Poll of the Day > So my cousin is making the case that all cops are bad, period.

(+) Yeah! (+)

This can't be the case, because if that were true then we'd have long-since abolished the police force...

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Aculo posted...

i'm not surprised he's part of your family. do you all get together and regurgitate dumb shit to each other for hours?

Yes, well - on instant messenger.

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This isnt about individual cops. Its about the overall structure of law enforcement and the systematic racism that is baked into it.

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Lokarin posted...

instant messenger

You mean like the AOL variant.
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EclairReturns posted...

You mean like the AOL variant.

facebook

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Mead posted...

This isnt about individual cops. Its about the overall structure of law enforcement and the systematic racism that is baked into it.

I think that was why we were arguing - I can't hold an individual to the responsibility of a group. I know there are good cops and POC cops.

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Mead posted...

overall structure of law enforcement

what needs to change in the structure?

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I believe it was Wanda Sykes who once said, "Want to talk to a corrupt cop? Just call the police station. Doesn't matter who picks up."

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https://i.imgur.com/2ifoIDM.gifv

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Your cousin a criminal or something?


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dvdjedi posted...

https://i.imgur.com/2ifoIDM.gifv

That's one of the arguments I made... I said "Hitler also breaths air, are you gunna just hold your breath forever now" and he just didn't understand what I was saying, and figuratively did continue to hold his breath.

PrettyBoyFloyd posted... Your cousin a criminal or something?

Nah, but he's close with the First Nations community and has been beaten up by cops before.

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Wanded posted...

what needs to change in the structure?

1. Establish an independent inspector body that investigates misconduct or criminal allegations and controls evidence like body camera video. This civilian body will be at the state level, have the ability to investigate and arrest other law enforcement officers (LEOs), and investigate law enforcement agencies.
2. Create a requirement for states to establish board certification with minimum education and training requirements to provide licensing for police. In order to be a LEO, you must possess that license. The inspector body in #1 can revoke the license.
3. Refocus police resources on training & de-escalation instead of purchasing military equipment and require encourage LEOs to be from the community they police.
4. Adopt the absolute necessity doctrine for lethal force as implemented in other states. Use of force is automatically investigated by #1.
5. Codify into law the requirement for police to have positive control over the evidence chain of custody. If the chain of custody is lost for evidence, the investigative body in #1 can hold the LEO/LE liable.

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The majority of cops are cool in my experiences.

BUT...

When they're assholes theyre REAL assholes. Really makes you wonder how they even passed the psych eval.

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1312

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That like saying all angels are good, but there are a few known ones like Satan, Lucifer, Mr. Trump and so on that have fallen from grace.

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I wouldn't agree but there are good points to that argument

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HornedLion posted...

Really makes you wonder how they even passed the psych eval.

Psychopaths know how you want them to present.
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Definitely good people are cops, most of them I'm sure mean well. However all cops are bad because if there were any good cops left, they would have seen the excessive force people are getting are getting away with and demanded they be held accountable or flat out quit.

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ZeldaMutant posted...

1. Establish an independent inspector body that investigates misconduct or criminal allegations and controls evidence like body camera video. This civilian body will be at the state level, have the ability to investigate and arrest other law enforcement officers (LEOs), and investigate law enforcement agencies.
2. Create a requirement for states to establish board certification with minimum education and training requirements to provide licensing for police. In order to be a LEO, you must possess that license. The inspector body in #1 can revoke the license.
3. Refocus police resources on training & de-escalation instead of purchasing military equipment and require encourage LEOs to be from the community they police.
4. Adopt the absolute necessity doctrine for lethal force as implemented in other states. Use of force is automatically investigated by #1.
5. Codify into law the requirement for police to have positive control over the evidence chain of custody. If the chain of custody is lost for evidence, the investigative body in #1 can hold the LEO/LE liable.

That's a lot of nonsense to go through for a job that pays barely $40k/yr.

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Lokarin posted...

I think that was why we were arguing - I can't hold an individual to the responsibility of a group. I know there are good cops and POC cops.

Even Ice T admits there are good cops. The problem is the 'thin blue line' and the mentality of protecting their own above all else. As has been said, if you have 1 bad cop, and 9 good cops who don't act to stop him, you have 10 bad cops.

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PrettyBoyFloyd posted...

Your cousin a criminal or something?

Yeah in all seriousness, most of the fuck da police! people Ive seen IRL are the types of people that do illegal stuff and then try to play the victim when they get busted for it. \_()_/

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DocDelicious posted...

That's a lot of nonsense to go through for a job that pays barely $40k/yr.

Is it? It's not that big a deal and it disincentivises people who join just to abuse their power.
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ZeldaMutant posted...

