Board 8 > Next Xbox to use Blu-rays, always online required as anti-piracy measure.

(+) Yeah! (+)

They could make it so you can't save the game unless you are online. So if your internet craps out for an hour you just leave the game on until it comes back.

SmartMuffin posted...
From: OmarsComin | #046
as an aside, it takes a few seconds to get to the game on my PS2, and it's even faster on my Genesis

why is it that the further we progress in technology the more nonsense gets in the way of just playing the game
Because the nonsense represents additional profit streams for the console manufacturer.

No it doesn't. The shareholders think it represents extra profit, but these anti-piracy measures always fail and just encourage more piracy.

--
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Because they added a bunch of new features that required a bit more complication, and as it turns out a LOT of people use and like those new features. Stop complaining that you have to wait an extra minute(and not even that), jesus christ some of you people on here act so entitled.

what new features, and what complication is required

because I've been able to play online games since the early 2000s

I hope that's not what you're talking about

as far as "entitled" goes I spent $300 on a 360, and $60 for a year of online. I'm well within justification to complain about stupid stuff that exists for no reason.

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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=npHDxSvwCE0

OmarsComin posted...
Because they added a bunch of new features that required a bit more complication, and as it turns out a LOT of people use and like those new features. Stop complaining that you have to wait an extra minute(and not even that), jesus christ some of you people on here act so entitled.

what new features, and what complication is required

because I've been able to play online games since the early 2000s

I hope that's not what you're talking about

as far as "entitled" goes I spent $300 on a 360, and $60 for a year of online. I'm well within justification to complain about stupid stuff that exists for no reason.

That extra menu enables things like the online store, netflix, movies and music access, personalization, etc etc etc. A LOT of things are possible because of that slight delay.

No, you aren't within justification to whine because you have to wait a minute longer to play. At all. You're acting like a spoiled twit.

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Joyrock
Fresh from my first justified ban. Ever!

That extra menu enables things like the online store, netflix, movies and music access, personalization, etc etc etc. A LOT of things are possible because of that slight delay.

seriously also I dunno about the other systems, but on ps3 you CAN set it up so that it launches the game in the PS3 immediately upon start up

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LordoftheMorons posted...
No it doesn't. The shareholders think it represents extra profit, but these anti-piracy measures always fail and just encourage more piracy.

No, he's referring to feature bloat (the phenomenom by which more advanced things are capable of doing more "stuff" but do the basic stuff more poorly as a tradeoff). Which is fair. It does generate more profit.

Edit: teh grammar, it was bad.

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assert(!hotterThan(foo, "Hot Nymphomaniacal Lesbian Mind-Controlling Dominatrix Fairy Doctors with glasses"))

SlymDayspring posted...
That extra menu enables things like the online store, netflix, movies and music access, personalization, etc etc etc. A LOT of things are possible because of that slight delay.

seriously also I dunno about the other systems, but on ps3 you CAN set it up so that it launches the game in the PS3 immediately upon start up

Preeeeetty sure you can do it on 360. Or at least you used to. I've had it turned off for a while, because I don't always want the game to start straight away.

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oh I see

so now it has pictures on the dashboard that say things like "hulu" and "music" on it

that's why it takes a lot longer to load

that makes sense

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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=npHDxSvwCE0

OmarsComin posted...
oh I see

so now it has pictures on the dashboard that say things like "hulu" and "music" on it

that's why it takes a lot longer to load

that makes sense

It actually does.

And an extra minute is not "a lot longer".

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Joyrock
Fresh from my first justified ban. Ever!

with your full blown erection for making s*** up and defending the dumbest company practices, I have no idea why you aren't fully on the "SFxT is fine guys, stop complaining" train

it seems right up your alley

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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=npHDxSvwCE0

lets get one thing clear here, omarscomin

nobody is blowing joyrocks erection, especially not fully. check your facts.

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I doubt home consoles will ever introduce always-online technology until they have LTE/HSPA radios in them (with something like free use for online validation to play your games and then subscriptions to actually use it).

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Digi
When you stop to think, treadmills are pretty dangerous.

OmarsComin posted...
with your full blown erection for making s*** up and defending the dumbest company practices, I have no idea why you aren't fully on the "SFxT is fine guys, stop complaining" train

it seems right up your alley

Except I've never made things up and I haven't defended any if the dumbest practices out there.

You're literally complaining because you have to wait an extra minute to play your game so they could add a bunch of features that other people use quite frequently, and not just that but you don't want to take the minimal effort to set it to launch your game automatically.

