Board 8 > NBA Stats and Discussion - Where Tanking Happens

(+) Yeah! (+)

ninkendo posted...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BZdik09RGJI" data-time="

still have nightmares

I mean after all the absurd playoff losses the Spurs had they deserved at least one of those

Duncan still has the greatest GW that didn't end up winning the game of all time
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transience posted...

then why weren't they best defense in 05 or 06?

Changes in the handchecking rules. Other teams adjusted better to it hence why they went from "elite all-time defense" to "top yearly defensive team." They realized heavily on their ability to handcheck, especially guards like Lindsey Hunter.
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this is like a contest argument where people throw out excuses to prop up their favourite character

Leon knows
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It's not excuses, you can see how across the board defensive ratings went up thanks to changes in the rules, and it's why the league ultimately became so guard heavy afterwards.

You can argue hypotheticals about what it would have meant for the Pistons, but the stats still say they were playing an unbelievable level defense post-Rasheed trade and there was changes to the rules that affected their style of play.
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they were a great defensive team for the era, yeah. they weren't any better (or worse) than the Spurs though. they weren't robbed of titles -- the Spurs were just a little better.
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The Spurs were a little better after a major change in the rules, yes. You keep discounting that when it was part of what made the Pistons so good and how it affected key defenders. Yes, Spurs had to adjust to the rule changes, too, but they were built better for the post-rule change.

And they still almost won that series against them.

It's like imagine if Golden State suddenly had to deal with the elimination of the three point line.
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that's silly. the Spurs were as handsy as the Pistons. remember Bowen? I will keep discounting that excuse with little to no evidence. the Pistons didn't tumble in defensive metrics or record or anything. (they finished 2004 strong but it's a small sample - their best record was in 06 which was probably a better team than the 04 team)
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The 2006 squad was massively improved offensively but took a slight step backwards defensively, but there offense tended to stagnate in key moments. And Flip Saunders ran the starters into the ground to get those 64 wins.

There's a reason Ben Wallace literally has the greatest single season defensive rating in NBA history in 2004. Which he didn't even win DPotY, thanks for that Ron Artest.
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transcience posted...

this is like a contest argument where people throw out excuses to prop up their favourite character

Leon knows

nobody did it better than me
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Spent some time between Celtics injuries reading about Robinson's 71 point game, which has a fascinating box score imo

https://www.basketball-reference.com/boxscores/199404240LAC.html

The Celtics are currently playing the Pacers without Horford (illness), Jaylen Brown (concussion), Kyrie (left the game at halftime, knee), and Marcus Smart (possible dislocated thumb in the 3rd quarter)

somehow, it is a 2 point game as I type this
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CherryCokes posted...

Spent some time between Celtics injuries reading about Robinson's 71 point game, which has a fascinating box score imo

https://www.basketball-reference.com/boxscores/199404240LAC.html

The Celtics are currently playing the Pacers without Horford (illness), Jaylen Brown (concussion), Kyrie (left the game at halftime, knee), and Marcus Smart (possible dislocated thumb in the 3rd quarter)

somehow, it is a 2 point game as I type this

Keep telling you, man, Brad Stevens is the best coach in the NBA.
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you don't keep telling me shit
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Yes I do, I said he was better that Pop and everyone told me I was wrong.
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get the fuck out of here
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you get the fuck out of here
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TheRock1525 posted...

Yes I do, I said he was better that Pop and everyone told me I was wrong.

I mean
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Brad's got a lot more to work with than Pop right now
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https://streamable.com/9xeu6

this is too good
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transience posted...

https://streamable.com/9xeu6

this is too good

https://streamable.com/cqf9u
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This is unbelievable

https://twitter.com/Steve_OS/status/973016972727382016

Gets 2 Lakers closing out on the strong side wing, plus he pulls his defender away from the lane, then hits Ante Zizic rolling to the basket and the only defensive player within 10 feet of the ball is Isaiah Thomas (Zizic's former teammate twice over, with the Celtics and the Cavs, though they only shared the floor during 1 game), who was presumably guarding someone on the weak side wing

it's not even fair to be able to do that
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CherryCokes posted...

