Poll of the Day > How many genders are there?

(+) Yeah! (+)

Sahuagin posted...

Lokarin posted...

Dmitri, an f2m, is also very attractive

do you mean Derrick, and am I once again the only one who knows what you're talking about?

sh0e's friend? Hes hot as fuck

IAmNowGone posted...

sh0e's friend? Hes hot as fuck

yeah. I can't even almost picture him as a female.
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i
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Sahuagin posted...

Lokarin posted...

Dmitri, an f2m, is also very attractive

do you mean Derrick, and am I once again the only one who knows what you're talking about?

Oh, from the shoeonhead video? ohhh, so I know two~!
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well who's dmitri then?
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Sahuagin posted...

well who's dmitri then?

Ehh, I mean Demetri (phonetic logic :p) , just someone I seen a few times.

+EDIT: Well this is weird, I can't find him on YouTube... I hope this isn't a weird Mandela/mixed memory thing and I was thinking of Derrick this whole time, they don't look similar.
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Depends on how you define gender, the term seems to have a different meaning with every person.
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Two genders as far as I'm concerned. Male or Female.

deoxxys posted...

Back then, we had tomboys that were more masculine females.

I 'dated' a tomboy when I were young. She wasn't masculine then although now she's more man than I am. Not sure if she is trans now or what.
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Lokarin posted...

shoeonhead

god shes so hot, exactly what I want in a girlfriend, just silly pretty and lovable
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Unfernal_Server posted...

I'm not sure I agree that there was an ultimate prevalence of DA and VO in all cultures

I'm not sure why that's a difficult point for you. You only need to look at the history of warfare to see its prevalence.
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ya, shoeonhead is one of the prettiest girls ever and has sexy voice
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There's only 1 gender and it's Kwame-sexual.
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Judgmenl posted...

There's only 1 gender and it's Kwame-sexual.

Mmm

Other- Just 1 gender, anything else is just like...a social construct man.
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You're either gendered or agendered.
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8G541OW-fA4

I don't understand why people get so bent out of shape about this.

If someone asks you to call them him or her or ze or whatever pronoun they like, why is it a big deal? Just do it and move on with your life. I know almost no one uses formal titles anymore, but it's like back in the day if you called a woman Miss and she preferred Mrs. or Ms. or Dr., she'd tell you and you'd acquiesce because that was the polite thing to do.

Seriously, I don't care what gender someone identifies as - man, woman, or submarine, who gives a shit? If it makes them happier, then more power to them. It's not up to me - or anyone else, for that matter - to tell them they're wrong.
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darkknight109 posted...

If someone asks you to call them him or her or ze or whatever pronoun they like, why is it a big deal? Just do it and move on with your life. I know almost no one uses formal titles anymore, but it's like back in the day if you called a woman Miss and she preferred Mrs. or Ms. or Dr., she'd tell you and you'd acquiesce because that was the polite thing to do.

Miss, Ms and Dr are all correct, sir or duke would be unacceptable, the same applies to gender.

darkknight109 posted...

Seriously, I don't care what gender someone identifies as - man, woman, or submarine, who gives a shit? If it makes them happier, then more power to them. It's not up to me - or anyone else, for that matter - to tell them they're wrong.

Surely the reverse is true too? Because I guarantee you there's more cases of them telling us our perception's wrong than us telling them theirs is.
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deoxxys posted...

i identify as an attack copter

I identify as an Imperial-I Class Star Destroyer
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THE RESULTS ARE IN.

The number of genders that exist areeeee: 2

Kyuubi4269 posted...

Miss, Ms and Dr are all correct, sir or duke would be unacceptable, the same applies to gender.

Except... who gives a shit? If a woman wanted to be called Mr., politely asked you to address her as such, and doing so legitimately improved her quality of life, why is it a big deal? Again, as a matter of basic politeness, this should not be a major issue.