1. Establish an independent inspector body that investigates misconduct or criminal allegations and controls evidence like body camera video. This civilian body will be at the state level, have the ability to investigate and arrest other law enforcement officers (LEOs), and investigate law enforcement agencies.
2. Create a requirement for states to establish board certification with minimum education and training requirements to provide licensing for police. In order to be a LEO, you must possess that license. The inspector body in #1 can revoke the license.
3. Refocus police resources on training & de-escalation instead of purchasing military equipment and require encourage LEOs to be from the community they police.
4. Adopt the absolute necessity doctrine for lethal force as implemented in other states. Use of force is automatically investigated by #1.
5. Codify into law the requirement for police to have positive control over the evidence chain of custody. If the chain of custody is lost for evidence, the investigative body in #1 can hold the LEO/LE liable.

You actually laid out some solutions. This is very refreshing. Well done.
If I could add to it I would say Ending No-Knock Raids.

DocDelicious posted...

That's a lot of nonsense to go through for a job that pays barely $40k/yr.

More than people's lives?

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rexcrk posted...

Yeah in all seriousness, most of the fuck da police! people Ive seen IRL are the types of people that do illegal stuff and then try to play the victim when they get busted for it. \_()_/

Well definitely the exception here.

I hardly even leave my house, I don't have the energy to do all the legal stuff I want to.

However I also don't think all crimes are equal to the reaction given. Like some dumbass minors went to hang out in an abandoned house and the cops pointed guns at them and handcuffed them. There was like maybe 5 people, and none of them were particularly threatening. No, I wasn't one. I was an adult and not in the building. Across the street from my mom's place.

Please tell me what world it's okay to point guns at dumbass minors for trespassing on an abandoned property?

When I was moving out of an apartment someone called the cops because I made a joke about squatting. I'm guessing since I wasn't loud it was MiL with her usual BS. Cops asked and put their hands on their guns right away, before I had any time to do or say anything. Made sure to draw my attention to it. Keep in mind I'm pretty tiny.

In what world is it okay to threaten a non threatening person over a joke that's not about harming people or property before you even have all the facts?

The police let my ex stepdad trash my mom's house and threaten her. But hey, minors in an abandoned house are worth pulling guns on apparently.

Reasoning behind ACAB is generally laid out at the start of this video:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9b3vDdqY1PA&list=PLZOMlO2_17fsUU0P7njAIGlech8Hn6z2x&index=8&t=0s

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All cops are bad because all cops are complicit

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DocDelicious posted...

That's a lot of nonsense to go through for a job that pays barely $40k/yr.

there are other jobs available if they dont want the responsibility

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So we are all Karening the cops

BeerOnTap posted...

If I could add to it I would say Ending No-Knock Raids.

I've always been confused by the logic behind No-Knock Raids. Law enforcement claims they're to prevent suspects from destroying evidence. I mean if you're trying to stop a dude from flushing an 8-ball down the toilet, you have a point. But is it really necessary to kick in a door over an 8-ball?

Obviously not.

No-Knock Raids when conceived were for large-scale, wholesale operations. You can't flush 20 kilos in the time it takes to batter down a door, so where's the logic used in the justification when they're tossing flashbangs through the windows of the wrong house entirely to get a half ounce of weed?

It's the militarization of the police in the past 20 years that has blown it all out of proportion. The warrior cop mentality. Too many kids that came back from Iraq and Afghanistan with a soldier's mentality that went into the force. Podunk towns of 20k people that have armored personnel carriers and tanks for their fully kitted out SWAT teams.

Police need a Stark reminder that they're public servants and the general public is not the enemy.

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Well the system is corrupt, and police serve the corrupt system.. so even if they are good as people individually, theres an argument to be made that their job position is inherently bad.

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I saw on Twitter earlier that someone at a DC protest yelled "No one ever says 'fuck the firefighters!' Because they do their jobs and actually HELP people!"

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DiScOrD tHe LuNaTiC posted...

I saw on Twitter earlier that someone at a DC protest yelled "No one ever says 'fuck the firefighters!' Because they do their jobs and actually HELP people!"

Lol.

My uncle's worked his way up to detective and he actively calls out the shady and bad cops. I've heard the stories at Christmas (sometimes with video evidence to back it up).

He also does drug busts and stuff but part of the reason he worked so hard to become a detective was to call out the shady cops.

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Final Fantasy2389 posted...

My uncle's worked his way up to detective and he actively calls out the shady and bad cops. I've heard the stories at Christmas (sometimes with video evidence to back it up).

He also does drug busts and stuff but part of the reason he worked so hard to become a detective was to call out the shady cops.

Oh yeah, I am sure there are no bad cops at your uncle's station. /sarcasm

JTekashiro posted...

Oh yeah, I am sure there are no bad cops at your uncle's station. /sarcasm

Did I say that? Tell me where I said that. I said he actively calls them out. I never said there weren't any anymore.

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