Poll of the Day > I'm not sure why people care so much about gender

(+) Yeah! (+)

It's just made to control people by giving them rules based on biological sex
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This is principly why gender dysphoria is a mental disorder. If you get riled up about something so ridiculously arbitrary, there's something wrong with how you perceive yourself and the world.
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only male or female

maaaaybe a third gender if you count hermaphrodite's as a third, but it's incredibly rare and i think they usually pick which gender they prefer
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Put the bong up muscles
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I want to see a woman running back in the NFL because she deserves the chance. Because we are all the same.
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Krazy_Kirby posted...

only male or female

maaaaybe a third gender if you count hermaphrodite's as a third, but it's incredibly rare and i think they usually pick which gender they prefer

Male and female aren't genders, man and woman are genders, also androgynous (which is pretty much any combination of characteristics from both, at least in the technical sense)
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Kyuubi4269 posted...

This is principly why gender dysphoria is a mental disorder. If you get riled up about something so ridiculously arbitrary, there's something wrong with how you perceive yourself and the world.

So what mental disorder do transphobes have, since they also get riled up about something so ridiculously arbitrary?
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Muscles posted...

Male and female aren't genders, man and woman are genders

Man and woman = Sex
Male and female = Gender

Doesn't matter whatever way you dice it as there are two of each.
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Golden Road posted...

Kyuubi4269 posted...

This is principly why gender dysphoria is a mental disorder. If you get riled up about something so ridiculously arbitrary, there's something wrong with how you perceive yourself and the world.

So what mental disorder do transphobes have, since they also get riled up about something so ridiculously arbitrary?

A short temper, after all you don't have to attack somebody for being wrong.
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wwinterj25 posted...

Muscles posted...

Male and female aren't genders, man and woman are genders

Man and woman = Sex
Male and female = Gender

Doesn't matter whatever way you dice it as there are two of each.

I mean, in the biological sense you can have birth defects that lead to having man and woman parts

And as far as gender goes, you can just make up as many as you like (though I would argue that there is at least 3 already, androgynous people have been around a lot longer than the current gender boom)
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Kyuubi4269 posted...

Golden Road posted...

Kyuubi4269 posted...

This is principly why gender dysphoria is a mental disorder. If you get riled up about something so ridiculously arbitrary, there's something wrong with how you perceive yourself and the world.

So what mental disorder do transphobes have, since they also get riled up about something so ridiculously arbitrary?

A short temper, after all you don't have to attack somebody for being wrong.

Dunno how many transphobes are murdered or driven to suicide just for being such?
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Kyuubi4269 posted...

This is principly why gender dysphoria is a mental disorder. If you get riled up about something so ridiculously arbitrary, there's something wrong with how you perceive yourself and the world.

If you think that men and women are treated exactly the same, youre very wrong. Id argue that a majority of gender dysphoria related feelings come from the way others treat you. If you feel like a woman but have the appearance of a man, strangers are going to treat you like a man. Its really not a particularly difficult concept to understand.
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Muscles posted...

I mean, in the biological sense you can have birth defects that lead to having man and woman parts

Indeed although those are a small minority and in that case it's up to them what they live as although in some cases the doctor/parents make the choice for them. Whatever the case they are given a sex.

Muscles posted...

And as far as gender goes, you can just make up as many as you like (though I would argue that there is at least 3 already, androgynous people have been around a lot longer than the current gender boom)

Sure when we continue to feed mental disorders those disorders can spiral out of control. This doesn't mean those without that mental disorder will follow the piper.
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wwinterj25 posted...

Muscles posted...
I mean, in the biological sense you can have birth defects that lead to having man and woman parts

Indeed although those are a small minority and in that case it's up to them what they live as although in some cases the doctor/parents make the choice for them. Whatever the case they are given a sex.

I know, I'm just saying it's more like 2* instead of 2, not 3 instead of 2

wwinterj25 posted...

Muscles posted...
And as far as gender goes, you can just make up as many as you like (though I would argue that there is at least 3 already, androgynous people have been around a lot longer than the current gender boom)

Sure when we continue to feed mental disorders those disorders can spiral out of control. This doesn't mean those without that mental disorder will follow the piper.

In saying it's more of scale, say there is 100 things than make you a male, but you only do 99 of them, by realistic standards you are a male (technically you are androgynous though because you have characteristics of both)
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Muscles posted...

I know, I'm just saying it's more like 2* instead of 2, not 3 instead of 2

It's 2 period.

Muscles posted...

