Current Events > Sweden's Government is presenting their proposed Pandemic Law.

(+) Yeah! (+)

Riksdagen will be called in early from their Christmas break to vote on it next week. The MPs will have 1 week to read through the bill which is a major piece of work.

To summarize:

The bill will grant the Government (our executive power) immense authority currently limited by our Constitution during a pandemic. The Government will be able to bypass the Constitution AND temporarily Riksdagen (our legislative power) itself too (Riksdagen need to approve the Governments actions within 14 days).

The bill will allow the Government to close down all manner of businesses and public buildings and public transportation and public areas like squares and streets. In essence, allow a total lockdown of society which currently is an illegal thing due to Swedes enjoying high freedom of movement in our Constitution.

What worries me is potential future implications of this. And it seems like they will circumvent the two votes in Riksdagen with an election between the two votes requirement to make changes in the Constitution since this bill bypasses the Constitution.

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The bill will give the Government the ability to make it a crime if you dont wear a face mask in public spaces.

We have a minority Government but the bill seems, so far, set to pass with overwhelming majority. Three opposition parties (the Conservatives, the Neoliberals and the Liberals) want the part about economic compensation for businesses if they are forced to close to be fleshed out but that is the only criticism of the bill.

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Good. Its needed to help get this under control, in the interest of public health.

For peace and security.

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I know this is for a good cause, but the conspiracy theorist in me is always thinking whether governments across the world will use their new emergency powers as a tool to stifle meaningful dissent and opposition in the future. Sort of like how the Patriot Act, while its justification was to prevent terror, was used against activists that werent terrorists to limit their rights.

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Giving more power to the government to do what's best is always a good thing, especially in times of extreme danger.

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Kolibri X posted...

Giving more power to the government to do what's best is always a good thing, especially in times of extreme danger.

weird gimmick

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Can you summarize the summary?

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BalanceLost posted...

set to pass with overwhelming majority.

good. swedens handling of covid up until now has been nothing short of embarrassing

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BalanceLost posted...

The bill will give the Government the ability to make it a crime if you dont wear a face mask in public spaces.

what happened to Tegnell going "facemasks don't work, and actually just makes the problem worse"?

have they said "i was wrong" yet?
nevermind, they're government officials, i alreaad know the answer to that

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I wouldn't worry about your government TC unless the corruption runs deep in Sweden that I don't know about, usually I don't hear much bad things happening in Sweden afaik.

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Kaliesto posted...

I wouldn't worry about your government TC unless the corruption runs deep in Sweden that I don't know about, usually I don't hear much bad things happening in Sweden afaik.

tf kind of post is this

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Choco posted...

tf kind of post is this

Reread again, I'm not pretending to know his government despite what people generally say about Sweden, but giving the benefit of the doubt about Sweden's government.

He is worried his government will take this in a wrong direction, but their government AFAIK is not that corrupt unless there is something I don't know about.

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"well personally i don't hear bad things about your country that i know very little about, so you shouldn't be worried (unless there are things i didn't hear about)" ???

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j/w if people are making "our government is a bunch of Nazis for making us wear masks!!" memes now in Sweden?

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ROBANN_88 posted...

what happened to Tegnell going "facemasks don't work, and actually just makes the problem worse"?

have they said "i was wrong" yet?
nevermind, they're government officials, i alreaad know the answer to that

For the non-Swedes: Anders Tegnell is a doctor and our State Epidemiologist. He is a Government official if we use American terminology but not if we use Swedish, then hes a myndighetsmbetsman (Administrative Authority officer). Tegnell was hired during Fredrik Reinfeldts time as PM.

Tegnell seems to be standing by his opinion about face masks. He has nothing to do with this bill. The whole idea with this bill is to increase what is legally possible and to decrease the number of checks on the Government. Our various State Agencies and Authorities have high levels of independence. This is why the Swedish covid-19 response would have been more or less the same regardless of governing party. All 8 parties have supported the response most of 2020 for this reason.

The Government tried to pass a softer version of this bill back in March (remember?) but all 6 opposition parties rejected the bill calling it undemocratic and would only pass a very watered down and toothless version which lasted April-June.

This bill will legalize Ministerial Rule meaning the Government will suddenly be able to tell Tegnell and the Agency of Public Health what to do regardless of whether it is good or bad.

Kaliesto posted...

I wouldn't worry about your government TC unless the corruption runs deep in Sweden that I don't know about, usually I don't hear much bad things happening in Sweden afaik.

Our political system is resistant to corruption and cronyism due to strong checks and balances. Im 100% sure this bill is written with benign intentions but it will set a political precedent that those checks and balances can be disabled because that is exactly what this bill will do. The bill will erase the independence of our Agencies and of our Regional and Municipal assemblies. Hell, it will weaken Riksdagen which is supposed to be the true seat of power in the country. Perhaps this precedent will only be used in times of true crisis like now and my fears will then be unnecessary but who knows what the politicians of tomorrow will be like?

