Board 8 > KCF plays Phoenix Wright: Ace Attorney - Spirit of Justice

(+) Yeah! (+)

The wind guard was removed for the Rite of Fire. I knew Part IV of the seance had something to do with the lanterns again, but I got stumped again. I kept thinking that the bird statue had to be seen via lanterns/moonlight, but the game was not having any of it. I kept guessing until I got it right. Apparently, the two times we saw lanterns to Tahrust's right, they were different lanterns.

There were at least three people at the scene. Well no shit.

There's an eyewitness? I'm guessing that if they aren't the culprit, and I highly doubt it given my thoughts about this being a multi-day case, then they will have been at the smaller peak.

This "eyewitness" is the guy with the fake hair/mustache? Oh, he has "amnesia" too? Yeah sure. Japan really likes their amnesiac characters despite it rarely working out well.

Fucking nailed it, he is claiming to have been on the smaller peak. At least I know that I will be using the poster or tent evidence first.
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so much i want to say right now, really excited for impressions
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I like how Nah is leading the witness on what he saw, but Phoenix didn't raise an objection. Then again, if he doesn't understand how the way a bladed weapon is held matters, then I guess I shouldn't be surprised.

If there's one thing that I like about cross-examining this guy so far, it is knowing exactly which statements I need to target. He claims it was a clear and still night, when it was not. That being said, it took several pieces of evidence to give the game what it wanted (Rites Guide).

Impossible to reach the inner sanctum? If the front gate was locked and it is ridiculous to suggest that he climbed his way up there, my only option is to say that he fell from the sky...oh my god, he's the escaped convict Datz isn't he? The prison is above him and looking at the court record, it says that Datz was a former paratrooper. I seem to recall from either the opening video or in a discussion with Ahlbi/Bhe'leeb that he fell/jumped.

Now I see an image of the prison directly above the inner sanctum. I'm sure of this now. I guess I have to play the waiting game to reveal this.
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So the string of sewn-together prayer flags were his makeshift parachute/paraglider. I feel like I am in control of this trial now.

A thought just came to mind. He clearly doesn't have amnesia, so what idiotic escaped convict willingly goes into court to commit perjury?

I'm sure that my anxiousness to reveal him as Datz is playing a major role, but this trial seems to be taking forever. I think that this is the fourth or fifth different testimony of his that I have had to cross-examine (on top of the four times I had to find inconsistencies with the seance). Datz made himself unreliable from the get-go, so get his ass out of here and put him back in prison or something. I don't really care what happens to Khura'in, they brought these problems on themselves.

Something terrible happened and Datz "doesn't remember." Fuck this guy.

It was a calm night, so he is obviously lying about the wind.
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Phoenix doesn't know his true identity, but Nah does. Switchies for one minute?

The game is actually claiming that he temporarily lost his memory and regained it mid-court. There are no words.

I guess this entire debacle was forced into the game just to give Datz the opportunity to say to Nah that he forgot the "will of the dragon," which I have to assume means Nah was/is a member of the Defiant Dragons. Could we have come up with a less insulting way to provide said moment?

How could he POSSIBLY escape from court? No windows were broken and doors are guarded by imposing, rifle-toting bailiffs. I couldn't even tell you the amount of times that I have face-palmed since Datz took the stand.

"Well I can't help but feel that entire episode was an enormous waste of time."
- Judge mind-reading me

Datz dropped part of a piece of paper that conveniently is in the shape of the portion of the blood-soaked piece found at the scene of the crime. As expected, they are instructions from Defiant Dragons.

For my sanity, I stopped after that.
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as you may have noticed DATZ ARE'BAL!

whyyyy you gotta stop

do you do these writeups far after the fact? they seem absurdly fast if you're both typing and playing in real time
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I have no home internet, so I play the game while writing down raw thoughts in a notebook. The next day, I take my laptop and go to the library or Panera, look over the raw thoughts, and see what I can combine and/or refine so that it is (hopefully) more interesting and an idea of what the context was.
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I could use my phone to do live updates, but that would be a huge hassle.

