Current Events > Tipping culture has reached its climax

(+) Yeah! (+)

https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/a/forum/8/81e8eb0c.jpg

President of Blizzard btw

but is it at the tipping point

spoiler they will still nickel and dime

Nobody feels this way about Blizzard games in fact I feel like I should get some money back after playing them

Lmao yeah right

no one has ever felt this way

literally buy the elden ring art book, a t-shirt, a second copy for your friend, or whatever the fuck

what a facile post

I would say tip the developers but then the publishers would just pay them less.

DrizztLink posted...

but is it at the tipping point

Lolololol

Embarassing as it is to say I previously have wanted to give more money to a company that made a game I loved as a kid... playing single player games that were complete and offered a full 100 hour experience was a different time back then...

I wish I could reply to his tweet just to see if I would get blocked

I just buy some merch as my tip if I like a game enough.

I'm currently wearing a Cyberpunk 2077 hoodie for instance.

Seriously? Ybarra wants to be able to tip developers for making good games that don't try to nickel and dime their way into players pockets?

This comes from a guy at the helm of the company responsible for the shitfest that is Diablo 4, that will sell you premium battle passes for 10 bucks, then making it so that completing the batle pass will NOT give you enough coin to buy the next and offer skins and other cosmetinct for 20+ bucks.

And here I was thinking Kotick leaving would be a good thing...

prediction: after this becomes an option for a while, they (CEOs, etc) will use 'lack of tipping' to justify raising prices to 'fairly pay developers', shifting the blame for the price hike to consumers (or developers) instead of the endless corporate greed

haarlem1982 posted...

Seriously? Ybarra wants to be able to tip developers for making good games that don't try to nickel and dime their way into players pockets?

no he is lying

he is hoping blizzard\activision fanboys read it and want to tip WoW or CoD

If a game retails for $70, all dlc going forward should be free. If a developer isn't finished with their game when they put it up for sale, it shouldn't cost full price.

I remember buying a map pack for Resistance Fall of Man. If I only knew what the future entailed.

I could maybe stretch my imagination enough to view this as a thing for low budget indie games. Even then, I'd rather just buy some merch to show my support if I was into it that much

masterbarf posted...

If a game retails for $70, all dlc going forward should be free. If a developer isn't finished with their game when they put it up for sale, it shouldn't cost full price.

The Tweet in the topic post is dumb, but I'll also never understand this mindset, either.

Take a fighting game, for example. If they advertised 30 characters, and I bought the game because 30 characters was enough for me, cool. The game is complete, since they gave me everything they advertised that they'd give me before I spent my money. If they then add more characters later on as DLC, that doesn't mean the game is now suddenly "incomplete," because I had already decided what I was getting initially was worth the money I paid initially. They don't owe me anything more for free. It'd be nice if they give it, but they certainly don't owe it to me, because I deemed what they offered initially to be enough value.

This is your brain on America.

Americans are still addicted to tipping because for five minutes any average schlub can make themselves feel like a medieval baron by granting or withholding a tip.

https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/a/forum/c/c4749616.jpg

Oh hell nah

Closest I came was buying DLC for Xcom Enemy Unknown. Got the game free on PS+ and felt guilty that I had so much fun with it without paying a dime. So I bought the dlc available to give some money to the developers.

StealThisSheen posted...

The Tweet in the topic post is dumb, but I'll also never understand this mindset, either.

Take a fighting game, for example. If they advertised 30 characters, and I bought the game because 30 characters was enough for me, cool. The game is complete, since they gave me everything they advertised that they'd give me before I spent my money. If they then add more characters later on as DLC, that doesn't mean the game is now suddenly "incomplete," because I had already decided what I was getting initially was worth the money I paid initially. They don't owe me anything more for free. It'd be nice if they give it, but they certainly don't owe it to me, because I deemed what they offered initially to be enough value.

Advertising a fraction of a game as a full game, doesn't make it so.

masterbarf posted...

Advertising a fraction of a game as a full game, doesn't make it so.

Yes, it does, because if you bought the game, then you deemed it a full enough game to warrant your purchase. If it wasn't enough, then why did you buy it?

This is a bad argument. We shouldn't be answering bad arguments with bad arguments.

If they say "30 characters!" and you go "Take my money!" and then over the next two years they add 5 more characters, you don't get to suddenly demand them for free. That's like buying a movie ticket for a single movie, then insisting you should get to see every movie played in that theater after for free. A purchase is an agreement to what they advertise that you are purchasing.

It isn't that I'm embracing tipping devs but I'm not going to lie I have felt this to a degree.

When it comes to big huge games like Elder Scrolls, Witcher, Dragon Age, those type of games I usually wait about 2 years after release for most of the bugs to be worked out, all DLC and any expansion to be put out.

