Board 8 > Star Wars: The Last Jedi: Spoiler Thread Episode III

(+) Yeah! (+)

leia's "force" scene is so ridiculously stupid

the force can now literally let you do anything, from telepathically skyping your friends to flying through space

Propelling someone short distances isn't even close to being weird for the force to do. Making things move (including the user) is one of the most basic things it has been shown over and over in the movies to be capable of repeatedly.

Like, that's one of the silliest complaints about that scene you could possibly make.

ExThaNemesis posted...

Oh and the Leia Marry Poppins thing actually made me say "what." in the theatre and got some snickers from the people around me.

No one seriously thought that was a good scene did they? Like that was fucking BONKERS. If someone had told me about that scene before I saw the movie I'd have called them a liar.

Well, can you explain what, specifically, you thought was wrong with it? I have yet to actually see anyone put out a coherent, rational explanation for why it is bad. Everyone that has taken that side so far just seems to assume that everyone else agrees with them and their explanations are along the lines of the super informative, "WHAT" and "LOL" etc.
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My reaction was basically 'what the hell' followed by immediate acceptance of 'well she is a Skywalker'
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Lopen posted...

One of the twists I thought would be cool

Mary Poppins Leia was some sorta imperial spy. She shot Poe and I was like OH MY GOD IT MAKES SENSE WHY SHE GOT IN THERE CAUSE SHE WAS SOME SORTA CLONE OR SOMETHING.

But then she wasn't so it was still dumb.

Trust me I have like 12 things to rewrite with this movie

This is why you don't write movies. What a hilariously awful idea. Let's do clones, jesus.

Like, that post is literally a Prequels tier idea.

Using the force to propel through a vacuum is easy time baby level force powers, the people who think it's absurd are being ridiculous.
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dank movie
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Like literally force jump (aka propelling yourself- against gravity no less, so it should be EASIER in space!) is one of the most basic force powers in the whole series.

ExThaNemesis posted...

Also,

"You're no one in all of this. You're nothing. But not to me."

Was such a FANTASTIC line and everything was set up so perfectly for her to join him.

Are you kidding me? It's a fantastic line, yes, because the moment he utters it the moment you know she isn't going to join him. It's an awful thing to say to a potential love interest and shows that despite his "turn" of killing Snoke he's still the same childish and self-absorbed person we've come to know. (And I say that as someone who thinks Kylo Ren is absolutely great character; it's the type of villain he is.)
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Lopen posted...

Trust me I have like 12 things to rewrite with this movie

if they're all on par with the first you can keep them to yourself
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NeoElfboy posted...

ExThaNemesis posted...

Also,

"You're no one in all of this. You're nothing. But not to me."

Was such a FANTASTIC line and everything was set up so perfectly for her to join him.

Are you kidding me? It's a fantastic line, yes, because the moment he utters it the moment you know she isn't going to join him. It's an awful thing to say to a potential love interest and shows that despite his "turn" of killing Snoke he's still the same childish and self-absorbed person we've come to know. (And I say that as someone who thinks Kylo Ren is absolutely great character; it's the type of villain he is.)

this btw
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That line from Kylo is the thing a dude who beats his girlfriend says.
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It's a thing a dude who beats his girlfriend and literally shoots up a school says
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"I'm the only one who could ever love you!"
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He should have taken his shirt off before saying that at least
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I was really drunk when I wrote that but I do think her being some sort of droid or fake or decoy Leia would've been better, ironically not even as a twist but to make the continuity of the movie make more sense. Not a clone per se just similar in appearance.

I mean she was unconscious the whole time up until that point so it could've worked and would've explained why the empire was able to track them, why their plan was so bad, why she was able to so effortlessly vault through the vacuum of space after being blown up, etc etc. Plants on the ship made a lot more sense than what we got.
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Lopen posted...

to make the continuity of the movie make more sense

not sure you're not still drunk imhotbqh
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You think it's so unbelievable that Leia would be against super hero Poe that you would prefer her to be a space clone

This is what it means to not understand the movie
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I mean that whole thread of the movie was basically like, a buncha mcguffins and just becauses to me. Which if that's good enough for you then you'll like it I guess. I'd personally prefer tracking through hyperspace, something we'd never seen before, to be achieved by something with a better explanation than "there's some sorta device on that Star Destroyer we gotta disable it"
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Yeah, still drunk.
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Also the escape pod strategy was pretty stupid when you really thought about it-- like why would you send out escape pods when the last ship was being destroyed. You'd think doing that when there were the least amount of ships left on the table and at closest proximity to your main ship (which they're launching from) would make them more likely to notice not less.

