Board 8 > Well, Symphony of the Night is pretty fantastic.

(+) Yeah! (+)

Got the Mist, Bat, and Wolf forms now and the castle is totally open. Got some really kickass weapons and even got the upgrade for the bat to breathe fire. Man, these areas keep getting more and more intense and I'm loving it. I can see why this game is so beloved.

So in a room underneath the librarian's, you can use the bat to fly up there, but the librarian is stuck in the way and there's no way past him. Is there something I'm missing here or does something happen later that changes this?

I also got my first Familiar -- the Faerie -- and uh, what the heck does it do exactly?
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The spoiler is kind of nice to know ahead of time because I think it isnt obvious how to make it happen. Maybe I am remembering wrong tho.
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Faerie sometimes recovers a bit of health when Alucard's HP is low. Not really that useful even when the Familiar is at a high level.
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As for the floor underneath the librarian:

Using the gravity boots and hitting him from underneath will cause him to drop an HP MAX UP powerup for an additional +5 HP.
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StartTheMachine posted...

Woohoo, just got me that double jump and the castle seems to be opening up a whole lot more. And now I hopefully won't have to do any more of those god awful wolf jumps where you run and time your leap at the last second.

Wolf...jumps?
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You are asking all of these questions and I want to answer them so bad. But I don't want to spoil anything.

But I will comment on this

Dark Silvergun posted...

As for the floor underneath the librarian:

Using the gravity boots and hitting him from underneath will cause him to drop an HP MAX UP powerup for an additional +5 HP.

And other stuff
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Alright, update time! I'm in the underground caverns now and I just beat the succubus disguised as Alucard's mother....that whole exchange was weird. But the fake save portal setup was brilliant. Even though I didn't even come close to dying in the fight, I'm glad I turned around and found the real save portal just a room away.

And man, Alucard looks kickass with this crystal cloak. I love how each of these cloaks actually changes not only his appearance, but the bat transformation appearance (and maybe the other ones) too. Now that's some good detail.

STATS!

Time: 5:52
Level: 23 (EXP 17,131)
HP: 202
MP: 121
HEART: 124

STR: 17+6
CON: 20+12
INT: 19+7
LUCK: 18+6

Whew, that's a lot of SotN for the day but man is this game wonderful. Gonna take a bit of a break but may play some more later. Also happy to see more bosses lately, as that's one area I feel like the DS games are still beating this in. Especially in boss frequency. This game just doesn't have enough!
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LOLIAmAnAlt posted...

StartTheMachine posted...

Woohoo, just got me that double jump and the castle seems to be opening up a whole lot more. And now I hopefully won't have to do any more of those god awful wolf jumps where you run and time your leap at the last second.

Wolf...jumps?

If you run with the wolf (quickly double tap one direction) and then jump, you can clear some pretty huge gaps, long before you're able to get the double jump. Of course, once you get the double jump, it basically nullifies this. Not sure yet whether the wolf has any other uses.
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neonreaper posted...

The spoiler is kind of nice to know ahead of time because I think it isnt obvious how to make it happen. Maybe I am remembering wrong tho.

Yeah. If I hadn't known about the spoiler, I never would have found it.
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Just you wait till you face Legion(Named Granfaloon in this game). They're awesome and disturbing.

StartTheMachine posted...

Aaaand I think I just pulled off a spell I don't have yet in that clock tower. I was going nuts dodging and I accidentally pulled off a...soul steal!? Is this some kind of secret spell or something? Because man Soul Steal is so OP. Slowly but surely getting used to pulling off the ridiculous button combination required to use it. I'd say I'm at about 25% now!

Dont think I saw anyone address this, but essentially, you have all the spells from the start of the game. It just doesnt tell you that. So when you buy them later youre actually just buying the menu option that shows you the button combo, which IIRC opens anyway the first time you use each one.
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StartTheMachine posted...

So how does experience work in this game exactly? Like for every time you kill an enemy a second time, does the experience gained keep halving or something? That's what it's seeming like to me.

I think it's just something like, each enemy type has a level, and the higher level you are compared to that, the less exp you get. If you're way higher level, you'll only get 1 exp.

Also YES the cloaks rule. Bring 'em back!
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StartTheMachine posted...

LOLIAmAnAlt posted...

StartTheMachine posted...

Woohoo, just got me that double jump and the castle seems to be opening up a whole lot more. And now I hopefully won't have to do any more of those god awful wolf jumps where you run and time your leap at the last second.

Wolf...jumps?

If you run with the wolf (quickly double tap one direction) and then jump, you can clear some pretty huge gaps, long before you're able to get the double jump. Of course, once you get the double jump, it basically nullifies this. Not sure yet whether the wolf has any other uses.