Anyway, I progressed some but hit a wall. I will post tomorrow what I have regardless if I push through or not
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Interesting. That's similar to how I do TV shows - though I take notes on a laptop as opposed to paper. Crazy about the no home internet!
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Nah believes Tahrust is in fact a rebel, which I can only assume means that he must also believe that Maya is the rebel hunter.

Looking at the inner sanctum diagram, there are some odd outlines against the mountain wall. I wonder if those outlines indicate that the bird statue moves or if there are hidden passages within.

Nah now believes that the Lady Kee'ra we saw in the seance was the robes being draped over the statue. Humoring this laughable proposition, I believe that nearly every species of bird has a beak that curves downward, so unless you are next going to propose that the statue was upside down or that Tahrust was running upside down while suspended in the air, Payne should probably be the lead prosecutor on this. There's nothing in the court record to help me prove this though, and I can't re-watch the seance.

Nah is on a roll. In addition to all these, using his own words against him, deluded fantasies, he also thinks Maya is capable of thinking three steps ahead. Ha!
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Maya and Phoenix were found guilty. I guess the game's over now. Thanks for tuning into my playthrough!

A second body was found. I guess I was right in suspecting that a second body would turn up in a case to allow for multiple seances. The bailiff says that the Lady Kee'ra dagger was sticking out, and it has Maya's prints on it.

If the victim was Zeh'lot, I am guessing that he killed Tahrust and Beh'leeb killed Zeh'lot. It doesn't seem likely that they would make a pregnant (have my suspicions if this is true) woman a murder victim.

Is Nah seriously considered to be a great investigator/prosecutor? He partially believes Maya to be the victim since she had access to Tahrust's home, but the letter that was allegedly placed there was planted next to his bed WITH an arrow protruding. There's no way that neither Tahrust nor Beh'leeb would notice it before going to bed, so the rebel hunter has to be Zeh'lot or Beh'leeb. Nah even says that Maya could have unlocked something before leaving, but Beh'leeb said the entire house was locked for sure.
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So right now, I feel that there are two likely scenarios:
1. Zeh'lot is the rebel hunter and killed Tahrust before Beh'leeb killed him. If everyone was so engrossed in prayer, they probably wouldn't have noticed if he left. If those odd outlines I previously mentioned basically give someone access to that area from a different location, that might explain how he got there.

2. Beh'leeb is the rebel hunter and killed both Tahrust and Zeh'lot. If Tahrust was really a rebel, and I will just assume that is true, then it isn't unreasonable to think that given the close relationship between Tahrust and Zeh'lot, both were rebels.

If I had to guess, I'd give #1 the higher likelihood.
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this is by far nahyuta's best moment, imo

i love how suddenly and dramatically that first day ends - you've got this working theory at the end of the seance about a third person that nahyuta never really gets to refute. instead he brings in a witness that he has to know will be completely worthless. you waste an hour debunking datz... and suddenly he drops the hammer that he can explain away your original defense - and time runs out. BOOM.

but yeah, obviously the game continues. <_<
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I got rid of a bunch of evidence, but I see that I still have the Plumed Punisher strap. I do not like this sense of dread coming over me thinking about the possibility of this being the ultimate key to solving the case. If it is, I can only hope they do it in a remotely clever way.

Info dump for the crime scene investigation:
- It appears Zeh'lot died in prayer. Well that kind of hurts my #1 scenario.
- Flowers that express sorrow were left at the scene. It is evidence, so I guess it is important.
- The prayer rug has no bloodstains on it
- Zeh'lot has a peach tattoo on the back of his neck
- The time of death is between the start of the rite and the discovery of Tahrust. I guess that doesn't quite rule him out for Tahrust's death, but it does hurt it some more. I am calling BS that nobody walking around didn't see a knife protruding from him unless that was planted postmortem
- Autopsy "suggests" that he was killed by a bladed weapon (aka maybe not the dagger)

After the discussion that Rayfa and Ema had estimating the time of death, I am under the impression that Zeh'lot's killer might have manipulated stuff to throw off the real time of death. Maybe my Zeh'lot rebel hunter theory is more alive than I thought.
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At Tahrust's house, Rayfa says that Zeh'lot was like a son to Beh'leeb who is just 10 years his senior.

