Current Events > Senate denies RR workers sick pay and makes striking ILLEGAL!!!

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WingsOfGood
12/02/22 11:27:45 AM
#1:


https://www.forbes.com/sites/saradorn/2022/12/01/ senate-approves-contract-to-avert-rail-strike-but- denies-unions-request-for-more-sick-leave/?sh=67263a7e7d6b

In a separate 52-43 vote, the Senate rejected seven days of paid sick leave for rail workers, who have complained that current policies keep them on call for days or weeks at a time and penalize those who call out sick.

GET IN LINE!!!

You exist to feed our wallets!
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TheGoldenEel
12/02/22 11:28:40 AM
#2:


fuck joe biden

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WingsOfGood
12/02/22 11:29:02 AM
#3:


Progressive lawmakers sided with the rail companies and introduced amendments to include the paid sick leave in the contract. But the unions have little recourse now that the Senate has approved the deal without the new sick leave policy. If Congress imposes the terms of our next contract, then pursuant to the Railway Labor Act, thats the end of the line, Brotherhood of Maintenance of Way Employees Spokesperson Clark Ballew told Forbes this week, citing the 1926 labor law that gives the federal government the power to intervene in railroad contract disputes.

Crucial Quote
The issue is paid sick leave, Sen. Bernie Sanders (I-Vt.) said on the Senate floor Thursday. They are one of the few industries in America today that have zero sick paid leave. Unbelievably, if a worker on the rail industry today gets sick, that worker gets a mark for missing work and can, and in some cases will, be fired.
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TheGreatEscape
12/02/22 11:30:28 AM
#4:


US work laws are so laughable holy shit

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FaultyCircuitry
12/02/22 11:30:31 AM
#5:


Time for them to strike now. Don't back down.

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WingsOfGood
12/02/22 11:31:13 AM
#6:


FaultyCircuitry posted...
Time for them to strike now. Don't back down.

they go to jail

can lose their pensions

stuff like that
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FaultyCircuitry
12/02/22 11:34:03 AM
#7:


WingsOfGood posted...
they go to jail

can lose their pensions

stuff like that

What are they going to do? Arrest every rail worker and put themselves in the same situation of having no rail workers as a strike would have done?

I know the pressure will be there on enough of them that they no longer will, but now is the best time to prove that they will not back down and to demonstrate the power of united labor.

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TheGoldenEel
12/02/22 11:34:39 AM
#8:


FaultyCircuitry posted...
What are they going to do? Arrest every rail worker and put themselves in the same situation of having no rail workers as a strike would have done?

I know the pressure will be there on enough of them that they no longer will, but now is the best time to prove that they will not back down and to demonstrate the power of united labor.
Thats easy for us to say from the comfort of our homes

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Jagr_68
12/02/22 11:35:12 AM
#9:


So the new deal includes no leave at all or just the minimum 4 days which was counteroffered?

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Tyranthraxus
12/02/22 11:36:18 AM
#10:


Biden should veto

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ScazarMeltex
12/02/22 11:36:58 AM
#11:


WingsOfGood posted...
they go to jail

can lose their pensions

stuff like that
Doesn't change the fact that it needs to happen. It will absolutely destroy the supply chain and collapse the economy. With that as your leverage you can force them to the table. Nothing moves without the worker.
A huge chunk of strikes during the gilded age were illegal also, but they got shit done.

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Kain_Highwind
12/02/22 11:37:01 AM
#12:


Tyranthraxus posted...
Biden should veto
lol he supports this

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WingsOfGood
12/02/22 11:37:11 AM
#13:


FaultyCircuitry posted...
What are they going to do? Arrest every rail worker and put themselves in the same situation of having no rail workers as a strike would have done?

I know the pressure will be there on enough of them that they no longer will, but now is the best time to prove that they will not back down and to demonstrate the power of united labor.