I never had to do that lol. I know what it is though.
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Final update for the night! We'll start with current stats:

Time: 7:14
Level 27 (EXP 27,697
HP: 266
MP: 139
HEART: 152

STR: 17+6
CON: 20+12
INT: 19+7
LUCK: 18 +6

(Those last ones are always changing depending on what's equipped, so I probably won't include them again until near or after the endgame/)

Highlights include me whooping up on that Legion boss; though he had another name here, I think he was called Legion in Dawn of Sorrow. Might have been in Aria too. I also got two more familiars, the bat and the demon. The demon just seems to occasionally attack but what exactly does the bat do? Pretty much the same thing?

Aaaand I got a bunch of new wolf powers and am a bit confused. So the Power of Wolf allows me to run super fast, right through weaker enemies if I keep it going, but I have no idea what the Skill of Wolf power does for me -- says it gives wolf form a special attack but so far I I've had no luck figuring it out.

Well thanks in advance for your all's help here, but I'm finally calling it a night! What a wonderful game every bit as deserving as its legacy. Feels great to play a top notch Castlevania for the first time in probably almost a decade.
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StartTheMachine posted...

I have no idea what the Skill of Wolf power does for me -- says it gives wolf form a special attack but so far I I've had no luck figuring it out.

It's a move performed like Card does his spells. Nothing particularly amazing, but if you want to know how to do it, do a Hadouken motion and hit attack in wolf form.
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StartTheMachine posted...

Encountered this really weird room in, I think the chapel, where you can sit down in a chair and this ghost lady appears and just starts sobbing over some great ominous music. Yeah, I have no idea what all that was about.

The only thing to get from the confessional booth is...Grape Juice. Only get it if you care about going for 100% item completion
One of the priests gives you it. Specifically the blue robed one. You keep going in and out of the confessional booth until the priest with the Grape Juice appears.
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GOGZero posted...

One of the priests gives you it. Specifically the blue robed one. You keep going in and out of the confessional booth until the priest with the Grape Juice appears

Be careful, though, since you might just get sharp objects thrown in your face instead.
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GOGZero posted...

StartTheMachine posted...

Encountered this really weird room in, I think the chapel, where you can sit down in a chair and this ghost lady appears and just starts sobbing over some great ominous music. Yeah, I have no idea what all that was about.

The only thing to get from the confessional booth is...Grape Juice. Only get it if you care about going for 100% item completion
One of the priests gives you it. Specifically the blue robed one. You keep going in and out of the confessional booth until the priest with the Grape Juice appears.

Ah, I knew that thing was strangely designed but didn't even realize it was a confessional booth.

That said, that is such a Castlevania thing to do. 100% item completion in these games always was absurd.
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crazygamer999 posted...

GOGZero posted...

One of the priests gives you it. Specifically the blue robed one. You keep going in and out of the confessional booth until the priest with the Grape Juice appears

Be careful, though, since you might just get sharp objects thrown in your face instead.

ftfy
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My bad
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It's just called Grape Juice because of censorship. In the Japanese version, it's wine, which makes a lot more sense to be given by a priest.

Well that was weird!

I didn't get the chance to play the game at all yesterday, booted it up today, and "beat" it in less than 15 minutes! Had no idea that was about to happen and it was honestly very underwhelming. Fooortunately I'm experienced with Castlevania titles and I know how endings in these games really work, so I'm not too concerned.

But yeah, I kind of just walked in the room with Richter Belmont and, while I could tell a boss was coming up, I wasn't expecting it to be a boss that initiated an ending cutscene! (In retrospect, just realized typing this up that the prologue of the game foreshadows this since it's the same area you play in the prologue -- nice touch). And then I got save reset'd and lost the brief amount of progress I did before the boss. Never good game design. Really should have put a save room directly before the Richter fight.

Anyway, just went back to regain that progress: got the Power of Mist upgrade again and this time went right first instead of left and encountered that room with tons and tons of goodies. I think there were two life upgrades, two heart upgrades, and the Ghost familiar. And even better, the huge room before the Richter fight has all these (inexplicably floating in mid air) candles and a few have $400 money bags. Ohhh yeah, time to farm for mula baby.

Oh, and no one still explained to me what the Bat familiar does and now I don't know what the Ghost familiar does either. They have no descriptors, just stats!

Anywho, excited to try and figure out how to get more endings in this game. There are clearly rooms on the map beyond where the Richter fight is, so maybe I use my new extended mist to go right past him? Probably not but hmmm, time to experiment!
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Ah, yes, poor Richter. He almost seems out of character... I wonder why?
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crazygamer999 posted...