After Phoenix told Beh'leeb that he has faith in Maya, Beh'leeb, while having Tahrust's portrait covering her face, says that "he" will curse Phoenix's family and disciples if Phoenix's faith turns out to be a lie. Phoenix only raised objections toward Athena and Apollo, but he clearly has viewed Trucy as his own daughter across several games. Poor Trucy...

Zeh'lot arrived two years ago when the rebel hunter surfaced. Coincidence?

I do not know if this matters, but since the photo of Beh'leeb, Tahrust, Zeh'lot, and Maya was put into evidence, Zeh'lot is wearing a magatama, and Tahrust is wearing the other one (mihtama?).
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I assume everyone in orange text matters, so they all had a meal called the Feast of Blessings the day before the rite. They ate stuff wit gingihl. You can go three days without sleeping after eating some. It can only be eaten between noon and 3 PM. It has a strong scent that Phoenix thinks might be garlic and mint. I can tell that this will be important in the upcoming seance.

Plaza was iced over the day before the rite.

I got stuck after that. I exhausted all my dialog options and presented all evidence to everyone, so there's something that I am missing via the examine tab. I went everywhere twice and clicked on all viewing angles that I could. I will look up a guide if I can't figure it out tonight.
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I believe AA6 has a Bomber's Notebook-style record you can use. I never got stuck, but presumably it can do something for you.
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It tells me to investigate the second murder, which as you can tell is super specific.
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I had no choice but to look up the solution online. Apparently. there is one prayer flag among a sea of them with checkmarks that I had to investigate at the Plaza of Devotion. It contained what sounded like communication between members of Defiant Dragons.

It mentioned a key, and I wonder if it could be for the inner sanctum gate, Tahrust's house, or something to do with those weird outlines in the inner sanctum. It could also very well be nothing of consequence.

Maya believes that the vigilante is female, and I think that this is the first time that someone narrowed it down to a gender (prosecution believes Maya is the vigilante and not necessarily that it had to be a woman).

Maya brought up (jokingly based on her expression) secret areas in the inner sanctum. I am feeling even better noticing the inner sanctum outlines.
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She has a notebook solely for the eyes of the person with the Lady Kee'ra role, which I want to point out is usually in possession of Bhe'leeb. It contains Lady Kee'ra's real name, which is Ihmsan (means nothing to me right now). She is depicted as holding the dagger differently than how we saw them holding it during the seance. I am more convinced that Beh'leeb would not screw that up and Zeh'lot is the rebel hunter.

I am laughing at the extremely remote possibility that Beh'leeb somehow discovered Zeh'lot was the rebel hunter and killed him because she also discovered he was holding the dagger incorrectly.

I'm trying to grasp the importance of names in this fictional religion, but I guess you need to know the deceased's face and name in order to establish a spiritual connection, which includes spirit channeling.

Rayfa goes on and on about spirits, but I'm guessing that will not be applying until a future case.
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I didn't have a say in this, but I guess that I have to track down Datz despite him clearly not knowing anything about the deaths of Tahrust or Zeh'lot (Phoenix somehow forgot about Datz in the previous trial).

Datz's scent is on the prayer flag, so I guess it wasn't communication between Tahrust and Zeh'lot.

A 40-ish man with back problems goes down a manhole that leads who knows where with a tiny dog. What could possibly go wro...WHAM! Punched by a rebel. Shocker.

Phoenix regains conscious in Dhurke's old law office and is somehow surprised that Dhurke used to be a lawyer despite having already been told this. Here is a photo of Apollo, Nah, and Dhurke 20 years ago, and they were surprisingly upfront about revealing to the player their names. This also renders the entire Datz testimony from the trial completely useless. Thanks Capcom!
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ah yeah, i think phoenix specifically draws attention toward the note in his commentary but if you miss it then it can be rough

hype
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The key mentioned in the prayer flag was for a secret hideout that is probably unrelated to the case but was mentioned in orange, so it will probably matter in a future case.

