Current Events > Juul CEO, maker of vapes, says DON'T VAPE!

(+) Yeah! (+)

https://amp.businessinsider.com/juul-ceo-dont-vape-long-term-effects-unknown-2019-8

Juul Labs CEO Kevin Burns issued a stark warning to nonsmokers about the company's vaping products.
"Don't vape. Don't use Juul," Juul CEO Kevin Burns told Tony Dokoupil in an interview that aired Thursday on "CBS This Morning."
"Don't start using nicotine if you don't have a preexisting relationship with nicotine," he said. "Don't use the product. You're not our target consumer."

Burns also said it was true that the long-term effects of vaping are unknown.
When asked how he could sell vaping products with no knowledge of the long-term effects, Burns said, "We think we have a product that is legal today, is tested for toxicity, and does not present, you know, a risk based on the guidelines of the category today to the American public."
In response to a question about whether Juul products are toxic, he said, "We do toxicology testing on all of our products."

Rip vape nation

It's because they're HQ'd in San Fran where the city is trying to outlaw selling e-cigarettes and stopping people from manufacturing it in the city.
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I never understood why anyone would even want to start smoking. It seems unpleasant

I get that people are addicted and their body craves it. But I do not understand why they let it get to that point

Zikten posted...

I never understood why anyone would even want to start smoking. It seems unpleasant

I get that people are addicted and their body craves it. But I do not understand why they let it get to that point

A friend they look up to smokes and asks them to smoke with them.

Hahahahaha

Top tier scum.

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Zikten posted...

I never understood why anyone would even want to start smoking. It seems unpleasant

I get that people are addicted and their body craves it. But I do not understand why they let it get to that point

Because nicotine is one of the most addictive things on the planet, and the first few weeks you're smoking cigarettes, at least in my experience, you feel this *extremely* satisfying rush that borderline knocks you out for a few minutes.
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Lol, what bullshit.
If smokers are your target consumer you'd make your stuff taste like tobacco rather than a myriad of sweet flavors packaged in bright, flashy containers with "hip" names plastered all over.
It's quite obvious who their target consumer is and it's as disgusting as 1950's tobacco advertising.
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is it safe to vape without nicotine?
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Hexenherz posted...

Zikten posted...

I never understood why anyone would even want to start smoking. It seems unpleasant

I get that people are addicted and their body craves it. But I do not understand why they let it get to that point

Because nicotine is one of the most addictive things on the planet, and the first few weeks you're smoking cigarettes, at least in my experience, you feel this *extremely* satisfying rush that borderline knocks you out for a few minutes.

Then shortly after smoking barely feels like anything at all and you wonder why you even bother, yet trying to stop causes all sorts of issues. It more just makes you feel "normal" now.
Only time I actually noticed a great feeling was when I was pretty drunk

refmon posted...

is it safe to vape without nicotine?

No

fusespliff posted...

Lol, what bullshit.
If smokers are your target consumer you'd make your stuff taste like tobacco rather than a myriad of sweet flavors packaged in bright, flashy containers with "hip" names plastered all over.
It's quite obvious who their target consumer is and it's as disgusting as 1950's tobacco advertising.

Agreed, but nothing will change until we make scumbags like this pay the price.

FrozenXylophone posted...

refmon posted...

is it safe to vape without nicotine?

No

Why not? I thought it just nicotine that had harmful chemicals
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refmon posted...

FrozenXylophone posted...

refmon posted...

is it safe to vape without nicotine?

No

Why not? I thought it just nicotine that had harmful chemicals

It changes your blood even without nicotine.

FrozenXylophone posted...

It changes your blood even without nicotine.

What? What do you mean "changes your blood"?

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refmon posted...

FrozenXylophone posted...

refmon posted...

is it safe to vape without nicotine?

No

Why not? I thought it just nicotine that had harmful chemicals

Inhaling smoke is always bad for you-- the chemicals just make it worse & more addictive.

fusespliff posted...

Lol, what bullshit.
If smokers are your target consumer you'd make your stuff taste like tobacco rather than a myriad of sweet flavors packaged in bright, flashy containers with "hip" names plastered all over.
It's quite obvious who their target consumer is and it's as disgusting as 1950's tobacco advertising.

They do, 2 out of 8 of their flavors are tobacco flavored, and even private juice companies make tobacco flavors.

But as a smoker who switched to vaping for a while, I definitely very, very strongly preferred the non-tobacco flavors.
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Neo1661 posted...

