Board 8 > transience's top 100 games -- please insert disc 2.

(+) Yeah! (+)

anyway, it's just two games this topic but that's another tier finished

100. hacknet
99. braid
98. batman: arkham asylum
97. super meat boy
96. portal
95. world of goo
94. hollow knight
93. super mario world
92. mega man maker
91. ace attorney 2
90. zelda: majora's mask
89. xenoblade chronicles x

88. monument valley
87. dragon warrior
86. mega man 3
85. castlevania: dawn of sorrow
84. nier: automata
83. we love katamari
82. zelda: link to the past
81. lethal league
80. half-minute hero 2
79. mike tyson's punch out!!
78. god of war 2
77. wolfenstein 2: the new colossus
76. super smash bros ultimate

75. binding of isaac
74. final fantasy 7
73. super hexagon
72. crystalis
71. suikoden
70. ace attorney 5
69. etrian odyssey 5
68. dragon warrior monsters 2
67. crypt of the necrodancer
66. dragon quest 3
65. final fantasy 4
64. actraiser
63. shadow hearts 2

62. persona 4 golden
61. metroid fusion
60. mega man 11
59. castle crashers
58. ace attorney investigations 2
57. street fighter 2
56. shadow complex
55. persona 5
54. zelda 1
53. holedown

52. final fantasy 9
51. final fantasy 6
50. castlevania: portrait of ruin
49. final fantasy 10
48. bleed
47. brothers: a tale of two sons
46. geometry wars 2
45. inside

44. slay the spire
43. super mario odyssey
42. street fighter 4
41. ace attorney 6
40. life is strange
39. tales of maj'eyal
38. etrian odyssey 4
37. dicey dungeons
36. the messenger

35. ace attorney
34. banished
33. tactics ogre: let us cling together
32. bleed 2
31. shadow hearts
30. dragon quest 11
29. ikaruga


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28.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T85-Obx9iE8

2010
PSP

I love Personas systems. Persona 3 is the only game that really lets the system be the focus of the game. Other games largely focus on the relationships between the main characters and the main narrative. Persona 3 Im not convinced it really has a core narrative until you get about 4 months into the school year, and I like that a whole lot more.

This narrative space allowed by the game lets the game flourish through its basic dungeon crawling and its social links. I love just getting sucked into the black hole that is watching the numbers go up as I get more social links and better stats.

It also lets the games tone shine through a little bit more. Persona 3s tone is brilliant and it becomes the star of the game in the absence of a lingering plot thread. The drums of Tartarus and the dorm song gives this game a mood that I just really enjoy. Its also my first Persona game which I think helps a lot - I think the first one you play sticks with you in a lot of RPG series, and Persona fits that bill.

And yet, despite Persona 3 not really having a standout story for the first half of the game, the story comes on in the last few months and actually shines. Persona 3 is the only game of the three that actually ends strong. Both 4 and 5 drop the ball, but 3 actually soars during its climactic ending and exhilarating (and exhausting) final boss. I like Persona 4 and 5, but I really adore Persona 3 and come back to it all the damn time.

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This is my Suikoden 2.

Persona 3 is the best. Man January is too good on every level.

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tier rankings so far

monument valley > ace attorney 1 > p4 golden > street fighter 4 and eo4 the only ones I played in this tier > binding of isaac > hacknet > final fantasy 69

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I like that you only list PSP as a console for P3P. Definitely the definitive version of the game!
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yeah I didn't talk about how much better P3P is than the others. there's an argument that FES is better atmospherically with the cutscenes and direct movement, but nope, not playing that one unless there's a mod that adds the P3P stuff into it.

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27.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N40uY51s5Z0

2012
Lots of platforms

Theres no other game with a tone quite like TWD. Theres a desperation to the characters that makes it must-watch even when you want to look away.

This game wouldnt work at all without the relationship of Lee and Clementine. The other characters are all differing levels of bad depending on the situation and their desperation levels, but Lee and Clem are an all-time pairing that honestly cant be touched.

That relationship makes the end of this game absolutely soar in a way that most other games cant touch. Im not sure if any game higher on this list left a mark quite like the final minutes of TWD Season 1. I was shellshocked for days after that one and Ive played my share of rough games before. I actually never want to play this game again because it was so impactful that Id hate to ruin any memory of it. Keep that hair short, Clem.