In saying it's more of scale, say there is 100 things than make you a male, but you only do 99 of them, by realistic standards you are a male (technically you are androgynous though because you have characteristics of both)

Yes your genitals tell you what you are. Surprising isn't it?
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Your genitals tell you what you are, gender tell you how to act but not everyone acts 100% based on their gender, and when you have a combination of traits from both its androgynous
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Andromicus posted...

Kyuubi4269 posted...

Golden Road posted...

Kyuubi4269 posted...

This is principly why gender dysphoria is a mental disorder. If you get riled up about something so ridiculously arbitrary, there's something wrong with how you perceive yourself and the world.

So what mental disorder do transphobes have, since they also get riled up about something so ridiculously arbitrary?

A short temper, after all you don't have to attack somebody for being wrong.

Dunno how many transphobes are murdered or driven to suicide just for being such?

If you're driven to suicide because people don't agree with you then it supports gender dysphoria. On the murder side, people with short tempers kill more than just transgenders, but they're the current talking point so clearly everything that happens to them is because of passively being them.
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"If you're driven to suicide because people don't agree with you"

yikes

argonautweakend posted...

"If you're driven to suicide because people don't agree with you"

yikes

Yup, not believing when they claim a gender that evidence doesn't support has been a cited reason for suicide.
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How silly is this? Do you not see the rediculessness of this?
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Muscles posted...

I know, I'm just saying it's more like 2* instead of 2, not 3 instead of 2

Kind of like instead of just humans there are also otherkin? >_>
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Women are trained to look pretty for survival, whilst men are trained to use their brain to get by. Society hones the genders to separate by nature, so why would you act like that isn't a reality, TC?

Muscles posted...

Your genitals tell you what you are, gender tell you how to act but not everyone acts 100% based on their gender, and when you have a combination of traits from both its androgynous

I'm a guy. I'm male. Doesn't matter if I like pink or any other thing associated with the opposite sex or gender. I'm still what I'm born as. To think otherwise would be a mental disorder.
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I do worry that we're pushing too many kids to transition when in fact all they're doing is being interested in activities associated with the opposite sex---girls being interested in robots, boys being interested in Barbies, etc. Maybe this isn't actually going on, but it's something to think about.

this topic went pretty much as expected.
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OmegaM posted...

I do worry that we're pushing too many kids to transition when in fact all they're doing is being interested in activities associated with the opposite sex---girls being interested in robots, boys being interested in Barbies, etc. Maybe this isn't actually going on, but it's something to think about.

I mean, it's not like most kids who might be trans are being given hormones. Transitioning without hormones isn't really all that harmful. They might be ridiculed by their peers, but if hormones aren't involved, it's not really hard to detransition if they decide that they aren't really trans or that transitioning just isn't going to work for them.
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Pus_N_Pecans posted...

OmegaM posted...

I do worry that we're pushing too many kids to transition when in fact all they're doing is being interested in activities associated with the opposite sex---girls being interested in robots, boys being interested in Barbies, etc. Maybe this isn't actually going on, but it's something to think about.

I mean, it's not like most kids who might be trans are being given hormones. Transitioning without hormones isn't really all that harmful. They might be ridiculed by their peers, but if hormones aren't involved, it's not really hard to detransition if they decide that they aren't really trans or that transitioning just isn't going to work for them.

I actually was just talking about getting hormones and surgery prematurely. Maybe I should've said that before.

OmegaM posted...

I actually was just talking about getting hormones and surgery prematurely. Maybe I should've said that before.

I don't really feel like you can get surgery prematurely as you have to have two letters from therapists on top of a year's worth of well documented time spent living as your preferred gender in order to get it done. Also, it costs a fortune.

Hormones, I could definitely see an argument for though, as they aren't THAT hard to get if you really try and if you're on them more than a few months they could have some permanent side effects.
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Krazy_Kirby posted...

maaaaybe a third gender if you count hermaphrodite's as a third, but it's incredibly rare and i think they usually pick which gender they prefer

Gender is binary. Here's a binary table
M|F
0|0 - Neuter
0|1 - All Female
1|0 - All Male
1|1 - Hermaphrodite

As you see there can be 4 combinations of traits from 2 genders. All the talk about additional genders is just new categories for the combination of traits from the already existing two.
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that's sex.

i'll agree that all the crazy tumblr genders are bullshit cries for attention though.

gender as people view it on either side is an asinine and toxic concept that needs to be gotten rid of or drastically changed.
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"I'm a guy. I'm male. Doesn't matter if I like pink or any other thing associated with the opposite sex or gender. I'm still what I'm born as. To think otherwise would be a mental disorder."

This. This. This. Unfortunately we live in a current society where we arent allowed to smack people up the back of the head and tell them to stop being stupid. I think it was Ben Shapiro who summed it up nicely and said they arent transgender, theyre transtrender, because just like the whole goth or emo phases that came through in the 90's and 00's, this is the current trend where they can feel different or special.