FrozenXylophone posted...

It changes your blood even without nicotine.

What? What do you mean "changes your blood"?

https://www.sciencealert.com/a-single-vape-could-mess-with-your-blood-vessels-even-without-any-nicotine

FrozenXylophone posted...

https://www.sciencealert.com/a-single-vape-could-mess-with-your-blood-vessels-even-without-any-nicotine

So does tea and coffee/caffeine.

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Neo1661 posted...

FrozenXylophone posted...

https://www.sciencealert.com/a-single-vape-could-mess-with-your-blood-vessels-even-without-any-nicotine

So does tea and coffee/caffeine.

Go ahead and vape then.

People always said vapes being safe was unclear but many didn't listen and companies like this assured they were at the time.

Hexenherz posted...

fusespliff posted...

Lol, what bullshit.
If smokers are your target consumer you'd make your stuff taste like tobacco rather than a myriad of sweet flavors packaged in bright, flashy containers with "hip" names plastered all over.
It's quite obvious who their target consumer is and it's as disgusting as 1950's tobacco advertising.

They do, 2 out of 8 of their flavors are tobacco flavored, and even private juice companies make tobacco flavors.

But as a smoker who switched to vaping for a while, I definitely very, very strongly preferred the non-tobacco flavors.

Okay, I stand corrected on that one. I've only ever been inside a vapeshop once for a few minutes. But the point still stands.
Tobacco products had to remove mascots. Cigs like Black Death are outlawed practically everywhere because the packaging was appealing to edgy teens. Tobacco names are usually simply a surname of those who founded the company.
Right now I'm looking at Vape Wild's site with lovely products like Hannibal Nectar, Strawberry WaterFellon,... all in white bottles with a bright, flashy label.
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FrozenXylophone posted...

Go ahead and vape then.

People always said vapes being safe was unclear but many didn't listen and companies like this assured they were at the time.

Most reputable studies so far show it's vastly safer than cigarettes. Studies that show it's very harmful are BS if you look into them carefully. Here in UK out public health say it's estimated to be 95% safer to vape compared to cigs and could be even higher. Only a complete moron will say it's totally safe because it's not but vastly safer.

Now if you vape very cheap or fake e-liquid from dodgy sites then that's a different story. If you vape with your system in completely the wrong way and don't do what it specifically says that could also potentially have issues associated with it but use it right and it's fine.

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Neo1661 posted...

Most reputable studies so far show it's vastly safer than cigarettes. Studies that show it's very harmful are BS if you look into them carefully. Here in UK out public health say it's estimated to be 95% safer to vape compared to cigs and could be even higher.

Comparing to cigs isn't a high standard.

And saying coffee does the same shows you didn't read the article:

We did expect an effect, but we never thought the effect was as big as what we found," radiologist Felix Wehrli told Wired. "It's not just a little change we detect - it's a major effect."

It's important to note that the sample size here is small. But the findings do suggest that vaping might be damaging to the inner lining of our blood vessels, known as the endothelium.

Endothelial injury is thought to be a key initiating event in the build-up of plaque in our arteries, and even though the vascular inflammation was short-lived and reversible, it suggests there's something more insidious at play. And it has nothing to do with nicotine.

In 2017, a study on mice found just five minutes of vaping can damage blood vessels, causing stiffness and narrowing. A year later, researchers noticed a loss of endothelial cell function in the blood vessels of those people who vaped. In fact, the harmful effects they found were similar to smoking tobacco cigarettes.

These people actually disgust me. They are trying to revive an incredibly harmful, costly, and ugly vice that was on its way to dying. I remember talking to people about vaping in 2014 and how it would rekindle nicotine dependence and would start being marketed as cool and safe to kids. People said that wouldn't happen and that it vapes would primarily be used as anti-smoking products. They said big government shouldn't regulate the obvious problem because it wasn't a problem yet.

Well here we are in 2019 with neon colored, cotton candy flavored vapes and Juul memes circulating among the whole population. Exactly as every rational person predicted. This industry should be straight up regulated out of existence like we should have done with tobacco if the companies weren't so politically and economically powerful.
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UNLESS YOU ALREADY HAVE AN EXISTING RELATIONSHIP WITH NICOTINE

holy misleading topic title. Its been obvious as fuck since vapes were invented that you shouldnt start unless you were already a smoker
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thronedfire2 posted...