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I actually prefer the movement in P3P. Makes everything feel a lot snappier. Kinda improves the pacing? P4 and P5 would drag a little less with movement like that I think.

also I dunno if any of the anime cutscenes in these games are great
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yeah, I like the movement better too. some people need that slow run in their RPGs though.

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I really wish they made a P4 with the movement from P3P, I would probably play it a lot more than I did with P4 Golden.

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Memories of the City is one of my favorite VGM tracks in existence. It perfectly captures the tone of Persona 3. Wandering around town with that playing is probably the most nostalgic memory I have of Persona 3.

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transience posted...

yeah, I like the movement better too. some people need that slow run in their RPGs though.

It's not necessarily movement as much as it is immersion. I'm trying to imagine playing something with a sprawling world like FFVII with something like what P3P uses. It's just not the same, but P3 doesn't have a big sprawling world, so I guess it's a bit easier. I suppose Shadow Hearts does something similar with its interface but you're still moving around in the towns themselves, I guess.

Either way, P3 has a top tier atmosphere and one of the best final battles in any game I've played, but I don't enjoy some of its negative mechanics like getting fatigued and stuff like that, which I don't feel like need to exist.

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yeah, I wasn't mocking people who wanted that. I truly meant that some people need that slower movement in order to feel immersed.

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Yeah, I don't mind point and click for certain genres or even if you just want to do it on the overworld (because I don't care about world maps in most games since they basically really only serve as a vehicle to get you into random battles), but I need some sort of freedom of movement beyond just dungeons.

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26.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZOsyTBhp4Hs

2011
Xbox 360, PS3, PC

Outland turns Ikaruga into a platformer and the results are kind of wild. Its slow to roll out abilities, but once you get going, this is a visual assault on the eyes as youre trying to juggle bullets, enemies and your own polarity all at once.

Outland wouldnt work unless it challenged you, and it brings the perfect level of difficulty: not *super* hard, but hard enough that its truly thrilling. Its fun to stare at a section and just go, is there really a way to do this? The game slowly adds on difficulty and lets you grasp the movement and the polarity shifting on a very smooth curve. Eventually you get so natural at it that is there really a way to do this? turns into my hands just did that and I am not at all sure how.

Sometimes you want to pause during a particularly dazzling bullet pattern, grab someone and say, check this shit out. Its slightly derivative, but there really isnt a polarity switching platformer out there so it still manages to feel unique.

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Oh hey Outland

There's a game I played a long time ago and never finished

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I wouldn't think it would be your cup of tea

anyway, top 25 time. I'm trying to get this done by Wednesday because I'm going out of town Thursday afternoon for the weekend and I hate leaving things hanging

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I dont remember much about Outland, but I do know it had a great game feel. Thats so key for platformer, and if nothing else, if you can nail that, Im down.

It was fun, but I just dropped it one day and never came back to it.

Heck, I tried to play SOTN for the first time last Christmas and lasted like two hours!

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25.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lDOYIUnbR-Q

2008
Wii, PS3, 360 + anything Legacy Collection 2 is on

Mega Man 9 was an absolutely amazing return to form after a decade away. 9 is pretty clearly the best made game in the classic Mega Man series. It has weapons that are useful, diverse and most importantly fun. The levels are really varied and theyre all pretty enjoyable. The minibosses are enough of a challenge that hitting the halfway point of a stage feels rewarding. This game is challenging. It has great replay value too, with additional modes like time attack that can be pretty addicting given how great the weapon design is.

The one downside to MM9 is that theres so much instant death placed all over the stages, especially towards the end. This has always been prevalent in Mega Man but it feels especially notable here given how fun the rest of the game can be. Some jumps can be pretty tight and the game can feel like it requires muscle memory since the punishment is to have to run through half the level again. It feels like outdated game design in the age of hard games that instaspawn you right back where you were. If theres one thing Id complain about with classic Mega Man, its that it still has the concept of lives and game overs that make you rerun the whole level, especially when you go into a stage with 0 lives because it took everything you had to beat the last level.