I mean, consider if you had a friend named Jonathan, He doesn't like the full version of his name, so he asks that you address him as Jon. Or maybe he just doesn't like the name period, and goes by his middle name. Or chooses a nickname for himself and requests you use that instead. You'd be a prick (and probably wind up with one less friend) if you insisted on still calling him Jonathan despite his constant requests to the contrary. To me, this is no different.

Kyuubi4269 posted...

Surely the reverse is true too? Because I guarantee you there's more cases of them telling us our perception's wrong than us telling them theirs is.

Why would the reverse be true? They're telling you about themselves. I 100% guarantee that they know more about themselves than you do.
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darkknight109 posted...

Kyuubi4269 posted...

Miss, Ms and Dr are all correct, sir or duke would be unacceptable, the same applies to gender.

Except... who gives a shit? If a woman wanted to be called Mr., politely asked you to address her as such, and doing so legitimately improved her quality of life, why is it a big deal? Again, as a matter of basic politeness, this should not be a major issue.*

*=true

B= Its a big deal when people expect me to go out of my way to be polite for irregular things such as referring to them solely with gender neutral pronouns, or some wacky made up ones.
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deoxxys posted...

darkknight109 posted...

Kyuubi4269 posted...

Miss, Ms and Dr are all correct, sir or duke would be unacceptable, the same applies to gender.

Except... who gives a shit? If a woman wanted to be called Mr., politely asked you to address her as such, and doing so legitimately improved her quality of life, why is it a big deal? Again, as a matter of basic politeness, this should not be a major issue.*

*=true

B= Its a big deal when people expect me to go out of my way to be polite for irregular things such as referring to them solely with gender neutral pronouns, or some wacky made up ones.

Why, though? Why get so hung up on it? They're asking you to swap out a handful of words in your conversation. This does not require an inordinate amount of effort on your part.

Again, if you have a friend name Jonathan and he tells you "Actually, I prefer going by Jon", and you say "Hmm... nope! I like Jonathan better, so I'm going to call you that instead", it's not Jon who is being unreasonable.
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sorry im not going around calling people xim or xir, not only is it stupid but it makes me feel like an idiot playing into a stupid word game.

Things like jon/jonathon are understandable thats fair. Its just a shortened version of his name. And pretty much everyone I've interacted with doesnt blow their cool because I dont call them their preferred name by accident.

Also I am the polite one, not everyone is this staple polite person. We have many different kinds of people, some are asshole assholes, and some are the assholes you love, some are nice people till you expect too much of them. But you got to understand that people dont want to bend over backwards to play some word game with some oddball.
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deoxxys posted...

Also I am the polite one [...] play some word game with some oddball

I don't know of too many polite people who characterize someone they never met as "some oddball".

deoxxys posted...

And pretty much everyone I've interacted with doesnt blow their cool because I dont call them their preferred name by accident.

By the same token, no trans person I've ever interacted with gets upset if you screw up their gender, particularly if it's your first time meeting them. And if you make a subsequent mistake, it's typically brushed aside (and more to the point, even if it wasn't that's an issue with that person, not with the request they're making). Most of them understand that what they're going through is largely unknown by, and sometimes confusing to, the non-transgendered population. Where they get (understandably) upset is if you repeatedly ignore their requests and deliberately call them by a different gender - then you're just being an asshole.

deoxxys posted...

Things like jon/jonathon are understandable thats fair. Its just a shortened version of his name.

And using different pronouns is just a variation on words you're already using. It's the exact same thing.
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this problem with pronouns is self-resolving. anyone who gives that much of a shit what words I use in referring to them is automatically someone I don't really care to interact with.

this is an unimportant issue to 99% of the population.
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darkknight109 posted...

don't know of too many polite people who characterize someone they never met as "some oddball".

Super_Thug44 posted...

this is an unimportant issue to 99% of the population.

They are an oddball if they are out of the ordinary, as this user pointed out
with the one percent.

darkknight109 posted...

deoxxys posted...