Datz gave me an orb, which is probably the eye to the bird statue in the inner sanctum, which means I was probably right about the strange outlines.

Now Datz and Phoenix believe that the vigilante is a woman. I am torn as to whether the writers are trying to mislead us or keep making slipups by forgetting to use neutral pronouns.

So this entire rebel vs royalty spat basically boils down to the Defense Culpability Act. I am a little relieved that it isn't as pretentious as I initially feared.

Dhurke probably didn't murder the old queen. I'm guessing it was Inga and/or the current queen, Rayfa will end up having a change of heart, the Defense Culpability Act will be repealed, and blah blah blah. Who knows, maybe it won't be that predictable.

I stopped before checking to see if my hunch about the outlines and the bird statue was correct.
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such an amazing psyche lock - felt like original trilogy stuff
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KCF0107 posted...

This also renders the entire Datz testimony from the trial completely useless. Thanks Capcom

i kind of look back on it fondly but if you look at my spoiler tags pre-trial day, good lors it was frustrating to me the first time. i'd gotten my ass kicked so many times by rayfa's images already
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I unfortunately will not be able to provide an update today. I also have nothing to update on, but that is beside the point!
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will there be one tomorrow though...!
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Should be
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The wall behind the statue does revolve. Hmm, nothing inside this place suggests that it leads to another location. Was the rebel hunter really hiding in this place the entire time? That doesn't seem likely.

People who used this room were Plumed Punisher fans. Beh'leeb led Phoenix to believe that she was only vaguely aware of it while Zeh'lot's interest is unknown.

There's drops of blood as well as a blood smeer on the floor. I also recall Maya mentioning that the water around the statue was already red when she arrived. This highly suggests that someone, likely Zeh'lot, was already killed when Tahrust died. This would mean that Beh'leeb is the prime suspect for both murders.

"If the rebellion happens..."
- Phoenix

I'm pretty sure that it is happening or there wouldn't be rebels.

There is a microphone under the Defiant Dragons banner. It doesn't seem like Defiant Dragons would bug their own place, so I am guessing that the rebel hunter and/or Inga already knew of this hideout and accessed it at some point.
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So I haven't started the trial yet, and I elected not to so I could post some questions/possibilities/theories prior to lawyering.

I don't know if this was always the case, but at 27, I am realizing that there are few, new characters in each case, so the pool of likely culprits is relatively small. However, this case in particular has a lot different angles that makes pinpointing this more difficult than I imagined. These are all kind of randomly ordered, so sorry for any confusion.

- The pool was already red BEFORE Tahrust died, and with Zeh'lot being the only other dead body that we know of, it is likely Zeh'lot's blood.

- That would mean that the person wearing the Lady Kee'ra robes was Beh'leeb, but she is not necessarily Zeh'lot's killer (Tahrust in theory could have). Tahrust kept looking at the sky for Datz, so if he was actually not worried about the threatening letter, that could mean that he killed Zeh'lot if he believed Zeh'lot to be the rebel hunter.

- No matter who the rebel hunter is, why would they kill the Tahrust since the regime wants to imprison them to presumably look good to the public? The seance of Tahrust "attacking" the person wearing the robes was very sad, so the rebel hunter should have had no trouble dispatching them non-lethally.

- Also, if she was the one wearing the robe, why was she holding the dagger in a different position than depicted in the Tome of Secrets? I think that they outright said that she has been portraying Lady Kee'ra during the rites in years past, so why would she disgrace the tradition and religion that she holds so dear (even more of a puzzler if she is in fact the rebel hunter)?

- If she isn't the rebel hunter, why would she kill her own husband? The seance kind of makes it look like Tahrust really stabbed himself since it doesn't appear as if Lady Kee'ra made a stabbing motion, but if that was the case, why didn't she move or yell out to Tahrust? I can understand why she would kill Zeh'lot (he was a rebel hunter or that he converted her husband to be a rebel), but motive for killing Tahrust is kind of lost on me. If she conducted herself differently, I would have thought trying to protect her (alleged) unborn child's future reputation would be a good enough motive. However, she did not destroy the evidence that eventually led to Tahrust being outed as a rebel.

