Current Events > Why can other free societies like ours survive without guns just fine?

(+) Yeah! (+)

why?
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Because we exist.
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You mean the free societies that went the way of Venezuela or Zimbabwe?
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ban all guns
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https://i.redditmedia.com/EPsaLIstNmvK02eDgNesqqj---mQJGwMlRuYiM9I-nk.jpg?w=1024&s=b6c139886ebb7979884d94bd4f6e5150
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meingott posted...

You mean the free societies that went the way of Venezuela or Zimbabwe?

or you know australia
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There are more guns in the US than ever and our violent crime rate, homicide rates, etc are all dropping lower and lower each year.

I think we're surviving just fine with them.

Microwaved_Eggs posted...

meingott posted...

You mean the free societies that went the way of Venezuela or Zimbabwe?

or you know australia

Not fair, their wildlife makes up for it.
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because they don't have to worry about King George trying to come and stay in their home or something like that.
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dodgefan91 posted...

There are more guns in the US than ever and our violent crime rate, homicide rates, etc are all dropping lower and lower each year.

I think we're surviving just fine with them.

Stop posting facts, otherwise Microwaved_Eggs might explode.
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i support gun rights though
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Because they use knives instead
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im not really on the side where everyone has a fistful of murder implements raised in audacious paranoid fervor above their heads. i dont think i could be counted among those peacefully sitting on the floor with their eyes closed and content half grins trying to pretend that they're not afraid either. there is argument that those places that are doing ok having been built without guns in everyone's hands needed the example of the u.s. before they could. it is also true that for the u.s. to have been born and develop as it has, it needed to have been so the way it was. even with the aspect of right to bare arms true. with things as they are now, is it still the right way to keep things so? ehhhh........ i would say changes of some fashion are in order. it would be a very high and tall way for merka to take examples from places that might have taken them from us, and, in doing so, set another positive one in that.
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Because they have governments that have at least managed to uphold the illusion that they have the people's interests at heart.

I mean if Mr. Rogers wants you to get rid of your guns, you might consider it. But if a three-headed serpent with demon horns and a giant sword with your name written on it wants you to get rid of your guns, you are definitely not going to.
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meingott posted...

You mean the free societies that went the way of Venezuela or Zimbabwe?

no, the ones that aren't total clusterfucks, like every single other civilized nation ON THE PLANET

Microwaved_Eggs posted...

meingott posted...

You mean the free societies that went the way of Venezuela or Zimbabwe?

or you know australia

or the vast majority of the civilized world
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Giant_Aspirin posted...

meingott posted...

You mean the free societies that went the way of Venezuela or Zimbabwe?

no, the ones that aren't total clusterfucks, like every single other civilized nation ON THE PLANET

Microwaved_Eggs posted...

meingott posted...

You mean the free societies that went the way of Venezuela or Zimbabwe?

or you know australia

or the vast majority of the civilized world

You mean like in Nice, France?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2016_Nice_attack

Oh wait a second.
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Why are people so obsessed with solving violence by addressing the legality of the tool and not the culture that leads to it?
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meingott posted...

Giant_Aspirin posted...

meingott posted...

You mean the free societies that went the way of Venezuela or Zimbabwe?

no, the ones that aren't total clusterfucks, like every single other civilized nation ON THE PLANET

Microwaved_Eggs posted...

meingott posted...

You mean the free societies that went the way of Venezuela or Zimbabwe?

or you know australia

or the vast majority of the civilized world

You mean like in Nice, France?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2016_Nice_attack

Oh wait a second.

there are Terrorist attacks in America, too, right?
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Giant_Aspirin posted...

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_firearm-related_death_rate

there are Terrorist attacks in America, too, right?

Yeah, but the point was that those other civilized countries aren't without their pointless deaths and bloodshed despite having strict gun laws. So your initial point was completely unfounded (as usual). There are places in America with a lot of guns that are safer than places in Europe where gun laws are very strict.
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Giant_Aspirin posted...

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_firearm-related_death_rate

there are Terrorist attacks in America, too, right?

