Board 8 > Wow, Capcom. WOW.

(+) Yeah! (+)

Are we in the Dark Ages of gaming at this point?

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actually the Capcom Dark ages is probably better

there wasn't DLC and locked content back then

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BIGPUN9999 posted...
actually the Capcom Dark ages is probably better

there wasn't DLC and locked content back then

TBQH it wouldn't surprise me if all content in Hyper SF2 had been on the Super Turbo cartridge, just locked.

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96065

What Pun said.


It sucks that amazing games like Twisted Metal sell nothing, yet these cash grabs like SFxT and the new RE game sell millions.

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caps

So what is their latest?

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From: rammtay | #004
What Pun said.


It sucks that amazing games like Twisted Metal sell nothing, yet these cash grabs like SFxT and the new RE game sell millions.

Literally complains about getting free DLC.

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KanzarisKelshen posted...
From: rammtay | #004
What Pun said.


It sucks that amazing games like Twisted Metal sell nothing, yet these cash grabs like SFxT and the new RE game sell millions.
Literally complains about getting free DLC.

Included on the disc != "downloadable" content

Literally buying vanilla Capcom fighting games.

From: Crono801 | #007
Included on the disc != "downloadable" content

Disc-Locked Content

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Crono801 posted...
KanzarisKelshen posted...
From: rammtay | #004
What Pun said.


It sucks that amazing games like Twisted Metal sell nothing, yet these cash grabs like SFxT and the new RE game sell millions.
Literally complains about getting free DLC.

Included on the disc != "downloadable" content

No, on disc DLC is exactly the same as downloadable content, except for where it's stored. There is NOTHING wrong with on disc DLC, so quit whining about it.

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Joyrock
Fresh from my first justified ban. Ever!

Saying there's nothing wrong with "on disc DLC" is like saying there's nothing wrong with a "non-alcoholic alcoholic beverage."

Crono801 posted...
Saying there's nothing wrong with "on disc DLC" is like saying there's nothing wrong with a "non-alcoholic alcoholic beverage."

It's actually nothing like that.

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Joyrock
Fresh from my first justified ban. Ever!

From: Crono801 | #011
Saying there's nothing wrong with "on disc DLC" is like saying there's nothing wrong with a "non-alcoholic alcoholic beverage."

As a Capcom detractor, this analogy makes zero sense.

The whole "DLC on the disc" thing is, quite frankly, irrelevant as to your complaints. Unless you would have been satisfied if Capcom had everything finished, but kept it off the final release to sell later. Your problem is that Capcom is making you pay for stuff that already exists. No, not even that. You're upset that Capcom is making you pay for finished content and that you know about.

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OctilIery posted...
Crono801 posted...
Saying there's nothing wrong with "on disc DLC" is like saying there's nothing wrong with a "non-alcoholic alcoholic beverage."

It's actually nothing like that.

"DLC" stands for "downloadable content." The word "downloadable" is an adjective which suggests that the content in question will be files available for download over the internet for an additional fee, not included on a piece of hardware that has already been purchased.

Similarly, in an "alcoholic beverage," the word "alcoholic" is an adjective that suggests that the beverage in question will contain alcohol.

I thought this topic was gonna be about how s***ty Operation Raccoon City turned out to be?

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Crono801 posted...
OctilIery posted...
Crono801 posted...
Saying there's nothing wrong with "on disc DLC" is like saying there's nothing wrong with a "non-alcoholic alcoholic beverage."

It's actually nothing like that.

"DLC" stands for "downloadable content." The word "downloadable" is an adjective which suggests that the content in question will be files available for download over the internet for an additional fee, not included on a piece of hardware that has already been purchased..

DLC started meaning that. Now it's just a term for extra unlockable content. If you're whining because they put it on the disc instead of on a server somewhere, you're an idiot and this conversation is over.

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Joyrock
Fresh from my first justified ban. Ever!

From: TheKoolAidShoto | #015
I thought this topic was gonna be about how s***ty Operation Raccoon City turned out to be?

it probably was

...sorry guys v_v

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@crono

Oh boy i sure love semantics

Seriously, you're making a fool of yourself

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The real shame is that allo fthis DLC would have at one time been earned by playing the game and now they want you to "earn it" by paying for it.

I mean could imagine if on the next smash luigi and Ness were paid DLC?