And pretty much everyone I've interacted with doesnt blow their cool because I dont call them their preferred name by accident.

By the same token, no trans person I've ever interacted with gets upset if you screw up their gender, particularly if it's your first time meeting them. And if you make a subsequent mistake, it's typically brushed aside (and more to the point, even if it wasn't that's an issue with that person, not with the request they're making). Most of them understand that what they're going through is largely unknown by, and sometimes confusing to, the non-transgendered population. Where they get (understandably) upset is if you repeatedly ignore their requests and deliberately call them by a different gender - then you're just being an asshole.

deoxxys posted...

Things like jon/jonathon are understandable thats fair. Its just a shortened version of his name.

And using different pronouns is just a variation on words you're already using. It's the exact same thing.

Well duh im not calling a mtf Transsexual a he but im not calling some dude with a male appearance that just decided he wanted to be referred to as a she, thats just lazy.

And no I'm not referring to people by made up pronouns

If I ever by some rare chance have to interact with someone who is that "Did you assume my gender" type person, I will respond, are you assuming I was referring to your gender?
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darkknight109 posted...

Why, though? Why get so hung up on it?

Why is it so hard to settle on a "He" or a "She"? I don't want to suggest that if I did it, anyone can do it, that would be daft, but I did do it. I identify as non-binary (I'm not cis, and would be trans if not for certain complications), prefer "other" when asked M or F, and accept male or female pronouns in conversation. Why is that so hard? When there's something weird about you, then making a little bit of extra effort to conform is just basic politeness. I mean, these are my problems, no everyone else's.

Super_Thug44 posted...

this problem with pronouns is self-resolving. anyone who gives that much of a shit what words I use in referring to them is automatically someone I don't really care to interact with.

This is the Jordan Peterson argument. If the pronoun thing is all it takes to make you feel "unwelcome" then you're "unwelcome". That's on you.
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How many genders are there?

genders are like insect species. 900 thousand different kinds and more are discovered every day.
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Super_Thug44 posted...

this is an unimportant issue to 99% of the population.

So is Lou Gehrig's Disease.

Just because something doesn't affect a majority of the population doesn't mean it's something that should be ignored.

deoxxys posted...

They are an oddball if they are out of the ordinary, as this user pointed out

Whether you think that or not, it's still not a polite term - your statement does a pretty good job of undercutting your "I'm a polite person" argument. You basically just posted a (much milder) version of "I'm not a racist but..."

deoxxys posted...

but im not calling some dude with a male appearance that just decided he wanted to be referred to as a she, thats just lazy.

Transition surgery is expensive and takes time. One of my neighbours is in her 50s and came out as trans a couple of months back. She still looks completely male (complete with a mostly-bald head). I don't know if/when she's going to have any surgery and/or start hormone treatment to make her look more feminine, but you know what? It's also none of my damn business. She's made a polite request to the community to be referred to as a woman (and also offered to speak to anyone in private who had an issue with it) and that's good enough for me.

deoxxys posted...

And no I'm not referring to people by made up pronouns

I've only ever met one person who didn't go by he/she and I still don't see what the big deal is. If it makes them happy, why not? They're not asking you to give them a tenth of your income or something, just change some words around. Particularly given how exceptionally rare it is (even if you refer to absolutely everyone by whatever pronouns they prefer, this will likely come up in less than one hundredth of one percent of your interactions with other people) I don't see the justification for a big public outcry.

deoxxys posted...

If I ever by some rare chance have to interact with someone who is that "Did you assume my gender" type person

I'm roughly 75% certain that those people don't actually exist in real life and are just caricatures made up on the internet by people mocking hypersensitivity, trying to push a political agenda, and/or just trolling.

Kungfu Kenobi posted...