Well the fatcats hope most will not strike due to the fear. The few who do can be HEAVILY
HEAVILY penalized and made an example

Sure, if they all strike it becomes harder to do this but they would still try

This is about power and control and the government is already sticking its nose in there saying "this is OUR power and CONTROL!"

Do you think if they all striked and they try to wipe their pensions Biden would be on the side of the workers all the sudden? Or these sentators?
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Questionmarktarius
12/02/22 11:37:18 AM
#14:


Tyranthraxus posted...
Biden should veto
Biden is going to sit on it until the 9th.
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Ar0ge
12/02/22 11:40:19 AM
#15:


So you guys want the supply chain and economy to get worse than it already is?
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WingsOfGood
12/02/22 11:42:12 AM
#16:


Ar0ge posted...
So you guys want the supply chain and economy to get worse than it already is?

If that is what it takes to give basic human rights to these workers.

But thing is, it shouldn't take that. Congress should passed law to give them their sick days.

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ScazarMeltex
12/02/22 11:42:43 AM
#17:


Ar0ge posted...
So you guys want the supply chain and economy to get worse than it already is?
If it secures the rights of workers, the people who actually make your economy work, absolutely. I say that as a guy whose job is entirely dependent on the supply chain working. I'm already spending two weeks furloughed in December because of supply chain issues.

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Doe
12/02/22 11:42:56 AM
#18:


Ar0ge posted...
So you guys want the supply chain and economy to get worse than it already is?
The choices are
1) Nothing happens to the supply chain and workers lose their jobs if they get sick
2) Nothing happens to the supply chain and workers don't become homeless for getting sick

Why do you hate railroad workers @Ar0ge?

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FortuneCookie
12/02/22 11:42:58 AM
#19:


WingsOfGood posted...
they go to jail

Once upon a time, someone could go to jail for refusing to move to the back of the bus. When the law is corrupt, breaking the law because ethical.

But that's easy for me to say. I'm not in the line of fire.
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Kain_Highwind
12/02/22 11:43:03 AM
#20:


Ar0ge posted...
So you guys want the supply chain and economy to get worse than it already is?
What's so bad about giving people sick days

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TheGoldenEel
12/02/22 11:44:29 AM
#21:


Ar0ge posted...
So you guys want the supply chain and economy to get worse than it already is?
The only options werent

fuck the rail workers

or

destroy the economy

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Kami_no_Kami
12/02/22 11:44:33 AM
#22:


Fuck we need a fresh start. This shit is revolting.
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#23
Post #23 was unavailable or deleted.
#24
Post #24 was unavailable or deleted.
FaultyCircuitry
12/02/22 11:44:54 AM
#25:


Ar0ge posted...
So you guys want the supply chain and economy to get worse than it already is?

If it gives power to labor in this country? Absolutely.

Temporary economic consequences are worth the cost it takes to empower the working class.

Also yes, I'm aware it's not likely to happen because livelihoods are on the line as well as retirements

Still doesn't change that striking now would be a long term HUGE victory for labor


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Jagr_68
12/02/22 11:45:27 AM
#26:


Kami_no_Kami posted...
Fuck we need a fresh start. This shit is revolting.

An entire generation of politicians would need to be phased out first.

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LightHawKnight
12/02/22 11:45:45 AM
#27:


Still dont get how republicans can literally screw over their voters and they take it.

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WingsOfGood
12/02/22 11:46:20 AM
#28:


Kain_Highwind posted...
What's so bad about giving people sick days

https://nymag.com/intelligencer/2022/11/rail-strike-why-the-railroads-wont-give-in-on-paid-leave-psr-precision-scheduled-railroading.html


Why do these rail barons hate paid leave so much? Why would a company have no problem handing out 24 percent raises, $1,000 bonuses, and caps on health-care premiums but draw the line on providing a benefit as standard and ubiquitous throughout modern industry as paid sick days?

The answer, in short, is P.S.R. or precision-scheduled railroading.

