Current Events > Girls tell me to show my emotions, but then make fun of and deride men who do

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I've often wondered about this, because I do think it's a problem, although its one that I perpetuate. I think it might be that fundamentally showing emotion, bubbling up in sadness, and openly weeping is looked down upon because it applies an unsolicited burden on people around you. When people cry, those around them seek to comfort them, and women, particularly white women, are told that their burdens SHOULD be socialized.

Men are allowed to cry in extreme cases, but that's because the burden of those things are so extreme and so infrequent that people tolerate them and empathize with them. However, if a man is upset because someone insulted him and went off on how he feels about something, and starts openly weeping at a party, people gonna look at him like wtf dude. Because without realizing it, if you're the person at the party crying, this is a form of communication that other people must deal with, much like loudly talking to yourself on the train places a burden on those around you.

In this society, men who regularly place burdens on other people are considered losers. It doesn't really matter the nature of those burdens, but from a lower order relationship, this seems relatively universal. I see a man crying on the bench alone, and I'm not going near that, because I assume the man wants to be alone.

Now there are exceptions when you're closer. For example, my boy Victor got broken up with his high school sweetheart and there were a lot of tears. Victor is a close friend and I know how much the girl meant to him... so I could understand it. (Our patience wore out after about a month). So you might have a girlfriend or sister who understands your struggles, but that's the emotional codependence of a close relationship.

Men who NEVER cry can generally get away with it once or twice. Men can also cry at movies (wipe them quick tears boyz). But from what I can tell, crying in public lowers your social status so women saying having to be tough is toxic masculinity seems like the best made trap i've ever seen.
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so do you have any advice nk or are you just ranting

When girls tell you that you need to show your emotions, what they mean is that you need to show emotional empathy when THEY'RE showing their emotions. When her boyfriend cheats on her for the 92nd time she doesn't want you to say "Wow, you didn't see that coming?" She wants to hear "Oh I'm so sorry, that must be terrible, how does this make you feel??"
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I added some advice.

My advice. Be strong 100% of the time. Find people specifically that you can be weak around safely. Play the system for what it is, not what it should be. You incur a social cost for breaking norms, unless you are willing to bear the brunt of that social cost (which you probably don't since you're crying already you weak weak man).
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I cry all the time because of the feels. Does that count?
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Yes generally being unstable is rather looked down upon. It's just more acceptable for women to be seen as unstable. Which they embrace for some reason but that's a whole different argument.
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Well I don't agree with your view point of crying. However you do bring up something I find funny. At the same time men get people attacking them for not showing emotions , you have feminist complaining about "fragile male ego".
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Fishy posted...

Yes generally being unstable is rather looked down upon. It's just more acceptable for women to be seen as unstable. Which they embrace for some reason but that's a whole different argument.

Feeling and expressing emotion is far from being unstable.
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NadYobWoc posted...

Feeling and expressing emotion is far from being unstable.

Weeping in public shows a pretty obvious lack of restraint. Of course it's understandable in certain situations but really if a chick sitting across from you on a train suddenly starting uncontrollably weeping there's no doubt you'd be like "wtf."
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Fishy posted...

NadYobWoc posted...

Feeling and expressing emotion is far from being unstable.

Weeping in public shows a pretty obvious lack of restraint. Of course it's understandable in certain situations but really if a chick sitting across from you on a train suddenly starting uncontrollably weeping there's no doubt you'd be like "wtf."

Oh you're referencing that specifically. Yeah I agree.
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yes there is a tension between men being called insensitive, and then being called "fragile" when they show their emotions about a situation

Fishy posted...

Weeping in public shows a pretty obvious lack of restraint. Of course it's understandable in certain situations but really if a chick sitting across from you on a train suddenly starting uncontrollably weeping there's no doubt you'd be like "wtf."