Actually they mostly appear to be suicides.
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Anarchy_Juiblex posted...

Giant_Aspirin posted...

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_firearm-related_death_rate

there are Terrorist attacks in America, too, right?

Actually they mostly appear to be suicides.

i didn't mean to leave that wiki link in there, it was unrelated to my post, sorry for the confusion.
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meingott posted...

Giant_Aspirin posted...

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_firearm-related_death_rate

there are Terrorist attacks in America, too, right?

Yeah, but the point was that those other civilized countries aren't without their pointless deaths and bloodshed despite having strict gun laws. So your initial point was completely unfounded (as usual). There are places in America with a lot of guns that are safer than places in Europe where gun laws are very strict.

i can't believe i still actually respond to you in a serious manner in topics like this. you are completely insufferable. with that, this engagement is finished.
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Guns don't promote violent crime. The GINI coefficient does.

Guns just allow you to defend yourself.
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dodgefan91 posted...

There are more guns in the US than ever and our violent crime rate, homicide rates, etc are all dropping lower and lower each year.

I think we're surviving just fine with them.

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Giant_Aspirin posted...

meingott posted...

Giant_Aspirin posted...

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_firearm-related_death_rate

there are Terrorist attacks in America, too, right?

Yeah, but the point was that those other civilized countries aren't without their pointless deaths and bloodshed despite having strict gun laws. So your initial point was completely unfounded (as usual). There are places in America with a lot of guns that are safer than places in Europe where gun laws are very strict.

i can't believe i still actually respond to you in a serious manner in topics like this. you are completely insufferable. with that, this engagement is finished.

"Holy fuck I better save face because I had no idea what I was talking about!11111"
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Also, they're not "free societies".
Many have harsh anti-free speech laws, very little rights to protect yourself, or as comprehensive of economic self determination.
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Anarchy_Juiblex posted...

Many have harsh anti-free speech laws

Like what?
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Are you really that unfamiliar with the censorship in England and Australia, people being arrest for tweets(CA), blasphemy laws, Holocaust denial laws, hate speech laws, etc etc etc.
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Anarchy_Juiblex posted...

Are you really that unfamiliar with the censorship in England and Australia, people being arrest for tweets(CA), blasphemy laws, Holocaust denial laws, hate speech laws, etc etc etc.

You're not the only one, but there's a rather large number of you CEmen that get unreasonably upset when asked to explain what you're talking about. Pretty weird to be posting on a board for discussion just to get upset when asked to discuss something.
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Anarchy_Juiblex posted...

Why are people so obsessed with solving violence by addressing the legality of the tool and not the culture that leads to it?

because that's easier to do?

and there are plenty of common sense gun measures we could pass with proven efficacy (like expanding background checks)

I mean, I don't really disagree with you, but is there any cultural problem we don't solve through jurisprudence rather than... public investments? Education campaigns? What's the alternative you're proposing?

changing "culture" is hard
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Anarchy_Juiblex posted...

Why are people so obsessed with solving violence by addressing the legality of the tool and not the culture that leads to it?

Good question. My guess is that people don't like linking gun violence to culture because that calls for personal accountability and also can be seen as racist. It's easier (and more comfortable) to just blame the tool and do away with it, than to imply that people themselves are the real problem.
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Anarchy_Juiblex posted...

Giant_Aspirin posted...

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_firearm-related_death_rate

there are Terrorist attacks in America, too, right?

Actually they mostly appear to be suicides.

Yeah funny thing that, the majority of gun deaths in the non-Spanish speaking western world don't get reported much at all as they would raise some rather uncomfortable questions about our society. Most of our gun deaths here are suicide, so what does that say about who we really shoot most often here in America?

And OT the other western countries you are looking at have much smaller populations, few firearm companies (business is business), and different views on and methods of social control.

NYmasajista posted...

Yeah funny thing that, the majority of gun deaths in the non-Spanish speaking western world don't get reported much at all as they would raise some rather uncomfortable questions about our society. Most of our gun deaths here are suicide, so what does that say about who we really shoot most often here in America?

https://fivethirtyeight.com/features/gun-deaths/
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