Current Events > Hollow Knight should have gotten the kind of treatment that Underdale did

(+) Yeah! (+)

It's one of the best indie games ever made, and it manages to capture the "cutesy" character feel that people like in Undertale without being annoying or juvenile. It has legitimate gameplay (unlike Undertale), the graphics are great, the atmosphere is awesome, and it's probably the best Metroidvania game since Super Metroid and Symphony of the Night.

My guess is that it picks up steam in a big way after the Switch release, but this is the game that deserves the praises that the Undertale got.
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Haven't played either yet. Undertale is on PS4 might pick it up there. Waiting for the Switch release for Hollow Knight.
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Hopefully the Switch keeps in affordable. It's $15 on Steam and is probably the best value you can get in a game. A first playthrough will take 40-50 hours if you want to explore.
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Oh hush...I didn't like Undertale myself but I can still say it deserved the praise it got. Millions of people absolutely loved it.
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Apples and oranges. Hollow Knight is a vastly superior game. It also had funding and an actual team behind it. Still, Undertale is impressive for what it is, and it does some surprising, wholly original, genre-bending things.
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Agreed tbh

undertale is bland and has incredibly flanderized characters
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It'll probably be $20 digital, $30 physical if there's a limited physical release. But you never know, I think Isaac was $40 physical when I bought it lol I hope Nintendo improves their sale page on the Eshop this year. Probably not though.
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I agree
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Im glad that in 2018 people are still able to get weirdly upset about people liking undertale instead of their random indie game of choice that often isnt at all comparable
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You mean have an insufferable fanbase? >_>
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Undertale is a fantastic game.

But Hollow Knight absolutely deserves more love than it gets.

I hear it's the pinnacle of Metroidvanias
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It's harder to troll in favor of a game that's actually good.
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I played it for an hour or two and still only had access to a basic slash. What sort of other attacks do you get? Or is the game just based around getting accustomed to best utilizing that one?
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HaVeNII7 posted...

I played it for an hour or two and still only had access to a basic slash. What sort of other attacks do you get? Or is the game just based around getting accustomed to best utilizing that one?

You acquire half a dozen different attacks/spells and many variations/augmentations of the slash as you collect charms.
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if it comes out on the PS4, I might pick it up
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The Admiral posted...

and it's probably the best Metroidvania game since Super Metroid and Symphony of the Night.

I'd throw Ori in there but yeah, pretty much.
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Ori has really fun movement, but I definitely have to put Hollow Knight above it on the whole. Hollow Knight is one of a small handful of metroidvania titles that really gives you the feeling of being lost in a massive area of interconnected and twisting locales. The mechanics are very fun as well, and the challenge is a welcome surprise, but the fundamental sense of discovery in Hollow Knight is something that few games in the genre have achieved.

Yeah, Ori awesome too. If you're a fan of the genre, definitely play that game.
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Will get it. Undertale is one of my favorite games ever.
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While I disagree strongly with your Undertale hate, I agree vehemently that Hollow Night deserves the same love and praise. Goddamn gorgeous game. Same for Original and the Blind Forest, which is even weirder because it does have the cutesy aspect like Undertale that makes Fandom latch on.

Also Admiral, if you're looking for more great hard indie games, I'd suggest Intrusion 2 and Dead Cells.

You know, I can't disagree. Hollow Knight is great.
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OctilIery posted...

Also Admiral, if you're looking for more great hard indie games, I'd suggest Intrusion 2 and Dead Cells.

Thanks, adding them to my list.
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The Admiral posted...

OctilIery posted...

Also Admiral, if you're looking for more great hard indie games, I'd suggest Intrusion 2 and Dead Cells.

Thanks, adding them to my list.

No problem! And don't let the early access on Dead Cells deter you, it's one of the few EA games I'd suggest.

I don't buy EA games on principal, but I can definitely see the effort the devs have put into Dead Cells. Looks great.

undertale is a meme game which is why everyone jumped on its dick so hard. hollow knight is just a game
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Ori is better though.
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sylverlolol posted...

Oh hush...I didn't like Undertale myself but I can still say it deserved the praise it got. Millions of people absolutely loved it.

I don't know, millions of people like the backstreet boys.
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Those last few boss fights were soooo good.

Nightmare King was insane
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Dragonblade01 posted...

I don't buy EA games on principal, but I can definitely see the effort the devs have put into Dead Cells. Looks great.

Honestly, dead cells right now is better than most WAS games.

I actually enjoyed undertale a lot more despite hollow knight being way more in the usual genre of things I enjoy

the world felt too big and empty. A lot of times your rewards for exploring areas were kinda lame. The majority of the rooms are massive and empty with just a few enemies here and there to be in the way, and provide no challenge at all on a micro scale. The small health bar and the way health works means most enemies just all deal the same amount of damage which is kind of lame.

