Current Events > detroit become human is so dumb

(+) Yeah! (+)

Dragonblade01 posted...

CyricZ posted...

I'm not saying that games shouldn't be made like this, but I'm interested to hear how you think the gameplay, such as it was, was well-combined with the narrative.

I think having the player interact with the scenes is a great option for helping the player connect with what's happening on screen while, at the same time, providing enough rigidity to developers that they can craft linear narratives on top of it.

It's neither the only option, nor even the "ideal" option for the video game medium. It is, however, a fact that video games can draw from other forms of media on top of layering an interactive experience over it. I recognize that the lack of mechanics-driven challenge is off-putting to some players, and I know that there ways to deliver narrative exclusively through gameplay.

But I think that, insofar as a developer wants to create a linear narrative experience that involves immersion through interaction, I think DBH is a good game to draw inspiration from.

I agree with this. When it comes to choice and consequence DBH is at the top of the pile right now. Even failing certain prompts or failing a gameplay objective leads to different branches of the story. Not even games like Life is Strange or the Telltale games do that.
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SwayM posted...

Lol oh I get it. So a Japanese developer could make the exact same game and yall would eat it up.

Any weird sexual moments, bad voice acting or bad writing? Instantly forgiven if its some anime bullshit.

In case you forgot, someone listed Mass Effect. Doesn't sound Japanese-developed to me.

eston posted...

Nobody goes into an anime game expecting a deep, cinematic experience. David Cage games are trying to be exactly that, so does it not make sense to criticize them in that context when they fail to do what they set out to?

Yeah, it's like an Other M situation as a comparison. I've legitimately seen some defenses toward it asking why the story is heavily criticized when Metroid was never known for story. But it's because Other M actually puts a major focus on the story unlike other Metroid games, so it should get scrutinized.
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My big problem with the idea of "making every choice count" in a game like DBH, Heavy Rain, and B2S is that there are times you are given prompts and cannot interpret them. I'm watching the end of the game right now and Connor can say things to Hank, and there's the just a prompt that says "Hank" and you have no idea what it actually means.

Having your statements and actions (and inactions) mean something is fine, but one has to know the action they're taking when they make a decision. It has to be clear. There's a reason Telltale prompts are more than one word.
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CyricZ posted...

Having your statements and actions (and inactions) mean something is fine, but one has to know the action they're taking when they make a decision. It has to be clear. There's a reason Telltale prompts are more than one word.

Yeah, this is definitely a bit of an issue. I watched a review where at the end he was rooting for Conner to win, a button prompt came up to grab the gun so he thought Conner would grab it, but no Markus did and now Conner's dead.
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CyricZ posted...

My big problem with the idea of "making every choice count" in a game like DBH, Heavy Rain, and B2S is that there are times you are given prompts and cannot interpret them. I'm watching the end of the game right now and Connor can say things to Hank, and there's the just a prompt that says "Hank" and you have no idea what it actually means.

Having your statements and actions (and inactions) mean something is fine, but one has to know the action they're taking when they make a decision. It has to be clear. There's a reason Telltale prompts are more than one word.

To be fair I don't think most of those are major decisions. They're usually just conversations.

But yeah I think this can be an issue in all narrative games that don't show everything you're saying. Even in Telltale and the Bioware games.
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Darmik posted...

To be fair I don't think most of those are major decisions. They're usually just conversations.

But it doesn't matter, because it frustrates you, takes you out of the moment, and now you realize you're playing a video game and no longer immersed.
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Delirious_Beard posted...

woolie fucked this playthrough up so much goddamn

Yeah the LP crashed and burned, but they actually ended up liking it in the end. They consider it far and away the best QD game and say so despite David Cage being involved.

It all would have gone better if Woolie wasn't such a coward.
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Dom dude named David cage
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CyricZ posted...

Delirious_Beard posted...

woolie fucked this playthrough up so much goddamn

Yeah the LP crashed and burned, but they actually ended up liking it in the end. They consider it far and away the best QD game and say so despite David Cage being involved.