So by the time I play them I'm often picking up a GOTY type edition for like $20 to $25 and at the completion of those games after doing everything possible to 100%, every single quest, everything I have often felt damn near guilty about how much amazing content I received for such a paltry investment on my part.

glad it's not just me. i personally stand up and applaud at the end of games too, and i wish it was possible for my console to record me and send them a video of me applauding and weeping tears at how amazing the fucking game was

actually, would it be possible for me to arrange to have an ubisoft exec come to my house so i can lick his shoes personally? let him pee on me? there are no limits really. i'm basically a free-use slave for big corporations.

archizzy posted...

It isn't that I'm embracing tipping devs but I'm not going to lie I have felt this to a degree.

When it comes to big huge games like Elder Scrolls, Witcher, Dragon Age, those type of games I usually wait about 2 years after release for most of the bugs to be worked out, all DLC and any expansion to be put out.

So by the time I play them I'm often picking up a GOTY type edition for like $20 to $25 and at the completion of those games after doing everything possible to 100%, every single quest, everything I have often felt damn near guilty about how much amazing content I received for such a paltry investment on my part.

I guess the thing is there are the occasional games, like RDR2 and Elden ring, where I ended up putting 100+ hours in so I got tremendous value out of my full priced game and at face value, yes I would have been happy to tip an extra $20

But over the years I've overpaid for a lot of really rushed and crappy games made by lazy people and I've never been entitled to a post purchase discount/refund, so why should it work the other way?

StealThisSheen posted...

Yes, it does, because if you bought the game, then you deemed it a full enough game to warrant your purchase. If it wasn't enough, then why did you buy it?

"Full enough" doesn't even make sense. A game is either full or not. If you don't have access to all the fighters in a fighting game, you don't have the full game. You bought it because you want the new Street Fighter or whatever. Selling a fighting game for $70 and charging extra for literal fighters is scummy as fuck.

masterbarf posted...

Selling a fighting game for $70 and charging extra for literal fighters is scummy as fuck.

No, what was scummy as fuck was the previous system of releasing a full priced game, adding four new fighters, and releasing an entirely new full priced game. What we currently have is much, much better. Why would you apparently want to return to that over being able to add them via DLC? Why would we want to return to fifty versions of Street Fighter 2, over just being able to choose to buy new fighters individually? Unless you're going to say new characters simply... Shouldn't be added at all, and people should just have to wait 3-4 years until the next game comes out?

EDIT: And before you say it, no, "Just add new characters and support the game for five years entirely for free" is not an option, because that's literally saying the devs should do work for you for free.

what about day-one dlc characters locked behind premium editions, etc? as in, content already finished and packaged with the game at the time of release, but which costs extra just because?

American pro-tipping takes should never be taken seriously. Keep that shit in America and dont spill it out to the rest of the world sane enough to not have any tipping

LinkDaLunatic posted...

what about day-one dlc characters locked behind premium editions, etc? as in, content already finished and packaged with the game at the time of release, but which costs extra just because?

That I'm against, yes. I'm mainly talking about characters that were clearly added after the game finished. I know Capcom was super scummy about this with Street Fighter X Tekken, since the characters were literally on the disc. That's not very common, though, and we know this because people break games open like, immediately.

Cant believe thats a real post...holy shit. He thinks he's being so coy, but this means they're toying with this idea one way or another.

As an American with not much money, tipping is a foul and disgusting practice that sould be eradicated forever

Oof

how do we also justify the costs of these characters? if the base game has 30 characters, and the game is $70, that's $2.3 per character... but the base game of course includes tons of other things, they had to create the engine, there's voice work for the story mode, tons of new music, etc. so realistically the characters probably aren't even half the cost of the game but let's say half to be generous, now we're looking at $1.16 per character

but when they are released as DLC it is of course a minimum of $5, sometimes more, sometimes there's no way to access them without buying a $30 season pass which includes only three characters at nearly half the cost of the fucking game

listen, i know this post is making wild assumptions and there's a lot to take into consideration but just hear me out, when you zoom the scope out a bit it's not hard to see how people are feeling cheated

Maybe the President of Blizzard just needs to pay his employees better.

No thanks. I've never wanted to tip someone for a game. As a matter of fact, I genuinely want to buy things and feel like I can enjoy it without having to think about the person or people that made it. Of I enjoy it that much, I'll look up other things that they made.

Rika_Furude posted...

American pro-tipping takes should never be taken seriously. Keep that shit in America and dont spill it out to the rest of the world sane enough to not have any tipping

The absurd part now in America is that it's basically become incorporated to any non-drive thru transaction in which you're getting food. If you either order food online to pick up or are checking out at a register...you'll be prompted to tip, and if it's in person, it's usually non-intuitive to get out of the screen or select a no-tip option.

Keep in mind this is a "tip" that you're giving essentially generically to some employee that literally just ringed you up and is offering no type of service akin to a waiter whatsoever.