Why is it so hard to settle on a "He" or a "She"? I don't want to suggest that if I did it, anyone can do it, that would be daft, but I did do it. I identify as non-binary (I'm not cis, and would be trans if not for certain complications), prefer "other" when asked M or F, and accept male or female pronouns in conversation. Why is that so hard? When there's something weird about you, then making a little bit of extra effort to conform is just basic politeness. I mean, these are my problems, no everyone else's

If you feel comfortable doing that, then good - this obviously isn't an issue that bothers you much (or if it does bother you, not to the point where you would raise an objection about it). For some people, pronouns are a minor quibble. But not everyone's like that - some people place different importance on such things.

As an example, if I went around referring to every male I met as "she/her", some people wouldn't care, some would feel awkward and ask me to stop doing that, some would tell me to knock it off in less-than-polite terms and a handful would try to punch me. That's different comfort levels with "wrong" pronouns.

My point can basically be summed up as "Why can't we all just be nice to each other?" - if someone asks to be referred to by different pronouns, it's not worth a fighting over.
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Amuseum posted...

How many genders are there?

genders are like insect species. 900 thousand different kinds and more are discovered every day.

and most of them are named after the person that discovered them or their favorite celebrity.
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darkknight109 posted...

But not everyone's like that - some people place different importance on such things.

It is, however, equally daft to say that just because I got through it and made something work, the people who don't and therefore take bigger issue with the pronoun debate have it harder.

So I don't accept the argument that someone who makes a bigger deal of it, necessarily is more deserving. It's quite possible that I'm a role model, not an anomaly.


darkknight109 posted...

My point can basically be summed up as "Why can't we all just be nice to each other?"

I don't think it's very nice to put your problems on everyone else.
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Kungfu Kenobi posted...

I don't think it's very nice to put your problems on everyone else.

They're not putting their problems on anyone else; they're saying "Hey, could you please refer to me as ______?"

If you have a friend in high school who constantly went by the nickname "Asswipe", because he thought it was hilarious when he was 16, him asking you not to call him that anymore when he's 25 because he now finds it embarrassing isn't "putting his problems on everyone else", he's making a request as to how he would like to be addressed. Everyone is entitled to do this - for most of us, it just takes the form of "Call me Steve, not Stephen," or "I'm actually Dr. Johnson, not Mr. Johnson" and no one would think you were overstepping your bounds for making the above requests, so pronouns shouldn't be a big deal either.

Again, they're asking you to change a handful of words, not spin around three times and do ten jumping jacks every time they raise their left hand.
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thats an awful example

asswipe lol

I know theres a good way to explain to you why this is such an issue, but I cant think of it
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darkknight109 posted...

"Call me Steve, not Stephen,"

It's nothing like that. It's more like saying "Call me by this scent, I don't identify by sound".
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Kungfu Kenobi posted...

darkknight109 posted...

"Call me Steve, not Stephen,"

It's nothing like that. It's more like saying "Call me by this scent, I don't identify by sound".

Except you're not able to change your scent to adjust someone, while I'm reasonably certain you are capable of giving voice to whatever pronouns someone requests without your mouth bursting into flame.
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darkknight109 posted...

Kungfu Kenobi posted...

darkknight109 posted...

"Call me Steve, not Stephen,"

It's nothing like that. It's more like saying "Call me by this scent, I don't identify by sound".

Except you're not able to change your scent to adjust someone, while I'm reasonably certain you are capable of giving voice to whatever pronouns someone requests without your mouth bursting into flame.

I'm capable of a lot of things that aren't reasonable to ask of me. Steve vs Steven is a standard form of address, and one that Steve, as a grownup, has learned to live within rather than try to change other people, just as I as a grownup have learned to live within our pronoun binary. He doesn't ask me to address him as an Attack Helicopter, or refer to him in honorifics unbefitting his station (such as "Master"). It doesn't matter how annoyed he gets with me that I don't call him "sweetie" just because he identifies as a cupcake.
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Kungfu Kenobi posted...

darkknight109 posted...

Kungfu Kenobi posted...

darkknight109 posted...

