Poll of the Day > You think pop music will ever go away from the mass produced garbage model?

(+) Yeah! (+)

Muscles posted...

What other people like has an impact on me, I wish I could go to a store without hearing garbage, or on commercials, it would also be nice to see talented artists that actually care about music make it big again, idc if people like Taylor swift but I don't want to hear her everywhere

It sounds like you want to only hear music you like on the radio and stuff. Not that you really care if something is garbage or not. If you don't like the song that's playing, change the channel. If it's in a store, wear headphones. Just because you don't like something or think it's garbage doesn't mean everybody else will agree with you... Nobody going to change stuff and stop making money to make you happy. And the store isn't going to change the song from a popular song that people like to one you want to hear because you hate popular things, or don't like it...
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Muscles posted...

What other people like has an impact on me, I wish I could go to a store without hearing garbage, or on commercials, it would also be nice to see talented artists that actually care about music make it big again, idc if people like Taylor swift but I don't want to hear her everywhere

muscles, you need to realize, you have bad opinions and no one cares what you like, ok?

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Muscles posted...

What other people like has an impact on me, I wish I could go to a store without hearing garbage, or on commercials, it would also be nice to see talented artists that actually care about music make it big again, idc if people like Taylor swift but I don't want to hear her everywhere

I wish I never had to hear country again, but I do. It's reality, while we have a political party dedicated to attempting to fight reality I don't suggest it.

Muscles posted...

What other people like has an impact on me, I wish I could go to a store without hearing garbage, or on commercials, it would also be nice to see talented artists that actually care about music make it big again, idc if people like Taylor swift but I don't want to hear her everywhere

you can listen your own music pretty much all the time dude

do you know about headphones

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LinkPizza posted...

It sounds like you want to only hear music you like on the radio and stuff. Not that you really care if something is garbage or not. If you don't like the song that's playing, change the channel. If it's in a store, wear headphones. Just because you don't like something or think it's garbage doesn't mean everybody else will agree with you... Nobody going to change stuff and stop making money to make you happy. And the store isn't going to change the song from a popular song that people like to one you want to hear because you hate popular things, or don't like it...

Why is it bad to want music to be made by the artists themselves? Why is it bad to want art to be artistic and not formulaic manufactured bs?

I don't call it garbage because I don't like it I call it garbage because it lacks integrity

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Muscles posted...

I don't call it garbage because I don't like it I call it garbage because it lacks integrity

so, you deemed yourself the one to judge the integrity of others? how noble of you, ok?

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I don't need to be a judge, the fact that they turned an art form into a soulless money making machine isn't up for debate

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Muscles posted...

I don't need to be a judge, the fact that they turned an art form into a soulless money making machine isn't up for debate

a lot of people enjoy popular music and consider some of it art even if you dont

just like your own stuff and stop acting like a brat about what other people like

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oh muscles, that obsession of painting yourself as a righteous savior of all we're to blind to see. how much have you smoked?

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Muscles posted...

I don't call it garbage because I don't like it I call it garbage because it lacks integrity

Quite a bit of art has been made for personal gain and 'lacks integrity'. That's the nature of the beast, there's always going to be someone wanting a buck, fame, etc.

It's like you're all intentionally missing the point, if it were original, such as Michael Jackson, instead of mass produced I wouldn't have an issue with it, my problem isn't with music I don't like or even pop music as a whole, or even the people that listen to it, its with the industry that went from scouting and signing artists to just getting some dude to write a formulaic beat and sign a pretty face with passable vocals

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Mead posted...

Michelangelo got paid 3000 ducats for The Sistine Chapel painting and people loved it

I guess he was just a sellout and shouldnt be considered an artist

He was painting shit from the Bible, fucking poser couldn't even bother to make up his own subject matter.

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Muscles posted...

It's like you're all intentionally missing the point, if it were original, such as Michael Jackson, instead of mass produced I wouldn't have an issue with it, my problem isn't with music I don't like or even pop music as a whole, or even the people that listen to it, its with the industry that went from scouting and signing artists to just getting some dude to write a formulaic beat and sign a pretty face with passable vocals

You've angered the hive mind, there is no escape.

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Muscles posted...

Why is it bad to want music to be made by the artists themselves? Why is it bad to want art to be artistic and not formulaic manufactured bs?

I don't call it garbage because I don't like it I call it garbage because it lacks integrity

Why is it so bad if other people don't care who wrote it? Why is it so bad that other people are fine with what you assume to be manufactured garbage?

Either way, you act like you're the only one who gets to decide what everybody should like. Why can people only like stuff you like?
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Muscles posted...

What other people like has an impact on me, I wish I could go to a store without hearing garbage, or on commercials, it would also be nice to see talented artists that actually care about music make it big again, idc if people like Taylor swift but I don't want to hear her everywhere

Quit your crying, Muscles.