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I judge people defending on-disc DLC and automatically associate them with incredibly low IQs.

There is no excuse unless you are a blind, rich fanboy or you're working for the company.

wg64Z posted...
I judge people defending on-disc DLC and automatically associate them with incredibly low IQs.

There is no excuse unless you are a blind, rich fanboy or you're working for the company.

Or maybe I'm not an entitled little twerp.

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OctilIery posted...
Crono801 posted...
OctilIery posted...
Crono801 posted...
Saying there's nothing wrong with "on disc DLC" is like saying there's nothing wrong with a "non-alcoholic alcoholic beverage."

It's actually nothing like that.

"DLC" stands for "downloadable content." The word "downloadable" is an adjective which suggests that the content in question will be files available for download over the internet for an additional fee, not included on a piece of hardware that has already been purchased..

DLC started meaning that. Now it's just a term for extra unlockable content. If you're whining because they put it on the disc instead of on a server somewhere, you're an idiot and this conversation is over.

if it is on the disc, it was dlc that had development time taken away from producing the actual game to make. aka the company in question blatantly intends to milk consumers for cash while not offering a complete product.

actual downloadable content made after release is not on such a level of offensiveness as it is being developed after the game is considered complete enough to put on a disc. aka not cutting into development time.

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TheKoolAidShoto posted...
I thought this topic was gonna be about how s***ty Operation Raccoon City turned out to be?

It was.

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The problem is completed content that is disc locked. When you buy a disc, that means you're purchasing it and everything on it.

SovietOmega posted...
OctilIery posted...
Crono801 posted...
OctilIery posted...
Crono801 posted...
Saying there's nothing wrong with "on disc DLC" is like saying there's nothing wrong with a "non-alcoholic alcoholic beverage."

It's actually nothing like that.

"DLC" stands for "downloadable content." The word "downloadable" is an adjective which suggests that the content in question will be files available for download over the internet for an additional fee, not included on a piece of hardware that has already been purchased..

DLC started meaning that. Now it's just a term for extra unlockable content. If you're whining because they put it on the disc instead of on a server somewhere, you're an idiot and this conversation is over.

if it is on the disc, it was dlc that had development time taken away from producing the actual game to make. aka the company in question blatantly intends to milk consumers for cash while not offering a complete product.

actual downloadable content made after release is not on such a level of offensiveness as it is being developed after the game is considered complete enough to put on a disc. aka not cutting into development time.

It's neither milking for cash nor is it an incomplete product. MVC3 had on disc DLC and it was still a complete product. If they decide they are going to charge extra for some content, that's all their is to it. It isn't milking, it doesn't make it an incomplete product, etc etc.

All you have to complain about is if something DOES feel like an incomplete product, and so far NOTHING of note Capcom has released feels that way.

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Joyrock
Fresh from my first justified ban. Ever!

Dark_Spiral posted...
The problem is completed content that is disc locked. When you buy a disc, that means you're purchasing it and everything on it.

No it doesn't. When you buy a disc, it means you're purchasing the rights to play their game as they say. It does not mean you are entitled to anything; in fact, you don't own anything that's on the disc.

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Joyrock
Fresh from my first justified ban. Ever!

When it comes to on-disc DLC...why wouldn't Capcom just release it with the already "finished" game. I mean, not releasing it with it means that they don't care about releasing the most stellar game they can. It's all about the money. Period.

With that said, I don't buy Capcom games so lol.

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ever notice how some of our more special users show up to defend on disc dlc when the topic comes up

yo joyrock and deepspraw

at least when sep argues about it you get the feeling that he has a functional brain

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wg64Z posted...
I judge people defending on-disc DLC and automatically associate them with incredibly low IQs.

There is no excuse unless you are a blind, rich fanboy or you're working for the company.

I'm neither blind nor rich, I just understand that a company is free to decide what they give when you purchase a product.

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Joyrock
Fresh from my first justified ban. Ever!

It looked terrible from the beginning. Slant Six is garbage, the trailers looked like garbage, the previews were like "uh, its a game I guess?"

But yeah, not a good look, Capcom. And no matter how good SFxTk may be(and its REALLY good), the DLC/gem stuff aint a good look either.

And we still got DmC and RE6 later this year, sequels to their two biggest franchises, with all eyes on them.