Anyway. I love classic Mega Man to death and MM9 might be the purest distillation thats ever been made.

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mm9 felt like a real labor of love from people who adored mm2 and 3 and it basically hit everything perfectly

i havent played it since it came out though, go figure

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I think that says a lot and feels oddly emblematic of a lot of people's feelings on 9

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i went through a big mega man phase around then where i was powering through all of the gamecube anniversary collection for the first time, so there was probably a degree of mega-burnout after the release of mm9

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24.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=74HqYNVuJI8

1990
NES, others

Ah, here we are. I hate writing about this game every time.

I have played this game an uncomfortable number of times. Im glad that I dont know how many because I am sure its very high, like high two digits high. This is almost certainly in my top 3 most played games.

FF1 was a revelation in 1990 to Nintendo-loving children who read Nintendo Power. We had Dragon Warrior but it wasn't a fully fleshed out world. FF1, on the other hand, was just way more expansive and had so much more to it. There were so many more enemies, dungeons, equipment, magic, everything was supersized from what we knew. We didnt get the other DQ games that were already released by then and even FF1 came here 2 years late.

As a gateway RPG this game totally works, and for me absolutely still works today. I actually dont play the base game very often anymore - I usually play some weird rom hack that either fixes the games many bugs (you wouldnt believe just how much of this game is completely broken), offers some brutal hard mode or just redesigns the game entirely and adds tons of new classes/enemies/etc. The FF1 template simply works and I think others that are my age feel largely the same way. It probably doesnt work for anyone under 30, maybe even 35, but theres an audience that this game speaks to on a base level.


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Mega Man 9's the best in a top-tier series. All love for MM9.

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Late again to the party but I really appreciate your sentiment about Tactics Ogre LUCT. I bounce back and forth between that & FFT when I make personal lists.

I'm guessing we will be seeing FFT later on then :p

I'll get boos for this I'm sure but no love for FFT Advance somewhere is there >_>

I don't hate it like some, but yeah, no FFTA. I haven't played it since 03. it's better than Knights of Lodis, I guess?

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I don't know if I would have the patience for the NES version, but I had a lot of fun with the GBA version back when that came out!

I also think the fair comparison for FF1 is probably DQ3 (which came out a few months afterward in Japan) rather than DQ1

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yeah, I said as much in the DQ3 writeup - but in NA, we didn't have DQ3 until two years later and by then people were playing FF4. (FF1 is 1987 in japan if you want to go there in terms of influence)

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transience posted...

. 9 is pretty clearly the best made game in the classic Mega Man series

Finally someone else who agrees. Still think it's pound for pound the overall best.

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23.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m8FNaJ2YPmU

2014
Mobile, PC

I am forever golfing in the desert. Im not entirely sure why, but Ive played something like 40,000 holes in Desert Golfing. I play it all the damn time. I played it yesterday. Ill play it today. Ill probably play it tomorrow. Anytime I just need something to do quickly, I golf in the desert.

Its fascinating to try to figure out why this game of all games is my go-to. One main reason for the fascination is its ultra minimalist design. Desert Golfing is stripped down to the purest elements possible: a ball, a hole, the ground and the angle of your shot. The only sounds youll hear are the tink of the ball being hit, the sound of the ball rolling the desert and a Pavlovian little ding when the ball goes in the hole. Thats it. Thats the game.

The other aspect of this game that appeals to me on a deep level is the permanence. The desert just keeps going. The game tracks your scores forever. Hundreds, thousands, tens of thousands of shots. You never see a title screen because youre always right in the game.

You could call it a cheap mobile game with no thought put into it, but I feel like theres way more to it. It takes a lot of active restraint to let such simple concepts shine. Desert Golfing will occasionally throw a vase at you on hole #537 and it completely shocks your system because the minimalism is so stark. The color palette changes every so slightly every hole and you dont notice it at all until youre 1500 holes in and suddenly you realize that the orange background is purple. There's a bunch of super weird stuff like that and it draws a lot of people in.

Its the little things that make Desert Golfing really mesmerizing despite it being undoubtedly the most boring game in the world. This game would never work as a sit down and play kind of thing, but as far as on-the-go gaming goes, it's perfect.

