Current Events > What is Hamas' endgame?

(+) Yeah! (+)

...people expect them to ID everybody and release the non-Israeli?
To them, everybody they see supports Israel and is thereby de facto the enemy.

indica posted...

Denying that Palestinians are heavily oppressed and generalizing that a minority of horrific actions represent the whole of that oppressed group are both really bad takes. I think you might need to reflect a little before posting next time...

Hamas is explicitly and anti-semetic terrorist group that wants to kill all the Jews. That's their goal. If you think you should be supporting Hamas, you should rethink your position.

Psuedo_Audacity posted...

Hamas is explicitly and anti-semetic terrorist group that wants to kill all the Jews. That's their goal.

Hamas is not the Palestinian people. Maybe comprehend the post before responding to it >_>

Psuedo_Audacity posted...

Hamas is explicitly and anti-semetic terrorist group that wants to kill all the Jews. That's their goal. If you think you should be supporting Hamas, you should rethink your position.

Palestine is very explicitly not Hamas.

Hamas the terrorist group vs. Israel the state in their eternal quest to see who can genocide "the other" the quickest.

indica posted...

Hamas is not the Palestinian people. Maybe comprehend the post before responding to it >_>

This topic is about Hamas, and the post you were responding to said "terrorist organization".

I think maybe you are having a Donny moment.

Background_Guy posted...

Okay well why did they do that to a civilian, regardless of their nationality? They're kidnapping and killing a bunch of civillians of a bunch of different nationalities.

Nobody said otherwise. Who are you even arguing with here?

Psuedo_Audacity posted...

This topic is about Hamas, and the post you were responding to said "terrorist organization".

I think maybe you are having a Donny moment.

Invokes Donald Trump, yet blindly supporting a white nationalist government clamoring for an ethnostate because they fell for an authoritarian government's obvious attempt at getting Israel to do its dirty work for them.

That is certainly a projection.

FinalBraveNUT posted...

I understand that murdering innocent women and children is unacceptable. That's all I need to understand.

But do you understand that the Israeli government actually does this in far higher numbers and has increasingly oppressed Palestinian civilians worse than they ever have since Bibi came back to power with the most racist and far-right coalition they've ever had? Because I doubt it.

SayHeyyShohei posted...

Invokes Donald Trump, yet blindly supporting a white nationalist government clamoring for an ethnostate because they fell for an authoritarian government's obvious attempt at getting Israel to do its dirty work for them.

That is certainly a projection.

Donny was a reference to a movie...

I think it's important to make the distinction that both Israel and Hamas are evil while also acknowledging that the innocents lost on both sides should not be used as propaganda for their own governments.

Psuedo_Audacity posted...

Donny was a reference to a movie...

Sure it is now, because you were caught projecting and would rather absolve yourself of that then admit you are running interference for a far right government.

Imagine not ignoring Shohei

Crimsoness posted...

Imagine not ignoring Shohei

What part did I mention upset you? The part where Hamas was evil or the part where Israel's government was evil?

SayHeyyShohei posted...

The solution would be to help Palestine's citizens in overthrowing Hamas. But Israel would have to admit they are citizens first.

The whole point of a two state solution is so the Palestinians dont HAVE to be citizens of Israel. Thats the entire problem. You have an entire ethnicity that doesnt want a one state solution where they have to share control of the land. They want to be a nation state all to themselves. There are about 5.5 million Arabs living in Gaza, West Bank, and Israel and about 6.5 Israeli Jews. The Arabs dont want to live in a state where they are a minority.

People really out here not 100% condemning the existence of a fundamentalist terrorist organization that is kidnapping, executing, raping, and parading the bodies of innocent people to include young women and children oof.. oooooooooof, big oof.. the biggest oof?

gamer167 posted...

People really out here not 100% condemning the existence of a fundamentalist terrorist organization that is kidnapping, executing, raping, and parading the bodies of innocent people to include young women and children oof.. oooooooooof, big oof.. the biggest oof?

Can you point these people out so I can tag them? I can't find them. Thanks.

FlyEaglesFly24 posted...

The whole point of a two state solution is so the Palestinians dont HAVE to be citizens of Israel. Thats the entire problem. You have an entire ethnicity that doesnt want a one state solution where they have to share control of the land. They want to be a nation state all to themselves. There are about 5.5 million Arabs living in Gaza, West Bank, and Israel and about 6.5 Israeli Jews. The Arabs dont want to live in a state where they are a minority.

Palestinians do not want a two state solution.

Psuedo_Audacity posted...

Again, living to the standard of right-wingers is not something I hold in high regard.

We shouldn't talk as if Trump is right, and therefore Palestine was right to throw a genocidal fit when being asked to accept refugees into their country.

I didn't say Trump was right. I said you're wrong for thinking most Americans would support a massive intake of refugees. It would never happen.

all this shit has predictably brought out the worst in terminally online discourse

hockeybub89 posted...

