Current Events > Nintendo sues Switch emulator Yuzu

(+) Yeah! (+)

https://www.theverge.com/2024/2/27/24085075/nintendo-switch-emulator-yuzu-lawsuit

Nintendo truly is the Arasaka of IRL

If they succeed I can see them potentially chanting emulation law and setting a new precedent they make it harder for normal folks to do emulation

Fuck Nintendo, they don't want you playing the library you own in better quality & performance. You're supposed to pay their tax & use their shitty UI & architecture

Current generation emulation is just too popularly used to pirate games, I don't see them getting away from Nintendo on this one

2Pacavelli posted...

If they succeed I can see them potentially chanting emulation law and setting a new precedent they make it harder for normal folks to do emulation

It's too bad. They cut away many places that have roms after they decided to release it themselves. Their library is barebones in comparison what it was.

This was settled decades ago. Nintendo can't win.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bleem!#Sony_lawsuit

They should not be able to strike down emulators unless they demonstrate intent to release the old material themselves. It sucks when emulation is literally the only way to play an old game without tracking down ancient hardware and software at potentially high prices and then on top of that, the emulation source gets shut down

For a lot of video game history, emulators have done more for preserving material than the actual companies have

Since yuzu is open source, it basically means anyone can just keep it going under a different name and stuff. This is Nintendo wanting to HURT the devs specifically.

If nintendo would rerelease old games so that i can easily access them i wouldnt emulate their shit.

But they refuse to, and im not gonna buy games for hundreds of dollars from scalpers

Zikten posted...

They should not be able to strike down emulators unless they demonstrate intent to release the old material themselves. It sucks when emulation is literally the only way to play an old game without tracking down ancient hardware and software at potentially high prices and then on top of that, the emulation source gets shut down

For a lot of video game history, emulators have done more for preserving material than the actual companies have

This isn't history though. This is about literally their most recent console that is still being worked on by Nintendo.

Tyranthraxus posted...

This was settled decades ago. Nintendo can't win.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bleem!#Sony_lawsuit

Yeah but Bleem, despite never losing, ended up being shut down.

Nintendo can win with a similar victory

Goldice posted...

Yeah but Bleem, despite never losing, ended up being shut down.

Nintendo can win with a similar victory

Yuzu is open source so they can't really shut it down.

Those dumbos make like $30000 a month off of Patreon, so I feel like that has to be pretty good ammunition for damages at least.

BlackOmnimon posted...

https://www.theverge.com/2024/2/27/24085075/nintendo-switch-emulator-yuzu-lawsuit

Nintendo truly is the Arasaka of IRL

Cyberpunk reference?

Tyranthraxus posted...

This was settled decades ago. Nintendo can't win.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bleem!#Sony_lawsuit

The particulars of this case slightly differ. PSX games weren't encrypted

mistymermaid posted...

The particulars of this case slightly differ. PSX games weren't encrypted

This lawsuit isn't alleging anything about encryption. It's 100% about facilitating piracy. But for legal purposes pirating encrypted data is the same as pirating unencrypted data so even if it was about encryption it wouldn't make a difference.

It begins.

So why havent they gone after Dolphin or Cemu as well?

Tyranthraxus posted...

This lawsuit isn't alleging anything about encryption. It's 100% about facilitating piracy. But for legal purposes pirating encrypted data is the same as pirating unencrypted data so even if it was about encryption it wouldn't make a difference.

Yes, Nintendo brings it up.

https://www.scribd.com/document/709016504/Nintendo-of-America-Inc-v-Tropic-Haze-LLC-1-24-Cv-00082-No-1-D-R-I-Feb-26-2024

Zikten posted...

They should not be able to strike down emulators unless they demonstrate intent to release the old material themselves. It sucks when emulation is literally the only way to play an old game without tracking down ancient hardware and software at potentially high prices and then on top of that, the emulation source gets shut down

For a lot of video game history, emulators have done more for preserving material than the actual companies have

Some people get weirdly mad at this type of thinking. Idk why

Mutahar bump: https://youtu.be/xZQXdiOdqf8?si=M8DaFDgGWrbi5RqW

This case would be disastrous for emulation as a whole, I wish I shared Tyranth's faith in the legal precedent when in America it doesn't mean shit anymore.

Nintendo's ridiculous about this sort of thing. Remember when they tried to sue game rental businesses?