Why is it also only people under say 25-30 who are suddenly having trouble working out what's between their legs? Why don't the older generations have issues? We've got 10 year olds going around "deciding" that theyre no longer a boy or girl. 10!! A 10 year old doesnt even know what they dont know. There's even accusations from the trans community that if a straight guy isn't attracted to or refuses to have sex with a trans guy who says he identifies as a female, but still has alllllll the male junk between his legs, that this straight guy is nothing but a transphobe.

Are there people who legit have gender stuff wrong and are legit the wrong gender? Sure. But they go and get the surgery and go on all the hormones etc. 99.9% of the current trend of this trans infatuation have zero plan or zero desire to do any of that and we are expected to act like it's all fine and dandy. Guys who suddenly identify as female because theyre attracted to men, how does that not just make them gay? Hell, ive met a guy who identifies as female, who has gone and had implants put in, still has all the male junk, and is in a "lesbian" relationship with a female. Lesbian relationship that has hetero intercourse. How does that even work?
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Some people need to feel special.

Everyone is a combination of male or female on the inside and outside. Usually they match, but not always, hence trans.
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Spiky_Peahorn posted...

"I'm a guy. I'm male. Doesn't matter if I like pink or any other thing associated with the opposite sex or gender. I'm still what I'm born as. To think otherwise would be a mental disorder."

This. This. This. Unfortunately we live in a current society where we arent allowed to smack people up the back of the head and tell them to stop being stupid. I think it was Ben Shapiro who summed it up nicely and said they arent transgender, theyre transtrender, because just like the whole goth or emo phases that came through in the 90's and 00's, this is the current trend where they can feel different or special.

Why is it also only people under say 25-30 who are suddenly having trouble working out what's between their legs? Why don't the older generations have issues? We've got 10 year olds going around "deciding" that theyre no longer a boy or girl. 10!! A 10 year old doesnt even know what they dont know. There's even accusations from the trans community that if a straight guy isn't attracted to or refuses to have sex with a trans guy who says he identifies as a female, but still has alllllll the male junk between his legs, that this straight guy is nothing but a transphobe.

Are there people who legit have gender stuff wrong and are legit the wrong gender? Sure. But they go and get the surgery and go on all the hormones etc. 99.9% of the current trend of this trans infatuation have zero plan or zero desire to do any of that and we are expected to act like it's all fine and dandy. Guys who suddenly identify as female because theyre attracted to men, how does that not just make them gay? Hell, ive met a guy who identifies as female, who has gone and had implants put in, still has all the male junk, and is in a "lesbian" relationship with a female. Lesbian relationship that has hetero intercourse. How does that even work?

This might be the single most ignorant post in this entire topic. It reads like one of those Christian fundamentalists crying out that evolution must be a hoax or we'd still see apes evolving today.

First of all, do you really think gender dysphoria is a new phenomenon? It's not. The only difference in modern society is that transitioning has become easier and while still taboo (as clearly demonstrated throughout this topic) it's gaining some social acceptance.

Trans people just want others to view them and treat them as their preferred gender. What you're arguing is that someone isn't really trans unless they're getting medical treatments or they've gotten genital surgery. That's absurd. That's like saying that poor people can't like pets because they can't afford them. I would even go so far as to argue that someone transitioning without the aid of medication is even braver than someone who does, because they'll face far more scrutiny in their day to day lives.

At the end of the day, everyone deserves the same level of respect, decency, and basic compassion no matter how they feel inside or what parts they might have between their legs.
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Pus_N_Pecans posted...

What you're arguing is that someone isn't really trans unless they're getting medical treatments or they've gotten genital surgery. That's absurd. That's like saying that poor people can't like pets because they can't afford them.

It's like saying poor people can't be rich people because they don't have money.

Pus_N_Pecans posted...

At the end of the day, everyone deserves the same level of respect, decency, and basic compassion no matter how they feel inside or what parts they might have between their legs.

And on that basis, we don't condone factual inaccuracies from anybody. Everybody is treated with appropriate levels of respect until they say something ridiculous that destroys their credibility. People are treated well when they don't express approval or involvement in taboo issues, this is universal and people involved in transgenderism should recognise this and tread lightly instead of crying for acceptance and trying to force respect for their taboo expressions.
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It's always interesting to see who shows up to these topics.

It's not the same people, but it's the same argument.
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Kyuubi4269 posted...

Pus_N_Pecans posted...

What you're arguing is that someone isn't really trans unless they're getting medical treatments or they've gotten genital surgery. That's absurd. That's like saying that poor people can't like pets because they can't afford them.