It all would have gone better if Woolie wasn't such a coward.

That and Pat flip flopping at the end.

I hope they stream their next playthrough of it like they said they would.
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Sometimes prompts are too vague, but often the reason for that is because they are usually intentions, not consequences. Choices are often framed from the character's perspective. So if the character doesn't know an outcome, the player isn't given that information either.

CyricZ posted...

You entered this topic complaining because David Cage games that "do things different" get over-criticized whereas the usual AAA yearly-release tripe gets a pass. Now you're tying Japanese games that get passes despite their failings.

Actually my point was people criticize AAA games all the time for rehashing a concept that works and barely changing, and not having the balls to try something new. Then games like this come out and all people can do is criticize QD games for being a complete departure from a traditional game.

Further establishing my point that gamers are such hyperbolic, hypocritical goofuses. Criticizing QD game for all the same trappings that a Japanese developer gets away with. You simply don't see the hate for Japanese style games, I honestly never have. Nothing close to what QD games get. People just accept that style of game isn't for them and they move on. They don't carry the hate bandwagon that David Cage does.Look at this topic. Look at yourself.

CyricZ posted...

He has the same tired problems he's had for four games, and with DBH, he's introduced new ones.

First. This, saying he's not doing anything different because he's still making games in his style. So with the vast amount of titles available today, you're really going to sit there and tell me a QD isn't a vast departure from most modern titles? Nonsense. Dude makes one game in his style a Gen. 4 games in 10 years. People who like this style of game have an extreeemely limited pool to choose from. You can't seriously think that an even bigger disparity in the variety of titles in an already niche genre could possibly be a good thing.

Second. This is his and his teams style. They get to make the game they want to make. They don't have to make your game. They don't have to make Telltales style of game. They have had success with their style and they are clearly not stopping anytime soon. Especially considering they're only getting better at it. Some mild internet whining isn't changing the fact the games sell and review fairly well.

You can sit there and criticize them all day. That's fine. It is actually working. I mean, you're reading off the same outdated script that David Cage can't write good games, can't make proper characters, can't go without shoehorning in some nudity, etc.

When Detroit fixes almost all the problems that people had with previous QD games, or makes a genuine attempt to at the very least. Most people would agree it's their best entry yet. And if you're sitting there thinking to yourself "The best turd is still a turd" then this turd ain't for you. That's fine, move on, you're not owed anything here.

CyricZ posted...

he's so stuck up his own ass about being the auteur he thinks he is.

You're looking to one of the few examples of studios who release this genre of game for a very specific style of developer? Or you could just look elsewhere. Why does Kojima need to slap his name and face on everything he does? When was the last time he's shown he can make a cohesive narrative experience? Hasn't stopped people from falling out of their chairs in excitement for Death Stranding. And good for them, it's completely unique and if you like Kojima's style and are excited to see what he can do without the shackles of Konami by all means.

At the end of the fucking day, who cares. You're not buying David Cage, or Hideo Kojima, You're buying their products. If you hate their style, or personality so much you can't get over whose name is on the box (or in HK's case, every 5 minutes in MGSV) then hope and pray someone makes the right game for you.
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CyricZ posted...

Darmik posted...

To be fair I don't think most of those are major decisions. They're usually just conversations.

But it doesn't matter, because it frustrates you, takes you out of the moment, and now you realize you're playing a video game and no longer immersed.

"Sway will remember that"
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Banjo2553 posted...

In case you forgot, someone listed Mass Effect. Doesn't sound Japanese-developed to me.

6/7 games on his list were Japanese examples.

And my point is pretty solid, without all the examples he listed.
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SwayM posted...

Banjo2553 posted...

In case you forgot, someone listed Mass Effect. Doesn't sound Japanese-developed to me.

6/7 games on his list were Japanese examples.

And my point is pretty solid, without all the examples he listed.

Your point isnt solid at all...
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Go head and Rika_Refute it bud.
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It's ok.

detroit: become dumb
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