(5) Alex Mercer From Prototype, Alex Mercer is an amnesiac with superhuman abilities. Alex has superhuman strength (he can lift cars, helicopters, and the outer shells of tanks), speed (he can run as fast as city-traveling cars), agility (he can flip and maneuver around debris with ease) and durability (he can reform from a nuclear explosion so long as there is something to absorb to reform). He can also glide, is durable enough to survive direct hits from missiles and tank shells, and can leap across a city block.
Alex's primary ability is to absorb organic matter of living creatures, which gives him health boosts and grants him all the knowledge, experience, memories and skills of what he has absorbed. He can manipulate this excess “biomass” into augmentations for various weapons, shields, or full body armor; when he takes biomass to the extreme he can unleash it in powerful area-of-effect attacks called “devastators.” Alex's offensive weapons include claws, hammerfists (large hammers), blades, and whipfists (a ranged attack of sorts).
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Mewtwo was easily able to overcome his fears, crushing It to the tune of 16-2.
(4) Lord Foul Lord Foul the Despiser is the primary antagonist of The Chronicles of Thomas Covenant. An ancient and seemingly immortal being, he traveled the universe planting evil powers said to be capable of tearing planets apart so that later beings would find them and destroy themselves until the Creator was able to defeat him, and establish the Arch of Time to seal him away in The Land, a single continent. Foul possesses incredibly powerful magical abilities, enough that at full power, direct combat against him would likely cause enough damage to destroy the world. In addition to using his powers for direct destructive means, Foul and those he empowers have used a variety of indirect abilities including manipulating the weather, resurrecting shades of the dead, and summoning creatures that induce extreme fear in all who witness them, though these abilities generally require time to use.
Foul has an inherent power over the undead, able to perfectly enslave any who violate the Law of Death. In addition, his nature as equal and opposite to the Creator means that he cannot be defeated by any power not guided by free will, and attempts to carry artifacts containing mere fractions of his power inevitably corrupt the bearers into serving his will. Though he is apparently immortal, sufficient force directed against him or he himself utilizing all the power at his disposal can nonetheless leave him powerless for many centuries at a time.
(Cont)
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For the record: this is just my interp, but I'd give Alex a way to absorb biomass in the terrain. Others may disagree, of course, but it wouldn't be a fair match if he didn't have access to fuel for his abilities.
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But what can Lord Foul actually do? Just reading "this characters has planet-busting powers" isn't enough, we need to know how exactly they function, if they function at all.
-- SomeC - sheer explosives since meeting that crazy hobo. BlAcK TuRtLe grabbed the Guru victory, slow but steady.
From what I remember, they don't really go into that in the books.
Also, I'm not changing my vote, but I will give an example of Alex's nigh indestructibility...
Survived a nuke and regenerated himself back from a bit of tissue the size of a worm. Theoretically, if one cell survives and has access to other organic matter, Alex survives, but again, that's only theory.
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And what exactly is "sufficient force"? A mere powerful punch or a continent-destroying blast? Does it have to be delivered in one blow or can the damage be built up? Are there any examples of Lord Foul getting defeated?
-- SomeC - sheer explosives since meeting that crazy hobo. BlAcK TuRtLe grabbed the Guru victory, slow but steady.
Some_Character posted... And what exactly is "sufficient force"? A mere powerful punch or a continent-destroying blast? Does it have to be delivered in one blow or can the damage be built up? Are there any examples of Lord Foul getting defeated?
There's a ritual that 'destroys' him. He doesn't actually die, but it's close.
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Since Alex has no way of knowing about something like that, he's going to have to rely on "sufficient force". Whatever force would qualify as sufficient.
-- SomeC - sheer explosives since meeting that crazy hobo. BlAcK TuRtLe grabbed the Guru victory, slow but steady.
Some_Character posted... Since Alex has no way of knowing about something like that, he's going to have to rely on "sufficient force". Whatever force would qualify as sufficient.
Oh, no, that ritual works on a lot of stuff. I was just using it as an example because it was an unraveling force of immense power.
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From: Some_Character | Posted: 9/11/2011 7:16:13 PM | #012 I need to know a minimum of power that's required. Would Alex throwing a tank at be do? If not, would Alex throwing multiple tanks at it do?
probably not, but if he had a white-gold ring...
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Don't remember the end of Prototype too well, but I think Mercer absorbed a crow that swooped down to eat at the little pile of goop that was left of him to start his regen after the nuke.
Tentatively gonna say Lord Foul. I don't think Mercer can bring him down and I feel like Foul can eventually at least incapacitate Mercer.