It's like saying poor people can't be rich people because they don't have money.

Pus_N_Pecans posted...

At the end of the day, everyone deserves the same level of respect, decency, and basic compassion no matter how they feel inside or what parts they might have between their legs.

And on that basis, we don't condone factual inaccuracies from anybody. Everybody is treated with appropriate levels of respect until they say something ridiculous that destroys their credibility. People are treated well when they don't express approval or involvement in taboo issues, this is universal and people involved in transgenderism should recognise this and tread lightly instead of crying for acceptance and trying to force respect for their taboo expressions.

Uhh how do you think things go from being taboo to accepted?
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It's a way to control people, and sadly it works a lot.
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Muscles posted...

Uhh how do you think things go from being taboo to accepted?

By deviants accepting their lesser position in society presently and representing their position respectably.

If the taboo is unreasonable it dissipates under weight of evidence, if it is reasonable then the deviants exposing their taboo suffer socially until they disappear from it once again.
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In the 21st century, people are making it a habit to identify themselves entirely by their gender or ethnicity.

Psychologically, this makes perfect sense. Especially with the whole "victimhood" mentality a lot of people are embracing these days.

No matter what you do......you can always dismiss your actions by blaming your gender or ethnicity.

Have you fallen on hard times? Are you not as happy as you'd like to be? Well that's simply because you are a <insert gender here>.

Completely removes all accountability. No one needs to hold themselves responsible for their place in life. Everything is the result of your reproductive bits or what shade your skin happens to be.

I have greatly enjoyed the past several years, watching people around me behave this way. Once you are tuned into it, it's impossible not to see it.
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This might be the single most ignorant post in this entire topic. It reads like one of those Christian fundamentalists crying out that evolution must be a hoax or we'd still see apes evolving today.

First of all, do you really think gender dysphoria is a new phenomenon? It's not. The only difference in modern society is that transitioning has become easier and while still taboo (as clearly demonstrated throughout this topic) it's gaining some social acceptance.

Trans people just want others to view them and treat them as their preferred gender. What you're arguing is that someone isn't really trans unless they're getting medical treatments or they've gotten genital surgery. That's absurd. That's like saying that poor people can't like pets because they can't afford them. I would even go so far as to argue that someone transitioning without the aid of medication is even braver than someone who does, because they'll face far more scrutiny in their day to day lives.

At the end of the day, everyone deserves the same level of respect, decency, and basic compassion no matter how they feel inside or what parts they might have between their legs.

Do I think it's a new thing? Not at all. But do you honestly believe that in the last 5 years we've gone from a very small percentage of people actually publicly suffering from it to suddenly every man and his dog claiming to be some made up gender because they feel different? The issue isn't the legit trans people, the issue is the squeaky wheel percentage demanding that we call guys girls and girls guys based on how they feel on any given day.

Compare it to 15 years ago, suddenly it was ok to be gay or lesbian. Suddenly schools were full of students claiming to be either gay, lesbian, or bi, and for the majority of those people making the claims it was a trend/phase. Check up on the same people now and most are married with kids and will tell you they dont swing that way anymore and haven't done for a long time. Same thing now with the trans movement. Let's check on them in 15 years and see just how many of them were doing it to feel different or to be seen as following the current trend vs the number of those who actually still think theyre the wrong gender.

As far as saying that it's braver for someone to transition without medical intervention, they're not transitioning anything, they're still exactly the same except for what's going on in their own head. Let's take that woman a few years back who identified as african american when she was white. She had the perm going on, she had the super dark tan. But no, people called her out on the ridiculousness of it. How is that different? Her brain was clearly telling her the wrong thing. Then we have the transabled people, they feel they should be disabled and get around in wheel chairs or whatever, going so far as to mutilate themselves to make their narrative match their mentality. How is that different?
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Spiky_Peahorn posted...

Check up on the same people now and most are married with kids and will tell you they dont swing that way anymore and haven't done for a long time.

Where did you come up with this information?
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ummm, there's only one gender ... the HUMAN gender
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Where did you come up with this information?

Try talking to people. Try looking at facebook. Plenty of ways to check what people are up to these days.
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Spiky_Peahorn posted...

Where did you come up with this information?

Try talking to people. Try looking at facebook. Plenty of ways to check what people are up to these days.

Ohhhh ok, so you took the people you know and generalized that to the rest of the people you don't know. Gotcha.
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"Because that's my girlfriend, Jerry! She ain't supposed to be having no penis!"
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Jerry! Jerry! Jerry! Jerry! Jerry! Jerry! Jerry! Jerry! Jerry! Jerry! Jerry! Jerry!
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