It's like complaining that you have to wait a minute at a red light so other people can go. Such a spoiled little child.

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Joyrock
Fresh from my first justified ban. Ever!

OmarsComin posted...
oh I see

so now it has pictures on the dashboard that say things like "hulu" and "music" on it

that's why it takes a lot longer to load

that makes sense

Well, from a programming perspective:

Making something that can do 20 things, but you know what those 20 things are beforehand is easy.
Making something that can do 10 things, but you DON'T know what those 10 things are beforehand is very hard.
The latter is typically called an operating system.

(now, whether you WANT an operating system for your game console is a different question, but there's no doubt it's a complex problem from almost every perspective and I will not have you trivializing another programmer's work)

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assert(!hotterThan(foo, "Hot Nymphomaniacal Lesbian Mind-Controlling Dominatrix Fairy Doctors with glasses"))

I really don't know why people want their consoles to do anything but play games.

We all have PCs for that.

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From: OmarsComin | #046
as an aside, it takes a few seconds to get to the game on my PS2, and it's even faster on my Genesis

why is it that the further we progress in technology the more nonsense gets in the way of just playing the game

Because our desire to have more stuff happening at the same time on the same device grows faster than our technology can advance.

--
_foolmo_
'You are obviously intelligent and insightful' - Sir Chris about me

All I know is , the newest Xbox dash has made me essentially abandon the console. It's so slow and counter-intuitive. It takes twice as long to get anywhere and do anything, and has a poor, poor way to look through all of your games, especially when you own around 100 arcade titles.

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Digi
I’ve spent my entire life researching the multiples of zero and it has amounted to nothing.

Ayuyu posted...
I really don't know why people want their consoles to do anything but play games.

We all have PCs for that.

No, we don't.

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From: FAHtastic | #068
Ayuyu posted...
I really don't know why people want their consoles to do anything but play games.

We all have PCs for that.

No, we don't.

If your PC can't play music or movies it might be time to change.

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If you really want the game to start automatically, turn on the option of "Start game automatically". It's in the PS3 and 360. >_>

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so I have an idea

what if it loaded the dashboard automatically, then signed you in when it got the chance

then people who want to just play their game can do it. and people who want to use youtube can do it with the exact same wait (or maybe less?) that they would've had before.

I'm not a programmer but it seems like a pretty easy way to add functionality at no real cost

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From: Ayuyu | #069
If your PC can't play music or movies it might be time to change.

This. I've got a toaster that's more than a decade old and it can still do the job. Keep consoles good at their job, which is to be a really good toy. Add multifunctionality once you know it won't impact the core functions.

--
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If you really want the game to start automatically, turn on the option of "Start game automatically". It's in the PS3 and 360. >_>

this has been mentioned a couple times so I'll address it I guess

unless I'm mistaken (let me know if I am) you can't make it automatically boot downloadable games. my 360 is basically a SF3 machine 95% of the time so booting the disc automatically won't help me much. that's one specific situation but with this gen's focus on downloadable games I'm sure there are plenty of other situations where that would be the case.

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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=npHDxSvwCE0

my 360 is basically a SF3 machine 95% of the time

It's time for you to admit that you are using your console in a way that 99% of consumers DON'T and stop demanding special features that cater to your mental deficiency!

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Ayuyu posted...
From: FAHtastic | #068
Ayuyu posted...
I really don't know why people want their consoles to do anything but play games.

We all have PCs for that.

No, we don't.
If your PC can't play music or movies it might be time to change.

No, it can. In fact my laptop is pretty up to date for a change. Normally whenever I buy a PC it's out of date in a few hours.

Doesn't mean I want it to do those things though.

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Still the number one reason for the success of the Internet.
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I wouldn't want to be forced to be online all the time. I have cable internet, but there's only 1 provider in my area for internet and they're pretty bad at times for connection stability.

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Why?

It does it much better than consoles.

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Ayuyu posted...
I really don't know why people want their consoles to do anything but play games.

We all have PCs for that.

It's generally easier and better quality on consoles than on PC, and it's up on the TV instead of a screen, and a lot of people don't have blu-ray players on their PCs.

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Joyrock
Fresh from my first justified ban. Ever!

Breaking News : You can hook-up your PC to a TV screen, more at 11.

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It's time for you to admit that you are using your console in a way that 99% of consumers DON'T and stop demanding special features that cater to your mental deficiency!

two things

1) I don't think this "it takes longer to load because of all the extra functionality!" thing is true. joyrock said it, but we don't have any evidence that that's actually the case.