The Celtics are currently playing the Pacers without Horford (illness), Jaylen Brown (concussion), Kyrie (left the game at halftime, knee), and Marcus Smart (possible dislocated thumb in the 3rd quarter)

add in: Theis is having an MRI on his knee in the morning after hurting it in the closing moments of the game
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kyrie might as well just get his minor knee surgery now. i don't want what happened to IT to happen to him.

also, stealth-tank to the pacers to try to give them the 3 seed and let lebron get the 4, imo
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don't need to to give the Pacers wins when the Lakers score 98 on the Cavs through 3 quarters
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Thomas and Randle are making the Cavs' March defense look like the Cavs' December defense
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And during the broadcast we get to hear more about the 2004 Pistons.

Just one of those nights!
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I don't know why they put Chauncey in as a color guy.

He doesn't really bring anything to the table
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Man being in the middle of the road makes it hard to move up in the NBA right now

Jazz are 18-2 in the last 20 and went from tenth place to tenth place. Meanwhile the Knicks have gone 1-15 in the last 16 and are still far behind the tank race
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yep. this year is all about maaaaybe 5 teams if you're feeling charitable to the Cavs and the Celtics.
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The Cavs and Pistons both got that temporary high from their trades and then crashed.

Everyone else just didn't bother at the trade deadline.

We're entering a new NBA, it seems.
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transience posted...

yep. this year is all about maaaaybe 5 teams if you're feeling charitable to the Cavs and the Celtics.

if things keep going the way they're going, Cavs will be out in the second round
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the Cavs seem to suck when Lebron puts in a lazy defensive effort. that at least can be remedied somewhat.

I don't know about round 1 or round 3 but it's tough to argue for anyone other than Toronto right now. I could see Boston and Cleveland both losing in round 1.
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I kinda like the star development going on right now though. Embiid, Oladipo, and Karl Anthony Towns all look legit and here to stay.

Every team seems to at least have something going for them and theres a lot of talent in the league, I think its pretty exciting even if the championship seems like itll be an easy Warriors win
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it's good that there seems to be young talent kind of spread around but it doesn't actually seem to be making the league better
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the league seems good to me. there's just a couple of teams with 2 top 10 players that tip the scales.
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I guess it's just the lack of stakes and the lack of any real feeling that any of these teams are going to create any sort of upheaval

I suppose that's what happens after seven straight LeBron finals appearances and 3 straight Cavs/Warriors finals

I'm rooting for the Raptors to finally do something interesting to bust up the monotony
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I'll believe Cleveland losing the east when I see it

literally every year "LeBron's gotta be done! Definitely gonna lose before the finals!!". not a good record for that camp

they still don't have KLove either do they
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transience posted...

the Cavs seem to suck when Lebron puts in a lazy defensive effort. that at least can be remedied somewhat.

I don't know about round 1 or round 3 but it's tough to argue for anyone other than Toronto right now. I could see Boston and Cleveland both losing in round 1.

if the Celtics avoid Cleveland and Toronto and *maybe* Milwaukee, they'll be fine

Health pending, of course :|
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KommunistKoala posted...

I'll believe Cleveland losing the east when I see it

literally every year "LeBron's gotta be done! Definitely gonna lose before the finals!!". not a good record for that camp

they still don't have KLove either do they

yes the return of noted defensive stalwart kevin love will help them not give up 120 to lottery teams
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*shrug* we'll see
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Kevin Love made the most important defensive stop in Cavs history

never forget that
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LeonhartFour posted...

Kevin Love made the most important defensive stop in Cavs history

never forget that

If LeBron doesn't make "The Block" then that play is probably irrelevant
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if Love doesn't make "The Stop" then that play is probably irrelevant

(although really "The Shot" was the most important one let's not kid ourselves)
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Cleveland was up 3. The worst outcome of Kevin Love playing his average defense is a tie game.

Plus, if The Block doesn't happen, Curry isn't looking for a 3 on that play, because the Warriors are almost certainly not down 3 at that point.
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well the worst outcome would be that he fouls Steph on a made 3
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Yeah that's why I said Kevin Love's average defense

On a vast majority of nights Kevin love does a poor job of keeping pace and doesn't bother contesting and it's a semi-open 3 where a foul isn't going to happen because he's not close enough
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Boston is doomed to winning a 7 game series in the first round and the fans have to get all amped up for a game that shouldnt have ever happened.

Pistons exploited rules in excruciating fashion and I would go on about their luck but they beat the Lakers so Im on Rocks side
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cavs losing now means little and none. they're nearly as hurt as the celtics.
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season-ending surgery for daniel theis :(

definitely the best celtics backup big
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best Celtics big not named Al Horford
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oh fucking hell

marcus smart has a torn tendon in his right thumb, out indefinitely
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