P.S.R. is an operational strategy that aims to minimize the ratio between railroads operating costs and their revenues through various cost-cutting and (ostensibly) efficiency-increasing measures. The basic idea is to transport more freight using fewer workers and railcars.

One way to do this is to make trains longer: A single 100-car train requires less track space than two 50-car ones since you need to maintain some distance between the latter. More critically, one very long train requires fewer crew members to run than two medium ones.

Another way to get more with less is to streamline scheduling so that trains are running at full capacity as often as possible.

All this has worked out poorly for rail workers writ large. Over the past six years, Americas major freight carriers have shed 30 percent of their employees. To compensate for this lost staffing, remaining workers must tolerate irregular schedules and little time off since the railroads dont have much spare labor capacity left.
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WingsOfGood
12/02/22 11:48:09 AM
#29:


Americas major freight carriers have shed 30 percent of their employees. To compensate for this lost staffing, remaining workers must tolerate irregular schedules and little time off


p-p-p-p-p-p-rofits!!!!!!!
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DarkBuster22904
12/02/22 12:01:06 PM
#30:


Ar0ge posted...
So you guys want the supply chain and economy to get worse than it already is?
Absolutely.

The economy NEEDS to absolutely tank. It's current state is deplorable. We've got situations like this, where people as essential as railroad workers risk getting fired of they ever, EVER get sick.

We've got CEOs getting hundred million dollar bonuses while their rank-and-file can't afford to eat at the company cafeteria.

We've got thousands of people providing essential services for literal poverty wages.

Even small businesses try to use their "small business" defense to JUSTIFY poverty wages, because somehow Jeff and Jan's dream of owning a dry cleaner means they're entitled to a worker living with their parents on cheap Ramen, for life.

We've got slashed benefits across the board. We've got an entire generation that barely understands what a pension IS, nevermind having any hope of getting one.

Wages have stagnated so hard that the median income hasn't budged in almost 50 years.

We've got thinkpieces from major economic publications telling us that homeownership is a thing of the past, and we should embrace renting forever as some "new frontier."

This economy absolutely needs to crash and burn. It will be absolutely shitty for a while, but its not like it's gonna get any better otherwise.


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ScazarMeltex
12/02/22 12:06:24 PM
#31:


DarkBuster22904 posted...
Absolutely.

The economy NEEDS to absolutely tank. It's current state is deplorable. We've got situations like this, where people as essential as railroad workers risk getting fired of they ever, EVER get sick.

We've got CEOs getting hundred million dollar bonuses while their rank-and-file can't afford to eat at the company cafeteria.

We've got thousands of people providing essential services for literal poverty wages.

Even small businesses try to use their "small business" defense to JUSTIFY poverty wages, because somehow Jeff and Jan's dream of owning a dry cleaner means they're entitled to a worker living with their parents on cheap Ramen, for life.

We've got slashed benefits across the board. We've got an entire generation that barely understands what a pension IS, nevermind having any hope of getting one.

Wages have stagnated so hard that the median income hasn't budged in almost 50 years.

We've got thinkpieces from major economic publications telling us that homeownership is a thing of the past, and we should embrace renting forever as some "new frontier."

We've got oil and energy companies flagrantly war-profiteering, netting all time record profits while simultaneously wringing their caps and pleading poverty as an excuse for doubling gas prices.

We've got insulin costing $5 a bottle to manufacture, flat, ever since its invention, but raising its price by 15-18% year-on-year just because they can.

We've got politicians incentivized to let this shit continue, because they're free to perform basically insider trading based on their policy decisions.

This economy absolutely needs to crash and burn. It will be absolutely shitty for a while, but its not like it's gonna get any better otherwise.
Yep. Sometimes you have to knock shit down to build something better on top of the ruins.

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s0nicfan
12/02/22 12:08:18 PM
#32:


I don't know why this needed another topic, but people should be aware that the TC's intentionally omitting some pretty critical information on this topic, primarily that the railroad workers are getting literally everything else they asked for as part of negotiations which includes a 24% pay raise, bonuses paid out over multiple years, and a cap on how much they have to contribute towards health care. It was a huge win for them on everything except sick leave, but some people seem to really like pretending like all they were negotiating for was sick leave and they got nothing.