Ah, yes, poor Richter. He almost seems out of character... I wonder why?

Ahhh, you may be giving away too much here :P

Very interesting. Also hello hidden button in room before Richter with tons more extra goodies! Thought that was going to be the way to access the rooms after Richter, but nope again. Just more gear. Time to do some more castle exploration!

man do I love me some Metroidvanias. can't say this has topped Dawn of Sorrow for me yet but it's still early and this is one stellar game!
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okay just looked up what exactly the uses of these Familiars are and that is some goddamn essential information

gotta love '90s games not explaining anything

or actually just Castlevania games period
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Always use the devil. He is by far the funnest.
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Corrik posted...

Always use the devil. He is by far the funnest.

But the fairy points out breakable walls! I think I'll alternate mostly between those two :D
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I saw someone mention the second half of the game is more fun than the first. I really, really disagree.
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Both halves are good, I can't pick one over the other.

The bat familiar can be cool if leveled up and you do some things
The demon is important
My favorite familiar however is

But you already beat the game, awesome!
Shame the good ending music is not in your version.
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Man that secret room in the Clock Tower was pure ridiculousness. Can't believe I figured that out on my own! I just knew there had to be a point to those gears and when I heard the "click" sound, well...it clicked! Too bad the rewards were all kind of useless for me at this point.

I just spent the last like 45 minutes organizing my gear. Definitely a super weak aspect of this game. Couldn't they have fixed that up in this XBLA version? Did they change like anything in this version?

Still, perhaps my biggest complaint is the inability to assign your subweapon to anything other than up + attack. It's especially frustrating when you have the cross, and one accidental use of it costs 100 hearts. Bleh.

Okay, onward we go to figure more crazy secrets this game has to offer! Let's see if they can get more cryptic than that Clock Tower one.
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StartTheMachine posted...

Did they change like anything in this version?

They took out the FMVs so the game would fit under what was the 200MB limit on XBLA games at the time.
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wait what

this game had FMVs
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JonThePenguin posted...

StartTheMachine posted...

Did they change like anything in this version?

They took out the FMVs so the game would fit under what was the 200MB limit on XBLA games at the time.

And the ending music.
Which is the worst change ever.
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I mean, 90s game.
Of course it has FMVs
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this opening FMV is great. gonna have to watch all of these on YouTube

and I was a 64 '90s kid so I didn't get to experience much FMV goodness :(
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LOLIAmAnAlt posted...

JonThePenguin posted...

StartTheMachine posted...

Did they change like anything in this version?

They took out the FMVs so the game would fit under what was the 200MB limit on XBLA games at the time.

And the ending music.
Which is the worst change ever.

I forgot about that change. Wasnt it done in a patch sometime after release? Changed to something from Lament of Innocence? Or was it the PSP DXC version that used LoI music for the ending?
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Beat Olrox and explored his quarters. That was a pretty cool fight! One thing I've noticed is the bosses are pretty easy in this game though. I've very rarely died from them, whereas Portrait of Ruins' bosses, in comparison, were ruthless.

And okay someone just go ahead and tell me...is there anything I'm supposed to do to these bells in the bell tower?
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No.

there is something with the gears, however.
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crazygamer999 posted...

No.

there is something with the gears, however.

I already did the gears thing -- read above. And google says that's wrong about the bell tower thing and there's an order I'm supposed to strike them in or something.

E: I think you were confusing the Clock Tower and the Bell Tower, crazygamer. Was in the Clock Tower earlier and already figured out that absurd secret room, as I described in an earlier post. Now I'm messing around in the Bell Tower and -- knowing the devious nature of this game's secrets -- figured there had to be another secret here. Now I just don't know if I should keep using google to figure it out or try to do it on my own like I did in the Clock Tower!
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Nope, no secret with the bell tower afterall. Google mislead me, since I was trying to only partially read the article thus to not spoil how to activate the secret myself...but then the conclusion was that no secret exists. That was a fun time waste!
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for organizing your gear, I believe there is a sort button. maybe square on psx?
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StartTheMachine posted...

I just spent the last like 45 minutes organizing my gear. Definitely a super weak aspect of this game. Couldn't they have fixed that up in this XBLA version? Did they change like anything in this version?

Epyo posted...

for organizing your gear, I believe there is a sort button. maybe square on psx?

Yes.
On the inventory, go to your menu and put the cursor on the Right Hand or Left Hand. Press the Square Button (X Button for 360 Controller). It will open up a Sub Menu where you can quickly organize/look through your equipment by category.
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FINAL STATS UPDATE, before fighting Richter with the Holy Glasses:

Time: 10:10
Level: 27 (EXP: 30,213)
Map: 98.8%
Rooms: 931
Kills: 2,580

HP: 291
MP: 139
Heart: 182

My highest leveled familiar is the Fairy at 19!