UNLESS YOU ALREADY HAVE AN EXISTING RELATIONSHIP WITH NICOTINE

holy misleading topic title. Its been obvious as fuck since vapes were invented that you shouldnt start unless you were already a smoker

Then why did the CEO need to say that?

It is almost as if you are being disingenous.

FrozenXylophone posted...

thronedfire2 posted...

UNLESS YOU ALREADY HAVE AN EXISTING RELATIONSHIP WITH NICOTINE

holy misleading topic title. Its been obvious as fuck since vapes were invented that you shouldnt start unless you were already a smoker

Then why did the CEO need to say that?

It is almost as if you are being disingenous.

Because a lot of people are oblivious to the obvious
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thronedfire2 posted...

UNLESS YOU ALREADY HAVE AN EXISTING RELATIONSHIP WITH NICOTINE

holy misleading topic title. Its been obvious as fuck since vapes were invented that you shouldnt start unless you were already a smoker

Yeah, because 50 year olds who've been smoking 3 decades will instantly drop tobacco when you present them Strawberry WaterFellon with its candy looking packaging.
I mean... fuck...I smoke cigarettes, but you don't see me being oblivious to the fact that tobacco companies don't care about my well-being and would use any vile tactic to get others to smoke their products if they weren't so highly regulated the past few decades.
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I mean, I smoked cigs for 6 years and quit cold turkey and the first Juul pods I bought were pineapple flavor

And theyve had tobacco and menthol flavors since the beginning
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thronedfire2 posted...

I mean, I smoked cigs for 6 years and quit cold turkey and the first Juul pods I bought were pineapple flavor

And theyve had tobacco and menthol flavors since the beginning

And did you do so because you wanted to quit smoking cigs or because the flavor/branding made you want to drop cigs? If the former, it should be quite apparent that the branding isn't designed to appeal to you.
Also switching from cigs to vape =/= quitting cold turkey. That's like a junkie exiting a methadone clinic claiming he went cold turkey.
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fusespliff posted...

If smokers are your target consumer you'd make your stuff taste like tobacco rather than a myriad of sweet flavors packaged in bright, flashy containers with "hip" names plastered all over.

Juul doesn't do that anymore.
Chances are very good we'll find out that this "vape lung" thing is caused by low-quality knockoff products that jumped into the flavored vape market void Juul vacated.

Questionmarktarius posted...

fusespliff posted...

If smokers are your target consumer you'd make your stuff taste like tobacco rather than a myriad of sweet flavors packaged in bright, flashy containers with "hip" names plastered all over.

Juul doesn't do that anymore.
Chances are very good we'll find out that this "vape lung" thing is caused by low-quality knockoff products that jumped into the flavored vape market void Juul vacated.

I'm speaking more in general terms. European here, don't think I've seen a Juul product around these parts. If Juul doesn't do that anymore then I can only surmise they got criticised for it and are now trying to rebrand.
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Neo1661 posted...

Most reputable studies so far show it's vastly safer than cigarettes. Studies that show it's very harmful are BS if you look into them carefully. Here in UK out public health say it's estimated to be 95% safer to vape compared to cigs and could be even higher. Only a complete moron will say it's totally safe because it's not but vastly safer.

Now if you vape very cheap or fake e-liquid from dodgy sites then that's a different story. If you vape with your system in completely the wrong way and don't do what it specifically says that could also potentially have issues associated with it but use it right and it's fine.

Saying vaping is safer than smoking is like saying getting thrown off a deep sea boat is safer than being trapped in a burning building.

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fusespliff posted...

Questionmarktarius posted...

fusespliff posted...

If smokers are your target consumer you'd make your stuff taste like tobacco rather than a myriad of sweet flavors packaged in bright, flashy containers with "hip" names plastered all over.

Juul doesn't do that anymore.
Chances are very good we'll find out that this "vape lung" thing is caused by low-quality knockoff products that jumped into the flavored vape market void Juul vacated.

I'm speaking more in general terms. European here, don't think I've seen a Juul product around these parts. If Juul doesn't do that anymore then I can only surmise they got criticised for it and are now trying to rebrand.

They are desperately trying to rebrand as a sort of "medical device" or something.

I do find it funny that Juul took off when previous brands like Blu and... whatever the other one totally failed. Blu was a shitty quality though - their disposables were fine but the ones designed for long-term use shipped with bum batteries and crap.
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Yeah I had a Blu before the Juul but it was awful. And the pods were more expensive and leaked all the time
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So the lesson here is that there's a market void.
Whichever one is best at pretending to care about highschool kids while not actually doing anything, is going to be the one that runs away with the marketshare.

thronedfire2 posted...