Edit:
https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-63814432
The deal included 24% raises - the most in more than 40 years - and $5,000 in bonuses stretched over a series of annual payments. While employees would be expected to pay a larger portion of their health insurance costs, premiums would be restricted to a maximum of 15%.

I'll also point out that the deal brokered was based on the Unions' own preferences and it seems like sick days was the only remaining holdout. They got everything else they wanted.
The issue of paid sick leave was contentious during prior negotiations, with the unions - which had previously expressed a preference for higher wages and strong disability benefits over sick days - arguing that the immensely profitable railroad companies could afford them with minimal impact.

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xXfireglzXx
12/02/22 12:14:01 PM
#33:


Ar0ge posted...
So you guys want the supply chain and economy to get worse than it already is?

Do you understand the dynamics of a hostage situation?

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WingsOfGood
12/02/22 12:15:28 PM
#34:


s0nicfan posted...
I don't know why this needed another topic, but people should be aware that the TC's intentionally omitting some pretty critical information on this topic, primarily that the railroad workers are getting literally everything else they asked for as part of negotiations which includes a 24% pay raise, bonuses paid out over multiple years, and a cap on how much they have to contribute towards health care. It was a huge win for them on everything except sick leave, but some people seem to really like pretending like all they were negotiating for was sick leave and they got nothing.

Edit:
https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-63814432

I'll also point out that the deal brokered was based on the Unions' own preferences and it seems like sick days was the only remaining holdout. They got everything else they wanted.


way to out yourself lmao

imagine bootlicking RailRoad Barons and pretending IT IS OK THEY CANNOT CALL IN SICK EVER

THEY SHOULDN'T GET SICK

WOW
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TheGoldenEel
12/02/22 12:16:29 PM
#35:


s0nicfan posted...
I don't know why this needed another topic, but people should be aware that the TC's intentionally omitting some pretty critical information on this topic, primarily that the railroad workers are getting literally everything else they asked for as part of negotiations which includes a 24% pay raise, bonuses paid out over multiple years, and a cap on how much they have to contribute towards health care. It was a huge win for them on everything except sick leave, but some people seem to really like pretending like all they were negotiating for was sick leave and they got nothing.

Edit:
https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-63814432

I'll also point out that the deal brokered was based on the Unions' own preferences and it seems like sick days was the only remaining holdout. They got everything else they wanted.
Now, why do you think they still were holding out?

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Ar0ge
12/02/22 12:16:40 PM
#36:


... I don't hate the workers. They already got most of what they wanted, and I absolutely think they should get their sick leave and I'm hoping that can be worked on later, but not at the cost of destroying the lives of most people in this country by halting the supply chain and destroying the economy even more. Wtf?

How is that a solution to anything? As if things will just be "built better" afterward. That's not how it works.

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WingsOfGood
12/02/22 12:17:22 PM
#37:


WingsOfGood posted...
Why do these rail barons hate paid leave so much? Why would a company have no problem handing out 24 percent raises, $1,000 bonuses, and caps on health-care premiums but draw the line on providing a benefit as standard and ubiquitous throughout modern industry as paid sick days?


also

s0nicfan posted...
TC's intentionally omitting some pretty critical information


LMAO

YOU CAUGHT LYING

LYING
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Paragon21XX
12/02/22 12:17:23 PM
#38:


FaultyCircuitry posted...
Time for them to strike now. Don't back down.
Gee, and jack up prices of everything more than the 24% raise they managed to get from the railroads?

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EmbraceOfDeath
12/02/22 12:19:03 PM
#39:


Ar0ge posted...
... I don't hate the workers. They already got most of what they wanted, and I absolutely think they should get their sick leave and I'm hoping that can be worked on later, but not at the cost of destroying the lives of most people in this country by halting the supply chain and destroying the economy even more. Wtf?
Is this some new fucking Duncan alt with this level of fearmongering? Goddamn, get a reality check.