Now granted this stuff is all kinda nitpicky more than actual issues with the movie but yeah that whole plodding chase didn't really make a lot of sense as some sorta master plan.
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Lopen posted...

I mean that whole thread of the movie was basically like, a buncha mcguffins and just becauses to me. Which if that's good enough for you then you'll like it I guess. I'd personally prefer tracking through hyperspace, something we'd never seen before, to be achieved by something with a better explanation than "there's some sorta device on that Star Destroyer we gotta disable it"

There will never be such a thing as escaping via lightspeed. Which means ships are indefinitely able to be chased. It was not a very well thought out introduction. About as dumb as the lightspeed suicide bomber.
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They needed a place for the escape pods to go to. The escape pods did not have access to faster than light travel so they couldn't just dump them out in the middle of space. The place they were heading to was also a location where they thought they could contact other allies.
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Yeah basically everything about the Star Wars hyperdrive mythos was dismantled because they couldn't think of better ways to move the plot along.
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Lopen posted...

Yeah basically everything about the Star Wars hyperdrive mythos was dismantled because they couldn't think of better ways to move the plot along.

pretty risky move I'd say
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Lopen posted...

Yeah basically everything about the Star Wars hyperdrive mythos was dismantled because they couldn't think of better ways to move the plot along.

Which is ironic because actual hyperdrive mythos explains why the plot was stupid also via just a simple jump ahead to surround the ship. (Assuming you don't want to pick off non snubfighter protected capital ships sitting ducks with your own snubfighters that you showed you were willing to do beforehand to incapacitate said snubfighters.)
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I'd call it sloppy more than risky. Like details in your execution isn't really about risks or lack thereof-- stuff like tone, direction of the plot and main characters, stuff like that are where you take risks. (and where the movie really didn't have any)
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It's weird how much the RLM nails the general problems with this film but I generally don't have the level of cynicism they do.
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Especially the Yoda scene:

"That was the magic of Star Wars... and now it's gone."

There really is no magic left to Star Wars. They're absolutely capable of making competent, well-acted films with fun/interesting characters with not-so-great plots, but there's nothing magical about them anymore. And I put almost 99% of it on TFA, a movie that was so intent on tapping into nostalgia and pushing back against the prequels that it just retold ANH, not realizing that it limited the world so much more than the PT ever did.
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My problem with the Space Leia scene wasn't that she used the Force so much as the fact that nobody acknowledged it afterward. They just said she was in a coma and moved on. Nothing about her using the Force or surviving in space for that long without massive damage. I doubt that sort of thing was anything they'd seen before.
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Ace_Killjoy posted...

surviving in space for that long without massive damage.

Why would there be massive damage?

You can survive in space for several minutes. You'll go unconcious from lack of oxygen in about 10-15 seconds, but even if Leia went over that (which I don't believe she did) its pretty easily handwaved by 'the force helped her slightly'.

I legitimately don't see why anyone has problems with the logistics of that scene.

It was shot really cheesily, which is the main issue I have with it, but it makes sense as a whole.

tcaz2 posted...

Ace_Killjoy posted...

surviving in space for that long without massive damage.

Why would there be massive damage?

You can survive in space for several minutes. You'll go unconcious from lack of oxygen in about 10-15 seconds, but even if Leia went over that (which I don't believe she did) its pretty easily handwaved by 'the force helped her slightly'.

I legitimately don't see why anyone has problems with the logistics of that scene.

It was shot really cheesily, which is the main issue I have with it, but it makes sense as a whole.

You are in the minority on that one for sure.
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My theater audience cheered at exactly two scenes during this movie. I will give someone a hella pat on the back if they can guess them. No the end or beginning sequence
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Corrik posted...