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No it doesn't. When you buy a disc, it means you're purchasing the rights to play their game as they say. It does not mean you are entitled to anything; in fact, you don't own anything that's on the disc.

This is why no one takes anything you say seriously, btw.

Xbyte posted...
When it comes to on-disc DLC...why wouldn't Capcom just release it with the already "finished" game. I mean, not releasing it with it means that they don't care about releasing the most stellar game they can. It's all about the money. Period.

With that said, I don't buy Capcom games so lol.

It's always about money. There are very, very few companies you will find that this isn't true. And yes, Capcom has been sliding and I have my gripes with them, but this is not a legitimate complaint.


OmarsComin posted...
ever notice how some of our more special users show up to defend on disc dlc when the topic comes up

yo joyrock and deepspraw

at least when sep argues about it you get the feeling that he has a functional brain

You act like you're smarter but you can't come up with a single legitimate defense against my arguments(here or otherwise).


Dark_Spiral posted...
No it doesn't. When you buy a disc, it means you're purchasing the rights to play their game as they say. It does not mean you are entitled to anything; in fact, you don't own anything that's on the disc.

This is why no one takes anything you say seriously, btw.

Because I know what I'm talking about?

Look it up. You are buying the right to play the game; you do not actually own the game.

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Joyrock
Fresh from my first justified ban. Ever!

I spent MONTHS convincing my friend to cancel his ORC preorder.

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FYI:

http://www.wired.com/threatlevel/2010/09/first-sale-doctrine/
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/programmes/click_online/9406690.stm
http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/2012/02/01/thought-do-we-own-our-steam-games/

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Joyrock
Fresh from my first justified ban. Ever!

Buying a Digital Camera? $1.99 to unlock x10 zoom
Buying a TV? $1.99 to unlock Sleep feature
Buying a Washing Machine? $1.99 to unlock Cold Water wash
Buying a Bike? $1.99 for front tire breaks

A good company will value its customers and give them a full, complete product.

Capcom has made it very clear it does NOT give a **** about the fans of their games. Both with "DLC" and blatant trolling.

wg64Z posted...
Buying a Digital Camera? 1.99$ to unlock x10 zoom
Buying a TV? $1.99 to unlock Sleep feature
Buying a Washing Machine? $1.99 to unlock Cold Water wash
Buying a Bike? $1.99 for front tire breaks

A good company will value its customers and give them a full, complete product.

Capcom has made it very clear it does NOT give a **** about the fans of their games. Both with "DLC" and blatant trolling.

None of those are even slightly comparable to anything Capcom has done. Allow me to fix the list for you:

Buying a Digital Camera? 1.99$ for an extra memory stick.
Buying a TV? $1.99 for additional cables.
Buying a Washing Machine? $1.99 for extra dishes/soap.
Buying a Bike? $1.99 for a bell.

Capcom is not removing key components. They are simply offering EXTRA features as paid content. And since they are still offering a complete, worthwhile product, THEY ARE DOING NOTHING WRONG.

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Joyrock
Fresh from my first justified ban. Ever!

Also this whole debate on "ownership" is completely irrelevant.

No, you don't own the stuff on the disc. When was this ever in question? I can't buy a game and reproduce and sell it, much like I don't own any of the songs I have.

The problem here is the blatant price gouging. Games used to drive a player to unlock new things by beating the challenges it had. Nowadays the challenge is having an active credit card.

It's kind of depressing.

Capcom is not removing key components.

Fighting Characters in a Fighting game not key components.

Derp?

wg64Z posted...
Also this whole debate on "ownership" is completely irrelevant.

No, you don't own the stuff on the disc. When was this ever in question? I can't buy a game and reproduce and sell it, much like I don't own any of the songs I have.

The problem here is the blatant price gouging. Games used to drive a player to unlock new things by beating the challenges it had. Nowadays the challenge is having an active credit card.

It's kind of depressing.

Again, if the game offers a complete, worthwhile product as Capcom does, it isn't price gouging, you're just a spoiled child.

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Joyrock
Fresh from my first justified ban. Ever!

wg64Z posted...
Capcom is not removing key components.

Fighting Characters in a Fighting game not key components.

Derp?

When they already have a large roster available? Nope, they aren't.

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Joyrock
Fresh from my first justified ban. Ever!