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I remember getting into Desert Golfing a few years back when there was a topic about it here. I made it a self imposed rule to always hit a ball into any water hazard before holing out. No idea why I did that, probably because water was extremely rare in the first 1000 or so holes.

Congrats on finishing the game. I think I made it about 4000 holes in on my old phone, and looks like I was less than 20% done. Maybe that can be a goal for me in 2020 - see how far into the desert I can get in a year.

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Desert Golfing was fun for the little while that I played it. I tried very hard to keep my average at 3 strokes per hole.

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22.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VQpHejqlzzY

2004
PC, Wii, 3DS, Switch

Cave Story is a mishmash of other 2d action/adventure games in such a specific way that it honestly feels like its own thing. It has exploration and powerups like Metroid, but doesnt go deep enough in that direction to feel inspired by it. It has weapon switching and combat arenas like Mega Man, but not totally. There are sections that are really heavily informed by platforming classics but the movement is awkward enough (in a good way) that it doesnt feel familiar.

Its biggest unique strength is its weapon system and the way it approaches combat. Each weapon in the game is pretty unique and your weapons lose strength as you get hit, meaning that boss encounters start out easy until you get hit and then turn into absolute chaos as you try to do the last 25%. Some weapons also assist with your movement so you can feel grounded in a weird way after taking a few unexpected hits. The push and pull of powering up your weapons and focusing on not getting hit, even from low level enemies, makes the combat a real thrill.

The other aspect of Cave Story worth mentioning is how complete esoteric it can be with its powerups and optional items/endings. It plays like a 90s JRPG in terms of having obscure pathing requirements. Take this obvious weapon powerup and youll be locked out of getting a super weapon near the end. Miss this hard jump and get a powerup to escape the area and a character will die, leaving you to miss out on the good ending. Talk to this character once instead of three times and youll miss a prompt to save them, also locking you out. Its maddening to try to 100% this game, but the intrigue also makes you determined to nail everything perfectly. Ive never actually done a pure 100% playthrough of Cave Story because of it. Ive done something like 99.5% with the best ending, but never all of it!

The funny thing is that I cant tell if this is bad, archaic design or if I genuinely like trying to puzzle my way through all of the weird requirements. I think it might be the latter even though it can enrage me when I dont pick up a mushroom from the beginning of the game at the right time. At least the combat is super fun to play over and over.

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Aw yeah Mega Man 9 love. MM games do best when they're giving you really powerful weapons and then challenging the heck out of you to make you use them, and MM9 does that beautifully, and has top-notch stage design on top of that (even if, as you note, probably a little too reliant on instant death). I also kinda like that it doesn't have the charged buster; maybe I'm just getting old and cranky but I really appreciate platformers that don't force you to hold a button down a lot of the time (while doing other platformy things). MM11 gets around this in a different way by just letting the buster auto-charge as soon as you buy a cheap upgrade.

FF1 is a weird game for me. It doesn't even make my top 100 RPGs, let alone top 100 games, yet I understand very well the feelings you posted for it. It was an important game for me too and I always have a lingering desire to replay it in the back of my mind.

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I haven't 100 % Cave Story either, because fuck Ballos.

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Ive beaten Ballos, its the other random items that Ive missed in a single play through

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I played Cave Story+ for the first time last year and it mostly just felt kinda archaic? Like, it was impressive that this thing was created in 2004, but nowadays there are plenty of similar games I like much better coming out regularly.
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I didnt play Cave Story until 2010 and I think it feels totally unique. it doesnt feel archaic to me at all

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Was it you that hit an ocean in Desert Golfing?

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twice!

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transience posted...

FF1 was a revelation in 1990 to Nintendo-loving children who read Nintendo Power.

This is so true. FF1 had a huge impact on me when it came out, starting with when I first saw the demo and played for 4 minutes at Nintendo Powerfest. I was totally obsessed with this game and remember talking about it with one of my friends at school basically every day for a while. I was always thinking about what different combinations of classes you could use (which is kinda funny since there aren't that many, but I think just the fact that you couldn't use all of them was enough to interest me).

Other game comments....

