Current Events > Democratic Primary #8

(+) Yeah! (+)

Sleepy Diamond Joe

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Biden impeached day one of his presidency

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Broseph_Stalin posted...

Guy who just started paying attention to the primary yesterday: "i think a bad debate performance could really tank the Biden campaign"

Oh. Thats not what Im saying. I just want to see Biden get danced around by Bernie so moderates can remember that moment when Trump does it to him.

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DezDroppedFreak posted...

Oh. Thats not what Im saying. I just want to see Biden get danced around by Bernie so moderates can remember that moment when Trump does it to him again.

do you only pay attention to politics on a few random days a year or something

If you are a Bernie supporter and Biden wins the primary: Vote Blue!

We cannot bring the kind of change that Bernie has started in this country with a judiciary dominated by Trump-picked regressive judges and a conservative Supreme Court!

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Doe posted...

If you are a Bernie supporter and Biden wins the primary: Vote Blue!

We cannot bring the kind of change that Bernie has started in this country with a judiciary dominated by Trump-picked regressive judges and a conservative Supreme Court!

Wish more Bernie supporters understood this.

Vindictiveness wins you nothing

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Broseph_Stalin posted...

do you only pay attention to politics on a few random days a year or something

Why are you like this
You are arguably the most insufferable person in these threads. You contribute absolutely nothing to any sort of discussion except poorly thought out gotchas with zero basis.

What does wanting to see Biden get embarrassed in a one on one debate with Bernie have to do with what you just said

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But it sure feels good.

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I'd love to get an inside account of Bernie's campaign and what went wrong

They bungled this

Like there's losing, but this is fucking embarrassing

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i mean

against trump, i'll vote for joe

i don't hate joe and i never have

i don't think he best represents me and my beliefs

i don't think he's the future of america

but bernie's campaign in 2020 has been lackluster... a clear ceiling with no ability to build beyond it

i'm forced to concede the people making the electability argument may be correct

bernie clearly isn't animating union workers in the midwest like he did four years ago. was his win in michigan in 2016 really because of his deep connection to union households, or was it just anti-clinton?

meanwhile, florida is going to be a bloodbath for bernie. it's would have been a bloodbath in a general election against trump, too, owing to its massive amount of older voters and cuban exiles, and bernie's positive remarks about castro. whereas biden can probably keep florida in play.

i don't know where the dem party goes from here, but bernie clearly isn't the man who's going to be leading it

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wackyteen posted...

Wish more Bernie supporters understood this.

Vindictiveness wins you nothing

honestly it only really matters in swing states. If you are in a deeply blue or red state, you do have to choice of voting third party because its not like trump is going to suddenly win California or Biden is going to win Alabama

the outcome for those states are known

when the outcome is known, then you can vote for whoever you want

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it'll depend on my mood that day if I feel like it's worth my time to go vote at all

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DezDroppedFreak posted...

Broseph_Stalin posted...
Oh. Thats not what Im saying. I just want to see Biden get danced around by Bernie so moderates can remember that moment when Trump does it to him.

I don't think anybody us doing any dancing on that stage lol

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DezDroppedFreak posted...

You are arguably the most insufferable person in these threads.

Says the guy who wants to watch a debate in a campaign that's already over because Biden might get embarrassed lmao

DezDroppedFreak posted...

You contribute absolutely nothing to any sort of discussion

Literally the opposite of what happens in these topics

Unity is a word that Clintonistas and Bidentimers use to find the best place to plant the dagger in our backs imo

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Doom_Art posted...

I'd love to get an inside account of Bernie's campaign and what went wrong

They bungled this

Like there's losing, but this is fucking embarrassing

I don't think it's that anything went wrong

it's just a lot of people fell for the electability argument and believe Bernie isn't electable vs Trump.

Also Bernie really fucking scares the knickers off of Boomer and Gen X democrats

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Doom_Art posted...

I'd love to get an inside account of Bernie's campaign and what went wrong

They bungled this

Like there's losing, but this is fucking embarrassing

I mean

with the exception of Bloomberg, every moderate candidate dropped before Super Tuesday and rallied behind Biden while the progressive vote was still somewhat divided. Bloomberg followed suit shortly after.

Something went wrong, but I dont think its necessarily within his camp

also yeah certain democrats are absolutely terrified of Bernie

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Mecha Sonic posted...

or was it just anti-clinton?

p much this, if today is any indication

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DezDroppedFreak posted...

I mean

with the exception of Bloomberg, every moderate candidate dropped before Super Tuesday and rallied behind Biden while the progressive vote was still somewhat divided. Bloomberg followed suit shortly after.