- Based on the timing of his appearance in the lives of the Inmees, Zeh'lot has to be the real rebel hunter or the rebel recruiter that got Tahrust to join up.
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great thoughts, hitting on most of the interesting points to be addressed. hype!
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Heading into the trial, I am leaning toward these "educated" guesses but I am not comfortable with most of them

- Zeh'lot died first, then Tahrust

- Zeh'lot is the rebel hunter

- Tahrust killed Zeh'lot

- Beh'leeb killed Tahrust

I guess that I am still banking on the name puns being ill-fitting and Beh'leeb's expression-less facade to crack.

This might be one of my favorite crimes in the series with all its possibilities. As long as the truth of the matter isn't full of illogical nonsense, this might end up being my favorite case (in spite of the disappointing first trial) in a long time.
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Glad to hear you're enjoying this one.

trial 2 is a good one. all your questions answered, and possible disgruntlement ahead!

(whole game spoilers) similar to kcf i was also really low on the rebellion for 6-1, but it looks like he's turning around on it a little bit, and hopefully he'll enjoy 6-5's take on it - and especially dhurke
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Zeh'lot was killed instantly.

No seance huh? If I understanding communing with spirits correctly, the error has to be that Zeh'lot is not actually died (impossible), he doesn't want to be disturbed (possible), or we don't know his true name/face (mostly likely).

Oh yeah, tattoos are basically IDs in the Khura'inese monk community. His one tattoo is actually two tattoos.

Zeh'lot's real name is Rheel Neh'mu = real name...u? Well, I can start using Rheel now and stop having to do the mid-name apostrophe.
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GOAT name right there
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He became a monk at the age of 1? Is free will not a thing in Khura'in?

He was killed in the hideout, so it should be easy to point out any inconsistencies for the near future. For Rheel to know it is the Plumed Punisher theme, that hurts my he is the rebel hunter theory because that would make it seem that the Plumed Punisher memorabilia in here belongs to him.

Okay, so while I thought this would be a cake walk, I had no idea how to approach the seance. Oh dur, the smell of the gingwhatever meant that it had to be during noon and 3 PM the day before the rite.

Rheel dying before Tahrust is confirmed. 1 for 1. This will not last.
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The ground was frozen that day, so he could not have been looking at the ground, and I know it was the mossy, wobbly stone slab in the hideout.

I would have never guessed that snow was used the keep Rheel cold and throw off the time of death.

Plumed Punisher theme came from the alarm clock. Things are starting to heat up in court.

I assumed that the heavy sensation was like a perception of sound and came from the revolving door. I feel stupid for remember the stone slab was wobbly but not thinking that it was falling on Rheel.

Wait, did Rheel die from the bird statue's beak? Oh, it's feathers were the pointy stuff. Does that make this an accident? It seems like this both kills my Tahrust killed Rheel theory and helps my Rheel is the rebel hunter one as it suggests that he was unfamiliar with the hideout (or he wouldn't mess with a wobbly giant stone slab)
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KCF0107 posted...

I would have never guessed that snow was used the keep Rheel cold and throw off the time of death.

This bugged me. We were told that the way they gauged the time of death was by measuring body temperature, which presumably cools off as the day passes. Seemingly, a colder body should actually appear to be dead for longer. I'd be fine if they didn't delve into details on the autopsy process, but they don't give enough information for this to make sense.
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I am confused on how that slab isn't broken. If someone would have used the revolving door, it should have cracked or something. That suggests someone was in the room at the time and had the strength to pull it back up. Maybe, just maybe my Tahrust killed Rheel theory isn't as dead as I thought.

Oh man, are getting Maya to spirit channel Tahrust? Glorious!

Lol, this is the first time that we have had someone spirit channel a soul from the opposite sex right? I don't know if I can take Tahrust seriously when he looks like this.

He admits to being a rebel and that Beh'leeb was not told of this. I'm not sure if I can take his word for it.

It is odd that Tahrust knew the exact time that Rheel did.
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yessssssss

KCF0107 posted...