2) in a world where we have desktop computers, laptops, tablets, and smartphones, you'll have a hard time convincing me that the general customer base is using their video game console as their primary surf the internet/watch youtube or hulu/whatever device. it's the least well suited for those tasks. I suspect it's quite the opposite - that most people just want their console to play games and are annoyed by the fluff but not so annoyed to actually do anything about it.

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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=npHDxSvwCE0

That's not what I meant.

I meant that most people play on-disc games rather than SNES games. And they included an option to go straight to your on-disc game. Your "automatically boot my last played DLC game" option that you seem to want also seems to be catered to a huge minority of gamers.

I guess it'd be nice of them to include that for you, but I can understand why they don't!

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SmartMuffin - Because anything less would be uncivilized - http://img.imgcake.com/smartmuffin/barkleyjpgde.jpg
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You do know the 360 uses a similar OS to Windows right? Are you complaining that it takes time to turn on your computer as well?

Yeah, I don't want to have to be online at all times. Especially since with the way my 360 is, we have to hook it up to my modem, and I can't hook it up to my computer and 360 at the same time. Took us a long time to figure out how to work it in the first place, and we're still not sure how to get our PS3 online.

But we'll see if this is true or not. I'm not sure this would even help prevent piracy tbh.

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From: Ashethan | #083
Yeah, I don't want to have to be online at all times. Especially since with the way my 360 is, we have to hook it up to my modem, and I can't hook it up to my computer and 360 at the same time. Took us a long time to figure out how to work it in the first place, and we're still not sure how to get our PS3 online.

But we'll see if this is true or not. I'm not sure this would even help prevent piracy tbh.

Uh... buy a wire/less router?

Ayuyu posted...
Breaking News : You can hook-up your PC to a TV screen, more at 11.

Yeah but why? If I can watch the same thing on my TV through my Xbox why not just watch it through that and leave my laptop free so I can do work on it while I'm watching TV? I can watch blurays and HD content just fine and then I can work on my fabulous CYOA while I'm at it.

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my PC doesn't have a Verizon FIOS app that lets me use it as a tuner without having a second box in the house.

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to measure the meaning can make you delay
it's time you stopped thinking and wasting the day

You do know the 360 uses a similar OS to Windows right? Are you complaining that it takes time to turn on your computer as well?

If you're not signed in to an XBL account be default, it actually boots considerably faster. this is specifically a "it won't load the dashboard until it confirms you're online" thing. I assume you people keep misunderstanding me because maybe it doesn't happen to you? maybe you all have super speed internet and you're not even aware that this is a thing? but I will vouch that it is a thing. also not just the 360 dashboard, it can happen any time a game feels the need to check something online before taking you past the menu screen.

has anyone here tried using their 360 while someone is downloading something on Steam? that's an obvious way to see what I'm talking about, since Steam tends to hog every inch of bandwidth it can get. there's a lot of stuff that just starts taking a lot longer. you stare at some loading screens for a good long while. this is all a direct result of games that check stuff online (so an analog to our current "must always be online discussion") before starting gameplay.

I'll offer the same example that I did earlier - compare Warcraft 3 to Starcraft 2. In Warcraft 3, you can access all functionality instantly. single player mode, options, custom games. none of those things require a connection to a server to do. the only time you'll have to deal with online stuff is when you want to play online. in Starcraft 2, logging in is the first thing you do. if you have great internet it's just a mild inconvenience. if your internet is in a bad place, it's a nightmare. no matter why you booted Starcraft 2, you're waiting an extra amount of time. from a consumer's point of view, there's no benefit for that. at best it's "not too much worse if at all," at worst "it's pretty awful.

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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=npHDxSvwCE0

in any case this isn't a "the extra functionality takes longer to load" thing like joyrock suggested. this is "we're adding wasted time to your experience by doing online the worst way possible." what we have now is kind of bad if your internet isn't great. the suggested "you must always be connected to the internet" that we started this discussion with would be even worse.

unless we're supposed to believe that games like WC3 or SC1 were just lacking in functionality somehow, there's no great argument in favor of this for consumers. SC2 did not improve our end of the deal in any way. maybe it's great for companies that want piracy to go away forever. I'm skeptical of that too though - you don't sell more games by gimping the paid for version. we already live in a world where pirates get superior versions of single player games on PC.

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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=npHDxSvwCE0

how long do you wait? are we talking like 5-10 minutes and it's because your internet sucks and you're downloading stuff on Steam all the time or whatever?