"Call me Steve, not Stephen,"

It's nothing like that. It's more like saying "Call me by this scent, I don't identify by sound".

Except you're not able to change your scent to adjust someone, while I'm reasonably certain you are capable of giving voice to whatever pronouns someone requests without your mouth bursting into flame.

I'm capable of a lot of things that aren't reasonable to ask of me. Steve vs Steven is a standard form of address, and one that Steve, as a grownup, has learned to live within rather than try to change other people, just as I as a grownup have learned to live within our pronoun binary. He doesn't ask me to address him as an Attack Helicopter, or refer to him in honorifics unbefitting his station (such as "Master"). It doesn't matter how annoyed he gets with me that I don't call him "sweetie" just because he identifies as a cupcake.

Perhaps I haven't been keeping up with the times, but I don't know of anyone who identifies as either an attack helicopter or a cupcake. I'm at least 90% sure those aren't actual things and no one would seriously ask you to address them as such.

As for sticking to established social norms, well, norms change. Less than a century ago you probably would have been ostracized or sold off to a circus sideshow as a "freak" simply for being non-cis gendered. That was accepted social norms at the time and suggesting that maybe you should be treated like an actual person would have gotten you the same exasperated eye-rolls that people are voicing in this topic. We've moved on from that era and good fucking riddance.

I don't know, I just assume that most people are made of strong enough stuff that they won't grasp for their pearls and look for a fainting couch when someone asks them to address them in a way they're not used to. Not one as nonsensical as "I'm an attack helicopter", not one that implies subservience or familiarity like "master" or "sweetie", just one that means "I am not cis-gendered", which they're not, so it should be fine.

Put it this way: if you're strong enough to not care about being addressed with masculine or feminine pronouns, why aren't you strong enough to not care about someone else asking to be addressed with gender-neutral pronouns?
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darkknight109 posted...

Perhaps I haven't been keeping up with the times, but I don't know of anyone who identifies as either an attack helicopter or a cupcake.

In word, Otherkin.

darkknight109 posted...

Put it this way: if you're strong enough to not care about being addressed with masculine or feminine pronouns, why aren't you strong enough to not care about someone else asking to be addressed with gender-neutral pronouns?

I'm strong enough to call them on their BS.
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Kungfu Kenobi posted...

I'm strong enough to call them on their BS.

That's not strength.

Anger - even in its mildest form - is instinctive, particularly when used against someone who has no power over you. It's easy as fuck to get angry; anyone reading this thread could easily do so by finding someone's post that they don't like and just stewing over it.

You "calling me out" and saying you disagree with me is not you being strong (just as me disagreeing with you is not me being strong) and I find it strange you'd characterize it that way.
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It absolutely is strength in this climate to stand for conservative, traditional values when the evidence points to those values having a basis in reality*, because the control crazy moral busybodies out there will call you everything in the book that you don't want to be called. They will try to have your job, your reputation, and your physical safety if UC Berkley is anything to go by. All for not drinking the 75 billion pronoun koolaid. Yes, ten pronouns for every person. Why the fuck not?

*And this is not something that I want, BTW. I came to this stance looking for arguments to legitimize my non-binary identity and found it an increasingly difficult position to justify to myself, let alone others. I want sex and gender to be fluid, because that's easier for me than accepting the arguments I'm now putting forward.

So don't patronize me by characterizing this in terms of strength and acting like, "Come on, you can do it". No.
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Three-

Male female and the one where a person gets so obese that you can't readily tell what gender they are because their body fat just kind of overwhelms any difinitive gender specific body parts.
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Lol why is this discussion still going on

There are two and there will ever only be two. Anything else requires therapy.
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deoxxys posted...

thats an awful example

asswipe lol

I know theres a good way to explain to you why this is such an issue, but I cant think of it

My pronouns are "your god" "my god" "that god"

If u do not properly gender me, youre a fucking bigot.

Dont you see the slippery slope goddamit?

Kungfu Kenobi posted...

