Poll of the Day > So what does PotD think of all censorship on social media and YouTube?

(+) Yeah! (+)

I think it's awful.

But apparently it's considered ok to shut down your competitors from expressing their free speech on what's supposed to be public platforms.
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A characteristic of 1984.
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Free speech doesn't count under private ownership. The U.S. is entirely corporate owned.

I don't know about other platforms, but on youtube it's handled extremely poorly. Youtube comes up with new terms of service and then retroactively punishes creators for breaking those terms long before they were ever a thing. Do you think they would simply give a warning and let you edit or remove the offending videos? Nope, they just automatically delete the video for you and give your channel a strike with a nice little message about how they want to keep youtube "safe" for creators and viewers.

And then there's the algorithm that works to promote corporate networks while pushing independent creators into the shadows, and flags videos based purely on subject matter with no regard to context, unless, of course, the video belongs to CNN or the like. There's an obvious double standard going on, and I'm convinced youtube is being run by incompetent morons at this point.
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All the youtubers are scared of cursing now. Well, not all of them. But a good chunk. Even one guy who reads reddit post is scared. Mainly because he doesnt want his videos to be demonetized...
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Oh yeah, tons of people got demonetized or had their entire channels taken down all in one day last week because of this stupid #VoxAdpocalypse thing.
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Youtube is just a mess. Not because censorship is evil or anything, but because Google insists on trying to solve any perceived problems with hamfisted algorithms that almost invariably create new problems without solving the ones they were meant to fix and are ripe for abusive exploitation. Youtube is getting harder and harder to create content for, which is a real problem, and the only reason that's happening is because Google's gotten lazy and complacent riding on the success of Pewdiepie and a handful of other mega-hits.

_AdjI_ posted...

Youtube is just a mess. Not because censorship is evil or anything, but because Google insists on trying to solve any perceived problems with hamfisted algorithms that almost invariably create new problems without solving the ones they were meant to fix and are ripe for abusive exploitation. Youtube is getting harder and harder to create content for, which is a real problem, and the only reason that's happening is because Google's gotten lazy and complacent riding on the success of Pewdiepie and a handful of other mega-hits.

Doesn't YouTube(and other companies) hate Pewds now though?
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dedbus posted...

Free speech doesn't count under private ownership. The U.S. is entirely corporate owned.

I just hate all censorship tbh.

On the latest release of Toy Story 2, they cut out the part in the outtakes where Prospector is talking to the two Barbies (because of all the Harvey Weinstein stuff) and I know its just a 20-second gag, but the principle of it is what bothers me.

If something like that is considered ok to censor, how long until more important things get censored?

Im so sick of this outrage culture we live in. People need to stop being so damn sensitive.
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You have the right to free speech, not the right to cause the air to vibrate with sound vibrations.

#YouTube
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Free speech doesnt apply to privately run websites.
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Free speech is either a concept you agree with or not. Either you promote it or you say shit like Mead just did.

Free speech is only important to many people when it helps them, and when they can hurt their enemies, they will not want it anymore because they think they're covered.

15 years ago, liberals championed free speech. Now that they think they are making all the rules, they're ok with punishing people who disagree with them.

tl;dr

"Republicans and conservatives are bad so we don't want them to have free speech because we don't like them."
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There have been and always will be limits to free speech. Nothing is absolute.

Like everything else your freedom ends when it encroaches on everyone elses. For the most part you can say what you want but if youre encouraging violence or promoting hate and intolerance towards groups you dont like then you give up that privilege.
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Social media (especially Twitter) should either stay neutral or just say no politics period. As for YT, blame the advertisers themselves which are even more scared than shareholders, YT actually has tried to defend free speech and thus it's primarily the advertisers that push YT to censor, they need to be taught to top freaking out over every little trivial controversy.
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LeetCheet posted...

I think it's awful.

But apparently it's considered ok to shut down your competitors from expressing their free speech on what's supposed to be public platforms.

Im alright with it. These are all private companies. Theyre allowed to essentially ask you to leave the same way a physical establishment can remove you if you start saying stuff they dont approve of.

Now if you want to have the debate that these platforms should be considered public spaces and therefore no censorship should occur, you can do that. But right now theyre private and are allowed to determine what content fits with the image they want to portray.
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LeetCheet posted...

_AdjI_ posted...

Youtube is just a mess. Not because censorship is evil or anything, but because Google insists on trying to solve any perceived problems with hamfisted algorithms that almost invariably create new problems without solving the ones they were meant to fix and are ripe for abusive exploitation. Youtube is getting harder and harder to create content for, which is a real problem, and the only reason that's happening is because Google's gotten lazy and complacent riding on the success of Pewdiepie and a handful of other mega-hits.

Doesn't YouTube(and other companies) hate Pewds now though?

I'm pretty sure they don't want him around because he represents "new media" while youtube would rather support traditional media.
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Mead posted...