Tactics Ogre has always seemed like something I should really like, but I kinda bounced off it when I got the PSP version. I'd try again but unfortunately I loaned my PSP to an ex like 7-8 years ago and never got it back. I've thought about messaging her asking her to send it to me but it hasn't seemed worth it. I'd like to play Crisis Core again too!

Woah, Mega Man 9, was not expecting that. That's another one I should give another try. For whatever reason it just didn't hook me the first time. I remember thinking it was way harder than MM2-6, maybe even harder than 1. Also I remember being annoyed there was no slide.

Cave Story is a game that I did like, but it doesn't come to mind when I think of my top games ever. Maybe it should, I should play again.

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21.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HLnx884hDVA

2012
Wii

This game is just a joy. The open exploration pairs really well with the get experience from doing everything approach that the game takes. It goes out of its way to encourage the player and never punish, and that really pays off.

Every gameplay mechanic works together to make the slow build from level 1 to level 99 really engaging. Getting more levels and finding more gear is oddly satisfying despite it being your standard RPG treadmill. Youre always finding new things and the exploration feels intrinsically interesting as opposed to doing it just because you might get some kind of external reward.

The best aspect of the game is the setting as you explore seemingly endless beautiful terrains on the top of two dead gods. Theres a lot of good in Xenoblade that turns to great when you start to explore Xenoblades huge, open environments.

The music and story do a great job of pushing you along on this long quest. I wont claim that Xenoblade is a top tier RPG story, but its revenge tale, along with its amazingly expansive world, works super well to keep you moving forward without feeling like youre just exploring a bunch of empty fields and caves.

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The revenge tale is quite good. It's why I'm a bit frustrated thinking it stumbles a bit when Fiona turns out to be alive again and then everything post-Mechonis Core. Unpopular opinion, but that final charge up the Mechonis to the Core is perhaps my favorite section of the game... and then it starts falling apart when Zanza hijacks the plot.

also justice for melia

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yeah that's my take too. the last 10 hours falters a bit as it gets a bit juvenile. but, it's still super likable.

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anyway, that's another tier down. top 20 time!

100. hacknet
99. braid
98. batman: arkham asylum
97. super meat boy
96. portal
95. world of goo
94. hollow knight
93. super mario world
92. mega man maker
91. ace attorney 2
90. zelda: majora's mask
89. xenoblade chronicles x

88. monument valley
87. dragon warrior
86. mega man 3
85. castlevania: dawn of sorrow
84. nier: automata
83. we love katamari
82. zelda: link to the past
81. lethal league
80. half-minute hero 2
79. mike tyson's punch out!!
78. god of war 2
77. wolfenstein 2: the new colossus
76. super smash bros ultimate
75. binding of isaac

74. final fantasy 7
73. super hexagon
72. crystalis
71. suikoden
70. ace attorney 5
69. etrian odyssey 5
68. dragon warrior monsters 2
67. crypt of the necrodancer
66. dragon quest 3
65. final fantasy 4
64. actraiser
63. shadow hearts 2
62. persona 4 golden

61. metroid fusion
60. mega man 11
59. castle crashers
58. ace attorney investigations 2
57. street fighter 2
56. shadow complex
55. persona 5
54. zelda 1
53. holedown

52. final fantasy 9
51. final fantasy 6
50. castlevania: portrait of ruin
49. final fantasy 10
48. bleed
47. brothers: a tale of two sons
46. geometry wars 2
45. inside

44. slay the spire
43. super mario odyssey
42. street fighter 4
41. ace attorney 6
40. life is strange
39. tales of maj'eyal
38. etrian odyssey 4
37. dicey dungeons
36. the messenger

35. ace attorney
34. banished
33. tactics ogre: let us cling together
32. bleed 2
31. shadow hearts
30. dragon quest 11
29. ikaruga

28. persona 3 portable
27. the walking dead
26. outland
25. mega man 9
24. final fantasy
23. desert golfing
22. cave story
21. xenoblade

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a game so good I have willingly played it across three nintendo systems (and PC!) with a fourth on the way

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Maybe I'll finally play Xenoblade when it comes to Switch

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I always forget that theyre remaking it. I think I might actually not want it after Xenoblade 2.

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