Zikten posted...

They should not be able to strike down emulators unless they demonstrate intent to release the old material themselves.

Thats not how IP laws work.

ssb_yunglink2 posted...

If nintendo would rerelease old games so that i can easily access them i wouldnt emulate their shit.

But they refuse to, and im not gonna buy games for hundreds of dollars from scalpers

Oh they released some old games. And I bought some on a thing called Virtual Console and then they shut those down, on the Wii you cannot even redownload them anymore, surely 3DS and WiiU will follow. Sony still letting me buy and download old PS1 games. Same with Microsoft (though there are still some classic XBox games I want that aren't available).

TyVulpine posted...

Thats not how IP laws work.

It's almost like he said "should".

Killmonger posted...

So why havent they gone after Dolphin or Cemu as well?

Because those devs aren't stupid enough to as for MONEY.
Well..Dolphin tried to be that stupid, but pretty sure the lawyer they hired to sue Valve explained why they got refused.

Unless the emulator uses Nintendo's code or supplies the decryption keys, I don't think they have a leg to stand on here.

Trumble posted...

It's almost like he said "should".

Again, that's not how IP laws work. They don't work based on snowflake feelings. They work to protect a company's IP, regardless of how the public feels, pro-emulation or not.

voldothegr8 posted...

Unless the emulator uses Nintendo's code or supplies the decryption keys, I don't think they have a leg to stand on here.

Having a PATREON for the damn thing is quite a strong leg.

rexcrk posted...

Some people get weirdly mad at this type of thinking. Idk why

While I do think everyone should be able to control their own IP, even if that means destroying it completely like so many publishers for some reason want so badly to do...

I haven't forgotten the AM2R stunt, and I consequently kinda want every attempt Nintendo makes henceforth and forevermore to control their IP to be answered with "cry me a river."

When it leaves the realm of hobbyist and sort of underground community status and gets to be too well known, you're going to get pegged. That's how these lawyers operate... make noise and they will have to act.

RetuenOfDevsman posted...

While I do think everyone should be able to control their own IP, even if that means destroying it completely like so many publishers for some reason want so badly to do...

I haven't forgotten the AM2R stunt, and I consequently kinda want every attempt Nintendo makes henceforth and forevermore to control their IP to be answered with "cry me a river."

Microsoft controls their IP, nobody cries. Sony controls their IP, nobody cries. Disney controls their IP, nobody cries. Walmart controls their IP, nobody cries. Nintendo controls their IP, "WAAAAH! HOW DARE NINTENDO DO THAT! THAT'S SO UNFAIR!!!"

TyVulpine posted...

Microsoft controls their IP, nobody cries. Sony controls their IP, nobody cries. Disney controls their IP, nobody cries. Walmart controls their IP, nobody cries. Nintendo controls their IP, "WAAAAH! HOW DARE NINTENDO DO THAT! THAT'S SO UNFAIR!!!"

Precisely. They've earned my apathy in ways that nobody else has. It's the equivalent of me not lending money to a (former) friend who I witnessed drowning puppies for fun.

TyVulpine posted...

Microsoft controls their IP, nobody cries. Sony controls their IP, nobody cries. Disney controls their IP, nobody cries. Walmart controls their IP, nobody cries. Nintendo controls their IP, "WAAAAH! HOW DARE NINTENDO DO THAT! THAT'S SO UNFAIR!!!"

There is definitely a weird entitlement with Nintendo software. Some of it is just console and brand fan and hater shit, but also because Nintendo games stay popular and relevant, and then also because Nintendo rarely discounts their games that much.

TyVulpine posted...

Microsoft controls their IP, nobody cries. Sony controls their IP, nobody cries. Disney controls their IP, nobody cries. Walmart controls their IP, nobody cries. Nintendo controls their IP, "WAAAAH! HOW DARE NINTENDO DO THAT! THAT'S SO UNFAIR!!!"

You dont think people complain about disney distorting and straight up bastardizing IP law lmao

RetuenOfDevsman posted...

It's the equivalent of me not lending money to a (former) friend who I witnessed drowning puppies for fun.

Okay...
...
...
Because you can't play a Nintendo game they made a long time ago in a resolution you want or on a platform you like or some similar issue...

...
...
...it's like someone drowning puppies!!?

Torgo posted...

