is damn good money. You just go into the part of the trade that fits your level of interest and ability. Trades are broader than most people who aren't blue collar workers realize. Electrician is another good example. You could be pulling wires in a new construction or you could be working on a transformer. Different levels of skill or interest.

or you could major in finance and work from home in AC and not have to do hard labor while playing games/netflix while working

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JBaLLEN66 posted...

or you could major in finance and work from home in AC and not have to do hard labor while playing games/netflix while working

I'd rather shoot myself than have a desk job. So I'll pass.

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JBaLLEN66 posted...

or you could major in finance and work from home in AC and not have to do hard labor while playing games/netflix while working

i'm an "alt" off the tracks type with mental illness, i wouldn't fit in in a job like that, which is for normies lol

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I dunno if this is typical or how relevant to the topic it is, but my friend tried to get into electrician work and part of his apprenticeship was going out of pocket to take classes. He had like a 3/3 split of work/classes. He ended up quitting and going back to college

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You get good at something by training and experience.

You're gonna suck at the skill until you've developed it.

CanuckCowboy posted...

I'd rather shoot myself than have a desk job. So I'll pass.

Honestly, working remotely has made it way more bearable, idk if I can go back to a corporate hell office

MedeaLysistrata posted...

i'm an "alt" off the tracks type with mental illness, i wouldn't fit in in a job like that, which is for normies lol

ah, corporate america requires a lot of mind games and politics lol

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Balrog0 posted...

I dunno if this is typical or how relevant to the topic it is, but my friend tried to get into electrician work and part of his apprenticeship was going out of pocket to take classes. He had like a 3/3 split of work/classes. He ended up quitting and going back to college

exactly, I think both collar jobs are romanticized, at the end of the day they both have collar at the end of it lol. Do what fits you

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Working from home would be p great for sure.

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CanuckCowboy posted...

Working from home would be p great for sure.

corporate offices are literally hell on earth

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You have to worry about your body breaking down before age 45-50.

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ExtremeLuchador posted...

You have to worry about your body breaking down before age 45-50.

that's if you make it to that age without any work related injuries

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GregShmedley posted...

Typically, a good company (or joining a union) will pay for your schooling. But I'm somewhat surprised seeing as apprenticeship classes are nowhere close to being as expensive as college, especially with what you could be making even during and at the end of your apprenticeship.

He wasn't making very much as an apprentice. He was doing it through the union, too. I think the two big differences were that school would subsidize his education and then the rest of his schedule was as flexible as he wanted it to be. Dude always did a lot of odd jobs (hes been a stagehand, ran a food truck, sold stuff at farmers markets etc).

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Oh yeah, I live in a "right to work" state with very low levels of unionization fwiw. I would bet the infrastructure elsewhere would be better

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Being good at a skilled trade is usually more about repetition than inert skill. Almost everyone is capable of getting good at something by doing it over and over again for years.

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DarkChozoGhost posted...

"Don't go to college, get into a trade instead" is really stupid and too many are saying it. High schools push college too heavily and trades should definitely be promoted as an option, but people don't realize that they're being just as destructive when they push it so hard.

Think it's more of a pushback in the "you're gonna be a loser if you don't go to college" narrative that's been heavily pushed for the past 40 or 50 years

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I've always imagined that trade work pays well because of unions. So I've always found it weird how a good portion of people who hype it up and say it has good pay, are probably those who don't support unions in the first place. But I might be wrong about this
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Solid Snake07 posted...

Think it's more of a pushback in the "you're gonna be a loser if you don't go to college" narrative that's been heavily pushed for the past 40 or 50 years

now it's you probably will be a loser if you get a BA

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Working in a trade requires knowledge but I think more importantly it really takes tolerance towards bullshit

Its not that you cant make it because you cant hammer nails - it really is a matter of whether or not you can stand being dirty, sweaty, lifting heavy things over and over and over and over, hammering things in awkward and frustrating angles, dropping something and going back down the ladder only to get caught in a nail

sometimes you hammer your own thumb and thatll hurt like a mother - your boss will tell you to hurry up carrying huge sheets of sheet rock up 4 floors of timmy ass stairs and then go back down just to do it again

Thats not a skill you can actually learn - you really have to foster that sense of compartmentalizing your own feelings so the day isnt as bad as it is lol

Im studying to be a teacher while I work, and I dont mind it.. I wanna own homes someday and fix em up so its incredibly handy for me to know this stuff

FrankJaegr posted...