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The record companies found out scientifically how to make catchy music. Expect them to run that into the ground forever.

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Muscles posted...

What other people like has an impact on me, I wish I could go to a store without hearing garbage, or on commercials, it would also be nice to see talented artists that actually care about music make it big again, idc if people like Taylor swift but I don't want to hear her everywhere

imagine this being a significant problem in your life

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dude if you had just stayed a high school sophomore your entire life I think youd be a pretty normal individual in comparison

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Muscles posted...

It's like you're all intentionally missing the point, if it were original, such as Michael Jackson, instead of mass produced I wouldn't have an issue with it

Muscles posted...

What other people like has an impact on me, I wish I could go to a store without hearing garbage

So as long as the music is written by the singer you don't care, but if the song sounds a certain way you do care. You're pushing conflicting viewpoints here.

Muscles posted...

it would also be nice to see talented artists that actually care about music make it big again, idc if people like Taylor swift but I don't want to hear her everywhere

You could argue Taylor Swift is talented and I imagine she cares about music. You're trying to portray your subjective opinion as objective.

Elton John barely wrote any of his songs, ok?

I guess that doesn't make him a true musician, ok?

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you really think Michael Jackson wrote all his songs LMAO

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Muscles posted...

I don't need to be a judge, the fact that they turned an art form into a soulless money making machine isn't up for debate

Music has always been a soulless money making machine. Bach's choral works - despite now being regarded as some of the most complex, intricate pieces of choral music ever written - were largely ignored in his lifetime because the masses (by which I mean the aristocracy, since the actual masses didn't have much to do with music until the advent and proliferation of recording and playback technologies) were more interested in complex keyboard works than complex choral ones. One of his contemporaries literally described some of his choral pieces as having "far too much art." Contemporary choral composers saw more success by dumbing down their choral pieces to be more accessible for the average chorister because those pieces were more widely performed and recognized during their lifetimes.

That was in the early 18th century. 300 years ago. As a professional industry, music has always favoured people who produce things that are popular over people who produce things that are technically or creatively demanding. Obviously, that paradigm has progressed and evolved as science and technology have enabled more effective, lower-effort means by which to act on it, which is why comparing The Messiah to Teenage Dream is more than a little silly, but the fundamental mentality is the same. In order to be significantly commercially successful (which is the only way to define any given era's "pop music"), composers have always and will always have to cater to the lowest common denominator, both on the performance end and the listening end.

Quite simply, you have two choices:

• Get over yourself and enjoy listening to the music you like (which will always exist) while letting other people like what they like
• Continue insisting that you're better than the unwashed masses that consume music you don't like and be miserable because nobody cares and nothing will ever change

Personally, I'd recommend the former, but then I've never been one for sacrificing happiness for the sake of a little impotent self-satisfaction. Your mileage may vary.

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sveksii posted...

You could argue Taylor Swift is talented and I imagine she cares about music.

For that matter, given the number of major genre shifts Taylor Swift has undergone, there's ample room to argue that she's got a lot more agency in what she sings than most pop stars. Most pop stars don't get to try anything different (unless they're forced to change to something more homogenized to boost sales), but Swift's fanbase likes her performing ability well enough to stick with her through some pretty radical changes and weird experiments. Sure, she's still definitely a pop singer and a lot of her stuff is pretty formulaic, but as far as pop singers go, she's got some pretty unusual stuff.

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Muscles must hate folk rock, the artists usually dont write the songs they perform, and sometimes they even make money, the bastards

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Muscles bringing up Taylor Swift on the first page then saying he wants them to write their own music when she heavily writes the majority of her own music is all you need to know.

Just because you don't like someone doesn't mean they aren't talented.

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Michael Jackson was one of the most "mass produced" artists of all time and you're okay with him. He didn't write his own music. He was also a model for the majority of artists today. If you don't like pop music that's fine. Wear headphones when you go to the store.

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Carole and tuesday is all about this very idea. Great anime highly recommend it.

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adjl posted...

As a professional industry, music has always favoured people who produce things that are popular over people who produce things that are technically or creatively demanding.

You can have both, look at the 70s, you had Floyd, Zeppelin, Rush, among others who were both insanely talented and popular, hell they are timeless classics up there with Bach and Beethoven

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Muscles posted...

You can have both, look at the 70s, you had Floyd, Zeppelin, Rush, among others who were both insanely talented and popular, hell they are timeless classics up there with Bach and Beethoven

are you implying that we dont have both now? that just sounds like you dont listen to a lot of music

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I mean, there definitely hasn't been a top 40 artist on the level of the bands I mentioned

I actually think there are good pop artists, such as Adele, but the fact that they have to sing over generic beats holds them back

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Muscles posted...