The movement feels nice though, the sword knockback bugged me at first but now I really like it and the dash + dash charm is just fun to use
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if you want a large world + gradual character growth + action game I recommend distorted travesty 3 instead. It always treats the player not like an idiot and doesn't feel like it's wasting their time because each room consists of a meaningful challenge in the context of the area
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Seconding Dead Cells. I just started playing it and I'm enjoying it a lot. It's similar to Rogue Legacy but heavier focus on combat and less on platforming.
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scar the 1 posted...

Seconding Dead Cells. I just started playing it and I'm enjoying it a lot. It's similar to Rogue Legacy but heavier focus on combat and less on platforming.

Still early access, though. Fun enough now, but itd be better to wait.
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I had a hard time getting into it. Just wasn't very fun for me. Loved the look and OST though.
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M_Live posted...

I've given it like 4 chances and it still hasn't clicked. It's a gorgeous game, but I never have any idea what I should be doing.

You're supposed to be exploring. That's pretty much the game. You'll have one story-related scene early on that tells you all you need to do to meet the criteria to complete the game, but there is no order and no guidance. There are probably dozens to hundreds of different orders you can use to explore and complete the game. It's one of the most non-linear platformers ever made.

kirbymuncher posted...

The small health bar and the way health works means most enemies just all deal the same amount of damage which is kind of lame.

This was intentional because it encouraged fair exploration. You can wander as far as you want, and you won't suddenly come across enemies unfairly kicking the shit of you just because you took a certain path.
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The Admiral posted...

This was intentional because it encouraged fair exploration. You can wander as far as you want, and you won't suddenly come across enemies unfairly kicking the shit of you just because you took a certain path.

yeah but the downside is that it feels like the game has no difficulty curve or progression
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Godnorgosh posted...

metralo posted...

undertale is a meme game which is why everyone jumped on its dick so hard. hollow knight is just a game

Undertale is also a really great game. You should try to see it for what it is, memes aside.

It's an Earthbound rip-off that looks like it was made in RPG Maker, and its "depth" is trying to be emotionally manipulative and make you feel bad about killing fake video game characters for your own amusement. Ignoring that twist, the game is juvenile and is clearly meant for kids.

The only area Undertale was above average is in the music department -- definitely a few kick ass tunes.
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kirbymuncher posted...

The Admiral posted...

This was intentional because it encouraged fair exploration. You can wander as far as you want, and you won't suddenly come across enemies unfairly kicking the shit of you just because you took a certain path.

yeah but the downside is that it feels like the game has no difficulty curve or progression

The difficulty progression is in the boss fights.
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Look I can understand not liking Undertale but you really shouldn't call it a ripoff of Earthbound. They're two completely different games and Earthbound isn't even original in anything but its setting.
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Or emotionally manipulative. :l I like games where I feel emotionally invested. I easily get attached to fictional characters. You're in the minority if you don't and especially when you mock those who do.
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The Admiral posted...

Godnorgosh posted...

metralo posted...

undertale is a meme game which is why everyone jumped on its dick so hard. hollow knight is just a game

Undertale is also a really great game. You should try to see it for what it is, memes aside.

It's an Earthbound rip-off that looks like it was made in RPG Maker, and its "depth" is trying to be emotionally manipulative and make you feel bad about killing fake video game characters for your own amusement. Ignoring that twist, the game is juvenile and is clearly meant for kids.

The only area Undertale was above average is in the music department -- definitely a few kick ass tunes.

The game has absolutely no resemblence to earthbound except for the map screen.

It wasn't made in RPG Maker but I don't see why that would be an issue if it was.

It's got a short but great story that has a bunch of twists and not just the one you mentioned.
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Leanaunfurled posted...

Or emotionally manipulative. :l I like games where I feel emotionally invested. I easily get attached to fictional characters. You're in the minority if you don't and especially when you mock those who do.

This is what bronies say all the time, too.

Also, there is a difference between having characters you can connect to emotionally and a game being emotionally manipulative. The Undertale characters are all fairly shallow, and its hook is feeding you with a line that you're hurting their non-existent feelings by killing them or deleting their game world to start a new quest for your own amusement. I get that stuff having a reaction on kids, but that's not the kind of stuff that should have any effect on an emotionally mature adult.
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The Admiral posted...

Leanaunfurled posted...

Or emotionally manipulative. :l I like games where I feel emotionally invested. I easily get attached to fictional characters. You're in the minority if you don't and especially when you mock those who do.

This is what bronies say all the time, too.

Also, there is a difference between having characters you can connect to emotionally and a game being emotionally manipulative. The Undertale characters are all fairly shallow, and its hook is feeding you with a line that you're hurting their non-existent feelings by killing them or deleting their game world to start a new quest for your own amusement. I get that stuff having a reaction on kids, but that's not the kind of stuff that should have any effect on an emotionally mature adult.

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