--
to measure the meaning can make you delay
it's time you stopped thinking and wasting the day

OmarsComin posted...
It's time for you to admit that you are using your console in a way that 99% of consumers DON'T and stop demanding special features that cater to your mental deficiency!

two things

1) I don't think this "it takes longer to load because of all the extra functionality!" thing is true. joyrock said it, but we don't have any evidence that that's actually the case.

2) in a world where we have desktop computers, laptops, tablets, and smartphones, you'll have a hard time convincing me that the general customer base is using their video game console as their primary surf the internet/watch youtube or hulu/whatever device. it's the least well suited for those tasks. I suspect it's quite the opposite - that most people just want their console to play games and are annoyed by the fluff but not so annoyed to actually do anything about it.

It's true whether you believe it or not. Stop whining.

And people use consoles for movies and media, as well as using the online shops to download demos and games, buy DLC, etc etc - that extra minute added a lot of potential functionality.

Breaking News : You can hook-up your PC to a TV screen, more at 11.

You can hook SOME PCs to SOME TVs. Not everyone can do it, and you have to find the right connectors for it. While it's awesome to do gaming in that way, for movies it's generally easier to use your console, be it streaming or DVDs(for those like me who don't have an actual DVD player).

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Joyrock
Fresh from my first justified ban. Ever!

from the time the 360 boot screen ends to the time I get to the dashboard is typically about 30 seconds on an open connection. maybe 2 minutes if my roommates are heavily youtubing or using steam. my guess is that it's exacerbated for me because of where I live and the connection I have. maybe not that much for most people.

but this is basic stuff, like getting to the screen where you get to choose which game you want to play. it doesn't take nearly that long if you're defaulted to a non-XBL profile or if you're signed into an ad-hoc network at bootup.

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OmarsComin posted...
from the time the 360 boot screen ends to the time I get to the dashboard is typically about 30 seconds on an open connection. maybe 2 minutes if my roommates are heavily youtubing or using steam. my guess is that it's exacerbated for me because of where I live and the connection I have. maybe not that much for most people.

but this is basic stuff, like getting to the screen where you get to choose which game you want to play. it doesn't take nearly that long if you're defaulted to a non-XBL profile or if you're signed into an ad-hoc network at bootup.

oh

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to measure the meaning can make you delay
it's time you stopped thinking and wasting the day

2 minutes. A long time.

Pick one.

or say I want to play some SF3 with my real life buddy. on an open connection for that game, you get a loading screen for about 5 seconds before it takes you to the menu screen. on a connection that being used heavily, it's a lot longer. we never wanted to play online in the first place! it's just a screwy decision that I suspect doesn't bother you as much until you deal with it on an extreme fringe. but hey, that's where I come in. I live in Alaska and my internet sucks and I have roommates. I'm in a position where staring at SF3 loading screen for a full minute before I can play some offline versus just feels dumb.

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GranzonEx posted...
2 minutes. A long time.

Pick one.

You have to remember how spoiled he is. If he has to wait a minute or two at a stoplight because other people are going, it's unacceptable.

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Joyrock
Fresh from my first justified ban. Ever!

2 minutes. A long time.

Pick one.

guess how long it takes for me to start up a PS2 game!

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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=npHDxSvwCE0

OmarsComin posted...
2 minutes. A long time.

Pick one.

guess how long it takes for me to start up a PS2 game!

Case in point. Spoiled and entitled.

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Joyrock
Fresh from my first justified ban. Ever!

From: OctilIery | #090
You can hook SOME PCs to SOME TVs

there are seriously people who don't use HDTVs still?

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From: OctilIery | #054
That extra menu enables things like the online store, netflix, movies and music access, personalization, etc etc etc. A LOT of things are possible because of that slight delay.

Uh you could do all that **** on the old dashboard too, and people did, frequently.

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From: OmarsComin | #080
2) in a world where we have desktop computers, laptops, tablets, and smartphones, you'll have a hard time convincing me that the general customer base is using their video game console as their primary surf the internet/watch youtube or hulu/whatever device. it's the least well suited for those tasks. I suspect it's quite the opposite - that most people just want their console to play games and are annoyed by the fluff but not so annoyed to actually do anything about it.

Actually, more people use their 360s (and probably PS3s) for that other stuff - http://latimesblogs.latimes.com/entertainmentnewsbuzz/2012/03/xbox-more-entertainment-gaming-hbo-go-comcast-xfinity-mlb.html

But I do agree, booting up in some games is a pain. You're not spoiled or entitled because you want to get into an EA game quicker but have to wait to connect to a server in order to kill some darkspawn - that's just dumb, but hey, look at who's arguing that point.


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