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xXfireglzXx
12/02/22 12:20:13 PM
#40:


Ar0ge posted...
... I don't hate the workers. They already got most of what they wanted, and I absolutely think they should get their sick leave and I'm hoping that can be worked on later, but not at the cost of destroying the lives of most people in this country by halting the supply chain and destroying the economy even more. Wtf?

How is that a solution to anything? As if things will just be "built better" afterward. That's not how it works.

What's to stop the government from holding the economy hostage in future negotiations like they did this time? The precedent being set is honestly disastrous for the future of this country.

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WingsOfGood
12/02/22 12:21:00 PM
#41:


xXfireglzXx posted...
What's to stop the government from holding the economy hostage in future negotiations like they did this time? The precedent being set is honestly disastrous for the future of this country.

American Capitalism is let the future burn for the short term benefit
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Master_Bass
12/02/22 12:21:37 PM
#42:


Yeah, I read that article about why the railroad companies won't budge on the leave thing a couple days ago, and it's absolutely disgusting. We have to stop making everything beholden to the shareholders.

The railroad workers should absolutely strike still. Only that or an act of Congress will change things, and we all know who's side Congress is on.

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CARRRNE_ASADA
12/02/22 12:23:02 PM
#43:


Ar0ge posted...
So you guys want the supply chain and economy to get worse than it already is?


So fuck you while I'm good? Where's your empathy? You could be one of those workers.

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s0nicfan
12/02/22 12:23:08 PM
#44:


WingsOfGood posted...
way to out yourself lmao

imagine bootlicking RailRoad Barons and pretending IT IS OK THEY CANNOT CALL IN SICK EVER

THEY SHOULDN'T GET SICK

WOW

WingsOfGood posted...
also

LMAO

YOU CAUGHT LYING

LYING

Your gimmick isn't clever (or subtle) and your intentional bias is transparent. If you actually gave a shit about these issues more than your personal commitment to shitpost about them by riling people up you wouldn't need to be so disingenuous in your framing in the OP.

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WingsOfGood
12/02/22 12:24:01 PM
#45:


s0nicfan posted...
Your gimmick isn't clever (or subtle) and your intentional bias is transparent. If you actually gave a s*** about these issues more than your personal commitment to s***post about them by riling people up you wouldn't need to be so disingenuous in your framing in the OP.

You are the one with a gimmick. To bootlick capitalists every chance you get.

And you are willing to LIE

to do so

You got caught LYING in this thread

WOW
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bigblu89
12/02/22 12:24:36 PM
#46:


WingsOfGood posted...
If that is what it takes to give basic human rights to these workers.

But thing is, it shouldn't take that. Congress should passed law to give them their sick days.

I thought Congress did pass it? Thats why it was raised to the Senate.


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Master_Bass
12/02/22 12:26:19 PM
#47:


bigblu89 posted...
I thought Congress did pass it? Thats why it was raised to the Senate.
The House passed it. Congress refers to the House and Senate collectively. The Senate rejected it so Congress didn't pass it.

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Silver_Patron
12/02/22 12:29:17 PM
#48:


See? This is what I mean when I say America is a third world country disguised as a first world country.

A lot of countries in Europe are miles ahead of us in regards to worker rights

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Heineken14
12/02/22 12:30:00 PM
#49:


ScazarMeltex posted...
Yep. Sometimes you have to knock shit down to build something better on top of the ruins.


Do you honestly believe that is what will happen? Or do you think it will cause all the dumb dumbs to blame this on democrats, they vote for republicans and then.... it just keeps getting worse?

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WingsOfGood
12/02/22 12:31:22 PM
#50:


Silver_Patron posted...
See? This is what I mean when I say America is a third world country disguised as a first world country.

A lot of countries in Europe are miles ahead of us in regards to worker rights


You are correct.
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