Capcom is not removing key components. They are simply offering EXTRA features as paid content. And since they are still offering a complete, worthwhile product, THEY ARE DOING NOTHING WRONG.

Remember when extras were PART of a complete worthwhile product and not having them would be a much more bland experience? Today you are saying a complete product is yesteryear's bland experience.

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SovietOmega posted...
Capcom is not removing key components. They are simply offering EXTRA features as paid content. And since they are still offering a complete, worthwhile product, THEY ARE DOING NOTHING WRONG.

Remember when extras were PART of a complete worthwhile product and not having them would be a much more bland experience? Today you are saying a complete product is yesteryear's bland experience.

You are getting more in the initial purchase now than you got in those older games typically, so you really have no basis for your incessant whining. Unless you want to say Capcom should have removed half the characters at start and made you unlock them, you really have nothing to whine about here.

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Joyrock
Fresh from my first justified ban. Ever!

Unlock Chocobo Breeeding: 1.99

Unlock Golden Chocobo: 1.99

Unlock Emerald Weapon: 1.99

Unlock Ruby Weapon: 1.99

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OctilIery posted...
wg64Z posted...
Capcom is not removing key components.

Fighting Characters in a Fighting game not key components.

Derp?

When they already have a large roster available? Nope, they aren't.

I am not the best player of fighting games, but I sure as hell know that forcing you to pay to unlock characters prevents you from training against them or getting a feel for how to play them or how they will be played. It prevents you from being competitive.

This is not a hard concept to understand.

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From: OctilIery | #032
Because I know what I'm talking about?

I don't get what you're asking.

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SovietOmega posted...
OctilIery posted...
wg64Z posted...
Capcom is not removing key components.

Fighting Characters in a Fighting game not key components.

Derp?

When they already have a large roster available? Nope, they aren't.

I am not the best player of fighting games, but I sure as hell know that forcing you to pay to unlock characters prevents you from training against them or getting a feel for how to play them or how they will be played. It prevents you from being competitive.

This is not a hard concept to understand.

It isn't. And if you want to play more competitively, you pay extra. Deal with it. The bottom line is they are offering a solid product worth the price. If you want more, you pay more.

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Joyrock
Fresh from my first justified ban. Ever!

To me, I always wonder at what point companies decide something will be DLC. Like with Capcom, did they have a list of fighters for SFxT at the beginning divided into two groups; standard and DLC? If that was the plan at the start, I don't really begrudge them putting the code for them on the disc to save on downloading and online storage.

But it's pretty much impossible to know if that was the case, or if they decided a couple months before to just take out a bunch of characters to hold back till later. Either way, I can't fault a company for trying to make as much money as possible, especially with game development costs being as high as they are, but I can't fault some players for feeling cheated by it either.

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joyrock doesn't actually play fighting games, it's pretty silly to argue with him

he actually believes that characters in a fighting game aren't a key component

if Blizzard locked a 1/5 of the units away as paid DLC in SC2 would joyrock say "they aren't key components because you already have a lot of other units to use"? who knows, because he's joyrock.

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When it comes to on-disc DLC...why wouldn't Capcom just release it with the already "finished" game. I mean, not releasing it with it means that they don't care about releasing the most stellar game they can. It's all about the money. Period.

With that said, I don't buy Capcom games so lol.

Nobody actually tries to put out the absolute best possible game possible. Nobody has the infinite budget required for such a thing. You can always add a new character into the game so you need to decided when enough is enough. DLC characters bring in extra money. On the expectations of this extra money, Capcom could hire more people to get the DLC characters done. Even if the characters are done in time for the standard release, Capcom still needs the money they would bring in a DLC so they remain DLC. Alternatively, they could just release them as non DLC and learn not to make DLC characters in the future since they can't sell them for extra money. This doesn't mean planned DLC characters would suddenly come with the game but means they don't have those characters at all. This is all based on the ideal scenario. It's also possible that Capcom chops off non-DLC characters and sells them as DLC for more money and the extra money does not generate any new content at all.

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I swear Octillery is getting cash under the table for every alternate color you buy for Chun-Li's tights.

Seriously, game developers used to include all this extra stuff to just straight up make their game better, more rewarding, more challenging, and to just be better than the competition. To not see a dramatic (and incredibly crappy) shift from legitimate challenge/reward to just forking out cash is complete blind fanboyism.