Man have I been plowing through this wonderful game today. I was stuck forever trying to figure out how to get past that narrowed spikes section in the Bell Tower (all the way in the upper left of the map). Even after using mist or bat, you wind up stuck: there's a sealed blue door with spikes in front of it that you can't open. I eventually gave up and later found myself at the lower right of the map, right where the spike breaker armor I needed was waiting underwater!

Funny enough, I had so much HP and high defense that I just toughed it out in the ...killer water?... before I got the "Holy Symbol" that gave me immunity to the water. So yeah, that relic was useless by the time I got it, hah!

Went back to the librarian with 40k+ gold and went to town. That Joseph's Cloak in particular is awesome. My customization settings: red all turnt up on the outside, blue all turnt up on the inner lining. Hot damn is it snazzy!

As for the Clock Room stuff, well, that was the only thing I looked up in this game so far, besides information about the familiars. I think I maybe would have actually figured out the Gold + Silver ring stuff, but using the time subweapon in the room to open the upper right side? Yeah...nope! Met up with Maria who gave me the "Holy Glasses" (come on devs you could've come up with a cooler name than that) and, at long last, I await my final battle.

Let's halfway finish this !!
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Okay...this Inverted Castle stuff is my jam. Upside down and mirrored with some brutal enemies, hopefully giving me that classic Castlevania challenge I crave? Yes please. And damn, my Walk Armor is gonna be crazy OP when I'm done exploring this second castle.

if only the achievement page hadn't ruined the surprise, this would've been instant classix

Also, in terms of how I'm feeling about the game as a whole -- I obviously absolutely love it, but it's hard for me to say if I prefer it or Dawn of Sorrow just yet. DoS has a special place in my heart for being my first Castlevania game and my first real Metroidvania outside of Super Metroid. I definitely think DoS had better bosses so far, but atmospherically this probably has the slight edge (of course there's way more to compare and contrast, but these are the things that stick out most for me). It's been over 10 years that I last touched Dawn of Sorrow anyway, and those rose-colored glasses are probably extra rosy, so whatever side I come out on I won't even be certain of its reliability.

A final random aside: I really like how SotN has all these weird PS1-era 3D textures that gives it a unique "moment in gaming history" feel. DoS kiiinda did that too, I think, but the 3D textures were crisper and just not as, you know, overtly PS1.
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Congrats on figuring out to get the barrel guy to blow up the wood.

Oh and as for other cryptic hidden stuff, good luck finding the jewel sword. oh and i can tell you didn't find my favorite sub weapon/familiar.
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StartTheMachine posted...

wait what

this game had FMVs

Whaaaaaaaat?

Anyway, great game -- arguably the best of its genre.
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LOLIAmAnAlt posted...

Congrats on figuring out to get the barrel guy to blow up the wood.

Oh and as for other cryptic hidden stuff, good luck finding the jewel sword. oh and i can tell you didn't find my favorite sub weapon/familiar.

Yeah, luring that skeleton was a real piece of work and I aaalmost thought it wasn't even the right method. Then I finally got it to work. I also know of a fifth familiar, but I figured he/it was in the Inverted Castle. You're telling me he's in the vanilla castle!?

Argh I may have to quest back.

HaRRicH posted...

StartTheMachine posted...

wait what

this game had FMVs

Whaaaaaaaat?

Anyway, great game -- arguably the best of its genre.

Super Metroid is a game that exists, my friend! Purely gameplay-wise, this and other Metroidvanias probably top it, but it's fucking Super Metroid and it is life.
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FINAL TOCCATA INTENSIFIES

Man, this is making me want to play SotN again
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StartTheMachine posted...

Yeah, luring that skeleton was a real piece of work and I aaalmost thought it wasn't even the right method. Then I finally got it to work. I also know of a fifth familiar, but I figured he/it was in the Inverted Castle. You're telling me he's in the vanilla castle!?

Argh I may have to quest back.

Ugh, I have said too much.

But heck, short story time about these items. Read if you want I guess, may be spoilers?

Back in the late 90s a friend and i got the jewel sword on the first play though. But we never knew exactly where we got the thing. We thought we knew where we got it, but no luck. This was a topic of discussion for years, where at times we even thought that our minds were just playing with us and it never existed lol. But a few years later we finally figured it out and it was joyous and it was exactly where we thought all along. Another thing that happened around that same time is when we found the other familiar and that was equally as amazing.

Yes, we kept finding legitimately awesome stuff for years and years after the first playthough. Part of this is why it is one of my top 3 games ever.
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