And on top of this now, drive thru fast food is priced so that fast casual is honestly at basically the same prices to it.

LinkDaLunatic posted...

how do we also justify the costs of these characters? if the base game has 30 characters, and the game is $70, that's $2.3 per character... but the base game of course includes tons of other things, they had to create the engine, there's voice work for the story mode, tons of new music, etc. so realistically the characters probably aren't even half the cost of the game but let's say half to be generous, now we're looking at $1.16 per character

but when they are released as DLC it is of course a minimum of $5, sometimes more, sometimes there's no way to access them without buying a $30 season pass which includes only three characters at nearly half the cost of the fucking game

listen, i know this post is making wild assumptions and there's a lot to take into consideration but just hear me out, when you zoom the scope out a bit it's not hard to see how people are feeling cheated

This is how it should be looked at. Yeah most DLC isn't free to make. But then you have to ask what is the best way to maintain ongoing support for a game?

I'd rather tip a traffic cop who pulled me over.

You look at the people who are buying 20, 40, 60 100 dollar skins etc and read this shit and it's actually kind of fucking scary

You're going to finish Elden Ring, a message box pops up at the end of the credits:
"Hi, I'm Miyasaki. The producer of this game you just finished. If you enjoyed the experience we crafted for you, please consider tipping the developers & me for our work."
Then several dialogue boxes pop up with a 10%, 15% & 20% tip option. If you select "no tip", they don't let you start a new game until you authenticate your account online to bypass it, but you had to make an email with Namco first.

notforremnant posted...

You're going to finish Elden Ring, a message box pops up at the end of the credits:
"Hi, I'm Miyasaki. The producer of this game you just finished. If you enjoyed the experience we crafted for you, please consider tipping the developers & me for our work."
Then several dialogue boxes pop up with a 10%, 15% & 20% tip option. If you select "no tip", they don't let you start a new game until you authenticate your account online to bypass it, but you had to make an email with Namco first.

And then you'll have to pay an additional 20% gratuity fee for playing over 20hrs on the game.

mistymermaid posted...

This is how it should be looked at. Yeah most DLC isn't free to make. But then you have to ask what is the best way to maintain ongoing support for a game?

Buying soundtracks, artbooks, supporter packs, merch, etc.

LinkDaLunatic posted...

how do we also justify the costs of these characters? if the base game has 30 characters, and the game is $70, that's $2.3 per character... but the base game of course includes tons of other things, they had to create the engine, there's voice work for the story mode, tons of new music, etc. so realistically the characters probably aren't even half the cost of the game but let's say half to be generous, now we're looking at $1.16 per character

but when they are released as DLC it is of course a minimum of $5, sometimes more, sometimes there's no way to access them without buying a $30 season pass which includes only three characters at nearly half the cost of the fucking game

listen, i know this post is making wild assumptions and there's a lot to take into consideration but just hear me out, when you zoom the scope out a bit it's not hard to see how people are feeling cheated

To be fair, more effort goes into characters created after initial release than the originals, since you now have to rebalance everything. You have to balance the new character vs. the original 30, which is extra effort, and then you need to apply balances to other characters that already exist, to both make sure they're balanced vs. the new character, and also in reaction to the way the balance has shifted among the existing characters that already exist. And these balance patches are actually provided for free, it's only the character itself that costs money.

For example, the latest trailer for Mortal Kombat 1 is for Ermac. In that trailer, it showed Ermac fighting Reptile. Reptile used both a variation of an existing move that doesn't currently exist, as well as an entirely new move that doesn't currently exist. They put effort into trying to balance/improve Reptile, since he's, currently, an underused character. That balancing comes in the patch, everybody gets that for free, regardless. Ermac costs money, yes, but... If you don't want Ermac? You DO get other work they did, for absolutely free. They do that because they figure the money they make from Ermac will balance out the free work atleast somewhat, and they want to support the game, either way.

EDIT: The scummy part of MK1, for example, isn't the DLC... It's the "battle pass/season"-esque stuff, which... You'd see more of, in games, if DLC wasn't a thing. We don't want every fighting game to turn into Games as a Service-esque Brawlhalla, for example.

Vicious_Dios posted...

I'd rather tip a traffic cop who pulled me over.

imagine this becomes a thing
you don't tip
they pull you over again and find something else

Prestoff posted...

And then you'll have to pay an additional 20% gratuity fee for playing over 20hrs on the game.

This honestly is the future I could see taking place for games, the next step is just companies determining where they want to add that extra monetization

I have bought some DLC/Soundtracks/etc. that I didn't have any interest in to support developers, but I'm not going to just fork over money to a company that keeps on having people steal breast milk out of the fridge and hasn't made a game I give a crap about in over a decade.

If he wants to give them extra money just buy another copy of the game it's not that hard.