No, I would assume something terrible happened to her (in her perspective) and she probably couldn't hold it in anymore. If I had a tissue, I would offer it to her.
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I see the hypocrisy, but ultimately it's another one of those things where it varies from person to person. Like girl A might see you tearing up at the end of Toy Story 3 and think "wow what a pussy" and girl B might think "omg he is so soulful" or some shit
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This is why I keep basically all my emotions inside even though I know psychologically speaking it's bad for me. There's still a large social stigma towards guys who show their emotions and the last thing any man wants to be considered is a "bitch" or a "pussy"
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Muffinz0rz posted...

I see the hypocrisy, but ultimately it's another one of those things where it varies from person to person. Like girl A might see you tearing up at the end of Toy Story 3 and think "wow what a pussy" and girl B might think "omg he is so soulful" or some shit

The benefit doesn't outweigh the cost.

More people will think you're a bitch than people will look at you in a more positive light. If your goal is to play the odds, then as a man you should come off as sensitive to other people's struggles, and willing to carry the burden of others, but not push your burdens on other people. People KNOW you have emotions, and women will generally like it more if they are hidden from everyone BUT them, because that's an emotional connection.

Crying at movies is an exception (but not really), because that's not a burden. In fact, it emulates the opposite. It means that this man who is crying at Toy Story 3 is able to empathize with other people's distress.

When I say crying, I mean crying for an entirely selfish reason. Your own feelings. You girlfriend left YOU. YOU lost YOUR job. YOU'RE feeling overwhelmed because YOU were embarrassed in public.
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You're so ugly when you cry
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MacadamianNut3 posted...

You're so ugly when you cry

You're so ______ when you eat _____!!!!
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I think most women like guys that can show and discuss emotions, they don't want a guy that gets controlled by his emotions. those type of guys often get to a kind of helpless state, which isn't sexy. its about recognizing your emotions without being controlled by them.
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AdviceMan posted...

Girls tell me to show my emotions, but then make fun of and deride men who do

Same girls?
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Men arent allowed to be vulnerable. This isnt societal, its just life. Watch your girlfriend immediately lose all her attraction to you the one and only time you actually show that you need her
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EnragedSlith posted...

Men arent allowed to be vulnerable. This isnt societal, its just life. Watch your girlfriend immediately lose all her attraction to you the one and only time you actually show that you need her

I'm guessing you think that's the reason couples usually divorce after the death of their child.

The majority of people only think they know what they want.

TheGrindery posted...

EnragedSlith posted...

Men arent allowed to be vulnerable. This isnt societal, its just life. Watch your girlfriend immediately lose all her attraction to you the one and only time you actually show that you need her

I'm guessing you think that's the reason couples usually divorce after the death of their child.

No?
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Laserion posted...

AdviceMan posted...

Girls tell me to show my emotions, but then make fun of and deride men who do

Same girls?

Same girls.

I'm pretty stoic, so I get complaints a lot that I don't seem to care about much. But then I see sensitive guys get made fun of for things that women tell me I should do. Maybe they do it too often, but how often is too often?
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AdviceMan posted...

Laserion posted...

AdviceMan posted...

Girls tell me to show my emotions, but then make fun of and deride men who do

Same girls?

Same girls.

I'm pretty stoic, so I get complaints a lot that I don't seem to care about much. But then I see sensitive guys get made fun of for things that women tell me I should do. Maybe they do it too often, but how often is too often?

Only when it actually matters a lot. Straight women don't want pussies. They've already got one.

AdviceMan posted...

Laserion posted...

AdviceMan posted...

Girls tell me to show my emotions, but then make fun of and deride men who do

Same girls?

Same girls.

I'm pretty stoic, so I get complaints a lot that I don't seem to care about much. But then I see sensitive guys get made fun of for things that women tell me I should do. Maybe they do it too often, but how often is too often?

Its not so much THAT as its that women are, by far, the worst at giving dating advice and have zero idea what theyre attracted to

For instance, so many girls talk about how they dont like buff hard bodies, but goddamn does my buff af coworker make them swoon.

Stoicism is seen as masculine. Vulnerability is not. One is attractive and one isnt. There is a narrow scope of masculine vulnerability, but its like mentioning how that puppy you tried to rescue didnt make it before looking off into the distance. Women like hearing about my paramedic past and the things that stuck with me. Actual feelings are a nogo.
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