From: Some_Character | #012 I need to know a minimum of power that's required. Would Alex throwing a tank at be do? If not, would Alex throwing multiple tanks at it do?
Well the Ritual of Desecration between Foul and Kevin basically flattened everything on the entire continent and left most of it still distorted and poised for centuries. After Foul's defeat in the first trilogy, Covenant destroying the Illearth Stone was enough to destroy pretty much the entire chunk of land Foul's Creche was located on/under, and that's just a weapon Foul had created in the past. In the second trilogy when he had more time to recover, he basically tried to power Covenant up so much that he couldn't do anything without destroying the world, but even after Covenant got that fairly well handled, he still didn't want to try a direct battle against Foul for fear of what the side effects of it might be. I've only read the first book of the ongoing series, but a couple of glancing blows from a time distortion made by wild magic brought down a mountain. So...I don't think anything Alex can do even with gameplay taken in would really compare.
Also I'm inclined to think that actually providing biomass, at least in the sentient form (ie humans) that Alex usually uses would possibly be un-neutral; if you want to interpret Alex as "undead" in any way (I wouldn't, personally, but given the plot twist about his actual origin, I could see why someone would), he pretty much auto-loses <_< Giving him extra people to kill but then absorb into his living body would push him closer to that
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From: Natwaf_akidna | Posted: 9/11/2011 7:50:33 PM | #016 Yeah... gonna need to know if Foul can destroy Alex utterly. As it is, it seems like they both can't keep each other down.
Also, about Alex surviving a nuke, what organic matter did he absorb to reconstitute himself? People checking if he's dead or not?
A crow, and actually, it was a puddle of goo he regenerated from.
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From: Natwaf_akidna | #016 Yeah... gonna need to know if Foul can destroy Alex utterly. As it is, it seems like they both can't keep each other down.
Also, about Alex surviving a nuke, what organic matter did he absorb to reconstitute himself? People checking if he's dead or not?
A bird
It's interesting to think of how Mercer's regeneration could come into play I guess, although he'd need a lot of stuff around to actually make good use of it. Foul does have indirect methods of winning (given that Mercer isn't exactly the most mentally stable guy around, throwing an illusion at him would probably confuse him a lot, and Foul is a master at screwing with people's minds) and the worst case scenario is probably Mercer trying to consume Foul, since he already had trouble handling the hive mind of the Infected and just carrying around a fragment of one thing Foul created was enough to let him enslave guys whose willpower is enough that they can swear a vow and have it make them immune to aging, so Mercer would basically be defeating himself if he tried it.
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Mistake you're making - overlooking the fact that we might not want to be saved.
So theoretically Alex has infinite energy to regenerate so long as he has material to work with? Okay then.
Mountain blasting you say? Even if it's not permanent, blasting everything until he's out of bio-mass to use should suffice... assuming Lord Foul's energy lasts. How long can Lord Foul keep it up before he sends himself into remission?
From: Natwaf_akidna | #024 So theoretically Alex has infinite energy to regenerate so long as he has material to work with? Okay then.
Mountain blasting you say? Even if it's not permanent, blasting everything until he's out of bio-mass to use should suffice... assuming Lord Foul's energy lasts. How long can Lord Foul keep it up before he sends himself into remission?
When he exhausted himself to "death", Foul basically was gathering every bit of power he had into one blast, and then he kept doing it for...I don't know exactly how long, a while. This was when he had Covenant's ring so it's hard to say if that made it take longer or shorter, and also means he was quite literally throwing blasts that could shatter time and definitely the whole planet. Alex definitely doesn't withstand or dish out anything even close to that <_< Hell, Alex needs to "borrow" a special army tank to break into the reinforced Infected hives, and those are just warehouse buildings. I don't think he ever really does anything even on the level of building destroying in the plot, and gameplay-wise that doesn't even necessarily get done in one attack.
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Note that when I say I'd give Alex biomass, this doesn't mean he gets an aethereal biomass bag that never runs out. He'd have to absorb it and given how Foul overpowers him that doesn't seem like something he'll be able to do.
@Silencer: 15. Mewtwo only barely failed to mercy It.
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From: Some_Character | #012 I need to know a minimum of power that's required. Would Alex throwing a tank at be do? If not, would Alex throwing multiple tanks at it do? Well the Ritual of Desecration between Foul and Kevin basically flattened everything on the entire continent and left most of it still distorted and poised for centuries. After Foul's defeat in the first trilogy, Covenant destroying the Illearth Stone was enough to destroy pretty much the entire chunk of land Foul's Creche was located on/under, and that's just a weapon Foul had created in the past. In the second trilogy when he had more time to recover, he basically tried to power Covenant up so much that he couldn't do anything without destroying the world, but even after Covenant got that fairly well handled, he still didn't want to try a direct battle against Foul for fear of what the side effects of it might be. I've only read the first book of the ongoing series, but a couple of glancing blows from a time distortion made by wild magic brought down a mountain. So...I don't think anything Alex can do even with gameplay taken in would really compare.