It absolutely is strength in this climate to stand for conservative, traditional values when the evidence points to those values having a basis in reality*,

[...]

*And this is not something that I want, BTW. I came to this stance looking for arguments to legitimize my non-binary identity and found it an increasingly difficult position to justify to myself, let alone others. I want sex and gender to be fluid, because that's easier for me than accepting the arguments I'm now putting forward.

Evidence like what? And, in the interests of brevity, let's stay focused on the matter at hand (that of "gender fluidity") because there are certain other aspects of "conservative, traditional values" that I support, so I'd rather not segue the discussion into a greater scope.

Kungfu Kenobi posted...

because the control crazy moral busybodies out there will call you everything in the book that you don't want to be called. They will try to have your job, your reputation, and your physical safety if UC Berkley is anything to go by.

Internet lynch mobs (and real-life rioters) are not the exclusive mandate of any one political ideology and it is a mistake to assume that only one viewpoint or political slant will earn you their ire. Ask media reporters how safe they feel at a Donald Trump rally if you don't believe me.

IAmNowGone posted...

My pronouns are "your god" "my god" "that god"

If u do not properly gender me, youre a fucking bigot.

Dont you see the slippery slope goddamit?

I've been around long enough to see the slippery slope argument come up every single time the subject of "the gays" enters the public discourse and it is never, ever valid. It was "If we start giving the gays rights, pretty soon we're going to start talking about giving pedophiles rights too! Think of the children!!", then it was "If we let the gays start getting married, pretty soon people are going to start marrying their toasters! Where does it end?!" and more recently it's been the charmingly (or not) retro "If we let trans people use whatever bathroom they want, it will lead to men defiling the purity of our women and raping our children!"

Reductio ad absurdum is a shitty argument on this subject. No one is asking you to refer to them as "my god" or "master" or "sweetie" or any of the other ridiculous examples listed in this topic thus far.

Having lived through this news cycle - or a variant of it - many times, it's actually started to dawn on me how shitty people are at spotting patterns. Every time in history that a movement has arisen trying to deny a specific demographic of the population rights, that movement ultimately fails and is looked upon very, very poorly by future generations. Every. Single. Time. It happened with the slavers in the 19th century, it happened with various anti-immigrant movements (anti-Irish, anti-Italian, anti-Jewish, anti-Muslim) periodically throughout much of the last 250 years, it happened with anti-suffragists in the early 20th century, it happened with the segregationists and anti-civil-rights movement of the mid-century, and it's happened again more recently with the anti-gay rights and anti-trans rights movements. Yet every time some new group asks for some basic, reasonable rights, a movement arises to oppose them in the assumption that "this time, things are different!"

Who knows, maybe you're right... but given the track record, I wouldn't put any money on it.
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RybNI0KB1bg
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darkknight109 posted...

Evidence like what?

The deadly failures of social constructionism when put into practice by the likes of Dr. John Money. The lives he destroyed show we ignore the role of biological sex in gender expression at great peril. John Money went looking to prove social constructionism in gender, and his results demolished his own argument.

And that makes sense, given the near 100% correlation between sex and the social constructs surrounding gender expression. As I said earlier in this thread, I'm not talking about superficial traits like pink dresses for girls, but nearly every culture has some variation of the patriarchal construct of Disposable (male) Agent and Valuable (female) Object. That's a powerful construct for creating rigid gender roles, and it's almost completely based in sexual dimorphism. It's not arbitrary, it's how our bodies work.

And even transsexuals are starting to speak up about this, because they don't appreciate the appropriation of their condition by postmoderinsts. Especially by shit for brains Millennials looking to use gender pronouns as a fashion statement, WHICH THEY BLOODY WELL ARE. Many trans people want to be one or the other, they don't have any interest in challenging the binary itself, they just want mobility within it. To which I say 'fair enough'.

darkknight109 posted...