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Wasn't Sweden going full-tilt into the herd immunity strategy? Guessing that didn't work out too well for them.
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Corrupt_Power posted...

Wasn't Sweden going full-tilt into the herd immunity strategy? Guessing that didn't work out too well for them.

The architects of the strategy are being sidelined.

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BalanceLost posted...

Corrupt_Power posted...

Wasn't Sweden going full-tilt into the herd immunity strategy? Guessing that didn't work out too well for them.

The architects of the strategy are being sidelined.

Good.
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Part of Tegnell's arguments against facemasks have always been "it's very tricky to implement in a way that will be effective, and the effects are marginal to none as long as people are social distancing.", which, IMO, doesn't really contradict the govt trying to make it easier to enforce face masks. His seemingly hard-line stance that "facemasks don't work" was always constructed by soundbites taken out of context, wasn't it?

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BalanceLost posted...

The bill will allow the Government to close down all manner of businesses and public buildings and public transportation and public areas like squares and streets.

i would say too extreme on all manner of business but public transportation and public areas like squares are huge risk factors.
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it's about damn time

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scar the 1 posted...

Part of Tegnell's arguments against facemasks have always been "it's very tricky to implement in a way that will be effective, and the effects are marginal to none as long as people are social distancing.", which, IMO, doesn't really contradict the govt trying to make it easier to enforce face masks. His seemingly hard-line stance that "facemasks don't work" was always constructed by soundbites taken out of context, wasn't it?

He has doubled down several times in interviews so this particular stance cannot be explained by soundbites. In an ideal world it would be possible to practice social distancing all the time but many cannot do it and many are on purpose not doing it. My job has directly cited FHM for why we are not given face masks at work for example :/

Questionmarktarius posted...

This is pretty accurate <____<

kingdrake2 posted...

i would say too extreme on all manner of business but public transportation and public areas like squares are huge risk factors.

In the cities many essential workers need public transportation to get to their jobs though so it is a tricky thing.

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BalanceLost posted...

He has doubled down several times in interviews so this particular stance cannot be explained by soundbites. In an ideal world it would be possible to practice social distancing all the time but many cannot do it and many are on purpose not doing it. My job has directly cited FHM for why we are not given face masks at work for example :/

I don't know your employer but I'm not sure I trust them. Then again, you're a lot more insatt than I am

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my brother told me about a coworker who wore a facemask at work was apparantly threatned with docking his pay for the day as it's a "social face job"

i don't know how that turned out, but that gotta be illegal, right?

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David1988 posted...

I know this is for a good cause, but the conspiracy theorist in me is always thinking whether governments across the world will use their new emergency powers as a tool to stifle meaningful dissent and opposition in the future. Sort of like how the Patriot Act, while its justification was to prevent terror, was used against activists that werent terrorists to limit their rights.

Look at what didn't happen in Belarus.
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ROBANN_88 posted...

my brother told me about a coworker who wore a facemask at work was apparantly threatned with docking his pay for the day as it's a "social face job"

i don't know how that turned out, but that gotta be illegal, right?

Yeah that sounds illegal. But if the union in his workplace are pushovers then it might not be so easy to fight

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scar the 1 posted...

I don't know your employer but I'm not sure I trust them. Then again, you're a lot more insatt than I am

Im not gonna name them but Im not working for a private company.

ROBANN_88 posted...

my brother told me about a coworker who wore a facemask at work was apparantly threatned with docking his pay for the day as it's a "social face job"

i don't know how that turned out, but that gotta be illegal, right?

He should definitely contact his union and challenge that decision.

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Chicken posted...

Can you summarize the summary?

Go outside during a pandemic?


Keep your businesses open during a pandemic?


Walk your dog during a pandemic?


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My bf is a driver. And his boss doesnt do anything to protect them. He drices buses and buses with kids going to school and people to dagverksamheter.

I hope this law can force more protection. I dont give a fuck right now if we lose some freedom, I just want this shit to end.

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At this point its either temporarily relinquish all freedoms, or permanently relinquish some freedoms.
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BalanceLost posted...

Im not gonna name them but Im not working for a private company.

The thing I have in mind is that I know that several regions have been antagonistic and defiant of FHM to the point where they've secretly worked against/defied directives, then blamed them afterwards. But since I likely don't know details as well as you, nor do I know if it applies, I'll happily drop it and believe you.

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BalanceLost posted...

He should definitely contact his union and challenge that decision.

Normally, i'd agree.
But it was some guy in another departement under another boss, so he doesn't have the info necessary for it even if he wanted to get involved

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