I didn't say Trump was right. I said you're wrong for thinking most Americans would support a massive intake of refugees. It would never happen.

The support for refugees has largely been the majority of democrats.

gamer167 posted...

People really out here not 100% condemning the existence of a fundamentalist terrorist organization that is kidnapping, executing, raping, and parading the bodies of innocent people to include young women and children oof.. oooooooooof, big oof.. the biggest oof?

I was assurred the war on terror had already been won, on this very internet in fact.

Psuedo_Audacity posted...

This topic is about Hamas, and the post you were responding to said "terrorist organization".

I think maybe you are having a Donny moment.

Maybe read through all the posts before embarassing yourself repeatedly. I was responding to someone who said that Gaza wasn't part of Palestine and was equating all Palestinians with terrorists. Is that your view as well? >_>

Delirious_Beard posted...

all this shit has predictably brought out the worst in terminally online discourse

From what I've seen it's basically been

"This is heinous" - Most people.
"Israel should be able to murder as many innocent people as they possibly can" - People solely defending Israel.

Psuedo_Audacity posted...

Palestinians do not want a two state solution.

Source? And don't post the 71% claim that is taken from results monitored by their own damn tyrannical government that the majority of them weren't even alive long enough to elect.

was equating all Palestinians with terrorists. Is that your view as well? >_>

He's doing everything possible to not deny it.

@indica

Kimbos_Egg posted...

Oh yes, keep defending terrorists who don't even live in Palestine.

I think he was talking about the terrorists that are the topic of conversation. I might think that because this topic is about Hamas, and he said terrorists.

I believe his post was suggesting people not go to bat for Hamas and push shitty propaganda to support their actions.

SayHeyyShohei posted...

Can you point these people out so I can tag them? I can't find them. Thanks.

In his mind, not 100% supporting Israel means that you 100% support Hamas.

Foppe posted...

In his mind, not 100% supporting Israel means that you 100% support Hamas.

The topic is literally about Hamas lmfao

Read the fucking topic title.

Psuedo_Audacity posted...

I think he was talking about the terrorists that are the topic of conversation. I might think that because this topic is about Hamas, and he said terrorists.

/facepalm

Do you need this repeated to you?

Oh yes, keep defending terrorists who don't even live in Palestine.

Shadow_Don posted...

The topic is literally about Hamas lmfao

Read the fucking topic title.

TIL, what is stated in the topic title could never possibly devolve into an argument about anything else

Stop trolling or re-read the posts lmao.

gamer167 posted...

People really out here not 100% condemning the existence of a fundamentalist terrorist organization that is kidnapping, executing, raping, and parading the bodies of innocent people to include young women and children oof.. oooooooooof, big oof.. the biggest oof?

I see plenty of people condemning both of them

Psuedo_Audacity posted...

@indica

I think he was talking about the terrorists that are the topic of conversation. I might think that because this topic is about Hamas, and he said terrorists.

I believe his post was suggesting people not go to bat for Hamas and push shitty propaganda to support their actions.

Possibly, but when you start with denying Palestinian homeland as even existing, it's hard to see that

Psuedo_Audacity posted...

Stop trolling or re-read the posts lmao.

COVxy classic projection again. This time telling others to re-read posts, when he still has trouble reading this one:

Oh yes, keep defending terrorists who don't even live in Palestine.

You're trying to bait me into calling you names to get this account suspended

https://www.youtube.com/post/UgkxRQYi05eCvp7GCNuSDR-YbQ9yS4inQ3eg

Psuedo_Audacity posted...

You're trying to bait me into calling you names to get this account suspended

This is certainly a rational take someone would make when seeing an innocuous post they disagreed with.

It doesnt matter how much the Hamas and hummus fight, theyre never going to get my 1999 sealed base set booster pack

https://imgur.com/a/UQWgGLK

Psuedo_Audacity posted...

You're trying to bait me into calling you names to get this account suspended

It took you long enough to figure out they were baiting you last time, when they refused to give their positions, reframed the argument, and then paraphrased your posts until the meaning and subject of the argument was lost pages behind that no mod was going to read... and then claimed you were for the murder of children.

You caught on now?

ClayGuida posted...

From what I've seen it's basically been

"This is heinous" - Most people.
"Israel should be able to murder as many innocent people as they possibly can" - People solely defending Israel.

Then you might want to try opening your eyes

>occupies country illegally based on shaky claims
>Doesn't acknowledge the indigenous peoples heritage of the land, labeling them "Arab" even though they aren't from or in the Arabian peninsula
>Claims heritage despite centuries of intermixing
>Kicks native people from their land, forcing them to least valuable parts.
>Proceeds to continue doing that
>indigenous people fight back
>Get brutally crushed and the oppression keeps occuring
>Religious extremist take over the resistance group
>The current situation

What I'm getting at this that Israel holds the keys to all it's problems and built the lock that is it's problem.