Something went wrong, but I dont think its necessarily within his camp

i remember reading that the Bernie camp was surprised that all the moderates consolidated and didnt have much of a counter attack. I think the Bernie camp should have always assumed the moderates were going to consolidate and always have been on the defensive. Perhaps they would have fared better that way. I remember people who worked for Harry Reid who were helping the Bernie campaign were surprised when Reid endorse Biden. But its like you should have seen it coming. Did you really think Harry Reid an establishment democrat was going to go for Bernie?

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Doom_Art posted...

I'd love to get an inside account of Bernie's campaign and what went wrong

They bungled this

Like there's losing, but this is fucking embarrassing

They didn't bungle anything, he never had the support to win this thing. He's just not that popular. His only hope was going into a contested convention with like 30% of the vote because the moderate candidates never dropped out.

i wonder what the older democrats think of people further left than Bernie? Are we the boogeyman to them?

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Something went wrong, but I dont think its necessarily within his camp

Part of it is definitely is in his camp. He chose to have a fuck you; join my movement or piss off attitude with his surrogates because he made the gamble hed get through a crowded field by staying in his lane and thereby get to push his vision as the candidate for 2020. He didnt have plan in place if the field thinned out.

So we're stuck with either 4 more years of Trump which will lead to a disaster, or 4 years of Biden who will be so weak and continue the same policies that frustrated many Americans to begin with that there will be even fiercer backlash over the Dems in 2024. Both party establishments (the same establishment) need to be fucking dragged through the streets.

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Bernie campaign also thought they had Latinos in the bag in places like Texas.

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SwordMaster13X posted...

i remember reading that the Bernie camp was surprised that all the moderates consolidated and didnt have much of a counter attack. I think the Bernie camp should have always assumed the moderates were going to consolidate and always be on the defensive. Perhaps they would have fared better that way

i think their plan was that the moderates would stay in through Super Tuesday and they'd build a decent delegate lead off the back of that.

Then everybody folded and Biden was holding a royal flush while Bernie was holding a Straight

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anyone else not vote for their own self interest? I have a master's degree in a stem subject and make enough money where I never have to worry about it. I also don't need better healthcare, etc. but I vote for bernie cause I care about people who aren't as well off. I want everyone in the country to be well enough off that they don't have to be concerned with third world problems in a first world country. even if it means I lose something and gain nothing out of it myself

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NinjaWarrior455 posted...

So we're stuck with either 4 more years of Trump which will lead to a disaster, or 4 years of Biden who will be so weak and continue the same policies that frustrated many Americans to begin with that there will be even fiercer backlash over the Dems in 2024. Both party establishments (the same establishment) need to be fucking dragged through the streets.

Without Trump I don't know of any big name Republicans that will unite the party quite like Trump has.

Unless one of the Fox News anchors join the political fray

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That guy didnt say the campaign was faultless, calm down

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Doe posted...

Bernie campaign also thought they had Latinos in the bag in places like Texas.

they did a good job with Latinos but everyone except young people not so much


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Sanders I guess aint gonna speak tonight. Smart look for his campaign

CruelBuffalo posted...

Sanders I guess aint gonna speak tonight. Smart look for his campaign

Both campaigns had planned rallies in Cleveland that got canceled due to coronavirus; Biden I think set something up for Philly afterwards.
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Doe posted...

If you are a Bernie supporter and Biden wins the primary: Vote Blue!

We cannot bring the kind of change that Bernie has started in this country with a judiciary dominated by Trump-picked regressive judges and a conservative Supreme Court!

nope! I wanted Bernie and if he doesnt win then Im not voting for anyone. Just like I did last time, didnt wanna vote Hilary.

Antifar posted...

Both campaigns had planned rallies in Cleveland that got canceled due to coronavirus; Biden I think set something up for Philly afterwards.

Well yeah but he could have spoken to cameras briefly like Biden is gonna do. Not sure how you look cute as Sanders right now. Its the footage that is gonna be used for the next 24 hours to compare each other.

DezDroppedFreak posted...

the exception of Bloomberg, every moderate candidate dropped before Super Tuesday and rallied behind Biden while the progressive vote was still somewhat divided. Bloomberg followed suit shortly after.

Something went wrong, but I dont think its necessarily within his camp

Not anticipating that is a tremendous fumble and oversight

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bernie's problems were laid well in advance.

why didn't he remain a democrat after 2016 and try to build bridges with the party establishment? why did he have to go back to being a registered independent?

why did he have to give his own response to the state of the union, undercutting stacey abrams and his currency with black voters?

why didn't he change tactics from being an insurgent bomb-thrower when he was polling in second place and it was clear he actually had a shot at this thing?

i'm not saying joe wouldn't have been a tough matchup, but there are things he could have done differently

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Like did it not occur to them that the other candidates would drop out??

Did they expect everyone running out of money and not winning states would just stay in the race and hang around with their thumbs up their asses?