I mean, there definitely hasn't been a top 40 artist on the level of the bands I mentioned

what is this "level" you are talking about? obviously not popularity so quality? thats entirely subjective

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what music do you like, muscles? we know very well what you don't like already

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Are you serious? Pink Floyd, Rush, and Led Zeppelin aren't popular?

They got them beat on quality too, you can say it's subjective and if you are just talking how it sounds to you then you would be correct, but if you are talking about about quality as in complexity, range of notes, dynamic range, etc. then it is objective

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TheWitchMorgana posted...

what music do you like, muscles? we know very well what you don't like already

I like a wide range from Pink Floyd, to Blink 182 (and you won't see me claiming they're super talented) to Wu Tang Clan

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Can we just all agree its okay to enjoy something that is of low quality?

It doesnt mean you are a bad person if you enjoy bad music.

In fact it means you are a big person to admit you have flaws, same as everybody.

What needs not happen is white knighting for talentless millionaires who can follow a formula.

I like a lot of songs that are crap. I am not ashamed nor am I ashamed to admit that its crap and pretend to only listen to good music like the majority of people who get offended by being told popular music is going downhill.

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bulbinking posted...

Can we just all agree is okay to enjoy something that is of low quality?

It doesnt mean you are a bad person if you enjoy bad music.

In fact it means you are a big person to admit you have flaws, same as everybody.

What needs not happen is white knighting for talentless millionaires who can follow a formula.

That's ok, my problem isn't with the people who enjoy it, hell I like pop punk which isn't known for its musical virtuosos or deep song writing, my problem is specifically with the way the industry has a complete disregard for originality

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Muscles posted...

but if you are talking about about quality as in complexity, range of notes, dynamic range, etc. then it is objective

How do any of those count as objective quality? They're objective measures, sure, but none of them automatically make music better simply for having more of them.

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Everyone just post songs you like that have been on the billboard charts so we can clarify that muscles hates them all and he can definitively judge them as not having artistic merit

https://youtu.be/4NRXx6U8ABQ

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adjl posted...

How do any of those count as objective quality? They're objective measures, sure, but none of them automatically make music better simply for having more of them.

https://playback.fm/blog/science-proved-music-getting-worse


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adjl posted...

How do any of those count as objective quality? They're objective measures, sure, but none of them automatically make music better simply for having more of them.

Yeah, I guess nursery rhymes and orchestral masterpieces are on the same tier of quality since none of that matters

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Shut the fuck up already, Muscles.

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Muscles posted...

Yeah, I guess nursery rhymes and orchestral masterpieces are on the same tier of quality since none of that matters

now which one of those is produced in order to make $$$

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I'm not just saying music I like is better

I like pop punk, and I would rather listen to it than an orchestra, but it's a higher quality of music, I can say the same with rap, and most rock, there are many funk and jazz artists that are a higher quality than a lot of what I listen to too


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People need to realize if anything can be art than nothing is art.

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Mead posted...

now which one of those is produced in order to make $$$

Aiming to make money isn't a bad thing, to make a career as a legitimate artist you need to make at least enough to support yourself, but thats completely different from making low quality art just to make money

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https://youtu.be/xPU8OAjjS4k

https://youtu.be/fgT9zGkiLig

https://youtu.be/oKsxPW6i3pM

https://youtu.be/gGdGFtwCNBE

https://youtu.be/HyHNuVaZJ-k

no artistic merit to this kinda music apparently, too many people paid for it

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bulbinking posted...

People need to realize if anything can be art than nothing is art.

or just try to wrap your head around the fact that art is subjective

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Mead posted...

or just try to wrap your head around the fact that art is subjective

If I can admit there is artists out there that are objectively more skilled artists than artists I enjoy, why can't you?

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Mead posted...

or just try to wrap your head around the fact that art is subjective

Enjoyment of art is subjective.

Art is objective. People just appreciate different art for different reasons, and appreciating something as art does not automatically make it so.

Many post modernist philosophies completely misunderstood Nietsche and nihilism. I dont think people realize what sort of hell world they are advocating to live in with the claim of universal subjectivity in meaning and value.

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Muscles posted...

If I can admit there is artists out there that are objectively more skilled artists than artists I enjoy, why can't you?

so youre claiming that the songwriters who have written countless hits, many of which go on to define the time periods in which they were released and became popular, are unskilled artists because they set out to write monetary hits yet still composed songs that connected to millions of people?

If you asked a bunch of people which is better, Metallica or Nirvana?, or hey who is more talented, The Foo Fighters or Jimi Hendrix? youre gonna get a lot of different kinds of answers from folks that appreciate different things

some of the music that you so flippantly disregard as being vapid and without substance, ends up being part of an anthem that connects to a part of a persons life because its what they were listening to when they were young or going through a memorable time in their life

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