Alteres posted...

It took you long enough to figure out they were baiting you last time, when they refused to give their positions, reframed the argument, and then paraphrased your posts until the meaning and subject of the argument was lost pages behind that no mod was going to read... and then claimed you were for the murder of children.

You caught on now?

When the fuck did I do any of this? He was responding to me.

Alteres posted...

It took you long enough to figure out they were baiting you last time, when they refused to give their positions, reframed the argument, and then paraphrased your posts until the meaning and subject of the argument was lost pages behind that no mod was going to read... and then claimed you were for the murder of children.

You caught on now?

Of course I've known this. Just when I have an account to spare I'll continue to speak my piece. Now I don't, so I'll stop responding to that poster.

FlyEaglesFly24 posted...

Then you might want to try opening your eyes

So which one are you?

StateofZen posted...

>occupies country illegally based on shaky claims
>Doesn't acknowledge the indigenous peoples heritage of the land, labeling them "Arab" even though they aren't from or in the Arabian peninsula
>Claims heritage despite centuries of intermixing
>Kicks native people from their land, forcing them to least valuable parts.
>Proceeds to continue doing that
>indigenous people fight back
>Get brutally crushed and the oppression keeps occuring
>Religious extremist take over the resistance group
>The current situation

What I'm getting at this that Israel holds the keys to all it's problems and built the lock that is it's problem.

Like I said before. Hamas and the government Israel share a common goal.

SayHeyyShohei posted...

Like I said before. Hamas and the government Israel share a common goal.

They do, they'd rather be in a perpetual war, so it's impossible for their citizens to supplant them with new leadership.

Alteres posted...

It took you long enough to figure out they were baiting you last time, when they refused to give their positions, reframed the argument, and then paraphrased your posts until the meaning and subject of the argument was lost pages behind that no mod was going to read... and then claimed you were for the murder of children.

You caught on now?

Pretty sure he was responding to me yesterday and it sucks he was suspended but nobody put words in his mouth.

Saying that the outcome is "unclear" when children die as the result of collateral damage is kind of bad imo.

But yea the people itt who refuse to see hamas for what it is are fucking batshit crazy. Like you can literally just post their political charters and the words of their leaders explicitly saying they want to eradicate Jews and people don't seem to understand why that can't be negotiated with.

Shadow_Don posted...

Pretty sure he was responding to me yesterday and it sucks he was suspended but nobody put words in his mouth.

Saying that the outcome is "unclear" when children die as the result of collateral damage is kind of bad imo.

But yea the people itt who refuse to see hamas for what it is are fucking batshit crazy. Like you can literally just post their political charters and the words of their leaders explicitly saying they want to eradicate Jews and people don't seem to understand why that can't be negotiated with.

The problem is, I don't think there's anyone itt who are incapable of seeing Hamas for who they are. I don't think this ever was a topic of contention. But you have to excuse me, I joined this topic late.

ClayGuida posted...

So which one are you?

I live in reality.

Where a sovereign state recognized by the United Nations has the right to defend itself against terrorism, and while it has the responsibility to limit civilian casualties as much as possible, you also just cant sit there and let the enemy shoot at you without a response.

But I dont expect people that bitch and moan on a video game forum about the most complex conflict on the planet to join me there. So by all means, continue to demonize. I know where it comes from.

FlyEaglesFly24 posted...

Where a sovereign state recognized by the United Nations

Probably should have stopped typing after this one. But I'll entertain you for a bit.

FlyEaglesFly24 posted...

has the right to defend itself against terrorism

By apparently attacking and solely attacking the citizens the terrorist state is oppressing prior to said state terrorists committing an atrocious act of their own.

and while it has the responsibility to limit civilian casualties as much as possible, you also just cant sit there and let the enemy shoot at you without a response.

You're right. Being that Israel and Palestine's people both hate Hamas, they should work with each other to have the government overthrown and to instill the two state solution both want.

Oh wait. It was never about Hamas for one of these parties.

FlyEaglesFly24 posted...

I live in reality.

Where a sovereign state recognized by the United Nations has the right to defend itself against terrorism, and while it has the responsibility to limit civilian casualties as much as possible, you also just cant sit there and let the enemy shoot at you without a response.

But I dont expect people that bitch and moan on a video game forum about the most complex conflict on the planet to join me there. So by all means, continue to demonize. I know where it comes from.

Wait, are you saying that lobbing missiles into residential buildings, children's hospitals, and press buildings somehow means Israel is defending itself from an attack that happened yesterday?

Care to explain how those actions retroactively stop an attack that has already happened?

This isn't about defending yourself, they had a chance and their intelligence failed. This is about retaliation and vengeance.