Like everything else your freedom ends when it encroaches on everyone elses. For the most part you can say what you want but if youre encouraging violence or promoting hate and intolerance towards groups you dont like then you give up that privilege.

Youtube is a lot more strict than that. One channel I watch covered a Sandy Hook "truther" and debunked his stupid theories. Then they got a strike for promoting conspiracy theories. That's kind of fucked up, no? News networks like CNN and FOX are apparently exempt from this sort of thing.
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They're hitting right wingers who constantly fear monger about immigrants, but the thing about that is they're big corporations that probably shouldn't be trusted in filtering speech.
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The only reason it is a concern in the first place is YouTube has gotten so big that there are no viable alternatives. Bitchute and Daily Motion are the closest, but they are nowhere near as big as YouTube. Twitter is sort of the same way, but there are more alternatives to that.
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LeetCheet posted...

I think it's awful.

But apparently it's considered ok to shut down your competitors from expressing their free speech on what's supposed to be public platforms.

Except they're not "public platforms", they're privately owned websites. When you join a website, you agree to abide by their terms and conditions, and that includes agreeing to abiding to what they determine to be acceptable speech.

GrimCyclone posted...

15 years ago, liberals championed free speech. Now that they think they are making all the rules, they're ok with punishing people who disagree with them.

"Republicans and conservatives are bad so we don't want them to have free speech because we don't like them."

You could replace liberals with conservatives and Republicans and conservatives with Democrats and liberals and it would be just as right. Both sides think only their side should be allowed to talk and the other side silenced.
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Yes youre right, Ty. Conservatives used to be just as bad as libs are trying to be now with censorship. And the minute they start up again, Ill light into their ass. But personally, I think its endgame. I think the liberals will take over soon or there will be a civil split. But there are far too many against them to just let them have 100% of what they want.

Then again, if history repeats itself, itll just be a slow march into authoritarianism and decadence and the US will dissolve. Im thinking well be conquered from the inside by China.

But in the end I think the liberals will win or there will be a war. Why? Because they never stop fighting and complaining. The noisy part gets the grease. Theyll eventually get their way.

Personally, I dont give a fuck anymore. I just wanted freedom, but I guess thats alt-right propaganda. You know, since being a libertarian means Im alt-right now.
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Mead posted...

There have been and always will be limits to free speech. Nothing is absolute.

Like everything else your freedom ends when it encroaches on everyone elses. For the most part you can say what you want but if youre encouraging violence or promoting hate and intolerance towards groups you dont like then you give up that privilege.

And all of that is just your opinion.
I could list my version too.

Its absolute until you change it. Aside from the bullshit back and forth argument about what free speech is that Im not going to waste my time arguing with you on, the real issue is who will change it or who will stop it from being changed.

I want to write free speech into stone. I DO NOT want to keep widdling away at it with my liberal values until it merely suits my goddam purposes.

You seem to forget maybe other people have different ideas than you. You of all people on a goddam website like this trying to give me the ultimate codified version of what free speech is. You gotta be fucking kidding me. Has it been so long that you just heard enough Stephen Colbert and Jon Stewart than you dont even question your goddam logic anymore? Or do those other half of the country men and women just all fall beneath your GameFAQs tier intellect? Please.

Ill have you know Ive been in the ivory towers of academy with great men of old than would shit all over you and the rest of your friends here intellectually speaking. I know Im right. I may not be able to run you off embarrassed like they would 1) because I am too lazy and youre not worth it and 2) all youd do is just stop talking about not give a damn if you found it you were wrong.

So lets cut the shit. You dont give a damn about free speech. If you did you wouldnt spout the rhetoric your contemporaries have taught you. True classically educated people who have learned the merit of free speech dont talk about how it has limits.

The only reason you even hang on to it at all is because of the Civil Rights movement in the 60s and the push for free speech back then. Its like a bug of a bygone era you cannot wait to die off so you can tell half of us that were obsolete.

And that is why youre the problem. Because Im not trying to get rid of you or liberals. But you definitely are trying to excise me and people like me. In a free country to the dispassionate man, the only enemy of our state would be you.

You see why I dont waste my time here anymore? You people have even started to abandon free fucking speech. Remember this shit you say so you can see how much youve moved in 20 years while still claiming to be right

Youre a common joes opinion on your best goddam day. The only problem is, you cant accept that. And you definitely cant accept those opinions of your fellow man. Im sorry you hate half our fucking country. But woe is me. A 30s-something snark poster in 2019 on GameFAQs has got the 411 on righteous post-modern ethics.

Give me a fucking break.
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LinkPizza posted...

All the youtubers are scared of cursing now. Well, not all of them. But a good chunk. Even one guy who reads reddit post is scared. Mainly because he doesnt want his videos to be demonetized...

well they don't have to be scared. there are other jobs out there....or maybe there isn't.
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But you definitely are trying to excise me and people like me.