That's not a minimum. That's just saying "the really powerful attack worked". Of course it did. Mercer isn't capable of that though, so we'll need to establish a win condition.
-- SomeC - sheer explosives since meeting that crazy hobo. BlAcK TuRtLe grabbed the Guru victory, slow but steady.
That's giving you a range that the minimum would be within. We know that destroying a mountain and a big chunk of land isn't enough, we know that a ritual that covers an entire continent and seems to specifically destroy living things is enough. I don't see how Mercer even comes close to the "not enough" end though so it doesn't matter much.
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Like, that's the two times that Foul has been "destroyed", a reference to the only other defeat he had and why Covenant didn't use force on him that time, and some extrapolation from other events. It's not getting narrowed down much more than "here is basically everything directly pertaining to his defeats and a bit that doesn't too"
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From: Some_Character | #033 That's where the other part of the original question comes in. Does it have to be one fierce blow or can you gradually defeat this thing?
Probably either; Covenant did fight with Foul over time and wore him down, and the Ritual of Desecration isn't instant (we know that after it's initiated, there's still enough time for Foul to say "This won't permanently kill me fyi" and laugh at Kevin for sacrificing so much to not even achieve his goal before it finishes them off, being able to do that is the entire reason Foul took part in the ritual in the first place).
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Hmhm. Alex, given a little bit of time probably could destroy a mountain with the high velocity at which some of his attacks are executed. Given that he doesn't die first, of course. Which brings me to another question: what would Lord Foul do first in this battle?
-- SomeC - sheer explosives since meeting that crazy hobo. BlAcK TuRtLe grabbed the Guru victory, slow but steady.
From: Some_Character | #036 Hmhm. Alex, given a little bit of time probably could destroy a mountain with the high velocity at which some of his attacks are executed. Given that he doesn't die first, of course. Which brings me to another question: what would Lord Foul do first in this battle?
Good question. Depending on whether he's able to sense anything about Mercer (which I honestly couldn't tell you if he could or not), he'd probably start off with an illusion of whatever he thinks Mercer wouldn't be able to figure out a way to break or by just talking to him to try to find out how best to actually fight. When it comes down to direct combat, he'd likely first go for just throwing out waves of energy to try to pin Mercer to the ground before blasting him (Foul went for something like that against Covenant IIRC and his servants have tried similar things a lot), which might not even be too necessary if the power gap is enough because if you're not that strong, just letting loose some of his power would be enough to leave Mercer immobilized (Alex can probably overcome that if Foul's not directly focusing on it though).
We've only ever seen him fight when he had good reason to stay in place so how he'd handle a mobile battle is hard to say, but he's had his armies use pretty good tactics (lots of indirect tricks and constantly changing tactics to wear down opponents) so he'd probably do similar things, which is manipulating the weather a bit to reduce visibility and firing energy blasts from a distance, and if he had enough space, trying to summon shades of the dead from the ground or summoning monsters. If he figured out that Alex is a virus that can be destabilized (like the way Cross did to him with the parasite that eventually became the Supreme Hunter) he'd probably try something like the venom he had his servants use on Covenant in the second trilogy (which amped Covenant's power up, but made it extremely volatile so he couldn't control himself without extreme effort that left him exhausted every time he did it).
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Can't Alex manipulate his surroundings (not going in depth just partiall bumping lmao) and infect the area + summon armies of his own (since by prototype 2 he basically controls them and has them etc)
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Guess it depends on the battlefield. I would figure if he was in at least a partially infected area (buildings covered in that red stuff etc) then he could summon them to him since he is somewhat "connected" to them.
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I don't think they count as undead but as manifestations of the virus dunno (like the hunters etc) dunno bout the zombie looking enemies though (yknow the people you just charge through for the lulz) depends on how it was interpreted
even if certian infected could be controlled with Foul's shenanigans (I don't think he could control the actual "threat" level infected like Hunters / Uber Hunters etc) but Alex could just "Omnom" of any that attack him and just heal up / get stronger.
<shrug>
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I don't think they count as undead but as manifestations of the virus dunno (like the hunters etc) dunno bout the zombie looking enemies though (yknow the people you just charge through for the lulz) depends on how it was interpreted
I have never played the games so I really don't know.
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