Yeah I had a Blu before the Juul but it was awful. And the pods were more expensive and leaked all the time

I got mine when I was in a class. Tried the disposable one, it worked so great, decided to buy a starter kit and avoid cigarettes right before going on an 8 hour trip out of town for the weekend... bad mistake since the one battery never charged and the other one lasted like an hour max.
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*boat horn*
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Hexenherz posted...

I do find it funny that Juul took off when previous brands like Blu and... whatever the other one totally failed.

That's how competition in open markets is supposed to work: build a better mousetrap, the world will beat a path to your door.

Wasn't the first death linked directly to vaping already active? This might be being published because of that.
I use an e-cig, like Juul, it's a bit safer than vapes with refilling tanks with liquid since it's smaller hits. I assume as long as I don't go crazy I'll either stop or continue at a slower rate.
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LadyVyxx posted...

Hexenherz posted...

Zikten posted...

I never understood why anyone would even want to start smoking. It seems unpleasant

I get that people are addicted and their body craves it. But I do not understand why they let it get to that point

Because nicotine is one of the most addictive things on the planet, and the first few weeks you're smoking cigarettes, at least in my experience, you feel this *extremely* satisfying rush that borderline knocks you out for a few minutes.

Then shortly after smoking barely feels like anything at all and you wonder why you even bother, yet trying to stop causes all sorts of issues. It more just makes you feel "normal" now.
Only time I actually noticed a great feeling was when I was pretty drunk

We have very different experiences with tobacco then.

The only time Ive felt like that is when I smoke way too many in a day (for whatever reason).
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Zikten posted...

I never understood why anyone would even want to start smoking. It seems unpleasant

I get that people are addicted and their body craves it. But I do not understand why they let it get to that point

It's soooooo pleasant lol
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Must be pretty bad if their own ceo is saying that.
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Zeeak4444 posted...

LadyVyxx posted...

Hexenherz posted...

Zikten posted...

I never understood why anyone would even want to start smoking. It seems unpleasant

I get that people are addicted and their body craves it. But I do not understand why they let it get to that point

Because nicotine is one of the most addictive things on the planet, and the first few weeks you're smoking cigarettes, at least in my experience, you feel this *extremely* satisfying rush that borderline knocks you out for a few minutes.

Then shortly after smoking barely feels like anything at all and you wonder why you even bother, yet trying to stop causes all sorts of issues. It more just makes you feel "normal" now.
Only time I actually noticed a great feeling was when I was pretty drunk

We have very different experiences with tobacco then.

The only time Ive felt like that is when I smoke way too many in a day (for whatever reason).

they always used to make me really lightheaded if I smoked when I was drunk. and I always smoked MORE when I was drunk
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thronedfire2 posted...

Zeeak4444 posted...

LadyVyxx posted...

Hexenherz posted...

Zikten posted...

I never understood why anyone would even want to start smoking. It seems unpleasant

I get that people are addicted and their body craves it. But I do not understand why they let it get to that point

Because nicotine is one of the most addictive things on the planet, and the first few weeks you're smoking cigarettes, at least in my experience, you feel this *extremely* satisfying rush that borderline knocks you out for a few minutes.

Then shortly after smoking barely feels like anything at all and you wonder why you even bother, yet trying to stop causes all sorts of issues. It more just makes you feel "normal" now.
Only time I actually noticed a great feeling was when I was pretty drunk

We have very different experiences with tobacco then.

The only time Ive felt like that is when I smoke way too many in a day (for whatever reason).

they always used to make me really lightheaded if I smoked when I was drunk. and I always smoked MORE when I was drunk

Yeah I would always get a headrush and sort of an, I suppose, "high" for a few seconds, then it would go away. This happened for about the first pack of cigarettes I smoked.
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untrustful posted...

Hahahahaha

Top tier scum.

Its a lot more honesty and decent than anything big tobacco ever said tbh.

Least hes not urging people to start it when they didnt smoke.
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Zikten posted...

I never understood why anyone would even want to start smoking. It seems unpleasant

Booze and pot were my gateway drugs to nicotine, there's not much better than a cigarette right after a joint.
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...I wonder how my best friend would feel about this announcement
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