If youre actively promoting hate or violence, then yeah, youre damn right right. That goes for anyone on either end of the political spectrum.
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- Social media is not public. It is the users fault for using bad platforms. Create a new platform without these censorship issues.
- The First Amendment protects you from the government limiting your speech.
- Corporations do not have to adhere to the First Amendment.

This is consumer's fault for not mass boycotting and being responsible adults. This is also the fault of media influencers who see nothing wrong with manipulating people for money.
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Censorship is bad, especially when it's just to silence someone you don't agree with even though they aren't doing anything worth being censored over

And to anyone saying "it's a private company so blah blah blah." Remember that legality=/=morality
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Dikitain posted...

The only reason it is a concern in the first place is YouTube has gotten so big that there are no viable alternatives. b****ute and Daily Motion are the closest, but they are nowhere near as big as YouTube. Twitter is sort of the same way, but there are more alternatives to that.

Even though I'm indifferent about censorship on private forums/social media/media, etc. I'll agree with you that some are so big that the alternatives are akin to nothing.
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Muscles posted...

Censorship is bad, especially when it's just to silence someone you don't agree with even though they aren't doing anything worth being censored over

And to anyone saying "it's a private company so blah blah blah." Remember that legality=/=morality

So you think antifa members posting videos encouraging people to burn cars and destroy property is morally right?
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That's quite the stretch from what I said
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Mead posted...

Muscles posted...

Censorship is bad, especially when it's just to silence someone you don't agree with even though they aren't doing anything worth being censored over

And to anyone saying "it's a private company so blah blah blah." Remember that legality=/=morality

So you think antifa members posting videos encouraging people to burn cars and destroy property is morally right?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QG13mzYzBZo" data-time="
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dedbus posted...

Free speech doesn't count under private ownership.

You're thinking of the First Amendment. Free speech is a principle and it absolutely *can* function on privately owned platforms, even if there's no legal guarantee to it.

GrimCyclone posted...

15 years ago, liberals championed free speech. Now that they think they are making all the rules, they're ok with punishing people who disagree with them.

Modern liberals have been against free speech for much longer than 15 years. Before SJWs were a thing, you had the PC police.

Actual liberalism died way longer than 15 years ago.
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I think theres a lot of censorship that goes on here.

Mead posted...

Muscles posted...

Censorship is bad, especially when it's just to silence someone you don't agree with even though they aren't doing anything worth being censored over

And to anyone saying "it's a private company so blah blah blah." Remember that legality=/=morality

So you think antifa members posting videos encouraging people to burn cars and destroy property is morally right?

People on the left are openly tweeting about it being ok to use violence on anyone who's pro-Trump and hurting white people just because they're white though.
How come they don't get modded for promoting violence against a certain kind of people?

And it really shouldn't matter if its a privately owned company, they should still stay neutral and let people have their right of free speech because censorship absolutely impacts politics and other things.

Why are people even defending the hugeass corporations anyway? Most of them are pure evil.
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I think unbiased censorship is fine. As in removing offensive or objectively unhealthy content. It's when you pick and choose to support a particular agenda that you get into dangerous territory, as you've removed dissenting opinions, like the Nazis, Soviet Union, etc.

LeetCheet posted...

Mead posted...

Muscles posted...

Censorship is bad, especially when it's just to silence someone you don't agree with even though they aren't doing anything worth being censored over

And to anyone saying "it's a private company so blah blah blah." Remember that legality=/=morality

So you think antifa members posting videos encouraging people to burn cars and destroy property is morally right?

People on the left are openly tweeting about it being ok to use violence on anyone who's pro-Trump and hurting white people just because they're white though.
How come they don't get modded for promoting violence against a certain kind of people?

And it really shouldn't matter if its a privately owned company, they should still stay neutral and let people have their right of free speech because censorship absolutely impacts politics and other things.

Why are people even defending the hugeass corporations anyway? Most of them are pure evil.

Its their site and their rules. You dont go into someones house and demand to be able to say or do anything you want just because you dont like their house rules.
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Mead posted...

Free speech doesnt apply to privately run websites.

It's a privately owned public square so it's kind of a new scenario that we're just now learning how to deal with. I think it's funny how leftists will complain about corporations until it involves shutting down free speech of people they dont like. Clearly, you just dont value free speech much at all

I think the censorship is really gonna come back to bite these corporate technocrats in the ass though

And let's not pretend we dont know Google are using algorithms to push certain content to the front. They're using their power over the internet and information to snuff out competitors. And if you care so much about outside forces like the Russians rigging election, you should be even more concerned with Google and Facebook's power over the internet and our access to information.

And let's not pretend they didnt mass ban conservatives like Alex Jones because of their ability to sway voters. These companies are clearly working with the government. It's already known they censor content for the Chinese government. You'd be naive to think it's any different here

Black Pigeon Speaks has been unbanned
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