Okay...
...
...
Because you can't play a Nintendo game they made a long time ago in a resolution you want or on a platform you like or some similar issue...

...
...
...it's like someone drowning puppies!!?

No? Didn't you read the quote chain? I said the AM2R stunt was like someone drowning puppies.

Those sick freaks watched this guy pour his life into making that masterpiece for years, silently, and only when he had finished it did they send the C&D. Literally days later. Maybe even hours--I don't quite recall.

There's no way they didn't know. They just hate humanity and found a puppy to kick.

RetuenOfDevsman posted...

Precisely. They've earned my apathy in ways that nobody else has. It's the equivalent of me not lending money to a (former) friend who I witnessed drowning puppies for fun.

It must be sad being so thin-skinned to think everyone must cater to you and all laws must be changed to suit you. Smh

TyVulpine posted...

It must be sad being so thin-skinned to think everyone must cater to you and all laws must be changed to suit you. Smh

Now, you have no excuse for not reading. You're the guy that initially quoted me, lol.

Well what gets me is one of the very first things they say is that the purpose of the emulator is to facilitate piracy.

That's not what emulators are for. Emulation =/= piracy.

Now....... I can acknowledge that most people emulating are not dumping their own games. But..... people who own software, like a Nintendo switch game, are entitled to play it on whatever hardware/software can run it, not just a Nintendo switch. Emulation is not piracy.

DemonicChaosXX posted...

Having a PATREON for the damn thing is quite a strong leg.

So in this case, would Ryujinx be safe? Not exactly the same thing, but Atlus attempted to shut down RPSC3 (which also had a Patreon) and failed.

RetuenOfDevsman posted...

No? Didn't you read the quote chain? I said the AM2R stunt was like someone drowning puppies.

Those sick freaks watched this guy pour his life into making that masterpiece for years, silently, and only when he had finished it did they send the C&D. Literally days later. Maybe even hours--I don't quite recall.

There's no way they didn't know. They just hate humanity and found a puppy to kick.

Them waited for him to finish before sending the C&D is a courtesy. Most fan games do not get that kind of consideration. Once it's out there, it's out there.

They also literally had their own Metroid 2 remake in development at the same exact time.

JimmyFraska posted...

Well what gets me is one of the very first things they say is that the purpose of the emulator is to facilitate piracy.

That's not what emulators are for. Emulation =/= piracy.

Now....... I can acknowledge that most people emulating are not dumping their own games. But..... people who own software, like a Nintendo switch game, are entitled to play it on whatever hardware/software can run it, not just a Nintendo switch. Emulation is not piracy.

I think the issue here with Yuzu, and why they're getting sued and not the other Switch emulator, is that they make it pretty obvious that it's for piracy. Ignoring the theoretical you can actually legally dump your own games and BIOS (99% of people aren't doing this), they provide you with instructions on how to not do that and to instead pirate. That's the big mistake they made that other emulators largely haven't. I don't know how this particular case will play out but I don't think anyone needs to worry about Switch emulation disappearing since we already have at least one other emulator and it's better than Yuzu a lot of the time.

Killmonger posted...

So in this case, would Ryujinx be safe? Not exactly the same thing, but Atlus attempted to shut down RPSC3 (which also had a Patreon) and failed.

I think the biggest thing there is that they don't tell you how to pirate right on their site. There was this sort of understanding everyone had of we all pretend we're just legally archiving our games or playing indie games or whatever and things were pretty chill. But Yuzu just decided to go blantant and tell you how to pirate. Bad move. The Patreon often used promises of being able to play a new game with a supporter only build to generate more revenue.

Over a million copies of TotK were pirated a week before release. I hope Nintendo buries them and then the thieving, scumbags leeches will have to crawl out of their basements and try to make somewhat of a living to afford a game.

FZeroMaster posted...

Over a million copies of TotK were pirated a week before release. I hope Nintendo buries them and then the thieving, scumbags leeches will have to crawl out of their basements and try to make somewhat of a living to afford a game.

I feel bad for those million people experiencing such a mid game after their hype was so high.

The gaming industry truly needs to die for a little while, it's gotten so corporate that moves like this feel straight up Disney like

I dont know about Yuzu but isnt there already precedent that reverse engineering is 100% legal

Enclave posted...

I feel bad for those million people experiencing such a mid game after their hype was so high.

Noone cares what the human equivalent to a cockroach thinks about the games they steal.