Internet lynch mobs (and real-life rioters) are not the exclusive mandate of any one political ideology and it is a mistake to assume that only one viewpoint or political slant will earn you their ire. Ask media reporters how safe they feel at a Donald Trump rally if you don't believe me.

I could approach this two ways.

One is to point out that the people making Trump rallies unsafe were the very leftists I was complaining about. Those were the ones blocking traffic, and assaulting people trying to get into or out of the rally.

Or I could talk about this feminist who went to see The Red Pill. She went on and on about how unsafe she felt sitting in a dark room with 50-75 MRAs. As though somehow they'd smell the "feminist" on her and rip her body to shreds. It was hilarious.
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Kungfu Kenobi posted...

The deadly failures of social constructionism when put into practice by the likes of Dr. John Money. The lives he destroyed show we ignore the role of biological sex in gender expression at great peril. John Money went looking to prove social constructionism in gender, and his results demolished his own argument.

Money was a quack, no arguments there, and I'm not about to argue that an individual's gender is malleable and changeable; you are what you are.

But if anything, Money's disastrous and tragic miscues regarding David Reimer should offer a cautionary tale in trying to tell people what gender they should or should not identify as. Saying "You MUST identify as male or female" is not far removed from Money attempting to indoctrinate Reimer as a female, fuelling his depression and eventual suicide.

The takeaway from Money's experiment for me has always been that people should be free to express their own gender and sexuality; being forced to conform to a specific gender role against their will can lead to serious - potentially fatal - mental health issues.

Kungfu Kenobi posted...

Many trans people want to be one or the other, they don't have any interest in challenging the binary itself, they just want mobility within it. To which I say 'fair enough'.

And that's completely fine. If you WANT to use a specific traditional pronoun, more power to you. If you *don't* want to use a gender neutral pronoun, that is entirely your business; it's not up to me, or anyone else, to tell you what you what pronouns you should or should not identify with.

All I'm saying is that maybe you should afford others that same courtesy.

Kungfu Kenobi posted...

I could approach this two ways.

One is to point out that the people making Trump rallies unsafe were the very leftists I was complaining about. Those were the ones blocking traffic, and assaulting people trying to get into or out of the rally.

Was it those same "leftists" who intimidated the media whenever Trump singled them out? Was it them who beat up any protesters that dared try and interrupt Trump's speeches? Because I'm pretty sure it wasn't.

A Google search of "Violence at Trump Rally" turns up a long tally of incidents, some incited by those supporting the candidate, some by those protesting him.

I've seen an alarming trend over the last year or so by conservatives suggesting that violence is the exclusive purview of the left, which is not just wrong, but dangerously so, because it shows not only the lengthy laundry list of violence perpetrated by right-wing groups,* ignorance to the perils of extremism and inflammatory rhetoric, regardless of whose side it is coming from.

*(interesting factoid: for the last ~20 years, the FBI has considered right-wing extremism to be a far more dangerous threat than left-wing extremism and the number of right-wing groups flagged as illegal or violent has dwarfed the number of left-wing groups given the same designation; this was particularly true during Obama's tenure as president)

Kungfu Kenobi posted...

Or I could talk about this feminist who went to see The Red Pill. She went on and on about how unsafe she felt sitting in a dark room with 50-75 MRAs. As though somehow they'd smell the "feminist" on her and rip her body to shreds. It was hilarious.

I'm not sure how this serves as a rebuttal to anything I said. Are you making the point that oversensitive people exist who see threats where non exist? Alright... I fail to see how that counters my earlier point, though.
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darkknight109 posted...

All I'm saying is that maybe you should afford others that same courtesy.

I don't impose my own subjectively arrived at identities on other people, I let them make their own decisions. All I'm asking for is that same courtesy. >_>
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Kungfu, just curious, have you ever met or had to interact with a trans person? I'm wondering what you would do if you had say a trans woman as a co-worker in an office. At a certain point you're going to be creating a problem when you're the only person in the office calling her he and refusing to use her name.
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