Working in a trade requires knowledge but I think more importantly it really takes tolerance towards bullshit

Its not that you cant make it because you cant hammer nails - it really is a matter of whether or not you can stand being dirty, sweaty, lifting heavy things over and over and over and over, hammering things in awkward and frustrating angles, dropping something and going back down the ladder only to get caught in a nail

sometimes you hammer your own thumb and thatll hurt like a mother - your boss will tell you to hurry up caring sheets of sheet rock up 4 floors of cramped stairs and then go back down just to do it again

Thats not a skill you can actually learn - you really have to foster that sense of compartmentalizing your own feelings so the day isnt as bad as it is lol

Im studying to be a teacher while I work, and I dont mind it.. I wanna own homes someday and fix em up so its incredibly handy for me to know this stuff

I'm glad to hear perspectives from the other side, people are listening to youtubers/commentators lol about how great blue collar jobs are

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MedeaLysistrata posted...

now it's you probably will be a loser if you get a BA

I mean there's nothing wrong with going to college. But this culture we've created and enabled where it's viewed as acceptable to go tens of thousands of dollars in debt to get a degree for a job that pays 40k a year is absurd. Or that college is the place to "find yourself". College is an expensive place to find yourself

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KiwiTerraRizing posted...

Also not considering the effect of millions of people suddenly trying to become plumbers and welders

This.

There is no magical solution to a messed up economy that involves individual actions of self improvement or helpful advice. You have to enact direct change collectively, or else everything will stay the same.

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Solid Snake07 posted...

I mean there's nothing wrong with going to college. But this culture we've created and enabled where it's viewed as acceptable to go tens of thousands of dollars in debt to get a degree for a job that pays 40k a year is absurd. Or that college is the place to "find yourself". College is an expensive place to find yourself

If you go to college for the right degree or take precautions then it's not bad. The issue is that people/parents are just hustling 18 year olds in to going to college asap.

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IShall_Run_Amok posted...

This.

There is no magical solution to a messed up economy that involves individual actions of self improvement or helpful advice. You have to enact direct change collectively, or else everything will stay the same.

Lots of people going into the trades would be a collective action

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Balrog0 posted...

Lots of people going into the trades would be a collective action

Sure, and everything would get worse, because now there's way too many people in trades and more competition for work and wages.

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IShall_Run_Amok posted...

Sure, and everything would get worse, because now there's way too many people in trades and more competition for work and wages.

Is this typical for union work? Kind of undermines the idea that collective action is useful if so

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KiwiTerraRizing posted...

Also not considering the effect of millions of people suddenly trying to become plumbers and welders

Unikely. Most people dont want to work outdoor, dirty, and physically demanding jobs. That's why these fields are in demand in the first place.


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IShall_Run_Amok posted...

This.

There is no magical solution to a messed up economy that involves individual actions of self improvement or helpful advice. You have to enact direct change collectively, or else everything will stay the same.

Okay, but the solution to your(not you specifically) individual problem of not being able to find gainful employment can definitely be solved by going into a skilled trade that's in demand

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is it true that trades are a boys club where connections matter?


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MedeaLysistrata posted...

is it true that trades are a boys club where connections matter?

What kind of question is that? Connections matter in any kind of job. If you don't get along with your co-workers you won't get far.

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coolsurfer800 posted...

What kind of question is that? Connections matter in any kind of job. If you don't get along with your co-workers you won't get far.

tfw antisocial

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MedeaLysistrata posted...

is it true that trades are a boys club where connections matter?

I can't think of a profession where connections don't matter

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Solid Snake07 posted...

I can't think of a profession where connections don't matter

dishwasher

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ImAMarvel posted...

Sometimes I worry that I'm fucking myself over by going to college instead of just getting a trade >_>

But fuck me, I'd hate to be a plumber or electrician for the rest of my life, no offense to people who do that kind of thing. They're necessary and respectable jobs for sure but just not for me.

I still maintain that going to college is still a good idea for most people, but there definitely needs to be an overhauling of the way America handles secondary education.

I just saw that you're getting your AA in the new years goal topic, congrats.

Most people that go to college end up totally fine. if you're not a social deviant/square peg, you barely have to worry.

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MedeaLysistrata posted...

tfw antisocial

You don't have to try to be best friends with everyone. Just don't be a dick and do your job and people will respect you.

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coolsurfer800 posted...

You don't have to try to be best friends with everyone. Just don't be a dick and do your job and people will respect you.

i have yet to see you around these parts >_>

rare user

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FrankJaegr posted...

Working in a trade requires knowledge but I think more importantly it really takes tolerance towards bullshit

Its not that you cant make it because you cant hammer nails - it really is a matter of whether or not you can stand being dirty, sweaty, lifting heavy things over and over and over and over, hammering things in awkward and frustrating angles, dropping something and going back down the ladder only to get caught in a nail

sometimes you hammer your own thumb and thatll hurt like a mother - your boss will tell you to hurry up carrying huge sheets of sheet rock up 4 floors of timmy ass stairs and then go back down just to do it again

Thats not a skill you can actually learn - you really have to foster that sense of compartmentalizing your own feelings so the day isnt as bad as it is lol

Im studying to be a teacher while I work, and I dont mind it.. I wanna own homes someday and fix em up so its incredibly handy for me to know this stuff

I feel this post in my soul

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