My theater audience cheered at exactly two scenes during this movie. I will give someone a hella pat on the back if they can guess them. No the end or beginning sequence

"See you around, kid" is one of them for sure. I don't think they cheered during the hyperdrive ram but I bet they went quiet. Did I guess right on these two?
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KanzarisKelshen posted...

Corrik posted...

My theater audience cheered at exactly two scenes during this movie. I will give someone a hella pat on the back if they can guess them. No the end or beginning sequence

"See you around, kid" is one of them for sure. I don't think they cheered during the hyperdrive ram but I bet they went quiet. Did I guess right on these two?

Neither.
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when Luke drank the milk
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LeonhartFour posted...

when Luke drank the milk

Lol no.

Both scenes were quickly supplanted by the fact that the crowd basically cheered for something it ended up not being.
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I'll just guess the two things that got the most reaction from me.

1. Luke brushing his shoulder off like a boss after the laser volley.
2. Snoke beaning Rey in the back of the head with the lightsaber handle.

Well okay the latter was more me audibly laughing.
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Lopen posted...

I'll just guess the two things that got the most reaction from me.

1. Luke brushing his shoulder off like a boss after the laser volley.
2. Snoke beaning Rey in the back of the head with the lightsaber handle.

Well okay the latter was more me audibly laughing.

At least you are on the right parts on both.
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Corrik posted...

You are in the minority on that one for sure.

You have a point, most people are stupid.
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1. Rey and Ren teaming up is definitely one of them. The crowds go nuts for it and then become bewildered thereafter.

2. Luke igniting his lightsaber.
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tcaz2 posted...

You can survive in space for several minutes. You'll go unconcious from lack of oxygen in about 10-15 seconds, but even if Leia went over that (which I don't believe she did) its pretty easily handwaved by 'the force helped her slightly'.

How about after being blown into space from an explosion, though.
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1. Kylo kills Snoke. Crowd went wild thinking Kylo finally went good. Sorely mistaken a few minutes later.

2. Luke leaving the base to confront the enemy. Tons of cheers here. Woops. He wasn't even really there.

Nothing else elicited any sizable reaction the entire movie besides a laugh here or there.

My cousin I watched the movie with did whisper over though after the Leia scene, "haha either I am still high or she just went Super Leia".

I wish he had still been high...
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I think the only time the audience in my theater audibly cheered was "See ya around, kid"

Definitely got some "Oohs" when Kylo Ren lightsabered that one dude in the face though
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Jeff Zero posted...

1. Rey and Ren teaming up is definitely one of them. The crowds go nut for it and then become bewildered thereafter.

2. Luke igniting his lightsaber.

Damn.
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Lopen posted...

How about after being blown into space from an explosion, though.

she didn't get blown up though

she just got sucked into space after they were exposed to the vacuum

she very clearly never gets hit by the flames of the explosion
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I don't see what being blown into space matters, not like she lost a limb. In fact, she was pretty clearly sucked out in that scene without being hit by anything.

There are problems with this movie on an actual structural and film making level. Some can look past those, some can't. Complaining about stuff like Leia in space and the warp smash just makes it impossible to take any legitimate criticisms a person might have seriously. It makes you the comic book guy on The Simpsons.
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The difference is if you're suddenly flung into space you've

1. Got momentum sucking you out and AWAY from the ship
2. Can't really be expected to have your wits about you immediately-- Leia really should've even have her bearings before 15 seconds expire and she's dead.
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Complaining about the Leia scene specifically is the worst because it just shows you don't know anything about real science OR fake Star Wars magic, and just makes someone look real dumb. It's embarrasing.

Thankfully a lot of people are realizing this after the fact, but some are just too stubborn.
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LeonhartFour posted...

Lopen posted...

How about after being blown into space from an explosion, though.

she didn't get blown up though

she just got sucked into space after they were exposed to the vacuum

she very clearly never gets hit by the flames of the explosion

A lot of the complaints people have make me think they just weren't paying attention to the movie.
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Lopen posted...

The difference is if you're suddenly flung into space you've

1. Got momentum sucking you out and AWAY from the ship
2. Can't really be expected to have your wits about you immediately-- Leia really should've even have her bearings before 15 seconds expire and she's dead.

there's something to be said about people who want more realism in their space fantasies
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