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https://twitter.com/juliacarmel__/status/1237538353848832000

Ooof. Dont do this lol

Mecha Sonic posted...

bernie's problems were laid well in advance.

why didn't he remain a democrat after 2016 and try to build bridges with the party establishment? why did he have to go back to being a registered independent?

why did he have to give his own response to the state of the union, undercutting stacey abrams and his currency with black voters?

why didn't he change tactics from being an insurgent bomb-thrower when he was polling in second place and it was clear he actually had a shot at this thing?

i'm not saying joe wouldn't have been a tough matchup, but there are things he could have done differently

Because he made the mistake of thinking there is a place for sincerity in American politics.

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CruelBuffalo posted...

https://twitter.com/juliacarmel__/status/1237538353848832000

Ooof. Dont do this lol

It's just such a moronic talking point

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Doom_Art posted...

Like did it not occur to them that the other candidates would drop out??

Did they expect everyone running out of money and not winning states would just stay in the race and hang around with their thumbs up their asses?

I think South Carolina caught everyone by surprise - if Biden doesnt run away with it, Pete and Amy dont drop out and endorse before Super Tuesday, and Biden doesnt build that momentum which then knocks out Bloomberg and Warren. Obviously people were going to drop out, but I dont think anyone could have known it was going to happen that quickly.

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My biggest issue with Bernie is he called himself a socialist despite advocating exactly zero socialist policies and knowing that the branding was toxic. He intentionally shot himself in the foot for no reason. All he had to do is say I want social democracy, the capitalist system you see in many European countries, not socialism, and people would have gotten it and been happy. Instead he just decides to go along with right-wing propaganda and call his non-socialist policies socialist for no gain.

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i actually don't think taking back 'socialism' was a bad strategy.

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ssjevot posted...

My biggest issue with Bernie is he called himself a socialist despite advocating exactly zero socialist policies and knowing that the branding was toxic. He intentionally shot himself in the foot for no reason. All he had to do is say I want social democracy, the capitalist system you see in many European countries, not socialism, and people would have gotten it and been happy. Instead he just decides to go along with right-wing propaganda and call his non-socialist policies socialist for no gain.

If I may cite Pete Buttigieg for a moment, I think Sanders' willingness to adopt and embrace an unpopular label is what endeared him to a lot of voters, who are used to seeing politicians avoid anything that isn't focus grouped for maximum approval. And I don't think it was too toxic in a primary where exit polls showed Democrats preferring socialism to capitalism.

https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/2020-election/live-blog/2020-super-tuesday-live-updates-14-states-hold-primaries-n1146871/ncrd1148651#liveBlogHeader
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MrToothHasYou posted...

I think South Carolina caught everyone by surprise - if Biden doesnt run away with it, Pete and Amy dont drop out and endorse before Super Tuesday, and Biden doesnt build that momentum which then knocks out Bloomberg and Warren. Obviously people were going to drop out, but I dont think anyone could have known it was going to happen that quickly.

I think it's clear that that's the inflection point. Sanders was polling close in South Carolina after Iowa/New Hampshire and had invested moderately in it. He likely felt he would do well enough there and decided to invest in more delegate-rich Super Tuesday states, especially California and Texas. Probably that would have even been a good bet, except Clyburn endorsed Biden and that appears to have had a major impact on the results. You could argue that Bernie should have invested more in the state, but I'm not sure that it would've helped: Clyburn has a unique amount of pull with older black voters there, and old voters were never going to be a good demo for Bernie.
From there, the other establishment candidates quickly coalesced around Biden(it's pretty clear this was coordinated), instantly burnishing his "electability" case, which has long (and quixotically) been among the top considerations of Democratic primary voters, leading to him cleaning up on Super Tuesday. The only endorsement that could have helped Sanders staunch the bleeding was Warren's, but it was witheld, either because she feels aggrieved by him or his supporters, or she calculated it wouldn't do enough and decided not to antagonize Biden.

We're going to see a very...unique campaign from Biden. Even before tonight, they really ramped back next week's debate, and I suspect he won't do more than the occasional public event.

I think if Bernie loses the battle here, he is winning the ideological war. People are in favor of his changes even if they think Biden is the pragmatic choice.

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I think it was not wise for him to thank Sanders supporters. It was dismissive and gonna piss off his hive. He should have thanked them in a way that made it seem like the fight was still on.

ssjevot posted...

My biggest issue with Bernie is he called himself a socialist despite advocating exactly zero socialist policies and knowing that the branding was toxic. He intentionally shot himself in the foot for no reason. All he had to do is say I want social democracy, the capitalist system you see in many European countries, not socialism, and people would have gotten it and been happy. Instead he just decides to go along with right-wing propaganda and call his non-socialist policies socialist for no gain.

I agree with you but the people wouldnt have gotten it. Theyd still try and paint him as a socialist or something of that nature

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