Lol, this is the first time that we have had someone spirit channel a soul from the opposite sex right? I don't know if I can take Tahrust seriously when he looks like this.

i hate the foot over shoulder pose SO MUCH

but yeah, this channeling really impressed me. we had literally never even seen a channeling of a non-fey before!
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I ran out of time updating. It will have to wait until tomorrow.
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noooooo
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SeabassDebeste posted...

I'd be fine if they didn't delve into details on the autopsy process, but they don't give enough information for this to make sense.

To be fair, the games always do this. They make several, necessary revelations in the final trial day that you wouldn't realistically be able to come to that conclusion prior to them telling you.

Now time to figure out where I was before the internet was cut off for me.
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So the rebel bugged their own hideout. I guess I can understand the motive for that even though the gate to go to the ultra restricted area that is the inner sanctum should have been locked. How did Rheel get in then?

Tahrust heard a man and woman quarreling. Assuming it didn't have to do with the Plumed Punisher (not that I recall there being a TV), it must be Beh'leeb and Rheel. It is odd that Tahrust wouldn't recognize her voice...unless he is covering for her! Beh'leeb was said to be at the house, but the judge (guest at the house at the time) couldn't confirm her presence. Tahrust is definitely covering for her.

You need to know someone's true face to commune with them, so nice try Tahrust, but Maya couldn't have spirit channeled Lady Kee'ra. That being said, no evidence specifically supports that Maya did not know her face, but I figured the Tome of Secrets would have reached that point in a roundabout way.

While the Tahrust killing Rheel theory is officially dead, Rheel is the rebel hunter, so I am 2 for 3 thus far.
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aw yeah let's go
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I'm guessing that the Plumed Punisher theme from Rheel's seance was actually the Steel Samurai theme after the words "taiko drums" were in orange while Tahrust was talking about what he heard through the microphone. We know that Maya swapped her watch with a Plumed Punisher fan, and how convenient would it be that she never mentioned who it was and it ends up being Beh'leeb? It couldn't be Rheel because of his aforementioned seance. I suppose this means that Beh'leeb is also a rebel.

You know, I never looked at the family photo that closely, but I do see the Steel Samurai watch. I will also admit, that I couldn't tell it was a Steel Samurai watch until they singled it out. I wasn't expecting it to be of just his head.

Tahrust committed suicide? I knew something was up with this
KCF0107 posted...

They are trying to say that he tried to attack/stop the person dressed up as Lady Kee'ra, but even though it makes sense on paper given the letter he received and Maya mentioning that he he kept glancing at the sky, that theory doesn't make sense given the position of his hands

But I didn't put it all together.

2 for 4. I'll take it.
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Tahrust would rather keep the hideout hidden than give his unborn child a life with their father. I like how nobody has yet to bring this up. I am also still bothered that nobody has revealed how Beh'leeb lifted that wobbly stone slab back to its original position.

So it really was a bird statue with the robes draped over it? I feel like that doesn't match up AT ALL with how it looked in the seance. I do remember that Nah brought this possibility up during the first trial.

Judge delayed the trial to call a physician for Tahrust. He's dead, so why should we care? We need to be concerned about Maya's body, not him!

I am increasing that to 2.5 out of 4. Tahrust did tamper with the crime and obstructed the investigation. I am also pretty sure that if he had actually ripped off the robes and threw himself to the ground where he died, we would have seen those sensations on his seance.

Beh'leeb suddenly made the bags under her eyes go away, and she's lost her mind. LOL, Dhurke just casually appeared.

End of Episode 3
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Pros
+ 2nd trial was excellent
+ Poignant toward the end
+ In spite of a con you will see below, this was a predominantly well-crafted set of mysteries
+ I was pleasantly surprised a great number of times throughout the course of the case

Cons
- To put it mildly, I was not a fan of the 1st trial
- I am convinced they violated their own rules when it came to Tahrust's seance
- I wish Beh'leeb had a more of a presence in the case and that they grew out her personality more.

This is easily a Top 5 case in the series for me. The only ones that I can say for certain would make the list are 1-4 (that is the conclusion of DL-6 right?), 2-4 (I think that was the final case), and this.
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